This game lacks epeen

Wow, isn't this interesting.

A couple of months ago (before the launch of the game - so on older forums) there was some talk about a system that would give casuals their "own little spot" - which i endorsed a lot. More specific, some form of Falshpoints where people would, if intended, be able to use more than one companion and give companion gear (maybe with a lot of Presence on it or whatever) and maybe some unique awards that would not affect gameplay but be aesthetically nice - like unique mounts or something.

Even more than that there were a lot more suggestions that hit the same "l33t" wall of hardcore players not wanting to lose their status - as if they would have been threatened by that since all the systems proposed would have been exclusive of the hardcore players, quite the contrary. Such said players would have had a much easier time completing the content...

It even took into consideration all the other players by adding that such content could be done with a group instead of 3 companions.

What did the hardcore say? Well, basically - "*** - that's not OP or HM FP so shove it up your arse" and such. Would have such content been easy to develop? Well, a lot more easier than developing more Operations for example since it was base on already developed content and systems (like the choice wheel, the companion system, already we have "Presence" as an attribute and so on and so forth). Would that have benefited a lot more players than the hardcore? Certainly.

So what happened? Beside some constructive elements brought into discussion the main counter argument was: "if u wanna feel l33t(er) than you so you have to do HM FP/OP like i do for the best rewards - and thats' the way it should stay" - the reason behind this being that those hardcore players would have wanted to be kings of the hill all the time - of all the "hills" so to say.

The discussion went so far as to trying to explain that "best" is a relative term (although an absolute from a linguistic point of view), and while HM OP/FP would offer the best rewards for such content any other system would offer the best rewards for that said content too. For example having drops with loads of Presence on it...

So my impression from the OPs is that now the hardcore players feel threatened (and their ego deflated) by the fact that the end game content is accessible to a lot more players simply by being easier - an impression nevertheless.

Double standard is your game. You have a system that makes you feel special (through hard work and dedication - which some people would call grind - that i admit to) but nonetheless oppose any other system that would bring at least part of that feeling to other categories through comparable amount of work and dedication - just other type of it. Each time something new is proposed you guys come in here and give the "too much trouble" argument stating that the resources should be concentrated towards developing OP/FP, not such a new system or the "there's no other MMO out there that has this" argument which is even more illogical since of course every other type of end game content was there at the big bang...

So there you are - i come now and say to this "well, shove it up your arse" and "WTH, the resources involved into making content that would be experienced only by hardcore players (<5% of the total playerbase) should most definitely be used to develop content that would be realistically accessible to the rest of 95% of the player base". Want to leave? Fine by me - can i get the gear? /irony

Beside the soar taste i get from all of this "epeen" attitude and how disgusted i am over such pathetic double standard coming from the hardcore players i will say that there is quite a lack of end game content. Nevertheless, right now, i would very much like to see a system that would benefit more players, since the current end game, simple as it is, is restricted to so few (from my point of view) yet so many (from a hardcore perspective) even if only because of a lack of better tools to find a group.

This has happened in every mmorpg which has been released since World of Warcraft, and no matter how unique or close to WoW the game is the "hardcore" come out and start attacking the game in the forums. It's always something that's "not catered for the hardcore community" and which will make them leave the game. Here you complain that the raids are too easy, while (more than likely the same) people complained that Age of Conan was "too grindy" and the raids were too hard, Rift was too easy, STO was retarded, Aion/WAR was too much of a grind etc etc.

The conclusion I've come to is that the compaints aren't so much about what they've done "wrong", but that the game isn't World of Warcraft, because they always go back there no matter how "crappy" the post WoW has become...

As long as Blizzard can do no wrong everyone else will fail in this group's eyes, no matter what they do...

Damned if you do and damned if you don't.

Well from I was able to gather from all that, I think that system would have been awesome and they totally should have done it.

Also the more I read on here, the more I'm starting to think we have entirely different definitions of hardcore players. My "hardcore", of which I am a member, is simply somebody who just wants a nice hard challenging game, nothing more. I'm taking your definition of "hardcore" as people who are like "I can do raidz and you can't, I'm so awesome!".

I call those people jerks, and they are most definitely not the ones I'm talking about.

I actually have to agree, this game has gotten excessively boring, and is down to dailies/weeklies. I consider Nightmare raids as a weekly. They're just so freakin easy. We've lost half our guild, replaced them, lost more, replaced them, it's getting tiring. Playing a game with no difficulty is pure boring. I can't understand why people love repitition so much, that it's come to this. I'll give 1.2 a shot, but if it's the same difficulty, I'll just have to just do rated bg's or quit if they don't bother balancing.

You are talking about the dragon soul raid........Paragon were also exploiting the Sinestra fight.

Ensidia were BANNED because of using bugged Saronite Bombs on LK25HC.

There were nerfs across the board, Normal and HM in FL's when they started seeing subs drop.

As for it being the devs fault that we can both agree on.

Ahhh, ok. Yea those bans happened, you just confused me. You start talking about firelands and them having to nerf HM Rag25 because even most hardcore guilds couldn't it, then you go onto to say that paragon had to exploit the fight to beat it. How was I supposed to know that you weren't talking about Rag anymore?

The Sinestra thing I always found suspicious considering Zarhym admitted they were watching that fight in realtime and apparently didnt realize they were exploiting until a few days later.

self-proclaimed hardcore-gamer will never accept that they are a vast minority (:

a bit on the fence for I have seen both sides but what remains is liking a challenge. However hard it may be, when it requires to do something once as the single goal, that's the challenge.

The hard factor can be maintained in so many different ways. Puzzles, multiple boss mobs to drop a item to move forward, Final boss drop. Having to do this whole sequence multiple times to get that said item mutilple-times for that other item, etc. It's just one example. However, many casuals may only see this once. Once the puzzles are figure out, once the paths are known, how to counter the boss's, once the gear is attained, it becomes trivial therefore the 'give us more' posts come out.

Perhaps warzone commendations can be spread out into the 4-man Heroics created on planet's where-as everyone can attain them. Just a crossing thought. I really don't care everything being thrown on a vendor for credits. After all, I am under 30k and lvl 40.

For the 10% they do, they completley alienate and discurage the rest of a playerbase with thier attitudes.

Surely it's content that is likely to keep them coming back !
There is no real need to keep subscribed if you have completed everything in the game.