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This game badly needs mods and macros.


Marasme's Avatar


Marasme
01.25.2012 , 11:04 AM | #831
Quote: Originally Posted by gregordunbar View Post
Wait, most people dont raid so we dont need mods? Wut? Did I not say that the most popular mods are not even raid mods? Yes I did so what are you saying here? WHAT THE HELL IS THE POINT OF YOUR POST?

CTmod was the single most download mod for WoW with its raid component being the 3rd most download submod and that is nothing but a raid frame...hell even Gearscore isnt even in the top 10 most download mods of all time and it is far more popular than any raid effecting mod.

Your argument point is a redherring.

OH and BTW if you wish to try to continue with the, it isnt going to be used by the majority of the playerbase so isnt needed BS...

PvP isnt not something the majority will take part in so it isnt needed
Roleplaying, dont need it, few do it, so get rid of social points and everything tied to it.
Space combat? Few players...get rid of it.
Raiding, as you say...
4 man epics? Same
Flashpoints...

Oh hell Bioware you may as well shut the servers down your entire game is made up of a bunch of things that most people wont take part it and as SOME people say, if most people wont take part in it, we dont need it.

Byebye...
if u can't play without addons ur simply bad. Remember how Nihilum wiped on live raid because they were not allowed to use addons ? One pala was QQing 'omg I no haz pallypower i no kean raid without pally power'. I mean lol. l2p

Sendrel's Avatar


Sendrel
01.25.2012 , 11:05 AM | #832
Quote: Originally Posted by DaxRendar View Post
Blizzard Dev Q&A #3
http://azeroth.metblogs.com/2011/03/...loper-qa-no-3/

"some addons do a great job of providing information we really should be providing"

"On the other hand, when addons are too helpful, they are playing the game for you and you’re just doing what the addon tells you to do."

"It is a fine line to decide when an addon becomes mandatory. Ideally you could raid without any addons, and some players do. Information is often power in complex raid encounters though, and we agree that in some cases we don’t provide enough information yet."

And to me the most important point:
"When the mod tells you so much information about the fight that you don’t even really need to pay attention to what is happening in the world at all, then we feel that crosses the line. I don’t know that we could put the djinn back in the bottle at this point though. It would feel really harsh to prevent addons from tracking some of that information, and in some cases we’re not even sure how we would prevent it."

It wasn't "bias" on my part - Addons almost by definition create unforeseen and unexpected gameplay experiences - some good, some very bad. And once they are out there, it's very hard for a Developer to do anything about them.
You said:

Quote: Originally Posted by DaxRendar View Post
DBM is a perfect example of what I'm talking about - it's an Addon that's insanely popular, that many in this thread have been asking for, and yet it's also an Addon that Blizzard themselves have said they wish they hadn't opened up the API so much that it could exist. It trivializes gameplay. Omen quite frankly does the same thing. Just because something is popular doesn't mean it's good for gameplay.
The quote doesn't support your claim.

It absolutely is perception bias. Blizzard never mentioned DBM as a source for all things unholy, nor did they attach a value judgement to its continued use and development. They never specified anything to the extent that you did. The fact that you immediately jumped on DBM is the definition of perception bias.

Again, it sucked so bad and was in fact so game breaking, that Blizzard felt the need to incorporate many of its functions in the stock UI. Also did the same thing with Omen. It kinda puts a kink in your argument that Blizzard would do away with both of those addons when they include their functionality in the base UI.

Zarrot's Avatar


Zarrot
01.25.2012 , 11:06 AM | #833
While I was never a huge WoW fan, I was a huge fan of the modable client. I think I spent more time screwing with the client and trying add-on off Curse than anything else. I was disappointing with the UI in general in this game and While I won't go as far as to OP and say they are a must and all "modern" mmo's need them. I was surprised they weren't part of SWTOR because I always found they take a load of work off the developers when it comes to UI and Tools and hands it off to the community allowing the developers to focus on content rather than UI flash. It also creates a core of die hard modders and fans who help drive the game and it's features.

Vitiock's Avatar


Vitiock
01.25.2012 , 11:10 AM | #834
Quote: Originally Posted by Marasme View Post
playing without addons is much more rewarding, unless u don't like challanges and have trouble coordinating ur abilities.

go play farm ville or wow pls
Does this mean that ability delay doesn't bother you either, I feel that macros and addons allow me to interact with my character more fluidly and in a more natural manner, ability delay like the lack of an interface that suits me removes me from that fluidity.

Bald_Haliaeetus's Avatar


Bald_Haliaeetus
01.25.2012 , 11:17 AM | #835
Macros definitely needed.

Mods I have mixed feelings about; I think they do more good than bad, but the ones that do bad, do REALLY bad. If BW is going to allow mods, they need to quick about breaking the ones that have a negative impact on the game.
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Raeln's Avatar


Raeln
01.25.2012 , 11:19 AM | #836
Quote: Originally Posted by gregordunbar View Post
Wait, most people dont raid so we dont need mods? Wut? Did I not say that the most popular mods are not even raid mods? Yes I did so what are you saying here? WHAT THE HELL IS THE POINT OF YOUR POST?

CTmod was the single most download mod for WoW with its raid component being the 3rd most download submod and that is nothing but a raid frame...hell even Gearscore isnt even in the top 10 most download mods of all time and it is far more popular than any raid effecting mod.

Your argument point is a redherring.
You are looking at total downloads for addons over the span of 7 years are you? You know, in a addon development world where addon names change? It stands to reason that some long term addons would have greater downloads in total than the addons that have been adapted from a previous addon and changed to be even better.

Quote:
OH and BTW if you wish to try to continue with the, it isnt going to be used by the majority of the playerbase so isnt needed BS...
The main push of the pro-addon players here on the forums is to get DPS meters.

DPS meters are only really needed for hardmode content.

Quote:
PvP isnt not something the majority will take part in so it isnt needed
Roleplaying, dont need it, few do it, so get rid of social points and everything tied to it.
Space combat? Few players...get rid of it.
Raiding, as you say...
4 man epics? Same
Flashpoints...

Oh hell Bioware you may as well shut the servers down your entire game is made up of a bunch of things that most people wont take part it and as SOME people say, if most people wont take part in it, we dont need it.

Byebye...
Now you are just trying to bait me into responding with a flame post.

I imagine more people will participate in PvP than in raiding, so take that for what you will.

As far as addons, I'm not opposed to having addons to rearrange the UI and deal with the abomination that is the galactical market interface.

I am opposed to threatmeters, group-based DPS meters, an exportable combat log and any addon API that allows an addon to parse the combat log in-game. I'm also 100% against allowing addons to communicate using chat channels or hidden channels between players.

This is a game. Play it as a game.

It's not a second job. There is no reason to pretend to be an accountant or statistician by bringing a multitude of spreadsheet data into the equation.

Truga's Avatar


Truga
01.25.2012 , 11:19 AM | #837
Quote: Originally Posted by Ganelon View Post
Addons are simply quality of life tools
Which is synonymous to making the game easier, if the quality of life tools affect your combat performance. Thank you for proving the other guys right.
boot.ini

Truga's Avatar


Truga
01.25.2012 , 11:20 AM | #838
Quote: Originally Posted by Raeln View Post
DPS meters are only really needed for hardmode content.
No they aren't. They help, they're not needed. Again, making the game easier by... helping.
boot.ini

Sendrel's Avatar


Sendrel
01.25.2012 , 11:20 AM | #839
Quote: Originally Posted by Raeln View Post
I simply cannot understand this need for people to work so hard at making their game so easy - only to turn around and then accuse the game developer of making the game too easy.
I disagree with almost the entirety of your post, but this is what really caught my attention. With very few exceptions at all, the only people claiming that WoW raiding is too easy are the people who have never even attempted any of the hardmodes. Claiming that the raid game is too easy on the general forums is tantamount to tattooing 'I'VE NEVER TRIED THE HARDMODES!!' on your forehead.

Say what you want about the hard/normal mode design paradigm (I might even agree with you), but WoW is still widely considered (by the people who actually do it) some of the most challenging raiding around.

TradewindNQ's Avatar


TradewindNQ
01.25.2012 , 11:21 AM | #840
Quote: Originally Posted by Marasme View Post
if u can't play without addons ur simply bad. Remember how Nihilum wiped on live raid because they were not allowed to use addons ? One pala was QQing 'omg I no haz pallypower i no kean raid without pally power'. I mean lol. l2p
Consonants and grammar are a crutch.
I am prepared to meet my Maker.
Whether my Maker is prepared for the great ordeal of meeting me is another matter.