How will this ruin the game? its not going to affect players who pay, they get priorty over f2p. True you can play to lvl 50 (i think thats too much free) but you still can't access all of the content. If anything this may entice the f2p to sub to get the full content. it does stink that it had to come to this so soon but it seems EA is doing what they can to keep it going.

Microtransactions.

Why are they making it pay to win? it sucks so much, f2p ftl (

Pay 2 Win? Really? We don't even have all the details yet!

I dont know, sound like f2p will be nice finantially and not to constricting on the gameplay. Then again, what if

I think I'm not going to take the word from a guy who can't spell "financially" and "too" and is too lazy to type out "It's a trap!" three times.

I see this as a cowardly move, that will only end in one thing, good by SWTOR nice to have known ya.

The game is not even a year old, a game trial to lvl 20-25 would have been ok, but this is like giving up.

Pretty sure this is a EA decision, EA and company's like them doesn't have the passions for MMO's, the only thing they look at is the bottom line.

There's an interesting article about this trend on IGN right now. They interview the CEO of Wargaming (World of Tanks), who makes the comment that for FTP to work, the game really has to be designed from the inception with that in mind, and so subscription games that convert to FTP rarely work.

http://www.ign.com/articles/2012/08/13/separating-free-to-play-and-pay-to-win

I support this idea.

Anything to keep this game alive.

as long as we who pay the sub get better treatment concerning content / gear availability and NO P2WIN stuff.

All in all I like it.

There's an interesting article about this trend on IGN right now. They interview the CEO of Wargaming (World of Tanks), who makes the comment that for FTP to work, the game really has to be designed from the inception with that in mind, and so subscription games that convert to FTP rarely work.

http://www.ign.com/articles/2012/08/13/separating-free-to-play-and-pay-to-win

Basically, the steps in the article are:

1) Make a PVP MMO wargame with a cash shop

2) Market it in Asia

3) Profit

I get what the article is saying about creating a game as F2P, rather than adding that option later, but in that case, GW or GW2 would be a better game to compare SWTOR to than WoT. It would have been interesting to see what SWTOR would have looked like if it was planned as F2P.

Also, I'm not sure that converting to hybrid system "rarely works". For example, LOTRO and DCUO are still coming out with new content, in spite of the stigma that going F2P has.

What hurts MMORPGs more than anything is the fact that there are so many out there and people have limited time to play and money to spend. Add to that that when a new MMORPG launches, the people who play the new game are largely drawn from the populations of other games, rather than from people who don't play MMORPGs. Granted, not everyone is drawn to the same genres of gaming, but essentially there's a finite pool of players with a limited amount of time and money (well, unless you open up to new markets, which takes a lot of money to do).

Honestly, though, that being the case, going F2P is a good way to draw people back after they've gotten tired of the new game.

I made this account months before the game came out I anticipated it so much and this is how I see it now:

Where are the Guild Capitol Ships? Where is Arena? Why is Space Flight a mini-game instead of the model you represented when advertising pre-release? What happened to being able to kill companions? Why did you only hire competent story board writers for 1/2 the character classes? Why are races completely cosmetic when in SW Lore they ARE NOT AT ALL JUST COSMETIC. Finally, from an investors standpoint, why would you risk nearly 1 mil subs to "increase reach of the game" when you can't handle the players you currently have? How do you expect to provide updates for 1-3 million F2P when you couldn't for 1.7 mil subs. I don't see those 1-3 million F2P players spending more than $15 a month, why would they? So you are going to have to tell your investors that they will see a lower profit being turned over as you lose a HUGE amount of your paying player base. This thread is a testament to that, about 1/4 of the posts are un-sub posts. Thus the investors will demand pay out and you will be left with LESS financial backing than before. I run a corporation, I know how these processes work, you have lost what I like to call "investor faith" and now you will flounder for a year trying to make up for it. Many players will do like I have and go from playing 4-8 hours a day to playing 1-2, which is NOT going to help populations. I had extremely high hopes for this game figuring it would build upon the foundation SWG had built but instead it has gone the Warhammer route. This will be my last month paying for the game and once I have completed every classes storyline, which i can do for free, I won't be returning. I have a feeling that the game "development" is now going to go about 25% to the pvp/pve content and 75% to the Cartel Store. This is just one bad business judgement after another, stop hiring people that were involved with past MMO's that failed... PLEASE!

I made this account months before the game came out I anticipated it so much and this is how I see it now:

 

Where are the Guild Capitol Ships? Where is Arena? Why is Space Flight a mini-game instead of the model you represented when advertising pre-release? What happened to being able to kill companions? Why did you only hire competent story board writers for 1/2 the character classes? Why are races completely cosmetic when in SW Lore they ARE NOT AT ALL JUST COSMETIC. Finally, from an investors standpoint, why would you risk nearly 1 mil subs to "increase reach of the game" when you can't handle the players you currently have? How do you expect to provide updates for 1-3 million F2P when you couldn't for 1.7 mil subs. I don't see those 1-3 million F2P players spending more than $15 a month, why would they? So you are going to have to tell your investors that they will see a lower profit being turned over as you lose a HUGE amount of your paying player base. This thread is a testament to that, about 1/4 of the posts are un-sub posts. Thus the investors will demand pay out and you will be left with LESS financial backing than before. I run a corporation, I know how these processes work, you have lost what I like to call "investor faith" and now you will flounder for a year trying to make up for it. Many players will do like I have and go from playing 4-8 hours a day to playing 1-2, which is NOT going to help populations. I had extremely high hopes for this game figuring it would build upon the foundation SWG had built but instead it has gone the Warhammer route. This will be my last month paying for the game and once I have completed every classes storyline, which i can do for free, I won't be returning. I have a feeling that the game "development" is now going to go about 25% to the pvp/pve content and 75% to the Cartel Store. This is just one bad business judgement after another, stop hiring people that were involved with past MMO's that failed... PLEASE!

I wish the investors would just look at the forums, I would like to see what they would say during an investors call after seeing the forums.

Why is the Sub remaining $15 when 50% of the game is free?

 

If I buy a Big Mac and Fries and the Fries are F2P I'm only going to pay for the Big Mac right?

 

What benefits does a subscription give? Full WZ and Ops is not worth $15 a month. Even less so with the obvious slowing of patches due to focus on maintaining F2P players.

You are qualifying a subjective matter, sure the game may not be worth 15 bucks to you, but you are one person, they must consider the potential impact of thousands and you'll find if handled well that this move will not only strengthen the game but add much needed attention to its content, a PURE benefit to the subscribers. . . . another person commented about "thanks for destroying SWTOR" . . . when it was noted that f2p to 50 was the model, I completely disagree a free to play character that is level 50 will but substantially different than a subscriber at 50 or higher when the cap raises and f2p is stuck at 50 . . . further the number of 50's and the immersion of that one level fifty toon will be MUCH less than the options held by subs. . . .this is a positive note and thus far seems to be being handled properly, the one thing they MUST avoid if a F2P that turns into a Pay2Win. . . .good luck BioWare, resist the urges of EA to marginalize and destroy this potentially wonderful move.

Please avoid Pay to Win.

Pay to look cool. sure.

Pay for convenience, why not.

Anything quality of life, is just fine, generally i think the people who will be paying will be the ones able to afford to do so (like me), and have less time to spend playing the game. In theory it should balance out.

I dropped Stronghold kingdoms because it was heavy Pay 2 Win!. I absolutely hated that about that game. People who bought cards had a HUGE advantage and it became a running joke in our group how much money we had managed to cost the other guy to spend on his defence. Needless to say we woke up fast and ditched that game, just like we all ditched D3 for essentially making something which enticed us to line Blizzards pockets, and presented little in way of thrills.

Free to Play in this economy and in the future does not always mean bad players at all. I have had at least 6 people approach me for friend invites from Steam alone, Reason: They want to test out SWTOR before GW2 and decide where they will spend their time. (4/6 would be playing right now if the dang emails would be sent out by SWTOR)

These people are fluent in English, in their mid 20's and two are female. Not your stereotypical trouble makers at all. Even friends of mine who quit SWTOR are now looking to come back and finish their storyline. This is a perfect move for SWTOR to recapture their audience.

Of my friends who quit STWOR, the main reason was difficulty creating groups (solved) and lack of content at endgame (semi improved). Out of 7 friends, 6 of them who stopped subbing will be coming back to check out the game. That is pretty good. They liked SWTOR but could not justify spending 15 a month.

Times have changed. This was a smart move by the company and i fully support allowing players who could not afford to play this wonderful game a year ago a chance to come on in and take a look.

You are qualifying a subjective matter, sure the game may not be worth 15 bucks to you, but you are one person, they must consider the potential impact of thousands and you'll find if handled well that this move will not only strengthen the game but add much needed attention to its content, a PURE benefit to the subscribers. . . . another person commented about "thanks for destroying SWTOR" . . . when it was noted that f2p to 50 was the model, I completely disagree a free to play character that is level 50 will but substantially different than a subscriber at 50 or higher when the cap raises and f2p is stuck at 50 . . . further the number of 50's and the immersion of that one level fifty toon will be MUCH less than the options held by subs. . . .this is a positive note and thus far seems to be being handled properly, the one thing they MUST avoid if a F2P that turns into a Pay2Win. . . .good luck BioWare, resist the urges of EA to marginalize and destroy this potentially wonderful move.

I have to disagree with this assesment. It is not a qualification of a subjective matter, it is quantifying cost/value. If I pay $15.00 a month per share to EA and at the same time they flood the market with free shares offering me prettier fonts and colors on my stock certificates for continueing to pay the full $15.00 a month, what is the true incentive to keep paying full price. What I'm paying for most, playing the game, is being given away for free.

I have to disagree with this assesment. It is not a qualification of a subjective matter, it is quantifying cost/value. If I pay $15.00 a month per share to EA and at the same time they flood the market with free shares offering me prettier fonts and colors on my stock certificates for continueing to pay the full $15.00 a month, what is the true incentive to keep paying full price. What I'm paying for most, playing the game, is being given away for free.

Now you're just throwing out nonsense. . . apples and oranges in that example, stocks? really? maybe you should just stop playing GAMES like this and re-evaluate truly important matters, because to be honest I'm about as close to dirt poor and homeless as you can be and 15$ a month for SWTOR vs Free is a no brainer for me, I value the game enough to continue to play over the next few months to see if they do it right or not.

I have no idea what you're trying to say, but it seems awfully skewed and out of balance with "reality" which is again, related to my initial statement the value of sub vs un-sub . . free vs $15 bucks . . . do as I wish playing a game I still enjoy vs playing a game I still enjoy but only being able to do x . . . is a matter of personal interpretation and purely subjective.

This is BY FAR the BEST post I've seen in this discussion and it should absolutely be addressed directly by BioWare, if they can't answer these things with accurate measurable and reasonable responses then they risk the very core of their remaining player base. . . this game carried promise, many people including me expected that this F2P move was something that was done so that the things listed in the post could be accomplished with heightened pull from the F2P turn, but reading this makes me think a bit more (not being a part of the pre-release hype / advertisement) that BioWare should indeed account for these matters along with the hopes that they CLEARLY dismiss that notion that some have that F2P will turn into Pay2Win . . . . Doc Ray? Doc Z?

I made this account months before the game came out I anticipated it so much and this is how I see it now:

 

Where are the Guild Capitol Ships? Where is Arena? Why is Space Flight a mini-game instead of the model you represented when advertising pre-release? What happened to being able to kill companions? Why did you only hire competent story board writers for 1/2 the character classes? Why are races completely cosmetic when in SW Lore they ARE NOT AT ALL JUST COSMETIC. Finally, from an investors standpoint, why would you risk nearly 1 mil subs to "increase reach of the game" when you can't handle the players you currently have? How do you expect to provide updates for 1-3 million F2P when you couldn't for 1.7 mil subs. I don't see those 1-3 million F2P players spending more than $15 a month, why would they? So you are going to have to tell your investors that they will see a lower profit being turned over as you lose a HUGE amount of your paying player base. This thread is a testament to that, about 1/4 of the posts are un-sub posts. Thus the investors will demand pay out and you will be left with LESS financial backing than before. I run a corporation, I know how these processes work, you have lost what I like to call "investor faith" and now you will flounder for a year trying to make up for it. Many players will do like I have and go from playing 4-8 hours a day to playing 1-2, which is NOT going to help populations. I had extremely high hopes for this game figuring it would build upon the foundation SWG had built but instead it has gone the Warhammer route. This will be my last month paying for the game and once I have completed every classes storyline, which i can do for free, I won't be returning. I have a feeling that the game "development" is now going to go about 25% to the pvp/pve content and 75% to the Cartel Store. This is just one bad business judgement after another, stop hiring people that were involved with past MMO's that failed... PLEASE!

i actually have mixed reservations about this. the main concern i have is that they are NOT going free to play. its pay to play. BIG difference. games like DDO, LOTRO, DCUO, Champions, etc. those games are free to play because you dont have to pay a single cent to download the client and start playing.. yes, there are restrictions (just like with swtor), but the client is free. hence free to play.

with swtor, new players coming in will still have to pay $15 to start playing. the client is NOT free. hence PAY to play. its basically guild wars 2 lite. and IMO, GW2 does it better because you get access to ALL the content and features, nothing is left out. they do have a cash shop.. but its not much different than games like WoW. all the pvp stuff, quick travel features, etc are all accessible

imo, if swotor was going to go free to play.. actually have it free to play. my suggestion would be the following:

you can download and install the client completely free.

players have access to the story for their first character, then charge something like $4.99 for each additional slot.

if you have an existing account but are unsubbed, all characters are still on the account, but you only have access to one of them (you choose), unless you pay the $4.99 for the slot or sub.

then go from there.

but the way they are doing it just seems off.. its going to divide the raiding and pvp community into pay and non-pay groups, guilds will have to worry about if players have access to the content they want, etc. i just dont get what bioware and EA are trying to do.

The profundity of ignorance and delusional elevation of expectations, to service self-righteous indignation in MMORPG forums, never ceases to amuse and annoy.

I sincerely believe that you are the only self-righteous person hoping to find profundity on a MMORPG message board sir. Further throwing sesquipedalian disdain for people who are merely discussing a topic in an open forum with light-hearted, fair minded and supportive spirited nature shows just how much more ignorant and delusional you actually are. . .. talk about "annoying"

What about the timecards? I don't have a subscription but I buy the 60 day cards when I can. How much I have differs from month to month, so I cant get a subscription. I've never run out of game time doing this, but it probably wont count toward the new system will it?

Time cards are the same as using a regular credit card to pay for your account bud. You are considered a subscribed player except you do so in two month increments now all you have to consider is if you want to continue to purchase and use the cards or when the current one you have runs out if you want to switch to F2P (I'm sure the difference between your subs expiration and the actual start of F2P will impact that).

I sincerely believe that you are the only self-righteous person hoping to find profundity on a MMORPG message board sir. Further throwing sesquipedalian disdain for people who are merely discussing a topic in an open forum with light-hearted, fair minded and supportive spirited nature shows just how much more ignorant and delusional you actually are. . .. talk about "annoying"

I totally have to write down "sesquipedalian," that is absolutely "forum gold."

i actually have mixed reservations about this. the main concern i have is that they are NOT going free to play. its pay to play. BIG difference. games like DDO, LOTRO, DCUO, Champions, etc. those games are free to play because you dont have to pay a single cent to download the client and start playing.. yes, there are restrictions (just like with swtor), but the client is free. hence free to play.

 

with swtor, new players coming in will still have to pay $15 to start playing. the client is NOT free. hence PAY to play. its basically guild wars 2 lite. and IMO, GW2 does it better because you get access to ALL the content and features, nothing is left out. they do have a cash shop.. but its not much different than games like WoW. all the pvp stuff, quick travel features, etc are all accessible

 

imo, if swotor was going to go free to play.. actually have it free to play. my suggestion would be the following:

 

you can download and install the client completely free.

players have access to the story for their first character, then charge something like $4.99 for each additional slot.

 

if you have an existing account but are unsubbed, all characters are still on the account, but you only have access to one of them (you choose), unless you pay the $4.99 for the slot or sub.

 

then go from there.

 

but the way they are doing it just seems off.. its going to divide the raiding and pvp community into pay and non-pay groups, guilds will have to worry about if players have access to the content they want, etc. i just dont get what bioware and EA are trying to do.

I hardly know where to begin except with, wow dude you're way out there aren't ya? >< they're GOING Free2Play, didn't say that SWTOR was / is F2P . . . . knowing that they are . . . future inference there . . . intending to, not having done so yet. . . going free to play they have discounted the game to the 15 bucks and given those who purchase it from Aug 7 forward . . . UNTIL the time when they ACTUALLY go F2P. . . the opportunity to "buy in" to advanced opportunities (again knowing that they intend to go F2P) to rake in some extra Cartel Coins and perks for the game ( <whisper> it's another marketing ploy, just so you get that part ) . . .

More so, I really find your "ideas" about where you'd go with F2P and this game naive and financially unsound, could you imagine being a previously subscribed player with 4+ characters, working the better part of the past year to develop them and then all the sudden having them ripped out of your hand and held in random for 5 bucks a pop? >< Maybe you should think a bit more about your proposals before writing a small book of absurdities and misaligned ideas . . .

Just to recap . . . the are ! ! ! ARE ! ! ! going . . .future tense . . . free to play . . . they aren't ! ! ! ARE NOT ! ! ! ! CURRENTLY . . . right now . . . free to play, its just discounted until such time as they announce the actual launch of F2P . . . i'm positive at THAT time you will be able to down load and play the game just as you would any other free to play game ><