Please upgrade your browser for the best possible experience.

Chrome Firefox Internet Explorer
×

The Jedi Shadow Handbook v2.0

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes > Jedi Consular > Shadow
The Jedi Shadow Handbook v2.0

Zintair's Avatar


Zintair
03.26.2012 , 11:35 AM | #11
Updated the force potency correction under KC as well as improved the Balance section to better describe the priority list and mechanics behind why Project isn't so high on the list anymore due to inefficiency. I left it in the rotation for Twin Disciplines buff if its possible to keep it up.

Truthfully when you reach 30+% crit your Force regen should allow you to drop a few Project bombs with Potency up if you don't want to use it on FiB for AoE reasons.
Sanctus formerly Serenity (PotF)
A Republic PvE/PvP Guild
Website | Video | Thread

Philosomanic's Avatar


Philosomanic
03.26.2012 , 12:29 PM | #12
You asked me for feedback on this in another thread, so here goes.

Quote: Originally Posted by Zintair View Post
Priority List (Standard):

1. Force in Balance (Even single target, every CD)
2. Spinning Strike (Target at 30% health or less)
3. Shadow Strike (Find Weakness, behind target)
4. Mind Crush (Force Strike buff, preferentially on an unafflicted target)
5. Sever Force (On a target not currently afflicted, or about to expire)
6. Force Breach (every CD or until DoT expires on boss)
7. Double Strike (bread and butter DPS spam for 2k+ damage totals)
8. Project (If Twin Disciplines is not active or expiring, very Force intensive so limit this)
9. Saber Strike (Conserving Force)
I would suggest swapping Mind Crush with Shadow Strike. Using Mind Crush more frequently will raise your force efficiency, as it's free. It also self-heals and does really high damage. Since it has a higher proc rate and lower proc limit, I think it's more important to keep Mind Crush going than to use Shadow Strike.



Quote: Originally Posted by Zintair View Post
Force in Balance: Use it on cooldown. It deals a lot of armor-bypassing damage and heals a moderate amount on each usage. Force Suppression allows it to return Force to you, but you will always lose more Force than you gain on a cast unless you're using a Force Striked Mind Crush. It's particularly effective for breaking enemy attempts at capturing an objective - you can use it to blast someone around a corner - but beware its three person target cap.
I would change it to something like this:

Force in Balance: Use it on cooldown. It deals a lot of direct damage, increases damage from your DoTs, and self-heals. Force Suppression charges are key to keeping your force up; Force In Balance restores 80 (against one target) to 240 (against three targets) force every minute. Be sure to put at least one DoT (Force Breach or Sever Force) on any target hit by Force In Balance. In PvP, it's particularly effective for breaking enemy attempts at capturing an objective - you can use it to blast someone around a corner - but beware its three person target cap.

That better describes what it's used for, and points out that you need to keep a DoT on every target it hits.



Quote: Originally Posted by Zintair View Post
Force Breach: In Force Technique, it's your strongest damage DoT, and a basic part of your cycle. In Combat Technique, it functions like a cheaper (20 cost versus 30 cost) and weaker version of Slow Time that bypasses standard armor-based damage reduction. It has double the cooldown length, and deals less damage even against heavily armored targets. -5% accuracy is also a significantly weaker debuff than -5% damage in PvP, though it's the other way around in PvE. It's useful and necessary, but not very fun or compelling. Reserve it for cap breaking or very large crowds.
Having the information for the Combat Technique version of this skill is unnecessary and confusing (to new Shadows). Any Balance Shadow should be in Force Technique. Suggested update:

Force Breach: In Force Technique, it's your strongest damage DoT, has a low force cost, and has no cooldown. In PvE, this DoT should be maintained on every target that isn't going to die in the next five seconds. This allows you to do a lot of sustained damage to many targets at once. In PvP, it's usually a good idea to keep this on all nearby targets; however, if focus damage is critical then don't worry about keeping it up on everyone.



Quote: Originally Posted by Zintair View Post
Sever Force: In PvE, you simply use this ability on rotation - note that its cooldown is much shorter than its duration, so be careful of over-early reapplication. In PvP, its thirty meter range is your best friend; it can be used to stop opponents for two seconds, and does not respect Resolve; a well-timed Sever Force handles most of your anti-kiting needs and when well-timed, can kill a ball carrier over a fire pit, or prevent successful enemy capture of a point until you're able to return from the dead. However, if you suspect that you will need to use Force Lift on a target soon, do not use this ability on that target.
This no longer prevents people from capturing and objective. Additionally, the information about Force Lift really isn't necessary, since that applies to all DoTs. I'd recommend taking that off here and putting it into the Force Lift description.



Quote: Originally Posted by Zintair View Post
Resilience: Any ability that doesn't deal 'weapon damage' in its description is affected by this ability. Use it together with Force Cloak to make a successful escape, use it offensively when you anticipate a cast, use it to remove all healer-removable enemy effects on you... It's on a short cooldown and grants you five seconds of near-immunity. It's particularly useful for running the ball in Huttball, or surviving boss damage traps like those on the final boss of Athiss or Eternity Vault. Resilience is not affected by nor causes a global cooldown. Jedi Knights and Scoundrels have some immobilizes and snares which Resilience does not grant immunity to.
This only provides three seconds of immunity for a Balance Shadow.



Quote: Originally Posted by Zintair View Post
Mind Crush: Only when Force Strike is active. Instant, no-cost Mind Crushes will give you a significant amount of burst, as well as regen from Force Suppression charges. The only bad part is that you'll have to watch your buff bar closely as there is no easily noticed visual indicator of this somewhat rarely activated ability.
Force Strike actually makes you glow bright gold. A Balance shadow also glows briefly any time a DoT crits (and they're self-healed), which makes it harder to spot. However, after playing Balance for a little while it becomes pretty easy to see as long as Resilience isn't up.



Quote: Originally Posted by Zintair View Post
As with all Consulars, Willpower is your primary stat, and you use both physical and Force abilities. Your gear priority in PvE and PvP is identical; you want Critical Rating and Surge Rating until the diminishing returns get too high. (Usually around 400 each.) Around 5% accuracy from gear is useful - much more and you are subject to diminishing returns that reduce the value of the gear. Your adrenals and active-use relics will prefer to be Surge Rating and Power so that they can be used in conjunction with your Potency. In PvP, Expertise Rating will be your single most important statistic.

The problem is gearsets. You can simply use the Stalker sets for PvE, but for PvP, you will want to use modified Force-Master item sets, taking out the Alacrity bonuses for Accuracy instead. The 2 piece bonus is immense. Depending on whether you use Project kiting regularly or prefer to slow to melee range more often, you may stick with Force-Master for the 4 piece bonus, or switch to Stalker for its 2 piece bonus.
Two pieces of feedback here. First, you need to specifiy whether you're talking about the PvP sets or PvE sets. Our PvE Stalker 4-piece bonus is incredible, but the 4-piece for PvP Stalker is almost worthless.

Also, I think you should change to reflect a higher focus on crit. In my Opinion, every Balance Shadow should have a minimum of 25% base crit. A large part of our damage comes from our crit rate. All of our DoTs and FiB have a 30% crit multiplier bonus, and Double Strike (our bread and butter spam skill) has +50% crit multiplier. Crits also give us a large amount of mitigation. That constant stream of self-heals adds up quickly.

I've found the crit+surge relic and power adrenal to make a better combination. The added crit rate means even more self-healing, and the surge/power means more sustained DPS. Also, Accuracy is a low priority for us. A large portion of our damage comes from force skills, and our only proc has a really high chance to activate. A Balance Shadow should definitely not go above 5% Accuracy if they can avoid it.



Hope that helps!
PvP Dacromir -- Vanguard -- Level 50 PvE
The Imp'Crusher Legacy
<Something Offensive>
The Bastion

Philosomanic's Avatar


Philosomanic
03.26.2012 , 12:34 PM | #13
Oh, and one other thing! Balance should get the gold color scheme. Balance Shadows are cosnstantly flashing/glowing gold, and all of our force skills involve golden energy/light. Stick Infiltration with purple :P
PvP Dacromir -- Vanguard -- Level 50 PvE
The Imp'Crusher Legacy
<Something Offensive>
The Bastion

Zintair's Avatar


Zintair
03.26.2012 , 01:32 PM | #14
Quote: Originally Posted by Philosomanic View Post
Oh, and one other thing! Balance should get the gold color scheme. Balance Shadows are cosnstantly flashing/glowing gold, and all of our force skills involve golden energy/light. Stick Infiltration with purple :P
HAHA ok taking care of these corrections. Appreciate the detailed feedback for the community. Most of this is a month + out of date. I'll be going through Kinetic Combat with a fine tooth comb tonight.

Could also use an Infiltration specialist to help check that section and make sure everything is in order.

Thanks again Philosomanic, appreciate you taking the time to help.
Sanctus formerly Serenity (PotF)
A Republic PvE/PvP Guild
Website | Video | Thread

Philosomanic's Avatar


Philosomanic
03.26.2012 , 02:22 PM | #15
Thanks for changing the color scheme! Two other small things I noticed:


Quote: Originally Posted by Zintair View Post
Priority List (Standard):

1. Force in Balance (Even single target, every CD)
2. Spinning Strike (Target at 30% health or less)
3. Mind Crush (Force Strike buff, preferentially on an unafflicted target)
4. Shadow Strike (Find Weakness, behind target)
5. Sever Force (On a target not currently afflicted, or about to expire)
6. Force Breach (every CD or until DoT expires on boss)
7. Double Strike (bread and butter DPS spam for 2k+ damage totals)
8. Project (If Twin Disciplines is not active or expiring, very Force intensive so limit this)
9. Saber Strike (Conserving Force)
Mind Crush has a duration of six seconds, and the proc (Force Strikes) can only apply every 7.5s or more. The base cooldown is 15s. This means that it's virtually impossible to apply to an already-afflicted target. You'd have to use the cast-time, high-cost version, proc Force Strikes, and then use the instant-cast version. Maybe take that part out?



Quote: Originally Posted by Zintair View Post
Mind Crush: Only when Force Strike is active. Instant, no-cost Mind Crushes will give you a significant amount of burst, as well as regen from Force Suppression charges. The only bad part is that you'll have to watch your buff bar closely as there is no easily noticed visual indicator of this somewhat rarely activated ability. Force Strike actually makes you glow bright gold.
"There is no visual indicator. On an unrelated note, this makes you light up gold."

Think you can spot the issue there :P. Also, maybe you should move this up the list a bit? It's one of our five essential rotation skills, so it doesn't belong among the other lesser-used skills. It's in the right place for Kinetic/Infiltration (who should never use it, ever), but for Balance it deserves a nicer view.
PvP Dacromir -- Vanguard -- Level 50 PvE
The Imp'Crusher Legacy
<Something Offensive>
The Bastion

Zintair's Avatar


Zintair
03.26.2012 , 02:57 PM | #16
Both change have been made including moving it up the list to a more prominent spot. Thanks again! You have no idea how much your helping haha! It's so hard to catch these small scale mistakes when dealing with transfer of constantly changing information haha.

EDIT: Also gave you a special thanks for the help (which goes for anyone who can help me make this guide completely error free and updated. After all this guide is for YOU the community.

<3
Sanctus formerly Serenity (PotF)
A Republic PvE/PvP Guild
Website | Video | Thread

Sireene's Avatar


Sireene
03.26.2012 , 03:17 PM | #17
Hey everybody!

We just wanted to say thanks to all of you who are helping and contributing to this great thread, as well as a special thanks to the OP for taking on this endeavor!

We really appreciate it!

Philosomanic's Avatar


Philosomanic
03.26.2012 , 03:19 PM | #18
Quote: Originally Posted by Zintair View Post
Both change have been made including moving it up the list to a more prominent spot. Thanks again! You have no idea how much your helping haha! It's so hard to catch these small scale mistakes when dealing with transfer of constantly changing information haha.

EDIT: Also gave you a special thanks for the help (which goes for anyone who can help me make this guide completely error free and updated. After all this guide is for YOU the community.

<3
Thanks! I'm glad to help.

Ideally, this guide would be maintained by three people, each one an expert in one spec. I'm really knowledgeable about Balance, but I don't feel good enough about the others to give much advice. I know the basics, but I haven't really played them enough to really know what works.

Also, I enjoy how you added a line saying that Balance glows every time a DoT crits :P

EDIT: Ooh, Dev post. Cool ^^
PvP Dacromir -- Vanguard -- Level 50 PvE
The Imp'Crusher Legacy
<Something Offensive>
The Bastion

shagatha's Avatar


shagatha
03.26.2012 , 03:29 PM | #19
Quote: Originally Posted by Philosomanic View Post
Also, I enjoy how you added a line saying that Balance glows every time a DoT crits :P
Never noticed but gotta check it next time I'm balance. I stopped watching procs on char after coming from sith assassin -> shadow because infiltration tactics didn't glow like it does on sith. Which is a shame.

VERY NICE job putting this updated handbook up!
Misery (Surmansola Legacy) @ Dxun Battle Circle
Most known as Shagath(8th life sorc) in DDO

Zintair's Avatar


Zintair
03.26.2012 , 03:48 PM | #20
Quote: Originally Posted by Philosomanic View Post
Thanks! I'm glad to help.

Ideally, this guide would be maintained by three people, each one an expert in one spec. I'm really knowledgeable about Balance, but I don't feel good enough about the others to give much advice. I know the basics, but I haven't really played them enough to really know what works.

Also, I enjoy how you added a line saying that Balance glows every time a DoT crits :P

EDIT: Ooh, Dev post. Cool ^^
Agreed thats sort of where my mind was taking it as well. 3 Shadows who play the majority of their time in either KC/Bal/Inf.

I am mostly Kinetic so can handle that and with Philosomanic helping me with Balance we are set on two, just need someone who is really particular to Infiltration. I can work with it for now but it is my least used spec out of the three.
Sanctus formerly Serenity (PotF)
A Republic PvE/PvP Guild
Website | Video | Thread