SWTOR: Theme-park MMO design. End of the road?

Thankfully things are changing. Games are coming out that have quite different systems to work with. TERA/GW2/Secret world, all of which are quite open ended, and those are just the top ones that are well known.

Check out GW2 if you love pvp and fantasy pve. Secret world is modern but has a sub. Tera is more asian themed fantasy with super skimpy armor (Not my thing), and you have to actually guide your attacks into a mob, where as in GW2 you actively evade.

Check em out, you might like em.

Your constant promotion of GW2 is getting annoying. This is SWTOR board.

Go to a board about GW2 if you want to post about it all day.

I noticed you advertise GW2 a lot on this forum.....one question; have you actually played the game for any significant amount of time? I ask this because it seems the most ardent promoters of the game have only seen videos. I have had significant hands on time and I like it for the same reasons I think the vast majority of MMO players will hate it. GW2 is fun, but to me isn't isn't a MMO, it is a online Role Playing game.

Yes, another feedback post, but seeing as I'm a Compsci major, and my forte is project design and layout, I think it will be worthwhile to read...

Bioware has developed a very compelling game world. Many of the locations exhibit not only great beauty, but also are technically very challenging to design. Take a look at the sky/mountains on Alderaan, or the sky above Ilum, etc. And places like Nar Shadaa (And presumably Coruscant) are technically very challenging to accomplish without load screens at acceptable FPS, etc. The use of musical direction in setting the mood for areas, worlds, or quests is excellent. It's the only MMO I feel I can't play with the radio in the background or I won't get the proper effect.

SWTOR right now however, is suffering a "death by a thousand paper cuts" as it were, with regards to quality-of-life design issues, and the unguided state of post-50 content. There are myriad little design annoyances with the game that when compounded, have a sizable affect on peoples' perceptions of the game. Combine that with the sink-or-swim nature of content once you reach L50, and it's no wonder server populations are already dwindling.

Theme-park MMO designs have reached an untenable situation of exponential costs + ever-shorter leveling curves. The theme-park style of MMO has reached a point of oversaturation -- people burn through the leveling content in 5 days /played and expect more within weeks. IMHO the only way forward from here is to mix together elements of the Theme Park, with the Sandbox. Sandbox MMOs alone are too niche to be economically feasible or popular on a large scale. But having sandbox elements in a theme park design, would help subscribers weather the periods between content updates, and give them a reason to keep logging in. It would be the social hub that MMOs have been missing for quite some time.

MMOs in the past featured an extensive grind with few quests. My first character in EQ1 took 50 days /played to hit L50, for example. (18-20 days for WoW) But what current MMOs are missing is the social aspect of MMO gaming from the past -- sure you were grinding, but chatting with groupmates and those in the zone was just as important or moreso than leveling your character. This is one of the largest reasons the Korean market still prefers heavier grinds -- it's for the socializing. I think they need to lengthen out the leveling once more and tap more into the social aspects of MMOs. Social networking is so huge now -- why is it that Massively MULTIPLAYER games are such insular solo content these days?

If Bioware really wants SWTOR to succeed they need to first and foremost, provide more cohesive guidance on how to proceed at L50, but then also add in sandbox elements to give players ways to spend their time between patches. Player housing, a total revamp of the crafting system for a more meaningful meta-game, etc. Heck I think an amazing thing would be an EVE-like space part of the game that you could explore and carve out your own little niche, except far less ruthless than EVE, of course.

(Quality of life and Guidance issues I'll address in a separate thread)

Yes, another feedback post, but seeing as I'm a Compsci major, and my forte is project design and layout, I think it will be worthwhile to read...

Bioware has developed a very compelling game world. Many of the locations exhibit not only great beauty, but also are technically very challenging to design. Take a look at the sky/mountains on Alderaan, or the sky above Ilum, etc. And places like Nar Shadaa (And presumably Coruscant) are technically very challenging to accomplish without load screens at acceptable FPS, etc. The use of musical direction in setting the mood for areas, worlds, or quests is excellent. It's the only MMO I feel I can't play with the radio in the background or I won't get the proper effect.

SWTOR right now however, is suffering a "death by a thousand paper cuts" as it were, with regards to quality-of-life design issues, and the unguided state of post-50 content. There are myriad little design annoyances with the game that when compounded, have a sizable affect on peoples' perceptions of the game. Combine that with the sink-or-swim nature of content once you reach L50, and it's no wonder server populations are already dwindling.

Theme-park MMO designs have reached an untenable situation of exponential costs + ever-shorter leveling curves. The theme-park style of MMO has reached a point of oversaturation -- people burn through the leveling content in 5 days /played and expect more within weeks. IMHO the only way forward from here is to mix together elements of the Theme Park, with the Sandbox. Sandbox MMOs alone are too niche to be economically feasible or popular on a large scale. But having sandbox elements in a theme park design, would help subscribers weather the periods between content updates, and give them a reason to keep logging in. It would be the social hub that MMOs have been missing for quite some time.

MMOs in the past featured an extensive grind with few quests. My first character in EQ1 took 50 days /played to hit L50, for example. (18-20 days for WoW) But what current MMOs are missing is the social aspect of MMO gaming from the past -- sure you were grinding, but chatting with groupmates and those in the zone was just as important or moreso than leveling your character. This is one of the largest reasons the Korean market still prefers heavier grinds -- it's for the socializing. I think they need to lengthen out the leveling once more and tap more into the social aspects of MMOs. Social networking is so huge now -- why is it that Massively MULTIPLAYER games are such insular solo content these days?

If Bioware really wants SWTOR to succeed they need to first and foremost, provide more cohesive guidance on how to proceed at L50, but then also add in sandbox elements to give players ways to spend their time between patches. Player housing, a total revamp of the crafting system for a more meaningful meta-game, etc. Heck I think an amazing thing would be an EVE-like space part of the game that you could explore and carve out your own little niche, except far less ruthless than EVE, of course.

(Quality of life and Guidance issues I'll address in a separate thread)

Imo , why levels at all. Just make all content "highend".

"people burn through the leveling content in 5 days /played "

I'm sorry, but this isn't Bioware's problem. I love Star Wars and video games. I've personally put hours/days/weeks of time into my 3 characters. However, I have yet to hit 50 on any of them. Someone who hits 50 in 5 days has got too much gametime on their hands. You can't rush through content, then complain you're out of game to play. Take some time off, take a break, get a job, go outside. I understand the frustration of short games. Short games are why I primarily use GameFly these days and buy only a couple games a year. This game, however, isn't short, and with the storylines and legacy system it's clear Bioware intends people to replay. Yet those people who have the time, patience and dedication to get to 50 in 5 days then turn around and complain they don't want to do it again? It's crazy.