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Please allow dual spec or cap respec costs.

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion > Suggestion Box
Please allow dual spec or cap respec costs.

GarbonzotheDude's Avatar


GarbonzotheDude
01.08.2012 , 02:59 PM | #661
Quote: Originally Posted by Radagastimus View Post
By all means have the free reserve spec slot for PVP if it is restricted to PVP only but do not allow such for PVE content other than the one that needs some running and credits. This also may be the case what they may implemet in future or something like that.
I still don't see why it would be a bad thing in PvE either. You may not have noticed but there is a growing trend amongst some having difficulty finding groups for four mans. Offering people the ability to dual spec could allow some people currently specced for one type such as dps to have another available for tanking or healing. Which in turn would allow people an easier time forming groups.

Not real sure how that is a bad thing.

I mean I doubt I would even take advantage of the dual spec myself. Only reason I would is for PvP, but I'm not a huge fan of how that is incorporated in this game anyways and yet I can still see the benefits of it being offered.

Even if it doesn't effect me personally anything that makes it easier for players to enjoy the game for their playstyle in general I see as being a good thing. The happier the player base is the more chance they will stick around. Which in turn benefits me if I plan on playing this long term.

HoneyBoy's Avatar


HoneyBoy
01.08.2012 , 03:01 PM | #662
Quote: Originally Posted by RAMunch View Post
The lazy slob was a quote from the guy i was responding too, it was not my own words. I should have put it in quotes.

I do believe that people wanting Dual Spec over the current system are lazy, but I believe that is an unarguable point.

Current System...you want to change from spec A to spec B, you pay.
Proposed system...you want to change, you get it for free.

Wanting something for nothing is lazy. I'm not sure how anyone can argue that.

Also change isn't always for good...so trying to justify that we should just go with it because that's what happens is a horrible argument.

Times change....Germany changed when Hitler took over...that was for the good right?
Industries change...remember the "New Coke" back in the 80's....it was a change and it failed horribly.

Change isn't always good.
Seriously? You're making allusions to Hitler and Coke now?

Like Dax said

Quote: Originally Posted by DaxRendar View Post
Most people play games for enjoyment, for fun, for relaxation. To attack people playing a game for being "lazy" clearly show that the issues you are presenting with regards to Dual Spec are your personal problems and not actually design issues or things that will break the game.
You have a personal problem with dual speccing, it does not negatively impact your play in any way or break the game.

zootzoot's Avatar


zootzoot
01.08.2012 , 03:03 PM | #663
Quote: Originally Posted by Radagastimus View Post
Having PVP spec in reserve is quite different than having spec in reserve for every PVE aspect of the game as many have pointed out earlier however indirectly.

By all means have the free reserve spec slot for PVP if it is restricted to PVP only but do not allow such for PVE content other than the one that needs some running and credits. This also may be the case what they may implemet in future or something like that.
Impossible to implement since who's to say what's a PVP spec and what's not.

....and you can't limit it to just WZ's or even Illum since many people would want the spec for World PVP.

I fail to see why having Dual Spec hurts anything. If you want one role it's no different than rolling a Sniper for example who can only DPS. If you like to stay Tank specced it doesn't change anything if there's someone who likes to quest as a DPS spec but likes to Tank in FP's with their Guild.

GarbonzotheDude's Avatar


GarbonzotheDude
01.08.2012 , 03:04 PM | #664
Quote: Originally Posted by RAMunch View Post
Also change isn't always for good...so trying to justify that we should just go with it because that's what happens is a horrible argument.

Times change....Germany changed when Hitler took over...that was for the good right?
Industries change...remember the "New Coke" back in the 80's....it was a change and it failed horribly.

Change isn't always good.
XD

Okay, be honest. You're trolling right? You can't be serious...

9/10 if you are. Epic comparisons going on here.

Hahaha

DeathHenk's Avatar


DeathHenk
01.08.2012 , 03:06 PM | #665
Quote: Originally Posted by RAMunch View Post
I see changing spec no different than race, class, level, stats, pvp rank, etc... it is a character defining attribute.
Really, nobody cares who you are in-game except your friends. And they will love you whether you have spec A or B.


Quote: Originally Posted by RAMunch View Post
And again I have explained how dual spec negatively impacts me twice now.
If I choose not to use it I am limited to only filling 1 role, while someone else isn't.
You're response will be that it was my choice to not use the dual spec system and I have to live with the consequences of those choices or choose to use it. I 100% agree. I MADE A DECISION AND I MUST LIVE WITH THE CONSEQUENCES OF IT.

I also say it was the players choice where to spend their talent points and they should deal with it or choose to pay the cost of respecing. Which is currently implemented in the game yet isn't good enough for you?
I do not dedicate my life to this game. We all want to have a good time right? Looking for a tank or healer for 15 minutes isnt really fun if you have school, a job or a family to take care of as well. Farming for respc costs takes away game time and the fun of it.


Quote: Originally Posted by RAMunch View Post
In it's current model the negative impact to me as a player is marginalized as the cost keeps people from just changing their role on a whim. Again I believe the current system is fine as it is. The ability to change specs is there, it just cost, the more you want to change the more it cost. That seems fair to me. I don't want to change, so it cost me nothing. I'm a healer, if a spot for a healer is open and some DPS wants to respec to healer spec to compete for that spot...fine, as of now he has to pay for that ability to compete for a slot i'm viable for...so we're even. Dual spec allows that player to switch to compete for a spot I am viable for without cost.
There is a shortage of tanks and healers now. Dual spec allows people to fill in the missing the roles to get the group started. With the help of dual spec when there are more healers, tanks or dps its simply a matter of agreement who is going to heal and who is going to dps and tank instead of fighting over roles.

Quote: Originally Posted by RAMunch
Also change isn't always for good...so trying to justify that we should just go with it because that's what happens is a horrible argument.

Times change....Germany changed when Hitler took over...that was for the good right?
Industries change...remember the "New Coke" back in the 80's....it was a change and it failed horribly.

Change isn't always good.
I have my coffee ready. I am ready for some more comparisons of yours.

Radagastimus's Avatar


Radagastimus
01.08.2012 , 03:09 PM | #666
I could also argue from a customer point of wiev that

"I bought this product, i demand that i can continue to use the product i payed"


In a way the customer who demands that things stay as they are is more entitled to having his way than the one who wants product to be changed to work somehow differently.

Naturally MMORPG game evolve but still it is valid argument as a whole of options that are demanded...

In the other hand why cant i have this appearance tab that does not impact your gaming at all since you dont need to use it? Or why do i not want this dungeon finder as i dont have to use it.

By all means have the spare slot for PVP if it is only usable on PVP areas and have spec change that costs the same as it costs now with a extra feature that again costs to you to buy.. Meaning the ability to change spec anytime, anywhere. Have it but may this ability cost you approriate amount of credits to buy on l50 and then still cost to change it to make it less desirable to change specs and focus on your role like you should.
“Named must your fear be before banish it you can.”

-Master Yoda

Crazyflames's Avatar


Crazyflames
01.08.2012 , 03:09 PM | #667
Quote: Originally Posted by HoneyBoy View Post
The fans that did not want it could simply choose not to use it, it's that simple.
This was one of the arguments, it really isn't that simple.

Oblivion was build around the fact that you could use fast travel, it really messed up the other ways of travel, horses were pretty bad and they took out all of the travel spells (such as those that make you run faster) and all of the ways to travel between cities (such as paying a fare for a boat). Even Speed didn't seem to have much of an effect compared to in Morrowind.
"Sir, we are surrounded!"
"Excellent, we can attack in any direction!"

Sparckus's Avatar


Sparckus
01.08.2012 , 03:12 PM | #668
Quote: Originally Posted by DeathHenk View Post
I have my coffee ready. I am ready for some more comparisons of yours.
You'll need something a lot stronger than that lol.

---

Outside of telling us your feelings(no they're not facts) and throwing strawman arguments at us, give us proper reasons why your against it or why it breaks the game?

I'll bookmark this thread incase I ever feel the need to despair at the stupidity of the human race.

Lethality's Avatar


Lethality
01.08.2012 , 03:12 PM | #669
Quote: Originally Posted by DaxRendar View Post
Ah Lethality, we dance again
It was inevitable in these fields of strife!

Quote: Originally Posted by DaxRendar View Post
Oh Master of the Strawman, please let me know why you are so opposed to a dedicated PvP spec (activates in Warfronts ONLY), when we consider the following:

-You immediately/auto-magically Teleport into and out of Warfronts (wonder why they don't make us all hang out in PvP lobbies and zone in at specific locations? )
-Especially at 50, there is PvP-specific Gear with stats ONLY applicable to PvP
-There are a number of Abilities and Talents which affect Players but not Elite/Champion mobs
-Characters 10-49 are auto-magically given a buff up to Level 50 Stats/Ability Ranks upon entering a Warzone
I wouldn't be opposed to it under those conditions at all, and given how TOR is designed then it's a reasonable compromise to free-wheeling changes. Of course I'd much rather see game design and balance that doesn't separate PvE and PvP... but rather offers simply "combat."

As for the lower characters, Bolster has shown time and again in this game and others that it simply doesn't work. They need to simply keep like-level brackets for players to compete in. But one problem TOR will face, especially with the much lower apparent server cap that other games, is finding enough people to play. This is where cross-realm Warzones would come in handy... though that's a different discussion all together.
Interested in a Mac version of TOR? Show your support here: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=683591

Radagastimus's Avatar


Radagastimus
01.08.2012 , 03:13 PM | #670
Quote: Originally Posted by GarbonzotheDude View Post
I still don't see why it would be a bad thing in PvE either. You may not have noticed but there is a growing trend amongst some having difficulty finding groups for four mans. Offering people the ability to dual spec could allow some people currently specced for one type such as dps to have another available for tanking or healing. Which in turn would allow people an easier time forming groups.

Not real sure how that is a bad thing.

I mean I doubt I would even take advantage of the dual spec myself. Only reason I would is for PvP, but I'm not a huge fan of how that is incorporated in this game anyways and yet I can still see the benefits of it being offered.

Even if it doesn't effect me personally anything that makes it easier for players to enjoy the game for their playstyle in general I see as being a good thing. The happier the player base is the more chance they will stick around. Which in turn benefits me if I plan on playing this long term.
Well since i have been using it on WOW i know it has many good conveniences but it also has bad things in it and the least is not the way to cater for even more unnecessary flexibility that lessens the skill of mediocre player which in the end is the denocracy that most use features like this.
“Named must your fear be before banish it you can.”

-Master Yoda