If you are 50 and a PvPer, why are you still here?

The pve content in this game is debatable depending on which pve crowd you're speaking to. And it's easier to add more pve content for a pve game, as they have plans to. It still doesn't support GW2 killing Swtor. Still apples and oranges.

Nah nah nah dude, you didn't say "GW was a successful PvP game", you said, AND I QUOTE

"First off, GW1's PvP was very successful."

That's not a claim of monetary success, you mentioned nothing of money, you said the "PvP was successful" as in other games apparently have "failed" PvP.

You have not defined what makes PvP a success.

You even ranked it's PvP as "3rd" after DAOC and WoW. Now, considering DAOC is not the 1st or 2nd most money making PvP MMO, obviously monetary success is not what you meant in that statement.

I am asking you what quantifies the PvP in a game as being "successful."

Your definition must be capable of applying to WoW, DAOC and GW since you have already ranked these 3 as the top 3.

A monetary argument would not apply to DAOC.

An Esport argument wouldn't apply to either DAOC or the first GW.

Both those arguments would apply to WoW, being both monetarily sucessful and an Esport, but since you've included DAOC and GW into your example, and the Esport argument fails for both of them, you obviously have some other metric of "PvP success".

I am asking you to define that metric. You haven't done it yet.

So, in one question.

"What defines PvP success that applies to WoW, DAOC and the first GW game"

Please, answer at your leisure.

No moving the goal posts.

Lightsabers?

So, you're saying in the few, short test sessions at an expo you are able to determine the long term success of the mechanics in GW2? I guess everyone should be clamoring at your door to solve the MMO PVP problems, because you obviously have the eye for recognizing greatness. /sarcasm

this.

10ballz

I should even mention, I'm no SWTOR fanboy. I like the game and will play it, but this is just a hold over until Dark Millennium Online.

I'm only picking at the GW2 fanboys because illogical thought processes and constant statements of subjectivity veiled as objectivity bugs me, regardless of subject matter.

So you want to argue semantics. Ok.

Here's irony. You argue against subjective statements, yet make your own after I provide proof of GW's success (economically).

You asked for proof of GW's success and I provided it. GW sold itself on PVP, had the backing of major E-Sport leagues. It was monetarily successful when compared to the reigning MMORPG's of the time (FFXI and World of Warcraft). It also had staying power, selling over 7 million copies with all of its original servers intact over the course of 6 years (no server merges), which indicates a steady population across all servers.

So I'm not exactly sure what you're asking here. Are you now asking me of subjective proof of GW's success as a PVP game? Such as fun factor, balance, style of PVP? Not to mention the glaring probably in your quote from me, which when arguing semantics, denotes that I was not speaking in absolutes when I said "top 3 games". However, consider games that were widely lauded for its PVP (GW, DAoC) when compared to a game whose PVP is widely mocked, even by its own playerbase (SW:ToR).

I still like pwning noobs.

Quick fallacy, there is in fact a shared server atmosphere such that towns are areas where people congregate but it isnt a huge multi server setup like wow or this game.

Side note: contuing to post about GW2 here will not accomplish anything for you or the people that like it (such as myself). We know what think it will be and that is the light on the hill. Now is the light a beacon or a warning light we wont know until its released but, its not "theme park" its a Sandbox, and we havent had a good sandbox in forever.

So you're not going to provide the metric by which you ranked and defined the "success" of a game's PvP?

You're also going to imply the statement that no one who played DAoC or GW ever mocked it's PvP?

By extention, you're going to pretend the forums of those two games were not just as bad as the forums of this game, for WoW, WAR, AoC and even the current fan and official GW2 forums?

Every MMO ever released has had a significant and loud forum base of people who claim the game sucks and is dying/failing. Every MMO ever. Every MMO has been mocked by it's own players because no MMO can please everyone.

Yet you continue the cycle. "This next one will be better guys." then "Okay, that was a disappointment, but the NEXT one guys, seriously."

The words that come from your mouth began coming the day the second MMO was ever announced, and the words that come from your mouth will continue coming out until the day that gaming dies.

You are less a person with a valid opinion and more an echo.