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New Shadow tank - slightly confused on what stats to stack

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes > Roles > Tanking
New Shadow tank - slightly confused on what stats to stack

Elyons's Avatar


Elyons
02.25.2012 , 11:49 PM | #1
Hey guys, I've been leveling a Consular Shadow tank for guild purposes and I'm looking for some advice on what the most beneficial tank stat is for this class?
Seeing that kinetic ward increases shield chance by 15% I naturally thought that shield and absorb would be the main secondary to stack - however I read a thread on tank builds and it mentioned that shield rating can be pushed off the scales completely if the enemy crit rating is high enough. It also stated that force and tech attacks can go completely through shield! Now im not to worried about the Latter as it is mostly only a problem in pvp, but the former has me a bit worried...

If force and tech attacks can go straight through my shield rating then wouldn't any time I fight a Sith/tech user I'd end up being destroyed due to half my defenses being gone?

You can see my concern.
If anyone can clear this up for me and or suggest the proper stat for me to be stacking then I'd send you cookies and flowers plus watch you as you sleep loyally for the rest of your days (most likely not)

Thank you!
Kaserai:Jedi Sentinel Mahddi:Smuggler Scoundrel
Begeran Colony

moneky's Avatar


moneky
02.25.2012 , 11:53 PM | #2
There are no tanks in PVP, there are people with high hp but no mitigation tanks. You want to get pieces that are for DPS users or you can pick pieces that have high end which will increase your hp pool. Usually they come with shield/absorb mods/enhancements and you need to switch them out for crit/surge/power mods/enhancs for you to be useful in WZ's/Ilum. I've seen Shadows run around with kinetic ward and shadows that do not, in the end its up to you if you want to use it. Yes you'll be easy target for people that have a lot of tech/force attacks but you'll have enough hp pool to survive it and smack their face in.

Elyons's Avatar


Elyons
02.25.2012 , 11:58 PM | #3
Hmm, thank you. That will probably help with PvP greatly!

I'm sorry if I didn't clarify though, I'm looking for the main secondary stat to stack in PVE
Kaserai:Jedi Sentinel Mahddi:Smuggler Scoundrel
Begeran Colony

Ibiza-Vin's Avatar


Ibiza-Vin
02.26.2012 , 05:37 AM | #4
Quote: Originally Posted by Elyons View Post
Hey guys, I've been leveling a Consular Shadow tank for guild purposes and I'm looking for some advice on what the most beneficial tank stat is for this class?
Seeing that kinetic ward increases shield chance by 15% I naturally thought that shield and absorb would be the main secondary to stack - however I read a thread on tank builds and it mentioned that shield rating can be pushed off the scales completely if the enemy crit rating is high enough. It also stated that force and tech attacks can go completely through shield! Now im not to worried about the Latter as it is mostly only a problem in pvp, but the former has me a bit worried...

If force and tech attacks can go straight through my shield rating then wouldn't any time I fight a Sith/tech user I'd end up being destroyed due to half my defenses being gone?

You can see my concern.
If anyone can clear this up for me and or suggest the proper stat for me to be stacking then I'd send you cookies and flowers plus watch you as you sleep loyally for the rest of your days (most likely not)

Thank you!
I'm terribad at explaining these kind of things but I'll try my best. Your shield rating will never go "off the charts completely".

Mob attacks are determined by two rolls:

The first roll determines if an attack lands or if you parry/deflect it (determined by defense chance)
The second roll determines if the attack is a hit, a crit, or shielded (crits are never shielded)

So, assuming you have a 30% shield chance while tanking a mob with a 20% crit rate, any attack that gets through the first roll (ie actually hits you) will have a 30% chance to be shielded, 20% chance to crit, and 50% to just be a normal hit.

Now assume you got your shield chance up to the gear cap of 50% and are tanking a mob with a 50% crit chance. You now have a 0% chance of being hit with a normal hit since every attack that lands will either crit or be shielded. At this point any extra shield chance you have (from kinetic/dark ward, for example) won't be taken into account since you can't "push" the crit rating lower.

That was an extreme example. Bosses don't have anywhere near 50% crit. I can't tell you the exact number since we don't have combat log data to parse but I'd estimate they have under 30% crit, meaning you can stack shield up to the cap and still get the full benefit from KW without losing any shield chance.

The only boss that I know of that ONLY uses force/tech abilities is Soa. Every other boss will have weapon/physical damage that can be shielded.

As for what stats to focus on...high absorption rating is crucial to take advantage of shadows' high shield chance with KW. That doesn't mean you don't need shield rating, but stacking shield with only a 35% absorption is not optimal.

Defense of course is the most important, as avoiding attacks altogether is the best form of mitigation. Thankfully, shadows have a pretty high def to start with (16%) so you won't need that much def rating. Get enough to get to 24-25% defense chance and then start stacking absorb and shield.

Once you hit 50 I'd advise you gear yourself with Advanced Sturdiness Enhancements 22 (+18 end, +39 shield, +27 absorb) on your tanking gear.

TL;DR...Yes you're right....shield/absorb is the way to go. And make sure to get your def to 24-25%

PS If you get 2 Veracity Nano-Optic Resistance Implants that will help your stats tremendously...each one has +40 shield and +60 defense with possible +28 absorption in augment slots
Venni - 50 Assassin
<Casual>
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Battilea's Avatar


Battilea
02.26.2012 , 05:41 AM | #5
Quote: Originally Posted by Ibiza-Vin View Post
PS If you get 2 Veracity Nano-Optic Resistance Implants that will help your stats tremendously...each one has +40 shield and +60 defense with possible +28 absorption in augment slots
And the same on the earring.

Elyons's Avatar


Elyons
02.26.2012 , 11:15 AM | #6
Quote: Originally Posted by Ibiza-Vin View Post
I'm terribad at explaining these kind of things but I'll try my best. Your shield rating will never go "off the charts completely".

Mob attacks are determined by two rolls:

The first roll determines if an attack lands or if you parry/deflect it (determined by defense chance)
The second roll determines if the attack is a hit, a crit, or shielded (crits are never shielded)

So, assuming you have a 30% shield chance while tanking a mob with a 20% crit rate, any attack that gets through the first roll (ie actually hits you) will have a 30% chance to be shielded, 20% chance to crit, and 50% to just be a normal hit.

Now assume you got your shield chance up to the gear cap of 50% and are tanking a mob with a 50% crit chance. You now have a 0% chance of being hit with a normal hit since every attack that lands will either crit or be shielded. At this point any extra shield chance you have (from kinetic/dark ward, for example) won't be taken into account since you can't "push" the crit rating lower.

That was an extreme example. Bosses don't have anywhere near 50% crit. I can't tell you the exact number since we don't have combat log data to parse but I'd estimate they have under 30% crit, meaning you can stack shield up to the cap and still get the full benefit from KW without losing any shield chance.

The only boss that I know of that ONLY uses force/tech abilities is Soa. Every other boss will have weapon/physical damage that can be shielded.

As for what stats to focus on...high absorption rating is crucial to take advantage of shadows' high shield chance with KW. That doesn't mean you don't need shield rating, but stacking shield with only a 35% absorption is not optimal.

Defense of course is the most important, as avoiding attacks altogether is the best form of mitigation. Thankfully, shadows have a pretty high def to start with (16%) so you won't need that much def rating. Get enough to get to 24-25% defense chance and then start stacking absorb and shield.

Once you hit 50 I'd advise you gear yourself with Advanced Sturdiness Enhancements 22 (+18 end, +39 shield, +27 absorb) on your tanking gear.

TL;DR...Yes you're right....shield/absorb is the way to go. And make sure to get your def to 24-25%

PS If you get 2 Veracity Nano-Optic Resistance Implants that will help your stats tremendously...each one has +40 shield and +60 defense with possible +28 absorption in augment slots
Thank you! That will help immensely with my future builds . I appreciate the help!


Thanks again!
Kaserai:Jedi Sentinel Mahddi:Smuggler Scoundrel
Begeran Colony

felirx's Avatar


felirx
02.27.2012 , 05:53 AM | #7
Kinetic ward helps a lot against snipers, marauders and dps shadows, So I would suggest running a shield in offhand in pvp.

If you go 2stalker2survivor or 4survivor with swapped out mods is your own personal preference. You can either take 5m range to force slow / mind snap, or 5% more damage.
2+2 is slightly easier to gear for since you only need to get two extra pieces to swap mods out of, but in the long run it`s a nonfactor.

Inarai's Avatar


Inarai
03.01.2012 , 06:59 PM | #8
Quote: Originally Posted by moneky View Post
There are no tanks in PVP, there are people with high hp but no mitigation tanks. You want to get pieces that are for DPS users or you can pick pieces that have high end which will increase your hp pool. Usually they come with shield/absorb mods/enhancements and you need to switch them out for crit/surge/power mods/enhancs for you to be useful in WZ's/Ilum. I've seen Shadows run around with kinetic ward and shadows that do not, in the end its up to you if you want to use it. Yes you'll be easy target for people that have a lot of tech/force attacks but you'll have enough hp pool to survive it and smack their face in.
There are plenty of tanks in PvP in this game - big part of how a good team works.

In any case, so far as survival stats, there's Defense, Absorb, and Shield. Basically block chance, shield absorption, and shield rating. Higher defense helps things like keeping Ward up (as you're not being hit as much). Higher Absorb means your shield takes off more of the damage when its triggered. Higher Shield means its triggered more often. I'd probably say Defense first, Shield to a certain point, and then Absorb. There's also a certain school of thought saying you should mix in some damage stat for threat, such as crit or Surge.
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calibrik's Avatar


calibrik
03.01.2012 , 11:55 PM | #9
pretty much been said already, but once you start hitting around columi and rakata tiers, you wont have to much choice in the matter, your def is gonna hoover around 25%, absorb will be mid 40's, and shield will be 50 ish with ward up.

any 'stacking' will just offset the 3 stats by a few% at the greatest.

and i need i say your gonna be accuracy capped whether you like it or not =p
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