The reason Sorcerer/Sage CC is OP in PvP

Are you for real ?

Are you throwing a whole constructive post for one screenshot outdps'in newbs ?

What kind of thinking is that ?

Guioki is correct - the 20/21 build is based entirely on being able to escape.

Tumri's response about survivability talents is a clear slippery slope fallacy. Obviously some survivability is good, but taking ALL of it in a 20/21 is bad.

And this post. I think it proves that he has been de-bunked several times. In fact in his rare posting he admitted he is incorrect about a build. However he covers that by using the term "Under estimated"

Looking to note that he says "He was told by another sorc that was bur sty spec" He's not informed enough or qualified in my honest viewing to at least what build "suppose to do most damage" it's just wild debating.

However the fact he edited the orginal thread, several times. Quoting the people who side with his argument and ignoring those against it. Show's how heavily biased he is.

The screen shot show's him as TOP DPS. Yet he's trying to NERF another class. I think that's more then valid to show a pattern of a one side arugment. He's not interested in any feedback expect how to "remove backlash" this entire thread is devoted to that.

the reason i cant take it serious is this

"balanced with other ACs"

one possible hybrid build being cc heavy isnt a reason to nerf a whole AC and every constructive post made seems to get argued against. i could make a list of many abilities that are ridiculusly OP in game atm but its two months old and the devs are the ones with the figures. not us.

i could go in depth into the newly updated first post but it will likely just be ignored like all other posts which work into whats been posted

Taking all of it costs you minimal sustained DPS. We're not talking about some gimped spec that does no damage. We're talking about a spec that has all the CC while having respectable damage. The DPS loss is worth about 1-2 seconds in a single target 1 minute fight(Which is longer than any realistic PvP battle).

1. I edited the OP to include that spec because someone asked for it to be included. I didn't do all the research surrounding the spec but I certainly didn't make any claims regarding it's viability before today. I've also edited the OP to correct myself whenever anyone gave solid proof against any of my arguments. The original thread(unedited) had a few snippets about other talents. Sorcerers made good arguments to prove that those talents were fine and as a result I removed anything related to them. If anyone's biased it's you for totally ignoring this fact.

2. I quoted people that proposed any suggestions to tone down the CC heavy hybrid specs. One of them is a Sorcerer himself and he definitely didn't support my original argument but did support the argument against CC heavy hybrid specs. When he and others provided evidence to show the other talents that I originally campaigned against were fine I changed my stance.

3. My screenshots show that PUG warzones have a lot of people that are absolutely horrendous at the game. That is all.

Why include your screen shot in the FIRST place unless you thought it mattered? in fact you were trying to back up an arugment that you didn't "suck" at the game by providing proof. Now you are flip flopping to say "I removed it because the people in the game sucked and it doesn't show anything"

Secondly, you quoted people who want to nerf/change the spec and ignoring those against doing that. It's clear this is not a general discussion about it. This is a rambling from a lone person who has bumped his own thread several times.

A person who has his OWN THREAD in his SIGNATURE. Just show's you this is not a casual debate more like an obsession. The truth of the matter is. The class is FINE, and working as intended and this is a campaign to fix something that's NOT broken.

I for one will not continue to post and contribute to this thread which is charged by a heavily biased warrior who still manages to get "10 medals in HuttBall" over classes he's trying to say are over powered.

It actually is, if the damage is also good. It wouldn't nerf the whole AC, it would nerf that spec. There's no reason to argue to don't move blackslash or barrage to t6 (one of them but not both, at last).

Most classes can't even think about going hybrid, and you got a surplus of good talents on low tiers which make you able to EVEN debate what hybrid build is good of a lot of them. Don't think that's some indicator ? Or every class get more low tier talents that awesome, or you get sucked up with the rest and get some of your great talents up to higher tiers. That's the real thing.

According to you.

@Your bits about Me - I'm done with the repetitive arguments about my personal skill/screenshots. People have made the EXACT SAME ARGUMENT you're making now. If you're too lazy to read through the previous arguments then I'm not going to dignify your repetitive argument with any further responses. This thread has gone in circles too many times.

then buff the 31point specs which are horrible. Thats the issue. hybrids are the only good builds for dps sorcs. As has been said in the thread a million times backlash is only effective against certain classes. Mainly warriors and OPs which is why the op is crying so hard and i guess your an OP too.

Taking a full cc spec does not necessarily make a good build for warzones for a multitude of already mentioned reasons in the thread.

Most other Classes ACs have good or relativley good 31point builds. Sorcs dont. the fact a hybrid spec is better than said 31point builds even in a flat out pve dps situation says it all. Moving certain survival talents into higher tiers not only destroys every viable pvp spec but also makes the class very weak unless they play a specific build. Which shouldnt be the case. All that will happen in that situation is that specific build will be damage buffed heavily to compensate for the loss resulting in more qq from people like the OP.

The damage of a full cc spect sorc is not that good. is subpar at best and relies on the sorc being able to run away fast and heal or dps from a large gap. mechanisms that are easily prevented in many ways. BUT as always the OP is STILL arguing that sorcs should be nerfed rather than roots being put onto the resolve bar.. but wait. then that would affect hum aswell with his multiple *********** force charges so he wont want that.

a lot of ACs have knockbacks which emcompase either a root or a slow. warriors themself have force push which has a knockdown animation. Backlash which is his main qq point because it affects HIS class in pvp already tier 4 and for a sorc to reach it they drop a lot of damage modification talents so your losing 8-10% damage output from dots. the one thing a madness build sorc needs to kill. It might not look a lot but an 8% damage drop can makea huge difference when you have ppl bashing on your head and your trying to kill someone.

oh fyi.. my other guilds premade with the cc build sorc in.. my group just destoyed them. you know why? we locked the sorc out of the game. not exactly hard to do.