Tank Assassins (and Shadows) are ruining PvP.

Lots of new issues and information being brought to light in this exhilerating thread.

QFT. Shadow/Sin tank hybrid specs have been out of whack since beta.

Because a class with taunt, a crippling AE debuff that does good damage, and guard is going to be really bad in large fights?

If anything Tankasins are even more powerful in large scale fights.

I stack power too. However, what those screenshots won't tell you is who were they fighting. You'll never see a 600K damage from a sin/shadow against equally geared teams.

For the record - I main Tankasin and chose to do so when I first logged in during late beta. I didn't care whether that class/spec would be strong or not - it's not the first mmo I play and I am conscious of the obligatory buff/nerf cycle - I just liked the concept of the AC and intended to tank in PvP, if possible.

When I hit 50, geared myself up, embraced the buff in 1.1.3 (iirc) and finally switched from the survivor to the stalker set, I was glad to discover that we were at the top of the food chain. Tankasins were the duel kings and excelled both in group and solo situations in the warzones.

For 1.2 I predicted a nerf and hoped for a redesign of the defense mechanics in PvP (thus making the tank sets viable in PvP). Well I was wrong.

Still, we don't exactly know how the new metagame will play out. 8m premade play will definitely shift the perceived value of the ACs. Same goes for the gearing process - it will be different when the majority of the players runs modded wh gear. Maybe we will even see new specs have their patch duration of fame (snipers, I am looking at you)...

Even though there are classes, that surpass us in terms of survivability or dps/burst - they never do in both (well, except maras ofc). And no other AC surpasses us in the utility department. Add to the mix, that the difference in survivability and damage compared to our respectively stronger peers is not too big and you'll come up with the godmode jack-of-all-trades you all know and love

But please do not forget, that the difference isn't as big as the qq crowd wants to believe as well. Maras are unarguably at a very strong spot atm, maybe the strongest, juggs just got buffed, too, pyro pt damage is insane right now, operatives are still able to do their thing if in capable hands, etc....

Long story short - balance actually is quite fine atm. Only Sorcs, Mercs and Medics got the shaft for now, while Maras and Tankasins shine a little (exact diference being debatable) too much.

Often it is just a l2p issue, but in the case of Tankasin - there is truth in the complaints. We are neither unkillable nor the strongest damage dealers - but we have the best package of them all.

There are many ways to approach this issue, here are just a few alternatives:

- change dc (tanking stance) to an increased damage penalty (and add an aggro modifier to counteract for PvE)
- make tank stats viable in PvP (involving drastic changes to the overall PvP situation; probably the hardest to do, but my personal favorite)
- buff the other AC's survivability/utility/damage to get them on par (aka balance around this gem of an AC aka what they allegedly intend to do)
- nerf force shroud aka the best spell in swtor, maybe increase cd (hard to counterbalance for PvE, though...)

Maybe, due to the 'new metagame after patch 1.2' reasoning above, there isn't even a need for any changes to the Tankasin. Just let them fix the other ACs, if necessary.

That said, I'd be totally cool about tweaks like the above, as well. Hell, I could even live with a severely gimping nerf, just to get it over with...xD As I said in the beginning - buff/nerf cycle, its's an mmo constant. Enjoy it in the good times, endure it in the bad times. After being at the top for quite a while, it can be quite healthy to experience a change for the worse again. Playing through such a patch is pure practice and this will be ever the sweeter when the next buff comes around in a subsequnt patch.

tl;dr - Op is right imo. As a Tankasin player I may be biased. Still I perceive them as borderline op, but would recommend downtuning the qq - wait for the metagame to settle.

i play a tank assassin in dps gear, full battlemaster with 3 augmented war hero peices. my spec is 31/0/10. again all dps stalker gear and i augment for crit.

im a skilled player and yes i play my class very good and just yesturday alone, i 2v1'ed a bounty hunter and a maurader. they both where bad, .

32/4/5 here, and it's easy to win almost every 2v1 even if they're very skilled (only 2v1 that requires me to pop adrenal/trinkets is 2x Carnage Maras, in which case I need to kill one of them very quickly use shroud, force cloak, force speed, overload, and deflection at key moments -helps that I have a marauder, so I know when those key moments are-). Hell even if I'm solo defender in a Novare Coast or Civil War and I have a group of 6 come zerging in, I can effectively hold them off until help arrives (and usually end up killing 1 of them). Problem is we have too much of a combination of burst damage (proc and stack-based), survivability, cloaking, defensives, CC's, mobility (force speed 20s cooldown, breaks slows/roots), and utility (pull, wither, force slow, electrocute, spike, taunts, guard, self-healing). And if we happen to pair up with each other or group with multiples of each other (especially with staggered taunting), there's just no counter to us. Two of us will stunlock and kill all squishies in ~ 6-8 seconds, easy to pull healers away from their protectors for quick kills, etc. How can any good tankasin actually NOT feel dirty doing all this?

/signed on nerfing tank sin/shadow in pvp

Also the pull they have works with full resolve... FIX THIS NOW