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Shutting Catboy down

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes
Shutting Catboy down
 
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Harukaze's Avatar


Harukaze
04.29.2012 , 01:50 AM | #21
Okay, so... unfortunately the CSR side of customer service disagrees with the CM side. I submitted a bug report as I was instructed here, and was told by the CSR that Jorgan is working as intended and that, in short, there's no stopping Jorgan once he falls in love. I was told to post in the Suggestion Box forum instead... which I guess I'll do next : \

CharlesBoyd's Avatar


CharlesBoyd
04.29.2012 , 11:24 AM | #22 Click here to go to the next staff post in this thread. Next  
Quote: Originally Posted by Harukaze View Post
I submitted a bug report as I was instructed here, and was told by the CSR that Jorgan is working as intended and that, in short, there's no stopping Jorgan once he falls in love.
It sounds like there are two separate issues at work here. Please correct me if I'm misinterpreting!

1) Your character entered the romance "path" with Jorgan, but you didn't intend for that to happen. This should not have been possible without picking Player options marked with [Flirt], specifically:

Spoiler

If you did not pick any of those options, and still ended up in a romance with Jorgan, then it's a bug.

2) Once your character was on the romance path, it was not possible to "break up" with Jorgan. I believe this is currently working as intended. That said, we've definitely seen all the feedback on the matter and are discussing possible changes to the system for the future, but I don't think we're ready to talk about any of those potential changes in detail as yet. As mentioned, please don't hesitate to post your own feelings on the matter in the suggestion box to add to the feedback!

If #1 occurred, please resubmit the issue and only mention that aspect of it, in order to clarify what needs to be investigated. And, again, I'm very sorry for all the trouble this has caused for you.

Khillian's Avatar


Khillian
04.30.2012 , 07:55 AM | #23
I sympathise with the OPs view. I'd like to see options within the Companion UI that allow you to select if that Companion should be 'romanceable'.

That way players would not be 'forced' to, even avoid, romance type options within dialogue or actions taken.

i.e. If the Romance 'tag' is set to NO then romance/flirt options should not even occur within dialogues.

..and for this particular Companion - I'd like to see an additional Quest option that sends him to a Veteranarian for the required procedures !

Drewhat's Avatar


Drewhat
04.30.2012 , 11:14 AM | #24
This is an AMERICAN video game! We should be able to be as entitled AND fickle about our romantic entanglements as possible. If aliens think that one romantic night means a relationship forever then that is their problem!

P.S. I would like a romance option with Bowdar pretty plz.

uberkind's Avatar


uberkind
04.30.2012 , 12:14 PM | #25
Quote: Originally Posted by CharlesBoyd View Post
2) Once your character was on the romance path, it was not possible to "break up" with Jorgan. I believe this is currently working as intended.
This is the problem, and I wish I'd known when I started my characters that [Flirt] in SWTOR means [Eventually Marry].

dmtvaroha's Avatar


dmtvaroha
04.30.2012 , 01:41 PM | #26
I sympathize (empathize?) with you, OP. This is bad. You should always have the option to break up with any NPC -- remove the appropriate affection points as well if necessary, but the option should be there. That shouldn't be too hard to implement I think.

Your term "Catboy" made me laugh, and now I'll forever think of him as such - thanks -- and really, it's like the NPC is harassing you, isn't it? You should be able to report him to Garza or something.

I guess these situations are one of the pitfalls for the dialogue-based story, and I suppose the voiceover work makes it even more difficult to correct. Hopefully over time the dialogue choices (& their text descriptions) will become more refined over time.

deags's Avatar


deags
04.30.2012 , 06:45 PM | #27
Dam those thundercats, one small flirt and they will never leave you along again
Vors, sith assassin of Guild Grievance
www.grievanceguild.com

BlackMink's Avatar


BlackMink
04.30.2012 , 08:34 PM | #28
This topic sounds like the opposite of the problem I had. I recently leveled a female trooper, and I don't recall EVER seeing a [flirt] option with jorgan. I actually got all the way to the end of the game and finished all my companion's dialog and had to ask a friend who the romance option was supposed to be. Not that I want to romance Jorgan, but I think its worth mentioning that I never had the option.

Taalbert's Avatar


Taalbert
05.01.2012 , 02:31 AM | #29
Quote: Originally Posted by Khillian View Post

..and for this particular Companion - I'd like to see an additional Quest option that sends him to a Veteranarian for the required procedures !
Awwww, poor kitty!

Kubernetic's Avatar


Kubernetic
05.01.2012 , 04:28 AM | #30
Quote: Originally Posted by CharlesBoyd View Post
It sounds like there are two separate issues at work here. Please correct me if I'm misinterpreting!

1) Your character entered the romance "path" with Jorgan, but you didn't intend for that to happen. This should not have been possible without picking Player options marked with [Flirt], specifically:

Spoiler

If you did not pick any of those options, and still ended up in a romance with Jorgan, then it's a bug.

2) Once your character was on the romance path, it was not possible to "break up" with Jorgan. I believe this is currently working as intended. That said, we've definitely seen all the feedback on the matter and are discussing possible changes to the system for the future, but I don't think we're ready to talk about any of those potential changes in detail as yet. As mentioned, please don't hesitate to post your own feelings on the matter in the suggestion box to add to the feedback!

If #1 occurred, please resubmit the issue and only mention that aspect of it, in order to clarify what needs to be investigated. And, again, I'm very sorry for all the trouble this has caused for you.
Charles, I just want to say that I really appreciate your posting here and contributing to this thread. I think it illustrates the perseverance that you all have for making this game better, and it's great to see.

Obviously companion relationships are a big thing, and I've seen a few threads like this where people feel forced into some kind of relationship due to some previous choice. While I do understand the programmer decision-tree reasoning that might lead one to assume that "Since they flirted at Opportunity A, this means that this should forever be the case", this is not at all how the game should operate, as real relationships don't operate this way either.

Things may happen that lead a change in heart, for example. A close mission where a companion is injured and nearly dies after flirting behavior may lead a CO to decide that getting close to the subordinate was a bad idea. On the other end, an initial rejection of flirting options might be outweighed over time by a greater affection for the character, and a desire to see more flirting behavior present itself.

I understand this throws your development decision trees into complete chaos, but you have spent so much time developing these companions and their own personalities, the romance arcs and so forth that I think it would be a shame not to continue expanding them and enhancing their decision points. And the possible necessities of a clean and easy decision tree can obviously lead to some rather unfortunate side effects if something happens, like the OP's issue with being forced into a situation they are not at all interested in, regardless of what may have happened so many decision points ago.

Going forward, there should always be options to stop the behavior that is happening. It would be nice to have some possible trigger points to re-ignite those paths down the road, but the definite focus I think should be more on the side of allowing players an "out" to avoid further action on a particular romance arc.

As a side note, and perhaps something you and your colleagues haven't considered, there are young children playing this game, and reading through these story arcs. Not all of them have parents that feel comfortable discussing these issues with them and teaching them how to conduct romantic interactions, sometimes because they just never thought about it in depth, or sometimes because they feel it would be some sort of a "license" to their kids to engage in that behavior, etc.

In these instances, your decisions, and your game, may have a marked influence on these youngsters in terms of how they see relationships, and in what ways they might try to mimic what they see in the game. I know of at least one 12 year old I've bumped into in the game and I'm sure there are many more.

Little girls playing the game who find themselves trapped in a romance arc and can't escape from it may internalize that to some degree, and chalk it up as something that is expected of females in general. Little boys playing the game who find themselves constantly being urged to flirt with every female they see might also internalize that and imagine that might be proper behavior, even in professional situations like a military squad. And these two can easily be reversed, with boys playing characters that feel trapped in situations, or girls being exposed to constant flirting prompts.

I'm not saying you're responsible for parenting these kids, and I'd hate to see all of this scrubbed to take romances out completely, but your decisions as developers should at least entail some thoughtfulness as to all of your customers and their demographics, and really shouldn't short-change any of them.

If you need to hire some relationship consultants to come in and do some workshops with the relationship arc story writers, do so! If you need to pay some relationship psychologists to come in and examine the possible relationship decisions to make improvements, do it! It can only result in a better, more well rounded game in the long run, and one that many of your players would appreciate... some of them knowingly... and some of them later one when they look back from a point in their future.

But again, kudos for your sharp eye in watching these forums and your eagerness to dive in and figure out what the problem was and try to fix the situation going forward. It's folks like you that will mean the success of this game in the long term.

Now then, when do I get to start flirting with General Garza?
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