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Design decisions and why the game engine hurts TOR

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
Design decisions and why the game engine hurts TOR

Agarwaenn's Avatar


Agarwaenn
02.20.2012 , 10:56 AM | #121
Quote: Originally Posted by Rabenschwinge View Post
The Unreal Engine is not suitable for an MMO above a certain scale. Single player games and MMOs are not the same thing.
After playing the Tera beta I can say you are completely wrong in this opinion. Better graphics, better draw distance, 100's of people around me with a solid 60 fps.

Try it yourself or go watch some 1080p videos of it on youtube.
Been actively reporting SWTOR bugs since July 2011. It's almost a full time job.
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Keller's Void - Rachgier, Galadrial, Galadeon (Empire)

renegadeimp's Avatar


renegadeimp
02.20.2012 , 10:58 AM | #122
Quote: Originally Posted by Agarwaenn View Post
After playing the Tera beta I can say you are completely wrong in this opinion. Better graphics, better draw distance, 100's of people around me with a solid 60 fps.
Why reference a game that would be lucky to last the first 6 months, if NCsoft win their 3 lawsuits? Theres also a big reason tera died in asia and the western port is a last ditch attempt to revive it.

The engine was very unstable in the asian version and had very little in the way of content.
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Agarwaenn's Avatar


Agarwaenn
02.20.2012 , 11:02 AM | #123
Quote: Originally Posted by renegadeimp View Post
Why reference a game that would be lucky to last the first 6 months, if NCsoft win their 3 lawsuits? Theres also a big reason tera died in asia and the western port is a last ditch attempt to revive it.

The engine was very unstable in the asian version and had very little in the way of content.
Because she was wrong in her assumption that it could not handle a mmo. Why are you attacking me and Tera? I was not saying anything bad about SWTOR, just pointing out that she was wrong.
Been actively reporting SWTOR bugs since July 2011. It's almost a full time job.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Keller's Void - Rachgier, Galadrial, Galadeon (Empire)

Satanski's Avatar


Satanski
02.20.2012 , 11:03 AM | #124
Quote: Originally Posted by ahnog View Post
Yes, the game needs improvement, WoW did too when it came out. All you, and the other posters like you, are doing is discouraging those who see the potential in the game. I refuse to be discouraged and choose optimism instead.
Everybody have the right to live in their fantasy, just dont demand everyone to be there with you.

DarthSabreth's Avatar


DarthSabreth
02.20.2012 , 11:03 AM | #125
Quote: Originally Posted by Symphony View Post
Good level-headed post. I more or less agree to your points, though I don't think it's too late - as far as official numbers go, the game is going strong and they've put too much money in this to let it go f2p.

I do believe they're keenly aware of their shortcomings, and scrambling as hell to fix the things players keep pointing out. They might not admit they've massively failed in some areas though :P

An LFG tool is coming soon, dual-spec is coming soon, guild features are being added soon - it isn't over yet

And a side note on quest and ops design - this can be argued, but you have to leave yourself room to improve. If you start out with massive innovations in that regard, where do you go from there? I'm sure upcoming flashpoints, ops and quests will have more varying objectives.
Have they stated that they are adding a LFG tool? can you link it?

I love SWTOR and have no intention of quiting, but some the OP's points i do agree with, the engine does seem to struggle a bit, i ran Rift on mostly high settings and not a hickup but there are some areas where my FPS goes in the drainage, like around the holo on the ships ect.

i do think there should be a "server only" LFG, i will spam to get into a flash point but will give up and go back to questing / pvping when i cant get a group for flashpoints.

i would not mind seeing some single player dailies on planets as well, spaming for a group for them just gets old as well.

I am a huge fan of SWTOR / Bioware and will continue to support this game because i have faith in Bioware.
"I have brought peace, freedom, justice, and security to my new Empire!" Rip .

Quraswren's Avatar


Quraswren
02.20.2012 , 11:25 AM | #126
I disagree with the majority of the OP's post.

He seems to be more about, "I want it all now" and instant gratification and how he would like to go back to WOW than offering real debate on things.

The majority of his post wasn't even about the game engine. Just another rant for several paragraphic comparing SWTOR to WOW and how he has to travel and why he can't get to another planet instantly.

It was worth a laugh to read how he would personally change things to the way he likes them but as an overall change to the game most of the OP's post was just fluff.

The engine

Works great for me and the guilds I've run with. I run it all on high settings and have raided everything through HM and moving in to NM. So far so good as far as I can see it.

PVP

Has always been a joke since WOW and the days before. You talk of imbalance as if BW could do anything about it. You can't force people to play a side and the only real complaint there is underestimating how much people wanted to be darkside. Nothing BW could really do about faction balance. It couldnt be controlled in WOW and certainly cant be controled here. Adjusted with server transfers at best but I doubt many take that.

PVP has it's issues but it's not the engine.

Operations

You didn't like the designs? I did. For the first set of raid type encounters there very good. They gradually get harder and harder from Normal to hard mode to Nightmare. Just as they should. It's a good transition for players in a new MMO.

After raiding Hardcore in WOW for the past 6 or more years. SWTOR has a good start on operations and while there are some bugs. The operation itself is good design wise.

Flashpoints are also a good length. Again, the OP just wants things faster and faster and then will most likely complain about how short things are. It's not enough there is little trash in operations before you get to boss fights(EV I'm talking about you specifically) now there should be little trash in FP's as well.

Another personal request than has nothing to do with the game engine but wanting something done faster and quicker and most likely easier. Another Instant gratification request to be ignored.

Patching

so far I like it. They have fixed more than they have broken and continue to work on existing bugs and none of which are just game breaking - Some are bad but not game breaking.

I like to patching so far.

Armor

Personal request at best and everyone has one. Everyone wants something different from appearance issues. Get in line but at the end of the day it's not even a big deal.

Travel

I already mentioned a little about this but you cannot get from one planet to the next with some time. While I'm not fond of the multiple transitions, it's not bad. Takes some getting used to but if I could teleport everywhere I would like that either.

The travel time is decent. I can make it anywhere I want in a couple mins and thats no different from any past MMO.

Companions

What can I say, I love them.

The craft, tank, heal, DPS, gather mats and there great to have.

They will never take the place of a real player and trying to duo a FP with 2 real players and 2 companion is at best silly. Especially knowing compansion cant use turrets and are not as good as people.

Sounds like the OP brought pain on himself and at the end of it couldn't handle it cause he lost. The hurdle was just to high or some things are not meant to be done with less than 4 real people. Take your pick but its not a game problem. It's the OP's personal wants getting into the mix of good design and messing it up.

The Story

It's all personal based. the 3 I'm doing I love. one of which I know someone didn't care for. It's like readying a book. Some like it, some don't and the scale can be anywhere in between.

Same with side quests. I like them, knew they would not be as good as the main story and yet, they were good enough.

One my second play through I still listened to the story as well as my third. The only story I skip is dailies.

So again, your letting your personal wants get in the mix of good design for the masses and just on an individual bases.

I'm finding the entire leveling process better than any MMO to date and I don't think there is one I've missed in the past number of years. Some parts are better than others and some I didn't even like but overall it's very good.

Social

As if speech bubbles would make a world of difference in my game play. If they never happened, I'd still play and sleep well at night.

Guild system, clearly something coming and not needed at launch. I'm good with that.

Carrick stations is pretty crowded as a social station/area. I see no problem with it as it is the center of it all. I can't expect to have huge amounts of people at the bar in taris or any other planet now can I.

So far I'm good with it.

Space Combat

We got what has always been announced. If you expected more then you ahve not been keeping up.

Sure we all want more more and I bet thats the next expansion but what we have now is a minigame and has always been hyped as a minigame.

It's a fun minigame and kills a little time. It's better than fishing and offers a side bit of fun.

Putting it in was a good design I think.

Conclusion

You have to much "ME ME ME" in your post and how you want things as if 1.7 million others want the same thing when clearly it's simply not true.

You want a faster game (probably cause your a console FPS shooter game where things are a little more fast paced and instant and are cayrrying that over to this game) However thats just a guess.

A few things I can agree with you on (bugs, PVP problems) but thats really about it as the rest is just personal wants that I don't 100% agree with.
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Jett-Rinn's Avatar


Jett-Rinn
02.20.2012 , 11:26 AM | #127
Quote: Originally Posted by jarjarloves View Post
free to play in 6 to 12 months.. Ok I'll take that bet.
They will just move the Goal posts again like they have been doing since launch.
No one hates Star Wars as much as "Star Wars fans"

Holden_Dissent's Avatar


Holden_Dissent
02.20.2012 , 11:27 AM | #128
the game is fine L2P

Arkerus's Avatar


Arkerus
02.20.2012 , 11:30 AM | #129
Quote: Originally Posted by Jett-Rinn View Post
They will just move the Goal posts again like they have been doing since launch.
Exactly.

Keep moving the goal posts. It won't be F2P in 6 months. So they will just move it back. 1 year, 2 years, 4 years, etc.

The OP spends most of the time ranting about what he/she expected in a MMO and their disappointment its not there. Its not really about what the game does well or what it doesn't. There is some of that there but its mostly a rant about that THEY wanted.

Its not really worth anything in the long run as it gives nothing constructive.
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Satanski's Avatar


Satanski
02.20.2012 , 11:35 AM | #130
Quote: Originally Posted by Quraswren View Post
[...]
Conclusion

You have to much "ME ME ME" in your post and how you want things as if 1.7 million others want the same thing when clearly it's simply not true.
[...]
And how exactly different is your post? I see me me me everywhere. You even know what do all of 1.7m subscribers want. Hehehe