The change is understandable, but it would be great if crystals and tuning unlocked with Cartel Coins via collection would be usable with legacy weapons and legacy cargo. Other crystals and tuning, no, but if unlocked via collection.. it would be annoying not to be able to move them despite having them unlocked for CC.

There were ways to make this change without negatively impacting those of us who use legacy weapons. Make it so that crystals and tunings do not get added to collections simply by removing them, and that the item is destroyed when its pulled from a weapon- no big deal since someone has a copy in the legacy and can replace it without allowing it to unlock on multiple characters. Remove tuning slots from legacy weapons. I mean if we weren't ever intended to be able to send these tunings to other characters then why were tuning slots added to those weapons in the first place?

 

The fact is, we have a post from 5 years ago telling us this wasnt an exploit- which means we were told its something we are allowed to do. When they introduced tunings, they added those slots to a lot of legacy weapons and it looks like even in these patch notes they are adding such slots to other legacy weapons within this patch (at least iirc those two sabers were changed to be legacy weapons). Of course that was before tunings were added to collections but still the point remains that they created a situation were, similiar to color crystals, tunings could be transfered between characters. And now, rather than finding a way to fix that loophole that does not negatively impact players (and no matter what the cost, forcing us to remove those tunings and crystals that we like for whatever reason and telling us we should simply use a different crystal is a huge inconvenience since it affects ALL CM crystals and tunings even if we have paid the fee to unlock them) they throw this out with no warning despite allowing this to happen for 5 years and telling players it wasnt an exploit and therefore ok to do.

 

They should scrub this particular item from the patch and find a way to accomplish the same goal without causing a huge inconvenience. As it is, I can see this negatively impacting their cash market as people will simply stop going after those items if they use legacy gear to outfit alts (which a lot of people do rather than creating multiple sets of gear for toons that are the same class, i personally have 4 assassins, 2 shadows that share gear and 8 mercs/commandos)

I think people are overreacting.This is clearly a prereq change for adding weapon character customization slots It is grossly inconvenient that this change was released before the other though, however I suspect they already have the slots in the works to address that functionality.

 

Think about it. With customization weapon slots, they are now free to patch the legacy collection issue without troubling players. Sure you need to pay for the unlock as intended, but that's their prerogative and a different topic. It also doesn't affect sharing gear with alts even if they lock it down since you'd put the tunings/crystals per character into the separate costume weapon that doesn't contain your gear.

 

This is in no way a prerequisite for adding weapons to outfit designer. If anything adding weapons to outfit designer should be a prereq for the change they are making as it would more or less fix the issue that their "fix" causes with the intended use of legacy bound weapons. This is them closing an old loophole with collections that just got a lot bigger when they added tunings to collections.

 

The result of their change is those who can are using the loophole as heavily as they can now, and those who use legacy weapons for alts will have to choose between the using tunings and CM crystals and putting up with the hassle and costs of pulling or overwriting them each transfer, or going without them. Overall the change devalues both legacy weapons and CM crystals and tunings.

 

If weapons were already in outfit designer then obviously that would not be an issue since the cosmetic components aren't needed on the legacy weapon, but that isn't the case yet and judging from the dev statements thus far while it is something they are interested in doing it is still a ways out there.

 

As someone who has used legacy weapons exclusively for years, and has spent the last few weeks, at least 100 mil credits and 7200 cartel coins unlocking all the tunings in collections I'm a little pissed off that my investment is wasted. Starting tomorrow all my weapons effectively have no tuning slot. I really hope they cancel, revert, or fix the change in tomorrows patch as soon as possible.

Edited July 11, 2017 by Lowarro

Also to me, this really shows what their priorities are. There are a lot of bugs out there that really need to be addressed and fixed. Everytime my group does the new ops instance, when we go to another area (like for example Yavin 4 to work on ToS) EVERYONE's game crashes when trying to use the speeder or quick travel. EVERYONE. Thats just one bug out of many that exist right now, some bugs that have existed for YEARS and make certain things simply unbearable.

 

But hey, lets not worry about those things. Someone might transfer a cash market item to another character without paying their fee! We must fix THAT pressing issue we've known about for 5 years and actually said wasnt an exploit.

Strange ... where is the Keith post this time?

 

Are we already back to anytime there is a change that the community detest, such as this, the communication on the issue stops? Where is the communication this time?

 

I mean the fact that this was conveniently left out announcing until the last moment just tells me the more things change, the more they remain the same.

 

There have been plenty of ideas both here and reddit on how things could have been managed MUCH better than this to ensure people use the collections system to unlock items and still being able to use their legacy weapons yet instead this decision was made YEARS after the system was introduced. There are just no excuses as far as I'm concerned to these illogical changes anymore that turn your community against you.

 

Prove me wrong though. Let us see a gold post on the issue, the thought process that led BWA to this decision and what, if anything, is going to be changed to appease your dwindling player base?

 

Until we start seeing more action and actual "discussion" to go along with those gold posts then all we've been getting is lip service as far as I'm concerned.

I've got one set of legacy weapons with tunings in, which I'll be ripping out of those permanently with this change.

 

Andyrah has pointed out that just placing a "cheap crystal" into the weapon will bypass the need to pull out the crystal prior to placing in legacy bays, which is also fine. I'll most likely just craft my own crystals in future and avoid any further interaction with CM crystals (i.e. they'll become worthless).

 

What I don't agree with on principle is this punishing players who have unlocked a crystal or tuning account wide no longer being able to pass legacy weapons easily. That isn't a QoL change, that actually detracts from buying account wide unlocks, so something else to be avoided entirely on CM crystals and tunings (I tend to mainly use legacy weapons).

 

TL;DR I can craft my own crystals, I can live without tunings. Seems like a good intention move not thought through properly.

 

Edit: BioWare, can you refund my account wide unlocks for crystals with this change? Fair is fair after all.

 

If I don't buy more CM weapons and I don't unlock them on collections is because of the huge hassle of moving stuff around.

I would happily pay a second kind of unlock for some CM items if their "copies" were legacy bound. Bunch of CM weapons are really cool, but the convenient factor of legacy stuff trumps the cool factor. For me, this change makes CM items less desirable even.

Well, I had been checking out the game again for a bit to see if it had improved since 5.0... but a move like this means I'm unsubbing again. I know this game has a long, long history of idiotic design decisions (I still remember the crowds on Coruscant waiting for the stage 3 elite mob), but every time they pull something like this .

 

I had already unlocked my favorite CM color crystals during the sales, for the sake of convenience, and I had wondered about this occasionally, so of course it was too good to be true. What really annoys me is that there was no warning, absolutely none. Not like everyone would have spent the weekend moving legacy weapons and crystals, but sneaking it into patch notes on a Monday is insulting.

 

And they know its insulting, otherwise they would have mentioned it beforehand. They know 5.3 is not going to be a popular patch, between all the nerfs, but adding this on top is just, ugh.

No, I don't see why a cartel market item we already paid for has to be repaid for again.

 

Paying twice is not okay.

 

This.

 

All The Best

What really annoys me is that there was no warning, absolutely none. Not like everyone would have spent the weekend moving legacy weapons and crystals, but sneaking it into patch notes on a Monday is insulting.

 

And they know its insulting, otherwise they would have mentioned it beforehand. They know 5.3 is not going to be a popular patch, between all the nerfs, but adding this on top is just, ugh.

 

It's like there's someone at Bioware making decisions solely with the intent of sabotaging what good feeling Keith has managed to build since becoming Lead Producer.

 

It seems like Keith, and to an extent Charles and Eric, are working damn hard to build a non-toxic relationship with the game community and then someone (probably a bean-counter) is in the background opening the toxic barrels with no regard to what will happen.

 

Okay, under Keith "two steps forward, one step back" is still an improvement over Ben's "one step forward, three steps back" approach; but it is still an approach that is causing unnecessary and unneeded friction.

 

Please, please, please Bioware start actually thinking about the impacts your choices have on the players, and their perception of Bioware.

 

Treating us like docile cash-cows that will put up with any old shoite because we love the IP will only get you so far. And I suggest that given how few servers there are now compared to at launch we are long past the point where that will carry you through.

 

All The Best

I am using two Gree Helix Lightsaber for two sentinels, one mara, a juggernaut, a guardian, a sage and a sorcerer.

I use the Gree Helix Double-lightsaber for my assasin and my shadow.

Of course I also use legacy armor for them and legacy offhands.

All three lightsabers are looking super awesome with the cm-crystals and tunings I am using on them.

 

Now Bioware decides that I:

 

1. Should stop using legacy weapons or

2. Should stop using tunings and crystals or

3. Should stop using tunings and overwrite crystals after every pvp daily (because thats what I do, I do the daily and log on my next char)

4. Should overwrite crystal and remove tuning after every daily.

 

All of these options seem like someone said a anti-QoL-change for me. Apart from the money-grab I see no advantage to anyone and I see no advantage for the players at all. I dont get why a player would defend this.

I understand that you want the loophole to be closed even as a player because you want bioware to earn more money from the community you are part of but there must be others ways. Because here the anti-QoL change exists even for us who unlocked everything via collections.

Edited July 11, 2017 by Bobby_McDonald

Strange ... where is the Keith post this time?

 

Are we already back to anytime there is a change that the community detest, such as this, the communication on the issue stops? Where is the communication this time?

 

I mean the fact that this was conveniently left out announcing until the last moment just tells me the more things change, the more they remain the same.

 

There have been plenty of ideas both here and reddit on how things could have been managed MUCH better than this to ensure people use the collections system to unlock items and still being able to use their legacy weapons yet instead this decision was made YEARS after the system was introduced. There are just no excuses as far as I'm concerned to these illogical changes anymore that turn your community against you.

 

Prove me wrong though. Let us see a gold post on the issue, the thought process that led BWA to this decision and what, if anything, is going to be changed to appease your dwindling player base?

 

Until we start seeing more action and actual "discussion" to go along with those gold posts then all we've been getting is lip service as far as I'm concerned.

 

I have to agree. The last two "BAD NEWS" have been complete silence from both Musco and Keith. Class balance forums went WEEKS without any responses until last week enough nudging by player they said "Yea... not going to change anything"... now they do this crap and don't even give any clarity to the issues that are about to explode on the user community. Very crappy communication skills for someone (Bioware) that is trying to repair its community relations. One step forward and three steps back guys. Where was Eric's "Litmus" testing on these legacy crap?

This is in no way a prerequisite for adding weapons to outfit designer. If anything adding weapons to outfit designer should be a prereq for the change they are making as it would more or less fix the issue that their "fix" causes with the intended use of legacy bound weapons. This is them closing an old loophole with collections that just got a lot bigger when they added tunings to collections.

 

cont.

 

Well said.

 

I hope they revert the change until weapons in outfit designer is released, but I'd settle for them just releasing it sooner than expected (in 5.4 at the very least).

Edited July 11, 2017 by Eli_Porter

What kind of a yellow post are you guys expecting? There is no way to salvage this. Whatever they will say it will be obvious they're trying to disguise a cash grab with sweet words. The only acceptable solution would be to come out and apologize for a bad decision of removing a feature that worked fine for five years and reverting it or making it a subscriber benefit, so most people will remain unaffected.

 

Sorry Keith but I have lost most entire hope I had for you saving SWTOR after this change.

 

Well, you can still win me over, whatever you do, with traditional Jedi robes in the end.

Edited July 11, 2017 by Alec_Fortescue

Meh....

 

I just pulled all my weapons and offhands and overwrote the crystals with a Legacy Black Purple Striated.

Its Legacy so will go into the bank without issue.

 

Take out weapon change crystal to one I want use it change back to a black/purple put it back

No fuss no muss.

I think people are overreacting. This is clearly a prereq change for adding weapon character customization slots. It is grossly inconvenient that this change was released before the other though, however I suspect they already have the slots in the works to address that functionality.

 

Think about it. With customization weapon slots, they are now free to patch the legacy collection issue without troubling players. Sure you need to pay for the unlock as intended, but that's their prerogative and a different topic. It also doesn't affect sharing gear with alts even if they lock it down since you'd put the tunings/crystals per character into the separate costume weapon that doesn't contain your gear.

 

Then they should have made them like diyes - delete, not remove; and let them carry over between legacy members.

 

This was really not very well thought out.

Then they should have made them like diyes - delete, not remove; and let them carry over between legacy members.

 

This was really not very well thought out.

 

And then no one will use CM weapons on alts if they want to share tunings/crystals, as they could just use legacy weapons instead. No thanks.

 

Just revert the change until we get weapons in outfit designer.

And then no one will use CM weapons on alts if they want to share tunings/crystals, as they could just use legacy weapons instead. No thanks.

 

Just revert the change until we get weapons in outfit designer.

 

Pay for the unlock if you want to share cosmetics.

Pay for the unlock if you want to share cosmetics.

 

you do realize this will likely affect even those who paid for it, right? guess you dont. as always it will take another 6 months to fix anything

Edited July 11, 2017 by MotherCrusher

Pay for the unlock if you want to share cosmetics.

 

This is NOT about sharing cosmetics.

 

This is about sharing the actual weapon with an alt while your main is using cosmetics.

Patch notes read: "Character bound Color Crystals and Weapon Tunings from the Cartel Market (direct sale or packs) can no longer be moved across characters via Legacy Weapons."

 

What is the community's view on this?

 

My opinion is that this is a bad change. I appreciate that Bioware probably want to make more money by eliminating a way to avoid paying for account-wide unlock. However, it's going to be a real pain to share weapons via legacy storage from now on. Personally, I think that the inconvenience to players is going to annoy more people and cause more problems than whatever is gained via the cartel market. And, actually, colour crystals might seem less attractive and less likely to be purchased due to this change.

 

Nothing surprising since this game have changed to a milking grab simulator where administrators don't fix buggs, provide quality content but selling shiny bubbles for doll lovers trying to get as much money as they want.

Cool, so if you want the pvp color crystals you need to grind pvp on every toon that wants them....

 

Dear EA and Bioware, imagine a hand with the fingers all stretched out, now fold down the thumb, the index finger, the ring finger and your itty bitty lil' pinky. Now turn what's left 180 degrees facing yourself.

Please understand that, they need your money for future development. Please understand they do care.

How do you all have those tunings from?

Please understand that, they need your money for future development. Please understand they do care.

 

We're already paying a hefty sub for that. This whole CM crap needs to stop or they need to make the entire game F2P. Currently we get shafted with the worst of both worlds and many like myself are getting sick of it.

All the bloody fanboys got Stockholm Syndrome so they can't think straight and defend whatever their idols present, even if it's gold-coated excrement, and all the whales don't care about wasting some extra "lunch money" because all they have to do is sneeze and make their losses back. Everyone else stuck in between has become collateral damage.

 

EA/Bioware,

Show us the numbers. Show us the development budget and costs in a nicely presented spreadsheet.

Show us how much money you REALLY need instead of trying to grab every last penny like you're a dying business who knows his days are numbered.

Give us facts if you want our money. Show us you're reliable, transparent and honest.

Is that really too much to ask?

We're already paying a hefty sub for that. This whole CM crap needs to stop or they need to make the entire game F2P. Currently we get shafted with the worst of both worlds and many like myself are getting sick of it.

All the bloody fanboys got Stockholm Syndrome so they can't think straight and defend whatever their idols present, even if it's gold-coated excrement, and all the whales don't care about wasting some extra "lunch money" because all they have to do is sneeze and make their losses back. Everyone else stuck in between has become collateral damage.

 

EA/Bioware,

Show us the numbers. Show us the development budget and costs in a nicely presented spreadsheet.

Show us how much money you REALLY need instead of trying to grab every last penny like you're a dying business who knows his days are numbered.

Give us facts if you want our money. Show us you're reliable, transparent and honest.

Is that really too much to ask?

 

Considering you are asking for confidential corporate financial data that as a business registered on the NASDAQ releasing that information is negligent at best and fraudulent at worst, then yeah, it is too much to ask.