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In SWTOR the "Real" Game starts at level 1

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
In SWTOR the "Real" Game starts at level 1

Majestic_Jazz's Avatar


Majestic_Jazz
04.03.2012 , 12:00 PM | #291
Quote: Originally Posted by Lethality View Post
The problem is not so much that the game starts at level 1, but rather than it ends at level 50 (or before.)
So why am I L50 now and still having fun with my character?
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Dawgtide's Avatar


Dawgtide
04.03.2012 , 12:03 PM | #292
Quote: Originally Posted by Klarick View Post
The only "true" end-game that any game can have is PvP. I will let you figure that statement out, as it would take a bit to explain it fully.

Your statement of End-Game IS the game is why MMOs of today fail. This paradigm was created by Blizzard, who because of their paradigm now has to spend months upon months and spend a huge budget in creating so called end-game content every two months. After all that time and money they sit back and watch their "end-game" players burn through it in 2 weeks then head to the forum and scream for more.
While, I agree with the original post, I don't here. What is end game for EQ? It is definately PVP. And it was long before WoW.

Stupiddrummer's Avatar


Stupiddrummer
04.03.2012 , 12:05 PM | #293
Quote: Originally Posted by Klarick View Post
Those that are new to MMO's may not fully appreciate this topics title. Let me explain. In most MMO's the "Real" game does not start until you reach the highest level and begin running the "so-called end-game content". Take the king of MMOS, WoW, as an example. The road from 1-85 is an excruciating one where nothing you do will have any impact on your toon at level 85. It is called a "grind" for a reason. WoW is not the only culprit here. Most MMOs follow this same broken paradigm.

SWTOR breaks the paradigm and sets a new one.

In SWTOR the "Real" game starts the moment you see the first cut-scene of your character. Starting at level 1 the decisions you make FORM your character. Each mission, each answer you chose has an impact. The game starts at level 1 -- not at the level end-cap! People, this is HUGE! It is genre-setting! It blows away the current MMO paraqdigm of grinding to end-cap levels.

This is why SWTOR succeeds. It is ground breaking in its approach. It amazingly combines the single player aspect with the MMO one. Dont let the complainers fool you either. There is an absolute TON of group content in this game. Yes -- It is an MMO in every aspect of the word EXCEPT it breaks the grind.

Your SWTOR life begins at level 1.
the game starts at max lvl because that's when you have the most people to play with.

There is always going to be more lvl 50s than lvl 14s. There is always going to be more lvl 50s than lvl 36s. There is always going to be more lvl 50s than lvl 40s. I hope you see what im getting at.

MMOs are designed for perpetual game-play, where the devs keep adding more content for you to complete until the game finally dies.

If you're playing a perpetual game, chances are you are going to get to max lvl. If you are still playing a perpetual game, chances are you are going to spend most of your time at max level.

The leveling process is designed to teach you howto play your class. Not be an end in itself. If you want your game to end at max level stop paying a subscription and pick up final fantasy 7 or something.

DevonDs's Avatar


DevonDs
04.03.2012 , 12:07 PM | #294
This is one of the reasons I love this game and expect to play for years to come.
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Dawgtide's Avatar


Dawgtide
04.03.2012 , 12:07 PM | #295
Quote: Originally Posted by Koboldfodder View Post
In themepark MMOs, the game basically starts at or near max level or when you reach a certain point. EQ2 it is max AA points, EQ1 it is around 85 with a set amount of AA points. WOW it is end game because that is the way it is set up. Same thing with Rift. LOTRO is a bit different even though it is a themepark game, but the main grouping part starts at around 60 and the raiding part stats at max levels.

Sandbox MMOs start as soon as you create your character.

You want well written quests, go play the original Everquest game. No "kill x number of beasts" there. In that game you had to read the NPC dialogue, then actually type something in to trigger something else. Then you had to think about the quest, and how it relates to the game world and lore then you had to search for possible quest components, and you would advance to the next part of the quest.

I can assure you, those quests were better written and better implemented than the tasks you have in TOR simply because the game mechanics allowed for players to think rather than react.

Entire gaming communities were created because of the quest system EQ had over a decade ago. There was no quest radar, no quest journal, no map icons, no hints when you moused over the mobs. You had your wits and your friends....of course, once the quest was completed you could just use a website.

That was a real quest system. I like TOR's system because I like Bioware's voice overs, but if you played EQ around 1999, you know exactly what I am talking about. That game also had a lot of built in frustration, something TOR does not have.
Loved it at the time, loved it for 8 years. But now, thank goodness times have changed. I don't have to go through hell levels or corpse runs anymore. Sometimes things get better with age. I do agree, that map icons for quests is bad. But hey, it is what it is....

Azzras's Avatar


Azzras
04.03.2012 , 12:09 PM | #296
I would think it's easier to add things to end-game than it is to revamp lvls 1-50.

Thus, I have to agree with OP in that SWTOR really does begin at lvl 1.

My own humble opinion.
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shaggscoob's Avatar


shaggscoob
04.03.2012 , 12:12 PM | #297
Quote: Originally Posted by kirorx View Post
I must admit that the best part of this game is ch.1 for all my toons. The downside is after the first 10 levels it the same side quests again on the same planets and in the same order.

Somewhere around level 30 or so the game feels like it slows down storywise and i find myself doing pvp or repeating flashpoints because i am tired of picking up the same side quests at every new bind location.

Its around level 30 were i start rerolling personally, I feel like i have lost interest by that point.

If this game just continued at a stready pace and you followed you questline only untill level 50 that would have been innovative. Not to waste anything, all the sidequest could be level 50 content that grants new gear and cool items for completing these storylines.

That would be more end game content and you would have so much fun leveling with less repetition and this would have cost no more money or time to create the system like that.
I know some of the side quests are close to questing areas, but that could just be fixed with placement or all the storylines quests could be instanced areas (most are anyway).
This is exactly why I do so much lateral play. I'll play a character one day, then another the next day, switching factions occasionally. It helps break the monotony. Additionally, I always do my current space missions(the ones that give xp) for all my characters each day (which is a bit of a grind, but I love the space mini game). This nets me a lot of xp, so my characters are sufficiently overleveled.

When characters are 5-6 levels overleveled, you can skip side quests here and there. Past nar shaddaa (which is also where I find the side quests start dragging things down), many times I'll just do class quest and heroics.

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Sirsri's Avatar


Sirsri
04.03.2012 , 12:14 PM | #298
In a year you'll spend 100-200 hours levelling and easily 10x that at level cap. Repeat for expansions. Right now I'm at 20 played days. It took me 4 to level and I basically only logged in for raids the last month or so. And we aren't even through the first tier yet, let alone the next 2 or 3 that will exist before the next expansion.

Leveling is a portion of the tutorial (the rest is not provided by bioware or Blizzard unfortunately) on how to play the game. It sets the tone, it tells a story, but ultimately the vast majority of the gameplay experience is when you are at level cap.

If anything BioWare did themselves a disservice with the leveling content. It's like a console game, a very tightly managed experience step by step, and then suddenly they can't do that anymore (once you finish your class quest at 50), and they just give up trying. It's a very strange experience, because it's like they didn't pay attention when we explained in beta, repeatedly, that the leveling experience exists to support the main game, not the other way around.

Taomist's Avatar


Taomist
04.03.2012 , 12:16 PM | #299
Quote: Originally Posted by Chokis View Post
Precisely why I love this game so much.
This.
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Dawgtide's Avatar


Dawgtide
04.03.2012 , 12:19 PM | #300
Quote: Originally Posted by Sirsri View Post
In a year you'll spend 100-200 hours levelling and easily 10x that at level cap. Repeat for expansions. Right now I'm at 20 played days. It took me 4 to level and I basically only logged in for raids the last month or so. And we aren't even through the first tier yet, let alone the next 2 or 3 that will exist before the next expansion.

Leveling is a portion of the tutorial (the rest is not provided by bioware or Blizzard unfortunately) on how to play the game. It sets the tone, it tells a story, but ultimately the vast majority of the gameplay experience is when you are at level cap.

If anything BioWare did themselves a disservice with the leveling content. It's like a console game, a very tightly managed experience step by step, and then suddenly they can't do that anymore (once you finish your class quest at 50), and they just give up trying. It's a very strange experience, because it's like they didn't pay attention when we explained in beta, repeatedly, that the leveling experience exists to support the main game, not the other way around.
Depends on the person too. I stopped my BH right when she finished at level 50 and finished the class chain. Now I am at 46 on my Consular. I have 6 classes to go. I may even do light and dark with each. The point is not everyone plays the same way. I will not spend more time at 50. I did that in EQ. Not again.