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Make Recruit Gear a Requirement to Queue

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
Make Recruit Gear a Requirement to Queue

Monterone's Avatar


Monterone
05.09.2012 , 01:37 PM | #131
While I don't agree with any system that would order you to buy anything, I do think they set the price a bit too high and that's why you see so many people in low level modded gear instead of recruit gear.

Not too long ago Bioware released a stat that the vast majority of SWTOR players had under 500k. And then they set the intro PvP armor set price at 2/3 of that amount. Not a good decision if your goal is truly to help people transition into PvP.

While some of us played the market and made millions, others do only have a half a mil or so and that money is used wisely and sparingly. If you can work on your BM set for a week or so and take a few deaths, why spend the majority of your savings on a very temporary boost? See the logic?

Add to that the fact that warzones pay dick for money, you can see that PvPers are not really rolling in dough and the 300k+ price is a bit too steep for PvPers.

That said, I'd never be found in a warzone with anything less than recruit gear, but I'm set. Seems they try subconsciously (or maybe consciously), to sneak in a money sink wherever they can, without actually thinking about the viability of such prices for the masses.
Sominette . Saminette
Pot5 > Harbinger

ThorgrimLutgen's Avatar


ThorgrimLutgen
05.09.2012 , 02:34 PM | #132
Quote: Originally Posted by valkyriewiz View Post
you have to PVP ALOT to get 3500 rwz guarentee your gonna hit lvl 50 before you make that cap since you dont start getting them till lvl 40 so your point is mute and invalid 700 expertise to start is nothing against someone with 1.3k fact. you talk a big game but you fail to understand that alot of those poeple sitting in BM got it the easy way and BW made it hard for everyone else. i agree remove expertise then it will be based of skill and not gear
Struggling through the lack of proper capitalisation, I think your argument is massively off the mark, it is far, far easier to get BM gear now than it ever was pre 1.2 with its lottery of bags.

It's not a "big game", it is simple to get these comms, just play pvp. I don't pve, I don't enjoy it, I do enjoy pvp, hence it is what I do when i log on. Seriously, my tank will have 4 good pieces at least of BM gear as soon as she hits 50, simply, because I pvp.

I wish this system had been available all along to my main toon, none of that (ah crap, just more champ tokens) disappointment from the bags.
REPS L55 Seer, L55 Defence Guardian, L55 Infiltration Shadow, L55 Assault Commando, L55 Sawbones, L20's Watchman, L20's Shield Specialist, L20's Gunslinger
IMPS L55 Carnage Marauder, L55 Medicine Operative, L55 AP Powertech, L55 Darkness Assassin, L55 Madness Sorcerer, L55 Marksman, L55 Vengeance Jugg, L30's Pyro Merc.

ThorgrimLutgen's Avatar


ThorgrimLutgen
05.09.2012 , 02:37 PM | #133
Quote: Originally Posted by NDiggy View Post
This isn't an elitist argument. Its basic common sense that you want people wearing pvp gear to pvp in. You wouldn't show up to play football with no pads or cleats, would you? If you did, how would that affect not only your ability to pretty but your contribution to your team? Would your team not be justified in being a little upset that you chose not to wear the right gear just because you care more about yourself than the team? Isn't it the height of selfishness to put your own needs before that of your team?

You don't buy gear to, as you put it, "appease my own sense of selfworth", you buy gear because its selfish to put your team at a disadvantage just because you don't want to buy and wear readily available pvp gear. You may not care that you're still wearing centurion gear on you're "fun"character, but I guarantee the 7 other people in your wzs care that you're wasting their time and hurting their chances of winning because you're too stubborn, selfish, ignorant or cheap to buy and wear easily available pvp gear.
Seriously, you sound like you need a reality check. Pay my sub and dictate to me how to have fun by all means, otherwise, play your own game and quit whining like a kid with a skinned knee.

This is a game, it is not real life, it is not remotely important to anyone with any real sense of perspective on life, if you feel different, I suggest you head down to the doctors. If you are not having fun due to me playing my casual toon in centurion and champ peices, please feel free to stop playing, because I can guarantee you, that your opinion on how I need to be having my fun means utterly nothing to me during my leisure time.

It is selfish to tell someone how to play a game, you will not be happy unless people do it your way, well, wake up and smell the roses and take note, the world does not revolve around you.
REPS L55 Seer, L55 Defence Guardian, L55 Infiltration Shadow, L55 Assault Commando, L55 Sawbones, L20's Watchman, L20's Shield Specialist, L20's Gunslinger
IMPS L55 Carnage Marauder, L55 Medicine Operative, L55 AP Powertech, L55 Darkness Assassin, L55 Madness Sorcerer, L55 Marksman, L55 Vengeance Jugg, L30's Pyro Merc.

L-RANDLE's Avatar


L-RANDLE
05.09.2012 , 03:14 PM | #134
Quote: Originally Posted by NDiggy View Post
I've been reading your posts and I'm not sure you understand how expertise works. Expertise on pvp gear more than makes up for the loss in other stats. You could be in full rakata and not do as much damage as someone in recruit gear or take as much damage either. Pve gear is never better than pvp gear. That is the point of expertise and why they changed the way it scales in 1.2. Before 1.2, pve gear was still good in pvp, not so much now.
No, just no....

Here is an example, assume full recuit gear 13K HP, 14% mitigation or 15-16K HP. Crit 5K attack.. Would you rather?

A. Get hit for 4.3K(33% of your HP)......YAY mitigation!! 8.7K left.....
B. Get hit for 5K, derp...11K left...


Now add in the PvP medpaks are based on 35% of MAX HP..... Shall we go into healing?

Yes, if you need to fill slots, get the recruit, if you have LVL 50 purps or ANY PVE gear higher than TIO, you are good to play in lvl 50 PvP. I am trying to make the focus of this thread "to the peeps in LVL40 greens in the 50 PVP bracket."
PvP Gear Viability? Read this first.
Tired of being broke? Stop being Felica and read this.
I'm not trying to be Rambo..... I'm trying to be Ray Tango

kronomandar's Avatar


kronomandar
05.09.2012 , 03:16 PM | #135
Quote: Originally Posted by ThorgrimLutgen View Post
Seriously, you sound like you need a reality check. Pay my sub and dictate to me how to have fun by all means, otherwise, play your own game and quit whining like a kid with a skinned knee.
i will accept your selfishness if you pay my sub everytime your undergeared self lands on my team and i have to carry you through a match.

the thing that your arguement ignores is that in this game, and other MMOs, you are required to interact with other players.
while you can play as you like, when you are interacting with others how you play effects their game too. it is totaly reasonable that they expect you to meet a minimum standard as to how you play.

in pve raids this isnt that much of an issue. if you dont have the gear, dont know the fights, or are just generaly bad, you will get booted out fast, if you were even lucky enough to be accepted in the first place.

pvp is a different story, you can queue solo and get put on a random team of other players. if those other players see you as a weak point they would rather do without, they have no means to remove you. your selfishness, bad attitude, and poor social skills become clear very quickly. thankfully we are spared your low standards of personal hygiene.

you want to get carried and think we dont have the right to complain about it.
we dont want to carry you and think we have the right to say so, loudly!

SneakyErvin's Avatar


SneakyErvin
05.09.2012 , 05:08 PM | #136
Quote: Originally Posted by L-RANDLE View Post
No, just no....

Here is an example, assume full recuit gear 13K HP, 14% mitigation or 15-16K HP. Crit 5K attack.. Would you rather?

A. Get hit for 4.3K(33% of your HP)......YAY mitigation!! 8.7K left.....
B. Get hit for 5K, derp...11K left...


Now add in the PvP medpaks are based on 35% of MAX HP..... Shall we go into healing?

Yes, if you need to fill slots, get the recruit, if you have LVL 50 purps or ANY PVE gear higher than TIO, you are good to play in lvl 50 PvP. I am trying to make the focus of this thread "to the peeps in LVL40 greens in the 50 PVP bracket."
You are so missinformed. Please do not advice the community.

In full recruit gear (besides belt, bracer and off hand which are champion items) my assassin has:

807 expertise rating
16.74 Damage bonus vs players
14.34% Damage mitigation vs players
9.17% extra healing.

Thats alot of extra damage and mitigation you dont get in PvE gear vs players. Alot more than what your main stats will bring you. You need astronomical amounts of main stats to equal that.

Not only do I deal 16.74% more damage to you while you wear PvE gear, but you deal 14.34% less to me aswell. Making the gap HUGE between PvP recruit gear and pretty much any PvE gear. The recruit weapons damage is also better than any form of fresh level 50 epic/modded you can get.

And regarding the PvP medpack, yes it heals for 35% health. Say you have 15000 health in pve gear, thats 5250 health with the medpack. 14000 health in PvP gear, thats 4900, but my pvp gear adds 9.17% extra healing. Thats 5349 HP with a medpack.

Stats just dont scale nearly as well as the pure % buff expertise gives to damage, healing and mitigation. So dont tell people they will do ok running around in PvE gear while PvPing. They will get shredded, they will complain and be left in the dark.

Please stop giving missinformation or I will report you for trolling.

edit: And this comparison is between recruit gear and pve gear, the gap gets even bigger between BM gear and pve gear where stats are even higher. But where the gap is much smaller between recruit and BM. Just a few odd % difference while its up around 20%, 17% and 13% BM vs PvE gear.
Ahahahahah!!

Arkerus's Avatar


Arkerus
05.09.2012 , 05:26 PM | #137
No. Its inevitable you have to suck when you first start but thats part of the game. Stop complaining and worrying about other people. Worry about yourself.
Hooning in the rex : http://youtu.be/xtXUM6yPMCY

Sneakypepper's Avatar


Sneakypepper
05.09.2012 , 05:29 PM | #138
How about this.

Delete all pvp gear from the game. When you q for warzone at 50 and you click join, it puts you in a suit of BM gear(just for the Warzone, not permanent gear), for your class and spec, or gives you the choice of 3 sets that each focus on a different secondary stats. When you leave the warzone your back in your gear.

Everyone is now gear equal and PvP is about skill, situational awareness and strategy. The way its supposed to be.

Make pvp rewards, Money, Special titles, still give commendations or whatever, but make it so there is cool social items, mounts, medpacks, stims, pets, titles, vanity items, crafting items, and such to spend them on instead of gear.

Make PvP about skill, strategy and teamwork, not gear and FOTM toons.

HurricaneXXIV's Avatar


HurricaneXXIV
05.09.2012 , 05:34 PM | #139
Quote: Originally Posted by Sneakypepper View Post

Make PvP about skill, strategy and teamwork, not gear and FOTM toons.
People play an MMO to make their toon better. It's why it's not a first person shooter, but even those games have come to the conclusion if you add carrots people will play it more. Play Battlefield etc and notice the ranking systems.

Adding the element of a gear grind is actually wanted by most people. The only argument how much of a grind should it be. For me I hate the grind and want it small, but I understand the need or want for a little bit of one.

L-RANDLE's Avatar


L-RANDLE
05.09.2012 , 05:50 PM | #140
Quote: Originally Posted by SneakyErvin View Post
You are so missinformed. Please do not advice the community.

In full recruit gear (besides belt, bracer and off hand which are champion items) my assassin has:

807 expertise rating
16.74 Damage bonus vs players
14.34% Damage mitigation vs players
9.17% extra healing.

Thats alot of extra damage and mitigation you dont get in PvE gear vs players. Alot more than what your main stats will bring you. You need astronomical amounts of main stats to equal that.

Not only do I deal 16.74% more damage to you while you wear PvE gear, but you deal 14.34% less to me aswell. Making the gap HUGE between PvP recruit gear and pretty much any PvE gear. The recruit weapons damage is also better than any form of fresh level 50 epic/modded you can get.

And regarding the PvP medpack, yes it heals for 35% health. Say you have 15000 health in pve gear, thats 5250 health with the medpack. 14000 health in PvP gear, thats 4900, but my pvp gear adds 9.17% extra healing. Thats 5349 HP with a medpack.

Stats just dont scale nearly as well as the pure % buff expertise gives to damage, healing and mitigation. So dont tell people they will do ok running around in PvE gear while PvPing. They will get shredded, they will complain and be left in the dark.

Please stop giving missinformation or I will report you for trolling.

edit: And this comparison is between recruit gear and pve gear, the gap gets even bigger between BM gear and pve gear where stats are even higher. But where the gap is much smaller between recruit and BM. Just a few odd % difference while its up around 20%, 17% and 13% BM vs PvE gear.
Still dont get it? Trolling? No... Obervations and simple math...yes. Ask yourself why BW buffed expertise if it really was on par with PvE gear? Are your seriously suggesting wearing recuit gear is better than wearing Rakata? I'll say it again expertise ONLY increases bonus damage/healing. What goes into your bonus damage? Ta-da..... MAIN STAT/POW/FORCE/TECH.

Do you want 16% increase on 600 bonus damage or 700 bonus damage? That does not even account for contributions of main stat to crit rating. As I said before, mitigation is even more muted, and healing is a joke. I also would guess you don't have any PvE gear to even compare it, so... I am using real stats to compare this you are just talking out of ur azz.... With the buff given in 1.2 it is on par with PvE stuff tier for tier.
PvP Gear Viability? Read this first.
Tired of being broke? Stop being Felica and read this.
I'm not trying to be Rambo..... I'm trying to be Ray Tango