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Augment slot on all gear 1.3

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Crew Skills
Augment slot on all gear 1.3
First BioWare Post First BioWare Post

Lexster's Avatar


Lexster
05.14.2012 , 07:44 AM | #121
Get your kits and go back to biochem?

Raeln's Avatar


Raeln
05.14.2012 , 08:07 AM | #122
Quote: Originally Posted by CompassRose View Post
This is the extreme case that will be very uncomfortable for a dev to comment on. You're talking about a moddable, offhand only blaster with a VERY COOL skin. One that's very desirable to dual-wielders. So if you're determined to get an augmented version, let's say you run off 5 in a row with Corso. You exhaust your supply of alloys (15). Burn through the expensive materials and come out with 1 augmented version and 4 non-augmented versions.

In reality, you created the blaster that you wanted but now you're stuck with 4 'Flashies'. You literally have 4 guns that may have level 50 blue mods in it, but for all intents and purposes the gun itself is no better than any other random, moddable blaster drop. The only difference is this one is offhand only and has a great graphic skin.

So if the devs are saying you can create 10, 'green' blasters and get the augment kit material.....

Then you're printing money.

This is a band-aid change. It's coming into the game because players want to be able to run around in slave-top bikinis and not get a handicap for it. Even on Hoth.

The unintended consequence is that ALL orange gear up for sale on the GTN will now have an augment slot in it. Meaning anything without one will be poo.

'Disposable', gear will be hard to find because players will stop selling those drops on the GTN and reverse engineer for augment kit materials. If new players thought finding gear on the GTN was hard before, they're in for a shock in 1.3.

The devs again, have taken something 'uncommon' and made it common because that's what everyone wants (the best gear).
The primary problem is that the augment slot is tied to a RNG crit mechanic. RNG crit on crafting is fine if the reward is an extra item (like stims and mods), but not when it changes the value of the individual item. At that point, it becomes fail. It is ludicrous to have to queue up 5 or 10 <insert moddable name here> chestpieces only to cross your fingers on whether you get a usable piece or not.

As it is in 1.2: if it's not augmented, it's trash except for a very tiny number of people who want that specific appearance and don't care about an augment slot.

It would be much better if crafted gear automatically came with the augment slot and RNG crits did something else that did not impact the quality of the finished product. That something else might be a reduction in the materials it took to make the item, an extra copy, a reduction in the time for the companion to make the next piece or even a standalone augment kit. The point is it will be fail for a crafting system to modify the finished product on crit chance that is entirely outside of the player's ability to control, no matter how many band-aides get thrown on the system.

During my last War Hero gear job, I came to the point of regretting my decision to take on Armormech and spending the time to level it up pre-1.2. I essentially made almost 7 complete sets of War Hero gear to get enough augmented pieces to make my guildy his single set of augmented gear. This was not fun at all. I did a mountain of missions to get more materials (Ciridium). I used my only companion with an Armormech bonus (+5 crit) and still had to make about 27 pieces to get 5 augmented pieces. I couldn't even find guildies to give the standard versions of the gear to - I finally just vendored most of it for 1 credit to open up inventory space.

Fail system is fail. It will be fail until Bioware wises up and removes the augment slot from RNG crit.

JimG's Avatar


JimG
05.15.2012 , 09:01 AM | #123
Quote: Originally Posted by Raeln View Post
The primary problem is that the augment slot is tied to a RNG crit mechanic. RNG crit on crafting is fine if the reward is an extra item (like stims and mods), but not when it changes the value of the individual item. At that point, it becomes fail. It is ludicrous to have to queue up 5 or 10 <insert moddable name here> chestpieces only to cross your fingers on whether you get a usable piece or not.

As it is in 1.2: if it's not augmented, it's trash except for a very tiny number of people who want that specific appearance and don't care about an augment slot.

Fail system is fail. It will be fail until Bioware wises up and removes the augment slot from RNG crit.
Disagree. If every piece of orange gear automatically had an augment slot, then it would be a joke. The market would be flooded with augmented gear and it would be worthless to sell. Why not just hand everyone augment slots when they create a character?

Is it a pain to try for a specific piece of armor and have to craft 7 or 8 just to crit on one? Sure. But I'm selling augmented gear typically from anywhere between 60k to 150k, so am I really not losing out because I have a few extras. Besides, I've been able to sell all my extras for 3k to 8k each...although I may have to throw them back on the GTN once or twice before they sell. Keep in mind, there is really no need for augmented gear while leveling (other than an OCD, min/max complex) so plenty of people are content to buy gear without augment slots before their toon hits the higher levels. So even on the low end, if I end up crafting 5 pieces and only one crits, then I'm still selling all 5 for about 75k combined if it's a less desirable piece and the mats cost me much, much less than that. So it's profitable for someone that has a little patience. I can see the A.D.D, gotta-have-everything-right-this-second, instant gratification crowd not being a fan of the system though.

Obviously they aren't going to remove the crit part of things as they are adding the augment kits to 1.3. I'd rather have the crit + augment slot system as it makes the critted gear more valuable to sell, there will now be crafted augment kits to sell (and those should be pretty valuable on the GTN) and now I'll be able to use some of that flashpoint gear for end-game stuff that's been sitting in storage because I'll be able to add an augment slot to it through the kits.

Raeln's Avatar


Raeln
05.15.2012 , 12:50 PM | #124
Quote: Originally Posted by JimG View Post
Disagree. If every piece of orange gear automatically had an augment slot, then it would be a joke. The market would be flooded with augmented gear and it would be worthless to sell. Why not just hand everyone augment slots when they create a character?

Is it a pain to try for a specific piece of armor and have to craft 7 or 8 just to crit on one? Sure. But I'm selling augmented gear typically from anywhere between 60k to 150k, so am I really not losing out because I have a few extras. Besides, I've been able to sell all my extras for 3k to 8k each...although I may have to throw them back on the GTN once or twice before they sell. Keep in mind, there is really no need for augmented gear while leveling (other than an OCD, min/max complex) so plenty of people are content to buy gear without augment slots before their toon hits the higher levels. So even on the low end, if I end up crafting 5 pieces and only one crits, then I'm still selling all 5 for about 75k combined if it's a less desirable piece and the mats cost me much, much less than that. So it's profitable for someone that has a little patience. I can see the A.D.D, gotta-have-everything-right-this-second, instant gratification crowd not being a fan of the system though.

Obviously they aren't going to remove the crit part of things as they are adding the augment kits to 1.3. I'd rather have the crit + augment slot system as it makes the critted gear more valuable to sell, there will now be crafted augment kits to sell (and those should be pretty valuable on the GTN) and now I'll be able to use some of that flashpoint gear for end-game stuff that's been sitting in storage because I'll be able to add an augment slot to it through the kits.
No, they aren't removing the crit augment mechanic - they are just marginalizing it. Considering the lack of good looking sets of moddable gear to make, many people will likely prefer to just buy an augment kit - thus rendering the augmented gear market in an unhealthy state.

Yes, all moddable gear should just be augmented from the start. Do you realize how inconvenient it is to try to price someone a set of augmented gear when you may get lucky and crit the first 5 combines or unlucky and have to make 30+ pieces to get the full set? You can't price that to a would-be client. Now imagine that being applied to any salesman in the real world -

You - "Mr. Salesman, how much will it cost to get this gun with the super-special scope on it?"

Mr. Salesman - "Um well, it depends on how many different guns and scopes they have to make before they find one that works together."

You - "Uh, what does that even mean? It's a gun, not a surgical laser. Bolt the scope on it and sight it in."

Mr. Salesman - "Well, it may cost $500 - it may cost $250,000. We won't know for sure until the gun is made."

You - "Are you serious? You're supposed to be an expert and you can't even tell me how much it will cost to buy one of your products?"

^^^ That sir, is a company that won't be in business very long.

DyasAlue's Avatar


DyasAlue
05.15.2012 , 01:27 PM | #125
Quote: Originally Posted by raeln View Post
...
You - "mr. Salesman, how much will it cost to get this gun with the super-special scope on it?"

mr. Salesman - "um well, it depends on how many different guns and scopes they have to make before they find one that works together."

you - "uh, what does that even mean? It's a gun, not a surgical laser. Bolt the scope on it and sight it in."

mr. Salesman - "well, it may cost $500 - it may cost $250,000. We won't know for sure until the gun is made."

you - "are you serious? You're supposed to be an expert and you can't even tell me how much it will cost to buy one of your products?"

^^^ that sir, is a company that won't be in business very long.
roflmao
Server: Kass City | Name: Bounty | Level: 50 |
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Jica's Avatar


Jica
05.16.2012 , 05:43 AM | #126
With all the hype about augment slot kits, I bet in the end it will turn out to only work on crafted items and not on looted/rewarded items (making it yet another joke), lol.
Ecca : (Section One) on "The Fatman"

MadHobbit's Avatar


MadHobbit
05.16.2012 , 02:14 PM | #127
As one of those players who has a char running around in bikini costume,since i ws able to get it from the social vendor,as far as i can tell I will NOT be able to augment it.:-(
I have crafted both types of lightsabers and have gotten augment slots on them,it took about 5-6 tries each to get one. what the Devs are doing is a bit of a double fakeoff, yes they will offer A slots,but make them either hard to get ,so we are all out runing around farming for supplies, we dont notice the other problems with the game.I have a friend who in another game spent over a month to get the items needed to enhance one of his weapons, he took the items to a crafter,and failed the crafting roll,which not only used the items also destroyed the weapon he wanted to enhance. really hope this game is not going to that point.

XenusParadox's Avatar


XenusParadox
05.16.2012 , 02:44 PM | #128
Interview with two of the devs on 1.3's crew skill changes just went up.

http://inquisitorsroadhouse.com/2012...atrick-malott/

Quote:
There are two costs to add an augment slot: credits and an Augmentation Kit. The current cost progression starts at 4,500 credits and ends at 50,000 credits, while the kits come in the same MKs that match the types of slots you can add to an item.

Kits are acquired through three crew skills: Armstech, Armormech and Synthweaving. There is no difference in the kits they make, and they can find the recipes on the trainer. In order to create a kit, you need 10 Augmentation Slot Components of the appropriate MK. You receive one component whenever you Reverse Engineer a piece of crafted gear. Note that this is a non-random addition on top of the other returns you already get from RE, meaning that every 10 consumed items will reliably give you the components for one kit. This helps counteract bad luck dealing with randomness and crafting crits, as youíre guaranteed to be able to get the primary limiting component for an augment slot after 10 crafts. Note that since you get the component for the level of the item youíre making, you donít need to try to craft the expensive purple 10 times. Just make one, then if you donít crit you can make cheaper items to get the components necessary to create an augment kit.

SpatterJack's Avatar


SpatterJack
05.16.2012 , 03:33 PM | #129
Quote: Originally Posted by XenusParadox View Post
Interview with two of the devs on 1.3's crew skill changes just went up.

http://inquisitorsroadhouse.com/2012...atrick-malott/
Veeery interesting, thx for the linky

Well, I can certainly see the price of resources on the GTN rising substantially post 1.3...

Augment kits will probably be in abundant supply, seeing as you have to make and RE 10 belts (of the appropriate tier) to get enough for components for 1 kit. I imagine orange shells with a crit-crafted augment slot won't sell for much more than the cost of a kit + shell + augment table fee...

But the good news is that it may put augmented orange gear in reach of lower level players, due to the tiering. The augment-slotted orange L11 gear will now only be useful to a high level player if they spend the additional augment table upgrade fee.

Lugosi's Avatar


Lugosi
05.16.2012 , 03:38 PM | #130
-"Our goal with the modification system has always been to allow players to use any gear they choose and have it function at maximum statistical efficiency."
-"For items made after 1.3, the crit augment slot matches the level of the item. That means that lower level items wonít get as much inherent value from crits as higher level items."

-"Q: So, that means if I craft a level 39 custom piece and it crits, its augment slot will only be able to accept augments up to whatever tier corresponds with that item level?"
-"Correct"

Am I missing something here? So much for any gear having maximum statistical efficiency.
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