No, You May Not Roll on Items for Another Class and Strip Out the Mods

You obviously didn't read my post, so let me break it down before you start insulting me.

DOES ITEM = ORANGE?

IF YES, PROCEED ON.

IS ITEM MEDIUM? CAN WEAR MEDIUM?

IF YES, PROCEED ON

DO ORANGE ITEMS == COMPLETELY MODIABLE?

YES

STATS =/= RELEVANT

Marauders use medium armor.

Orange armor = completely customizable.

Ergo, he can take the stupid mods that do not matter to him out and put mods that do work for him in. Suddenly the item has stats to work for him.

Is that so hard to understand?

Nope, apples to apples.

The laws in real life against murder are not physical constraints of the universe. You CAN, at any time, pick up a gun and shoot someone in the head. The law against it certainly won't prevent it from happening; it merely describes the consequences you will face if you decide to do this.

Law is merely a formalization of the social contract for some egregious scenarios. Outside the law, there are plenty of socially unacceptable human behaviors where the social contract is NOT formalized, yet we still consider violations of these unwritten protocols to be inappropriate or immoral. There is a giant difference between law and morality, in both directions.

Need rolling on orange items to trade mods is "allowed", as in there are no physical laws of the universe (or, in this case, the game engine) that prevent it, in exactly the same way that murder is allowed too. Sure, there's no written social contract on the expected behaviors and repercussions in this scenario, but that's not unusual for social interaction in human society.

What is under discussion here is the moral implication of doing so and the implied social contract of MMO games to which other gamers will hold your behavior accountable.

There are tons of good reasons that the need rolling behavior described by the OP might be morally reasonable and acceptable within the MMO social contract, but "because I can" is NEVER a valid argument for deciding which behaviors are acceptable and which aren't. Not just here, but in general for all decisions of morality in life, because that argument tends to be true for almost all behaviors under the sun, barring violations of the actual laws of physics. If it's effectively always true, it is effectively always useless for formulating a stance on morality.

...if anyone in that class is with your group.

I can't believe I'm posting about item rolls, or about this issue. People worry too much about loot, and I'm a big believer in just enjoying the game.
But poor claims hurt group dynamics, and there's no need for this kind of thing.

Today, a Sith Marauder rolled Need to get this
Cademimu Sharpshooter's Jacket
+34 Endurance
+38 Cunning
+18 Critical Rating

when I pointed out it was made for an Agent, like me, he said he intended to strip out the mods and trade them.

When I noted that the mods are Bound, he insisted that since he could wear it, he could roll. More surprising was that when he brought the issue to /General, a few voices agreed.

Most did not, but the others need to know that sort of claim i's a party-breaker. This is clearly an Agent item - a huge upgrade in my case - and my next group will get a little less healing as a result.

One of the pleasures of running Flashpoints is the chance to get gear suited to you. If it's better suited to someone else, leave it for them.

Murder = against the rules by law

Looting an orange item you can use =/= against the rules.

That is all that matters.

This would be very bad form indeed, and if it went against what was agreed on before the run, you would likely be booted instantly.


Cake is a lie; there is only pie.

It does not matter whether or not it is 'bad form'. The simple fact of the matter is that it is armor he can actually use. Both roll need on it, they compete for it. Just because its current stats are not reflective of his class does not mean that it cannot be changed.

He thus ends up with a fair chance at getting the armor he might like for its appearance (and oh how marauder armor is goofy looking at times) as the other person does.

Yes you certainly are. And I would never group with you.

However, you are too cowardly to post your server and toons, so many people will be victimised by you and your selfish, arrogant attitude, unfortunately.


Cake is a lie; there is only pie.

What matters is the fact that you are in the minority of ninja looters.

There is a thread with 15000 views on this subject. The majority of players are not jerks. If you want to be one, go ahead. You can group with your ninja friends and Need on everything.


Cake is a lie; there is only pie.

My information is very easy to find in my posting history. I'm not hiding anything. It's already been established that you and I are on different servers.

But you actually read through that entire list and feel like I'm selfish? And my actions are victimizing people?

Because I am up front about rolling on aim-sabers?

Are you for real?