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No Cross Realm LFG tool please!


Feluraunt's Avatar


Feluraunt
04.02.2012 , 10:26 AM | #901
I apologize for posting and not reading all 50 pages of this thread. I may say things that have already been said, or... I might say things that will incur a flame... My only intent was to say what I feel about the topic of the original concept of the thread with my flare of the dramatic and sometimes obsolete ramblings.

To start with, I want to say I like SWTOR as a game... or maybe better stated is that I want to like it as a game, I just find it very incomplete in many different aspects (IE: User Interface Customization, Guild System, Support Ticket System, Crafting System, and Looking for Group to just name a few). Yes, yes… I know some of these things are coming, but I why are we having to wait?

With the number of MMO games released over the last decade, I feel that SWTOR is behind the times in many of the little things that make a game successful somewhat... fulfilling. I want to stay positive with this thread though, but it feels like no one in development paid any attention to other MMO games that have been created (successful or failures), or perhaps this game was being developed before the concepts of guild banks, customized user interfaces, looking for group features, and so forth. I have played many of these games (EverQuest , EverQuest II, Lineage II, Star Wars Galaxies, World of Warcraft, City of Heroes, Age of Conan, Lord of the Rings, Rift, Anarchy Online, EVE, Vanguard… to name a few too many) and yes, they all had growing pains… bugs… incompleteness. I just feel that SWTOR has delivered just enough to generate interest but not enough to be a complete system. I am not trying to make a comparison to a specific game, but perhaps the need of a MMO game for today’s market in general.

I now have 8 characters in SWTOR on one server, all but one is in the high 30’s and I am running out of options and patients. Perhaps I am on an unpopulated server (Kath Hound), but I find it near impossible to get into Flashpoints, or even to run Heroics on any planets without waiting (actually praying), pleading, begging, and offering a pile of credits and yet it still takes several hours to do one. About the only flashpoint I see not needing a LFG for is the first one (Republic or Empire), seems to be plenty of people looking for that one on the fleet. This general chat LFG wasn’t so bad when the game was first released, there were a ton of people on, but now I see less than 50 people on the fleet at peak times. Usually 20 to 25 and on some planets less than 4 people… not even enough to make a group for a heroic 4. Yeah, I know you can use companions… but that is not the point being made. MMO count doesn’t include companions, so perhaps the easy fix here is to take one of the M’s out of MMO.

So, I guess in conclusion I just find it somewhat sloppy to a release a MMO game and not have some of the most fundamental features that have become a necessity today… as in a real Looking For Group feature, but that is perhaps just my opinion. If a real LFG is coming, I applaud that. I would prefer a cross-server LFG system myself, at least for Flashpoints and Warzones. Heroics could be just server side, where you queue and wait. I know that introducing new content is a good thing; it just isn’t very exciting when I am unable to use the old content.

Regardless, if you read my post, thank you… I will try to stomach through the other 50 pages.

chaosdefined's Avatar


chaosdefined
04.02.2012 , 10:29 AM | #902
Quote: Originally Posted by Feluraunt View Post
I will try to stomach through the other 50 pages.
When you realise it's actually 91 pages, you may find your task a little harder

DarthTHC's Avatar


DarthTHC
04.02.2012 , 10:32 AM | #903
I managed to find 3 whole groups via the current LFG tool (read: spamming General).

In the first group, the group leader rolled NEED on everything. Everything. I warned him once. Then I left the group. You see, in the current tool, the group leader can kick anyone they want at any time, but there is no vote-kick feature to use on idiots such as this.

The second group was amazing. Everyone knew what they were doing. Crowd control was plentiful and unbroken. Chat was great. The run was flawless.

The third group was a bunch of MMO noobs. Nobody understood crowd control - how to use it and how not to break it. DPS face-pulled constantly. Tank never watched anyone's health before leaping into the fray; not even his own. Nobody self-healed after combat. They were unteachable.

So the current tool, for this weekend, has a 66% f***tard ratio.

But I'm sure a cross-server LFG tool will be far worse..... /sarcasm

Snoodmaster's Avatar


Snoodmaster
04.02.2012 , 10:35 AM | #904
Quote: Originally Posted by DarthKhaos View Post
How so? In my estimation there wouldn't be much additional cost.

You'd prob need dedicated servers for chat but the rest of things would operate similar to cross server flashpoints and warzones. Players would temporarily hop over to a server as one would a flashpoint/warzone. Players from various servers would share the general chat with everyone else in that flashpoint/warzone. The biggest hurdle I can see is the GTN and future guild banks.

Note the original characters would still reside on the server it was created on.
Imagine that you have 500,000 players in Imp Fleet. Designing a system to handle that, and a UI to make transitions smooth is a significant additional cost. Significant enough to likely require a redesign of the entire game. It can be done, and I would be very interested in an MMO that did it, but it's a much bigger challenge than just adding a LFG queue.

I can personally think of how I would implement a LFG queue. I.E. what data structures would be required and what likely programming challenges might crop up. I envision a global data structure on each server with methods for adding and removing characters, plus some overhead algorithms for matchmaking. Not a trivial task, maybe a month's work, but not particularly difficult.

I can't even begin to imagine trying to write code to convert 120 different servers into a single server. Or how to handle load balancing on that server.

Feluraunt's Avatar


Feluraunt
04.02.2012 , 10:50 AM | #905
Quote: Originally Posted by chaosdefined View Post
When you realise it's actually 91 pages, you may find your task a little harder
I obviously missed that number didn't I

chaosdefined's Avatar


chaosdefined
04.02.2012 , 10:54 AM | #906
Quote: Originally Posted by Feluraunt View Post
I obviously missed that number didn't I
There are some great posts on how the LFD tool could help and how they could take the model designed by other games and then make it better. Unfortunately you gotta get through a whole lot of crying and ranting from people who got upset over in another game...

Meldwyn's Avatar


Meldwyn
04.02.2012 , 10:55 AM | #907
Quote: Originally Posted by Feluraunt View Post
I apologize for posting and not reading all 50 pages of this thread. I may say things that have already been said, or... I might say things that will incur a flame... My only intent was to say what I feel about the topic of the original concept of the thread with my flare of the dramatic and sometimes obsolete ramblings.

To start with, I want to say I like SWTOR as a game... or maybe better stated is that I want to like it as a game, I just find it very incomplete in many different aspects (IE: User Interface Customization, Guild System, Support Ticket System, Crafting System, and Looking for Group to just name a few). Yes, yes… I know some of these things are coming, but I why are we having to wait?

With the number of MMO games released over the last decade, I feel that SWTOR is behind the times in many of the little things that make a game successful somewhat... fulfilling. I want to stay positive with this thread though, but it feels like no one in development paid any attention to other MMO games that have been created (successful or failures), or perhaps this game was being developed before the concepts of guild banks, customized user interfaces, looking for group features, and so forth. I have played many of these games (EverQuest , EverQuest II, Lineage II, Star Wars Galaxies, World of Warcraft, City of Heroes, Age of Conan, Lord of the Rings, Rift, Anarchy Online, EVE, Vanguard… to name a few too many) and yes, they all had growing pains… bugs… incompleteness. I just feel that SWTOR has delivered just enough to generate interest but not enough to be a complete system. I am not trying to make a comparison to a specific game, but perhaps the need of a MMO game for today’s market in general.

I now have 8 characters in SWTOR on one server, all but one is in the high 30’s and I am running out of options and patients. Perhaps I am on an unpopulated server (Kath Hound), but I find it near impossible to get into Flashpoints, or even to run Heroics on any planets without waiting (actually praying), pleading, begging, and offering a pile of credits and yet it still takes several hours to do one. About the only flashpoint I see not needing a LFG for is the first one (Republic or Empire), seems to be plenty of people looking for that one on the fleet. This general chat LFG wasn’t so bad when the game was first released, there were a ton of people on, but now I see less than 50 people on the fleet at peak times. Usually 20 to 25 and on some planets less than 4 people… not even enough to make a group for a heroic 4. Yeah, I know you can use companions… but that is not the point being made. MMO count doesn’t include companions, so perhaps the easy fix here is to take one of the M’s out of MMO.

So, I guess in conclusion I just find it somewhat sloppy to a release a MMO game and not have some of the most fundamental features that have become a necessity today… as in a real Looking For Group feature, but that is perhaps just my opinion. If a real LFG is coming, I applaud that. I would prefer a cross-server LFG system myself, at least for Flashpoints and Warzones. Heroics could be just server side, where you queue and wait. I know that introducing new content is a good thing; it just isn’t very exciting when I am unable to use the old content.

Regardless, if you read my post, thank you… I will try to stomach through the other 50 pages.

Valid, all valid points!
welcome to the discussion, pull up a chair and stay for a while!
My epiphany about End Game in SWTOR!

ferroz's Avatar


ferroz
04.02.2012 , 11:05 AM | #908
Quote: Originally Posted by chaosdefined View Post
Well the cost of buying the new equipment for setting it all up, not to mention the staff hours.
Why assume that it would require any new equipment?

Feluraunt's Avatar


Feluraunt
04.02.2012 , 11:05 AM | #909
Quote: Originally Posted by chaosdefined View Post
There are some great posts on how the LFD tool could help and how they could take the model designed by other games and then make it better. Unfortunately you gotta get through a whole lot of crying and ranting from people who got upset over in another game...
I played WOW since beta... I am used to the QQ

But, on that topic, I think some of the crying has merit. BioWare cannot please everyone, no game can. This is why I didn't compare to any specific game. I just think smart money is on a game that thinks of its future by looking at the past... "Those who do not know their history are doomed to repeat it" and that is what we have here.

So, no game in history of MMO has released with a LFG, LFD. I am okay with that, but BioWare could have been pro-active and had one ready to be implemented if it became necessary, which by the number of QQ and non-QQ posts on this thread seems to have hit the necessary mark.

** Slowly I am reading the back posts, while at work. **

ferroz's Avatar


ferroz
04.02.2012 , 11:06 AM | #910
Quote: Originally Posted by chaosdefined View Post
When you realise it's actually 91 pages, you may find your task a little harder
we're currently on page 23 for me.