Nowhere in patch notes is mentioned, that BW fixed the problem with repeatable space heroics. Instead we just got them nerfed.

 

Right.... great job.

It wasn't mentioned in the patch notes, because it wasn't fixed by the patch.

 

In fact, if you check the Customer Service thread, this was added to the "Known Issues" list as of today. That's right: the dozens of posts noting these have been broken since they launched has been added to the known issues list only now, and after the rewards were reduced into the ground.

 

Honestly, though, nothing surprises me anymore about updates and patches from this company.

Nowhere in patch notes is mentioned, that BW fixed the problem with repeatable space heroics. Instead we just got them nerfed.

 

Right.... great job.

 

I can actually step in here to explain what happened. Per our development team:

 

We noticed that the Credit rewards for the new repeatable Heroic Space Missions (the ones you can do as many times as you want per day, not the Dailies) were too great and out of sync with how many credits we expected players to earn on average during normal gameplay. To account for this, rewards for these quests missions have been reduced to bring them more in line with the risk and cost of running Space Missions versus playing through the ground game’s content. We apologize to fans of the new Heroic Space Missions for this oversight and hope that the Credits and Commendations rewarded for the Daily quests are still found desirable enough to overcome the difficulty of these new challenges. Going forward, we will be keeping an active eye on this issue and others like it to make sure players are being rewarded correctly for the amount of effort they put into the game.

Well, according to one of BW staffers, this issue was to be fixed in "upcoming patch". As it was mentioned before today's patch, I believed that the fix will be implemented today. But it seems that it was "truth, from the certain point of view"... and "upcoming patch" means anything from now till server closure.

 

I can actually step in here to explain what happened. Per our development team:

 

We noticed that the Credit rewards for the new repeatable Heroic Space Missions (the ones you can do as many times as you want per day, not the Dailies) were too great and out of sync with how many credits we expected players to earn on average during normal gameplay. To account for this, rewards for these quests missions have been reduced to bring them more in line with the risk and cost of running Space Missions versus playing through the ground game’s content. We apologize to fans of the new Heroic Space Missions for this oversight and hope that the Credits and Commendations rewarded for the Daily quests are still found desirable enough to overcome the difficulty of these new challenges. Going forward, we will be keeping an active eye on this issue and others like it to make sure players are being rewarded correctly for the amount of effort they put into the game.

 

And Joveth, I can understand the nerf... but putting nerf before fix is just not right, especially since those issues were known since those missions saw live servers.

Edited January 8, 2013 by MorgothPl

I can actually step in here to explain what happened. Per our development team:

 

We noticed that the Credit rewards for the new repeatable Heroic Space Missions (the ones you can do as many times as you want per day, not the Dailies) were too great and out of sync with how many credits we expected players to earn on average during normal gameplay. To account for this, rewards for these quests missions have been reduced to bring them more in line with the risk and cost of running Space Missions versus playing through the ground game’s content. We apologize to fans of the new Heroic Space Missions for this oversight and hope that the Credits and Commendations rewarded for the Daily quests are still found desirable enough to overcome the difficulty of these new challenges. Going forward, we will be keeping an active eye on this issue and others like it to make sure players are being rewarded correctly for the amount of effort they put into the game.

Well, that explains the credit reward reduction, thank you for that.

 

Can you offer any insight as to how much longer until the availability is fixed? These missions were one of the biggest points to 1.6 and this is now two patches leaving them completely broken.

Well, according to one of BW staffers, this issue was to be fixed in "upcoming patch". As it was mentioned before today's patch, I believed that the fix will be implemented today. But it seems that it was "truth, from the certain point of view"... and "upcoming patch" means anything from now till server closure.

 

And Joveth, I can understand the nerf... but putting nerf before fix is just not right, especially since those issues were known since those missions saw live servers.

Honestly, it's not their fault for your assumption. When I see "upcoming patch" I usually believe that means "not the next one, but sometime after that".

 

As for the nerf, doesn't really affect me... since I can only 2 do of the heroic space missions per week. Wah wah waaaaaahhhh...

The difference is a fix would probably involve a whole lot of testing, debugging, development, more testing and QA to resolve the issue. Changing how many credits are earned from a quest, could and probably is as easy as an update to a single field in a database. Maybe a Quest_Reward table. I support software myself and we try and keep little things like this ticking over.

I can actually step in here to explain what happened. Per our development team:

 

We noticed that the Credit rewards for the new repeatable Heroic Space Missions (the ones you can do as many times as you want per day, not the Dailies) were too great and out of sync with how many credits we expected players to earn on average during normal gameplay. To account for this, rewards for these quests missions have been reduced to bring them more in line with the risk and cost of running Space Missions versus playing through the ground game’s content. We apologize to fans of the new Heroic Space Missions for this oversight and hope that the Credits and Commendations rewarded for the Daily quests are still found desirable enough to overcome the difficulty of these new challenges. Going forward, we will be keeping an active eye on this issue and others like it to make sure players are being rewarded correctly for the amount of effort they put into the game.

 

Thats so stupid to let people who able to do these over and over get mass credits and new players dont get crap now.

I can actually step in here to explain what happened. Per our development team:

 

We noticed that the Credit rewards for the new repeatable Heroic Space Missions (the ones you can do as many times as you want per day, not the Dailies) were too great and out of sync with how many credits we expected players to earn on average during normal gameplay. To account for this, rewards for these quests missions have been reduced to bring them more in line with the risk and cost of running Space Missions versus playing through the ground game’s content. We apologize to fans of the new Heroic Space Missions for this oversight and hope that the Credits and Commendations rewarded for the Daily quests are still found desirable enough to overcome the difficulty of these new challenges. Going forward, we will be keeping an active eye on this issue and others like it to make sure players are being rewarded correctly for the amount of effort they put into the game.

 

Not really, the credits were the only attractive part of the missing, given then ramped up difficulty. No real reason to play them now.

Yes, I'm glad they had the time to go ahead and fix all those terrible outfit clipping bugs, and the completely optional resource recharges on the Carbonite chamber and Lifeday orb.

 

I'm glad that I spent over a month grinding out space missions in order to be able to afford all of the level 7 spaceship upgrades on day 1, only to have them appear on the Cartel Market and flood the GTN at ridiculously cheap prices. Could have saved myself some time there. Thanks for the heads up on that.

 

I'm also glad that it's been almost a month since 1.6 was implemented and these missions were introduced and I STILL cannot do the weekly operation versions of these missions with any regularity, and that my bug report submissions get the standard "Yeah we know, but we're clueless about what's going on with that so...suck it up." responses.

 

No wait, I'm not glad. I'm questioning whether or not my entertainment dollars could be better spent each month elsewhere.

I can actually step in here to explain what happened. Per our development team:

 

We noticed that the Credit rewards for the new repeatable Heroic Space Missions (the ones you can do as many times as you want per day, not the Dailies) were too great and out of sync with how many credits we expected players to earn on average during normal gameplay. To account for this, rewards for these quests missions have been reduced to bring them more in line with the risk and cost of running Space Missions versus playing through the ground game’s content. We apologize to fans of the new Heroic Space Missions for this oversight and hope that the Credits and Commendations rewarded for the Daily quests are still found desirable enough to overcome the difficulty of these new challenges. Going forward, we will be keeping an active eye on this issue and others like it to make sure players are being rewarded correctly for the amount of effort they put into the game.

 

My primary issue is, as others have mentioned, that a fix was not introduced before the change in reward.

 

That said, I am admittedly one of those people that farmed these missions for the credit reward. Now I find myself in a position where I will very rarely, if ever, do these missions again until a fix is introduced to the daily missions.

 

Personally, I enjoy space missions. I was a fan of the old Rebel Assault games and see this as a continuation of that venue. The time investment for completion against going planet-side was always a consideration because I can almost always do something in five minutes but very rarely sit down for twenty or more, uninterrupted, at a time given other real-life concerns. I am in the game an awful lot (thus my four level fifties) but this inability to set aside consistent time greatly hinders my ability to be involved in other game activities such as PVP, FlashPoints or the Operations that I have not once been able to be involved in.

 

I would have liked to have seen what additional considerations were made for the reduction in credit reward. I understand the desire to make them more in-line with offerings on the ground but it seems to me that other items were not considered or just conveniently ignored.

 

Let's take daily missions for example.

• Can be done in a group to increase speed of completion.
  
• Loot drops can include items of various qualities as well as credits.
  
• Bonus missions are available to further increase legacy or credits.
  
• Missions are fairly lucrative from a standpoint that they provide various daily coms used for superior items, higher level mods and good credit return to the point that an hour or two can see perhaps an additional 200k in credits alone.
  
• Can gather crafting materials at no additional cost.
  

 

Space missions:

• Can only be completed solo and require fine motor skills that not everyone possesses.
  
• Provide credit rewards.
  
• Provide fleet com awards that can be traded for very limited crafting items or some adaptive gear.
  
• Provide daily coms in very limited quantities compared to planet-side missions.
  
• Provide BH coms in limited quantities.
  
• Provide legacy XP in limited amounts compared to planet-side missions and kills.
  

 

Heroic Missions specifically:

Pretty much require Level 7 equipment

 

The time and material investment for people that EARNED but did not simply buy using cartel coins, is substantial. The return on investment is abysmal to even participate in these even before the change in credit reward. Consider that it takes 300k credits, 1500 Fleet Comms and 300 Daily Comms to get all the non-schematic parts. (Thanks Dulfy)

 

Now that they have been relegated to being more "in-line" the return on time invested is very low, with poor rewards and the only missions that are pretty much worth the time are in limited supply and not working as intended.

 

It would be my humble request you consider all the benefits that those people receive by going planet-side and then either re-adjust or provide additional incentive to perform these missions because there is little reason to continue with them when one could spend their time doing a number of other activities with greater reward for their time invested.

 

Yet to me? With my spare 5 minutes at a time, these missions were pretty critical to my continued enjoyment of the game at this point in order to feel like I might still be able to progress somehow, over time.

 

*Editted Addendum*

Please also consider your companies own investment of time and resources and how so many people are choosing to completely ignore what you have created because you have made it not worth the time or effort to enjoy at all.

Edited January 8, 2013 by Smuggler_Caylin
addendum

This was a huge mistake. Why would you nerf rewards for space missions? You only make good credits if you spend enough time doing it. And you want to punish that? For people spending their time, their money, doing what they like to do in the game? This is idiotic. You don't want subscribers do you? At least people that like to play space missions. What is the point of even doing heroic space missions? They're super hard, and now you get nothing for it. Well guess you failed us for the last time. Say goodbye to thousands of subscribers, I'm sure EA is going to be really happy to hear you're losing more money for them. More layoffs maybe? Edited January 8, 2013 by jarjar__

This was a huge mistake. Why would you nerf rewards for space missions? You only make good credits if you spend enough time doing it. And you want to punish that? For people spending their time, their money, doing what they like to do in the game? This is idiotic. You don't want subscribers do you? At least people that like to play space missions. What is the point of even doing heroic space missions? They're super hard, and now you get nothing for it. Well guess you failed us for the last time. Say goodbye to thousands of subscribers, I'm sure EA is going to be really happy to hear you're losing more money for them. More layoffs maybe?

 

Hope you are trolling, heroic space missions still have the highest reward vs time invested rate of the game.

Honestly we could have seen this coming.

Space missions are for me the 2nd biggest thing in game with 1st being gtn and this change does not cause me any problem. It's the weekly rewards that i'm after. Now if you could fix those then it would be a really good thing.

I can actually step in here to explain what happened. Per our development team:

 

We noticed that the Credit rewards for the new repeatable Heroic Space Missions (the ones you can do as many times as you want per day, not the Dailies) were too great and out of sync with how many credits we expected players to earn on average during normal gameplay. To account for this, rewards for these quests missions have been reduced to bring them more in line with the risk and cost of running Space Missions versus playing through the ground game’s content. We apologize to fans of the new Heroic Space Missions for this oversight and hope that the Credits and Commendations rewarded for the Daily quests are still found desirable enough to overcome the difficulty of these new challenges. Going forward, we will be keeping an active eye on this issue and others like it to make sure players are being rewarded correctly for the amount of effort they put into the game.

 

1. They were not worth it at 7k each, but that 7k reward would at least justify the time spent while waiting for the heroic dailies to be fixed. I doubt that anyone in their right mind will run these ever again. They are not enjoyable at all, just a mass of blaster fire and twitch reflex for some semblance of a reward.

 

2. This should have remained until the heroic missions were fixed and we could actually do them. Nerfing them while not fixing the real issue is just one more slap in the players face.

 

I really wanted to stay with this game, but honestly folks, I'm at my wits end with this nonsense.

Hope you are trolling, heroic space missions still have the highest reward vs time invested rate of the game.

Honestly we could have seen this coming.

Space missions are for me the 2nd biggest thing in game with 1st being gtn and this change does not cause me any problem. It's the weekly rewards that i'm after. Now if you could fix those then it would be a really good thing.

 

The net earnings for these are about 80k per hour. One can earn 100k per hour doing the older dailies. One can earn over 100k per hour doing the normal dailies. I earn over 100k in 20 minutes farming particular mats (which means 300k per hour). They were, in no way, the highest reward in the game. In fact, they were a rather poor return rate for the difficulty. The 7k did little more then make them semi worth it.

 

Bottom line here is that I paid, with real money, for the upgrades to be able to do these missions. They are broken, our tickets have been closed, our questions ignored, our faces slapped.....and then they nerf down the normal ones rather then fix the issue at hand?

Edited January 8, 2013 by Blackardin

The net earnings for these are about 80k per hour. One can earn 100k per hour doing the older dailies. One can earn over 100k per hour doing the normal dailies. I earn over 100k in 20 minutes farming particular mats (which means 300k per hour). They were, in no way, the highest reward in the game. In fact, they were a rather poor return rate for the difficulty. The 7k did little more then make them semi worth it.

 

Bottom line here is that I paid, with real money, for the upgrades to be able to do these missions. They are broken, our tickets have been closed, our questions ignored, our faces slapped.....and then they nerf down the normal ones rather then fix the issue at hand?

 

Without the weekly on them sure, they don't give anything. Same with killing mobs without having the dailies on them so i don't get your comparison. And this is not taking commendations into account (8 bh comms in 9 min, try to beat that). Sure this supposes that weekly were working.

 

And it's not like there is all that investment to get into the heroic 7. 300k for converter, some daily for the missiles and you can clear all missions. Actually stay away from defensive equipment, it will reduce your damage.

Edited January 8, 2013 by Spoletta

I can actually step in here to explain what happened. Per our development team:

 

We noticed that the Credit rewards for the new repeatable Heroic Space Missions (the ones you can do as many times as you want per day, not the Dailies) were too great and out of sync with how many credits we expected players to earn on average during normal gameplay. To account for this, rewards for these quests missions have been reduced to bring them more in line with the risk and cost of running Space Missions versus playing through the ground game’s content. We apologize to fans of the new Heroic Space Missions for this oversight and hope that the Credits and Commendations rewarded for the Daily quests are still found desirable enough to overcome the difficulty of these new challenges. Going forward, we will be keeping an active eye on this issue and others like it to make sure players are being rewarded correctly for the amount of effort they put into the game.

 

What dailies? None of the heroics seem to reset as dailies and when the do appear as Ops which appears to be broken (I think its made as a known bug) these are weeklies. Are the dailies you speak of the standard missions that offer fleet coms?

 

Rail Shooter space is pretty bad, the heroics require level 7 gear and offer little in the way of emjoyment unless spaming space bar as you try to avoid being driven into rocks or contianers. Surely things should be done to make space more rewarding and enjoyable and not nerf the rewards.

The net earnings for these are about 80k per hour. One can earn 100k per hour doing the older dailies. One can earn over 100k per hour doing the normal dailies. I earn over 100k in 20 minutes farming particular mats (which means 300k per hour). They were, in no way, the highest reward in the game. In fact, they were a rather poor return rate for the difficulty. The 7k did little more then make them semi worth it.

 

Bottom line here is that I paid, with real money, for the upgrades to be able to do these missions. They are broken, our tickets have been closed, our questions ignored, our faces slapped.....and then they nerf down the normal ones rather then fix the issue at hand?

 

As a biochem, you can PVP enough in 1 hour to afford a war hero implant, which you can RE and get about 1.5 molecular stabilizers on average, or 250k-300k on the market on my server.

 

So yeah, the thought that 1,500 credits is appropriate for a 5 minute mission (or 30k an hour) is pretty epic math.

Edited January 8, 2013 by anakedcowboy

Without the weekly on them sure, they don't give anything. Same with killing mobs without having the dailies on them so i don't get your comparison. And this is not taking commendations into account (8 bh comms in 9 min, try to beat that). Sure this supposes that weekly were working.

 

And it's not like there is all that investment to get into the heroic 7. 300k for converter, some daily for the missiles and you can clear all missions. Actually stay away from defensive equipment, it will reduce your damage.

 

You do not get coms for the non-dailies, and that is what we are discussing, not the heroic dailies. They were not nerfed, the regulars were.

 

We can't even do the heroic missions because they are broken for many of us. Once they, if they ever fix those then we can debate that, but at this time the nerf and discussion centers around the non-dailies.....which, as I stated, were not all that profitable.

 

Further, If you did get the dailies, its not 8 coms for nine minutes, its 8 coms per week as that is all you can run it. It would be 7k PER WEEK, not 7k per five minutes. With the regular missions, one can do them for an hour and earn that 80k per hour and therefore average it out to 7k per five minutes, but it is a deceptive misnomer to argue that one can earn 8bh coms in 9 minutes as the most lucrative aspect of the game..

It's obvious that all things coming from space missions can give only a limited amount of rewards a per week. If you make it a sustainable way of obtaining rewards then you are also forcing those that don't like them to partecipate in it.

Right now, or better, when they will fix those damned weekly missions (yes i don't get them), then space will give huge rewards vs time invested, but only in limited amounts, which is the best way they could handle this aspect of the game.

I can actually step in here to explain what happened. Per our development team:

 

We noticed that the Credit rewards for the new repeatable Heroic Space Missions (the ones you can do as many times as you want per day, not the Dailies) were too great and out of sync with how many credits we expected players to earn on average during normal gameplay. To account for this, rewards for these quests missions have been reduced to bring them more in line with the risk and cost of running Space Missions versus playing through the ground game’s content. We apologize to fans of the new Heroic Space Missions for this oversight and hope that the Credits and Commendations rewarded for the Daily quests are still found desirable enough to overcome the difficulty of these new challenges. Going forward, we will be keeping an active eye on this issue and others like it to make sure players are being rewarded correctly for the amount of effort they put into the game.

 

There are actually a couple problems here.

 

 

1. The patch notes are incorrect. I can't recall for sure or not, but I believe previously the space heroic "weeklies" were rewarding the 12k mentioned in the notes, similar to a typical level 50 daily heroic. They now reward 7k, similar to a typical level 50 daily. The newer repeatable space missions used to reward 7k also, they now reward the 1.6k mentioned in the notes. So you might want to update the notes to be correct.
    
    
   
2. This change doesn't make any sense without making a swath of other changes to back it up, now you have silliness like the bonus missions in the heroic space missions awarding more than 2 times as much as the mission completion reward, as well as older, far easier, far less gear required mission rewards being up to 4 times as much as the newer, harder missions.
   

 

Aside from slightly hampering credit farmers will this change all you've done is annoy the crap out of people who actually enjoy this content for what it is. Not just because of the reward nerf for "balance" as much as the pointlessness of this change while weeklies, the main impetus for doing these missions, STILL don't work. Not to mention the other various bugs still there, BLAST CONDENSER still doesn't work on nearly half my characters.

 

Look, if you want to fix the credit farming issue, LIMIT the number of times the repeatables are repeatable. Problem solved. Or do some real work and put in changes to stop the bots.

I'm upset with this, because, we were promised to be able to collect Black Hole Comms by doing these missions. I've done every single one, and haven't received a single BH Comm. I haven't gotten any of the repeatable missions to come up yet either. They're BROKEN. I've successfully completed them ALL!! THey DON'T come back!! Weekly mission? I don't even get one! These missions are now useless with the credit nerfs. They don't reward anything but fleet comms. Not even daily comms. So what's the point then? 5k credits? I get 7k for Impossible Sector. I can do that in my sleep. What a waste.

False Advertisement much?

Honestly... 7k credits for 4-8 minutes IF you beat the mission first try (which some of these missions are hard enough most players won't) was NOT too much. I can do all the dailies in Black Hole except the group one in 15 minutes or so- and without any effort.

 

This nerf is stupid- then again, most of what BW is doing lately is stupid- so I guess it's pretty normal for them.

So I paid approximately 1.5 million for the parts on the GTN. Means I only have to do 1000 Space Missions to make back my investment. Seems perfectly "in line" with me.

Glad I don't even do these now. ^^