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Consular Sage Seer Talent Spell Redundancy?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes > Sage / Sorcerer
Consular Sage Seer Talent Spell Redundancy?

baddyfett's Avatar


baddyfett
12.14.2011 , 11:59 AM | #1
I have planned on and will continue to level my Sage Seer but I was looking at the talent tree and something struck me as odd. There are two talent-acquired spells in the Seer tree.
They are....

Rejuvenate
Instant
Force: 30
Range: 30m
Immediately heals a target for a 97 - 153, plus an additional 134 over 9 seconds.

(you can then add on to this with more talent points into Conveyance and Force Shelter.)

but then the second spell is...

Healing Trance
Instant
Force: 40
Range: 30m
Heals a target for 143 immediately and a further 143 per second for 3 seconds.

(at higher levels it increases to 1083 healed and 1083 over 3 seconds)


My main question, though, is why are we investing 5 talent points into attaining and then bolstering Rejuvenate and then 2 levels later getting Healing Trance? Then having to bolster that ability and possibly replace Rejuvenate completely?

Why don't we get two abilities that complement each other for different situations/encounters instead of the same spell re-wrapped?
Joa'shan of the Ardor Legacy l 50 Jedi Consular
<Never Tell Me The Odds>

Lord Praven
l PvE US PST

TiVOs's Avatar


TiVOs
12.14.2011 , 12:22 PM | #2
I think they begin to become more separate once you've got Conveyance and Resplendence. Rejuvenate procs Conveyance which raises the crit chance of Healing Trance (a channeled spell vs. the fire & forget that Rejuvenate is) to a point where it's a fairly reliable spell to proc Resplendence, which negates the costs of Noble Sacrifice.

Force regen combo aside, Rejuvenate's a HoT and Healing Trance is channeled, so having Healing Trance allows you to hit your target with both healing over time effects ticking simultaneously.
<><
"Don't feed the trolls!" ~Proverbs 9:7-9
The Alcyon Legacy

baddyfett's Avatar


baddyfett
12.14.2011 , 12:27 PM | #3
I guess i just don't understand why they wouldn't make them two different styles of spells in order to trigger two different procs. I assume this is what they wanted since they aren't going to overlook the talent tree spells at launch.

Just thought maybe someone could clear up my curiosity and possibly tell me how they are different or are to be used in different scenarios.

But as far as i can tell, it looks like you stack Rejuvenate on a few people and wait for the Conveyance procs, then use the one you get to benefit healing all around... and maybe when your low on Force, use Healing Trance to get the Resplendence proc...
Joa'shan of the Ardor Legacy l 50 Jedi Consular
<Never Tell Me The Odds>

Lord Praven
l PvE US PST

Llenyd's Avatar


Llenyd
12.14.2011 , 12:46 PM | #4
There is a difference.

Rejuv is a front-loaded HOT; Healing Trance is a channeled heal.

Rejuv places a moderate heal immediately, then heals a small amount every 3 seconds. It heals slowly, can be cast on the run, and you can move/cast while it is ticking away.

Healing Trance gives a moderate heal every second. It heals quickly and cannot be cast on the move. Healing Trance is like a healing version of our Telekinetic Throw.

Both spells have their place.

Liaskar's Avatar


Liaskar
12.14.2011 , 12:47 PM | #5
They are different styles. Healing trance is channeled, meaning you can't just pop it and forget about it.

Like the above poster said, once you buff them with talents they become even more unique. Rejuvenate becomes the heal you use first, to proc conveyance. Healing trance gets its critical chance buffed by conveyance, so you use that. When healing trance crits, it procs resplendence which allows you to regen mana for free with noble sacrifice. It's a very beautiful system.

EDIT: Also, there's no waiting for conveyance if you put two points into it. It has a 100% chance to proc. D:

Sage
Scoundrel

TiVOs's Avatar


TiVOs
12.14.2011 , 12:53 PM | #6
Additionally, by themselves, Rejuvenate is more Force efficient (7.7 - 9.57 hp/F) compared to Healing Trance (7.15 hp/F), but traited up, Healing Trance extends to a 50m range. I don't know what Rejuvenate's final healing numbers are, though.
<><
"Don't feed the trolls!" ~Proverbs 9:7-9
The Alcyon Legacy

baddyfett's Avatar


baddyfett
12.14.2011 , 01:10 PM | #7
Ahhhh.. I completely understand now. I says nothing of Healing Trance being a channeled spell (but that makes sense with it's name).

Thanks for the explanation. I didn't reach that high in the talent tree in beta so i was curious. Sounds like it makes for a nice dynamic rotation.
Joa'shan of the Ardor Legacy l 50 Jedi Consular
<Never Tell Me The Odds>

Lord Praven
l PvE US PST

Cartho's Avatar


Cartho
12.16.2011 , 03:37 AM | #8
Aye they're totally different spells.

Rejuv procs Conveyance, which gives Healing Trance a powerful crit buff. HT will be your go to heal for people taking alot of damage when you've got a conveyance proc. Rejuv is something you'll probably keep rolling on the tank for the armour buff and the healing. When raid healing you'll probably be spot healing with it on targets taking damage due to its slightly frontloaded nature. The 6 second cooldown and 9 second duration means you won't be able to blanket a group with it like you could with rejuv in WoW.

So yeah, both HT and Rejuv are very important tools - there is no element of redundancy.
Slashinator, Sith Juggernaut - The Shadow Runner EU

KivanSane's Avatar


KivanSane
12.16.2011 , 03:45 AM | #9
When examining these powers you need to do more than crunch numbers. You need to look for ..

is it instant ?

Classic Fire and forget. can't be interrupted and the only way it doesn't go off is if some elite one shot kills you.

Is there a long cool down ?

Two identical heals with long cool downs means you doubled your healing ability.

Is it channeled (ie: you could be interrupted)

This applies to stuff with long casting times too. You can be interrupted by a knock back or such in the middle and it won't go off. Not a good thing if you're up close and personal.


Does it have a healing over time component. (or damage over time)

There's actually three of thse, a front loaded heal over time , a rear loaded one , and a pure heal over time eavenly spread out.

This is the one you throw on the tank when you see him charging into a mob , but he hasn't taken any damage yet, but you know he's about to.


.
.
.
Tactics are important here. Each ability in it's place. High powered heals usually have a draw back of some kind , so look for it.
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