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What Sent/Mar spec and change has contributed to them becoming op?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
What Sent/Mar spec and change has contributed to them becoming op?

Darianth's Avatar


Darianth
04.30.2012 , 11:30 AM | #171
Quote: Originally Posted by DestyOwn View Post
good marauders break your flashbang then saber ward = can't legshot them, get in range and by then their resolve is full and tbh on my server most marauders know me and when i fight them they always have all their defensive cd's up somehow.
Just use dirty kick or whatever it's called or the counterpart move of the sniper them they are out for several seconds. Their resolve would be full by then but if you needed to you could use that time to reposition yourself and really give them a hard time and if positioned correctly you can hold them off of you long enough for their resolve bar to drop back down the. Knockback and once they are free leg shot. But I doubt that they would still be alive before you had to use that.

Jatne's Avatar


Jatne
04.30.2012 , 11:33 AM | #172
Quote: Originally Posted by broganthomas View Post
There are a few factors...

Other DPS classes got nerfed, and are no where near as effective as mara/sents.(Hence balance issues)
They got a buff.
Great DPS + Best defensive CD's in the game.

I don't know why this is so hard to understand...
BH both spec are capable of HIGHER burst damage than ANY spec of Mara/Sent AND they do it from 10m+ yet I don't see QQ about them (yet).

This is NOT an OP class issue it is an L2P issue.
COME AT ME BRO
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rsomazzi's Avatar


rsomazzi
04.30.2012 , 11:35 AM | #173
Quote: Originally Posted by GypsyMagik View Post
lol taking away our defensive cd's would make us so squishy it wouldn't be funny EVERY complaint I have seen is based around survivability which is non existent without a healer. Like always it's a skewed view from all the complainers. all the classes are balanced and as Bioware said everything is how they wanted it to be so perhaps people should work on their wz tactics and focus fire.
How about 1v1, also a completely viable and legitimate circumstance which would show how completely wrong you are. First, without healing, any 1v1 or 8v8 encounter, EVERYONE is a measure SQUISHIER. It's that the collective combination of both damage mitigation AND high damage output is why Marauders and Sents are out of line with the rest of the classes. I won't say "OP" anymore because of the stereotypes it's created. But there is little doubt that those classes have a collective presence in fights that the rest of the classes would like to have but don't.

Switch to a Commando and then tell me how well you do versus your Marauder. Until then, you have little understanding. Until then, everyone who decries your class is an automatic "whiner". Right?

Darianth's Avatar


Darianth
04.30.2012 , 11:44 AM | #174
Quote: Originally Posted by rsomazzi View Post
How about 1v1, also a completely viable and legitimate circumstance which would show how completely wrong you are. First, without healing, any 1v1 or 8v8 encounter, EVERYONE is a measure SQUISHIER. It's that the collective combination of both damage mitigation AND high damage output is why Marauders and Sents are out of line with the rest of the classes. I won't say "OP" anymore because of the stereotypes it's created. But there is little doubt that those classes have a collective presence in fights that the rest of the classes would like to have but don't.

Switch to a Commando and then tell me how well you do versus your Marauder. Until then, you have little understanding. Until then, everyone who decries your class is an automatic "whiner". Right?
I still see commandos wreck face.

Baconmonster's Avatar


Baconmonster
04.30.2012 , 11:48 AM | #175
Quote: Originally Posted by GypsyMagik View Post
lol taking away our defensive cd's would make us so squishy it wouldn't be funny EVERY complaint I have seen is based around survivability which is non existent without a healer. Like always it's a skewed view from all the complainers. all the classes are balanced and as Bioware said everything is how they wanted it to be so perhaps people should work on their wz tactics and focus fire.
Squishy like say, a pyrotech? That's the problem I have with Mara/Sents. You have an escape mechanic, great defensive cds, and very good damage. Take away those first two benefits and you've got a Pyrotech. Sents and Rauders don't know how good you've got it in the current state of PvP.

Quinlynn's Avatar


Quinlynn
04.30.2012 , 11:54 AM | #176
Thre real issue is not Sent/Mar, it is population.

On my server, we have a severe population issue. When we have ~45 Repub on Fleet, Imps have ~150.

Thusly, their premade groups are much more likely to have multiple healers and DPS'ers. The dominant DPS'er class is Mara. Thusly, the perception is that Mara is OP'd when in fact it is a population issue.

BW failed big time by making Classes/Professions faction locked and they failing to delver mirrors. All the Classes / profs should have been independent of faction to eliminate any failed perception of bad balance. BW will never win this battle going forward and they were lazy about how they implemented the voice overs / quests that dictated they lock faction.

IMHO

rsomazzi's Avatar


rsomazzi
04.30.2012 , 11:56 AM | #177
Quote: Originally Posted by Darianth View Post
I still see commandos wreck face.
I never said they didn't, nor that MY Commando does not. We *can* wreck, but not "wreck face" unless the Commando is geared well and the target is a fresh 50 in greens and blues. Different from that example, things change.

But, have you played a Commando? Have you seen your self:

1. Constantly interrupted so you can't cast your only real dps ability: grav while your health gets chunked down?
2. Have to turret to attempt #1 (stand still) and still not be able to "cast" your dps abilities?
3. Rely on one, long cooldown break to get out of trouble? Imagine for a moment what happens when you're on that cooldown... yea...

BUT! Isn't that supposed to be the weaknesses of a dps class, because they can "wreck face", as you put it?

So, while you're here, please list the weaknesses, similar to the above for the Commando, that an equally geared Marauder has. There has to be some, right? Please help me out and list them. I am being serious, I don't know the class other what is presented to me in matches, so help me out. I'd like to know what a class that is currently built for dps output AND mitigation has in terms of weaknesses. They have to exist, right? I mean, I play a Commando and the weaknesses are pretty clear. Thanks...

fyi, for being such a great PvP tank, I'd expect the Marauder to have a weakness, say, in dps output. But that's not what I read, nor is that what I find in warzones. When I see a Marauder, unless he's craptastically geared, I see a class with BOTH high damage output AND high damage mitigation. Please explain if that's not truly the case. I'd like to know more. Thanks again.

rsomazzi's Avatar


rsomazzi
04.30.2012 , 12:08 PM | #178
Quote: Originally Posted by Baconmonster View Post
Squishy like say, a pyrotech? That's the problem I have with Mara/Sents. You have an escape mechanic, great defensive cds, and very good damage. Take away those first two benefits and you've got a Pyrotech. Sents and Rauders don't know how good you've got it in the current state of PvP.
Agree.

Interesting to me how much talk there is about class balance, and yet, I have yet to see some real testing.

It would be really nice to record several matches, at least, between a Mara/Sent and say my class, Commando. Video, plus parsed combat logs, not just who was still standing at the end. You'd have to keep variables constant, right, like gear and player skill, but if it could be set up, man, what the data would say.

Interesting to me, given how valuable such testing would be, that I haven't found anything like this from either Bioware or players. It would first be up to BW to provide this, since all the code are belongs to them. I'd be willing to supply the Commando, but there's still the details of gear and skill to hammer out I suppose.

Tigalo's Avatar


Tigalo
04.30.2012 , 12:42 PM | #179
Short answer to the OP:
Expertise damage buff got a boost
Expertise healing buff got a nerf

So,
dps >> healing
+
dps with superior defensive CDs >> other dps
=
mauraderf/sentinels is now a very strong PvP class
Nite Legacy (legacy level 50) on The Progenitor: Kir - 55 merc, Tigalo - 55 jugg, Kirana - 51 sorc, Jax 50 marauder, Rev - 50 operative, Nish - 50 gunslinger, Kenix - 55 sage, Manji - 50 assassin, Tigelo - 50 Commando and more

Kaarsa's Avatar


Kaarsa
04.30.2012 , 12:48 PM | #180
Quote: Originally Posted by Tigalo View Post
Short answer to the OP:
Expertise damage buff got a boost
Expertise healing buff got a nerf

So,
dps >> healing
+
dps with superior defensive CDs >> other dps
=
mauraderf/sentinels is now a very strong PvP class
Damage increased by expertise is now almost exactly canceled by damage reduced by expertise. Difference between now and previous system - about 1,76%.

Difference between max healing increase from expertise before 1.2 and after 1.2 - around 1,5% (I am not sure what exact value it is, but it is more than 1% and probably less than 2%).

As usualy, a lot of QQ about nothing.
Official Dev info about resolve system: http://dulfy.net/2012/04/07/paxeast-q-a-day-2/
Quote: Originally Posted by Darth_Philar View Post
To be fair, about 98% of all PvP problems can be resolved by learning to correctly play the class you rolled.
The remaining 2% aren't going to be fixed by complaining on a forum...