BW states TOR didn't start out "heavily PvP-focused"

Bioware = noobs.

I had a conversation with one of their guys in Orlando at Celebration a couple of years ago. I tried to tell him that the playerbase will decide what this game is all about. He laughed at that and wanted to continue talking about how immersive class stories would be.

I should have PvP'd his *** on the spot.

i find it a bit insulting that BW claims they were blind-sided by this. There were outcries about PvP support the entire beta and they ignored them. We warned them PvP is the core of any MMO. Regardless of how much you want it to be a PvE game, the game will only retain players with PvP. Things they have been adding and fixing since launch regarding pvp were ALL being asked for before launch...i call BS.

Oh...and to say this game has the most pvp of any MMO...i find that laughable. how would they even begin to gather such statics about other games...just shows the mind games they are trying to pull on their player base

I'm trying to queue on Shii-Cho right now. It has now been 70 minutes without a warzone. Granted, it's a weekday morning, but 70 EFFING MINUTES with no zone? SERIOUSLY?!?!

I finally got a warzone. It was a 4 v 3 Huttball match that ended less than 2 minutes in because the whole Imp team quit. (all 3 of them)

What a joke.

I did play pre-CU. There were a lot of PvPers. Even from my guild. Especially this one Pikeman that got a legendary pike drop from a krayt and would fight jedi and win.

But the percentage of the overall population that PvP'd was less than the percentage ratio here. That was my point.

Yeah, you haven't seen it because the total revamp is inhouse so far. It's coming, though.

No, they said that TOR has the most PvP population ratio of any MMO. Not the most PvP of any MMO. Any developer would have been blind-sided by that.

Also, I was here before launch. The things the majority of PvPers were asking for was haphazard and all over the place. PvPers are having a hard time agreeing on anything these days.

Yeah, that sucks. Server transfer/shut-downs should take care of that, along with X-server queues.

I played SWG from closed beta until its final days (off and on). I was there for launch. I remember the days of no speeders, when we had to walk everywhere. I remember the CU, the NGE, the gross imbalance of having 32 professions, all of it.

I was a BH in that game from nearly start to finish (respec to Officer @ the very end). Most of my PvP experience in that game was people logging off in my face after hours of tracking them, Jedi that ran around with 10 friends, and receiving hate tells that threatened to kill my mother. But that is all behind us now. SWG was largely a failure on many levels, though there were some really great things about that game.

But yes, I remember the days of taking down player-owned bases and open world PvP that actually mattered. Where controlling factions got $$$ and XP buffs as well, if I'm not mistaken. I remember voting for Victor at every chance as well.

Point being, even in a failed game, PvP mattered in SWG. It had its ups and downs and imbalances, but at least it mattered. In SWTOR, it's just a mini-game with gear grind attached. BioWare got it really, really wrong.

It is obvious that BW screwed up with PvP, but I don't know that they even know why. What makes epic PvP is writing your own story. That's what great PvP is, and BioWare doesn't want that. They want you to play THEIR story. Granted, they write great stories, but in this case their strength is their weakness. They need to create open PvP environments where the players fight over something allows them to mae their own story. That's what makes epic PvP, and I still think BikWare doesn't get that.