DONT screw up the other parts of the game for pvp.

The fact that they are adjusting classes solely based on pvp experiences, example with the scoundrel/Op nerf while bosses in Ops still don't drop loot, unable to loot, people dieing outside of the instance, etc, etc just shows what they are working towards.

Not saying pvp should be put on the back burner, but in all honesty, without strong pve and people advertising it, anyone that isn't playing will remain that way.

Yep-- games that put PvP ahead of PvE fail. That's just how it is. I'm a PvPer myself, but I'm not going to pretend otherwise.

I can think of several games who slowly eviscerated their PvE game in an eternal search for "PvP balance", which can never be attained anyway. People will always tell themselves their loss wasn't their fault. They even do it in shooters.

Personally, I don't think classes should be balanced in a game like this anyway. Make things enjoyable in PvE, and let the chips fall where they may in PvP. People who want a challenge will take the universally-acknowledged gimp classes, and they usually find some way to make them work.

^^^^
This

I rolled on a PVE server, I don't pvp. I not am whining to BW that other class need nerfs for mobs, each nerf BW does affects pve players. If that is not bad enough BW continues to allow for pvp players to kill pve players on pve servers. The way this game is going nobody will be happy and it will the biggest flop of the century.

Balanced pvp=Pong how many people still play that game....

Everybody in this thread needs to learn to count. Over 40% of the servers are PVP servers. PVP is not some minority you can sweep under the rug. Just because you don't like PVP, and don't think it needs focus, doesn't mean it should be forgotten. Nearly half of all servers are PVP. PVP should get equal consideration as PVE, based on this fact alone.

Quit your b*tching. PVP is popular and it is here to stay.

Nerfing an opener on a stealth class does almost nothing to it's PvE damage when it comes to high end content as that is a very small minority of the class' damage. Reducing the armor pen to 30% from 50% is the only thing that will effect PvE damage and from what I've seen operatives will be just fine.


It's not like the PvE is particularly hard in this game anyway.

BW just needs to separate PvP and PvE completely from each other. They have already taken the first step by making some skills not work in PvP. BW just have to man up and jump completely into the water.

Balance PvP for PvP
Balance PvE for PvE
Profit.

Especially if you are over leveled.

this is not about a particular class or particular situation. its the general situation.

no part of the game should be continually messed with because of the demands from a group which plays another part of the game more than the other parts.

Yes, this discussion is not specific to the recent changes/nerfs to any particular class. Instead it's a general notice to Bioware since tweaking and changing classes can so easily be spurred on by the very vocal PVP player base. For a fledgling MMO dev, the temptation could be to adjust classes according to that group and that style of play and, in turn, very well ruin a playstyle for the arguably quieter but larger PVE crowd.

And what happens when a game like Guild Wars 2 comes along from a developer with a proven track-record of PVP game design and focus? If Bioware has simply been tweaking/nerfing classes based on PVP mechanics and play, where does that leave the PVE people when the PVPers leave for GW2 and the PVP brackets of Areanet? There must be balance and/or segregation of the playstyles via server separation or some other means.

And a tiny bit off topic for a second, but I'm a little shocked and surprised how cordial this thread has been. Love it.

Now for a good old fashioned bump

Cheers!

wow, so they did that actually ?

that would fix balance issues a lot. they can just designate a number of talents to be usable in pvp, and focus on balancing them. this would make inter-class balance in pvp and pve much more easier too.