'End' game silliness.

Endgame doesn't means "repeating same thing over and over" it might mean bashing your head with your baddie guild on some boss for weeks trying new aproaches and all that kind of stuff.

quite !

and indeed, therefore, the first 18-25 years of one's life SHOULD be fun too. not some 5-6 year period in between 35-45.

we may not be able to make this in real life. but, there is no reason that games, a medium which we can shape as people, should follow the same example. there is no point.

i totally agree.

So Shady says,

Then Enako responds,

So Rik says, what the heck does that have to do with the point? It took 4 years to craft this game. What to you want them to do, release 10 levels of content every three months. We are 17 days from Early access and the amount of 50s is piling up. What would they do after 10 levels? They'd sit around waiting for new content.

Now, I personally believe there needs to be alternatives to raiding, but that often only means PVP. You can do collection quests, but until they have player housing to decorate with your collections, which It hink they should have, that won't work either.

Even single player games get burned through pretty fast, then what? Buy another single player game $60 and burn through that.

I've been having tons of fun leveling. The most fun I've ever had leveling.

and enako says, 'rik, that had to do with events that transpired threads that were posted yesterday'. in which shady was trying to persuade us all that swtor is a bad game. yesterday's events, today's surprise.

works - if they do not spend inordinate amounts of resources on 'endgame' trying to satisfy the below :

there is no way in hell to satisfy this segment. these are not even raiders, endgamers - these are achievers. nomatter what you do, these will be there first, and get bored. because they play for achievement. there is no way you can hold these people in - the only way to hold these people in would be through an excessive, painful grind and a repetitive, punishing 'endgame'. and that would drive everyone else out.

this segment jumps ship at the point they achieve something. they come back ,when there is more to achieve in the game they left. they jump ship every 3-4 months.

no sane game development house focuses on these. only, niche ones. or, alternatively, games which create their own impossible grind leveling, like eve. but these do not prefer eve due to the fact that there is no potential, defined and clear achievement in that game.

totally leaving the fact that there would be no problem for bringing in new content in proper speed once you have given up in trying to satisfy the early rusher/achiever segment, lets see what else is possible :

a space game in which you do trading, smuggling, and engage in various activities ? even, space stations in which guilds can set up and run ?

special zones/worlds in which players engage in manufacturing and trade ? and build things ?

player houses in separate instances ? (coruscant would be spectacular)

these are a few examples. other games do these successfully. lotro is one. and, stuff in space does not take considerable server resources due to there being no need for a landscape.

but im sure you can come up with your own propositions. the key is freeing the mind from the forced conditioning wow/everquest has impressed upon mmorpg landscape.

yet, kotor 1 and 2 makes one play them 3-4 times more without getting bored, for example. that is because the entirety of the game is entertaining - not just the closing 1/10 of the game.

At the EQ1 stage MMOs were very much a niche genre. I frankly got sick and tired of leveling. I don't want to get into the infinite debate about long not equaling challenging, but that's how I felt. There has to be a balance. I'm not saying SWTOR has achieved it, but EQ1 didn't either. SWG had some good concepts if it hadn't been a bug laden laggy mess. That still needed some "end game" for those who enjoy that sort of thing, but like I said in a previous post, what alternatives do you have. Collection quests can be just as monotonous as raiding, and usually much less rewarding.

The genre is in adolescence, and it doesn't know yet what it wants to be. The old hard cores who have all the time in the world to play these game, and the new casuals, who don't, but represent a much larger money pool are vying for developer attention. Unfortunately these games cost a lot of money to produce, so guess who is going to win that fight.

yes, i did too. therefore i am not saying i am 'leveling' in this game - but 'playing'. this is the first mmo in which i had had made distinction.

and i want it to be that way. i dont want my gameplay separated in between something called 'leveling' and a neverending repetitive 'endgame'.

what i want is, the star wars story take me from adventure to adventure smoothly as time goes by and i progress. everything else is peripheral, and supplementary.

Ugh, your still not seeing it.

neverending, work from there.

'fortunately' you should have said.

note how wii brought back 'simple, engaging fun' into console gameplay. before wii, consoles were unanimously aaa titles produced as timesinks by megacorporations. wii has kicked everyone in the industry in their balls.

same needs to happen in pc industry. and it will. the question is, who will do it first.

granted, swtor had had made a major move with this immediately entertaining immersive interactive storytelling thing. it is a revolution, but not as abrupt and ball-kicking like what wii has done. im sure it will change mmos forever though.

Ugh x2. Your understanding of both these topics is....Ugh