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Are you prepared for 2.0? You still have 2 weeks to roll a sniper/slinger


biowareftw

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FOTM = Cancer.

 

Threads like this = Carcinogenic.

 

Yes because it is much better to see this crap go live, and wait months to see this is an issue, as people slowly reroll this AC, right?

 

I don't think this thread changed jack, other then helping those that might struggle with the class.

 

Every lowbie WZ now has half snipers in it LOL.

 

What have there been like 50 threads on the PTS forum asking what the hell Bioware is thinking? This class is already good. To even suggest that I in anyway am at a disadvantage currenly (before these insane buffs) compared to another class would simply be a lie.

 

Now I know that there are a ton of certain players who are on alert 24/7 and trying to protect these stupid buffs, but these people are a joke. It only shows how far people will go to get an OP beta class live. I remember when people said Deathknights were extremely underpowered before Wrath of the Lich King in beta...That turned out well hahaha.

 

Why the hell am I getting a roll on a class that already can't be charged, has a knockback, a 30 meter aoe cc, a stun, and a ranged root BASELINE?

 

This class doesn't need buffed...at all. I am sorry but when such stupid changes are made, and buffs like this introduced? The class should be rolled to the point that Bioware does something about it, because that is the only way it will sink in, and that they will change it.

 

I mean I know the lead dev plays lethality but really? Is there anyone who honestly thinks this class needs these buffs? Hell no one will even play melee in 2.0 besides tanks if this crap remains as long as bubblestun did.

 

If all they gave the MM spec was slow on the root? The class would have been fine. The knockback already puts a smasher beyond leap range.

 

Lethality? That spec sure as hell didn't need a roll. The other pure dps class(marauder/sent) has one viable spec, and now engineering looks bawler as well? Did they spend half of this expansions development costs to appease Rob Hinkle? LOL

Edited by biowareftw
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<snip>

I mean I know the lead dev plays lethality but really?

<snip>

 

Really? When and where? Because I would like to see that!

Then again, lethality is for PVE or for scoreboard junkies, so it would be very fitting if Dev would play that spec in PVP. :rolleyes:

 

On a different note, we had a sniper epidemic once before, that was around patch 1.2.

Then they all leveled up and got destroyed in 50 wzs, and just like that, the epidemic was over.

I expect the same to happen again once people realize how severe the limitations of this class really are.

Edited by Totaltrash
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after reading this sniper sounds like everything i love about marauder but stationary with range. sounds pretty cool and like its a strong class. unless merc gets a crazy buff which I doubt it will, i will play my sniper after i finsih my marauder. i like dps alot. Edited by MarkXXIV
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Really? When and where? Because I would like to see that!

Then again, lethality is for PVE or for scoreboard junkies, so it would be very fitting if Dev would play that spec in PVP. :rolleyes:

 

On a different note, we had a sniper epidemic once before, that was around patch 1.2.

Then they all leveled up and got destroyed in 50 wzs, and just like that, the epidemic was over.

I expect the same to happen again once people realize how severe the limitations of this class really are.

 

Watching some of them leveling, I'd believe it. Probably much like marauder who would have the keyboard turners using smash as a crutch. It will likely keep the metrics down.

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This thread is a very good demonstration why ppl suck at metagame (original poster as well).

 

You guys should have rolled snipers IMMEDIATELY after 1.4 smash buffs. What did you do? You became part of the a very problem (rolled smash specs) instead of trying to solve it with the class that counters it.

 

But you? You roll a class after you get bored to hell with smashing the crap out of everyone and someone tells you that sniper got buffs.

Edited by NoTomorrow
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Decent Lethality snipers destroy stealthers, so even the stealth counters us statement is only partially true ;)

 

Decent lethality sniper doesn't even begin to touch a good Scrapper. Cleanse + Dodge as soon as the sniper uses Cull will remove both sets of dots as well as make the ranged component of Cull miss, nullifying all of the damage they've been setting up.

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Decent lethality sniper doesn't even begin to touch a good Scrapper. Cleanse + Dodge as soon as the sniper uses Cull will remove both sets of dots as well as make the ranged component of Cull miss, nullifying all of the damage they've been setting up.

 

There are tons of low quality posts on the forums. This thread has it above average unfortunately.

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This class doesn't need buffed...at all. I am sorry but when such stupid changes are made, and buffs like this introduced? The class should be rolled to the point that Bioware does something about it, because that is the only way it will sink in, and that they will change it. LOL

 

Nope, that's now how class rebalancing works in ToR. BW bases their class rebalancing on which class is performing best ingame. And "best" is defined using their extensive ingame stat collection system. Which is to say it is using meta average comparisons. So when a class becomes FotM, what you see is a horde of undergeared players still learning to play the class surge into warzones. This actually reduces the meta average productivity of the class and this results in BW buffing that class. This is why snipers are being buffed in 2.0. And that is why they will be further buffed in 2.1. Count on it.

 

In contrast unpopular classes such as Merc dps and Anni Mara will continue to be nerfed. Once a class gets it's first nerf, certain players leave that class. And the first to do so are the lower performing ones. The better players who can remain viable with the class tend to stay. Thus subclasses that get nerfed actually see their meta average productivity RISE. Which leads to them being nerfed again. This is what happened to operative dps in 1.1 and 1.2. This is what happened to Merc dps multiple times since 1.2. This is what has happened to Anni Mara. And this is what is going to happen in a big way to PT Pyro.

 

The bottom line here is that BW's ingame stat collection system is unable to account for player migration and shifts in player quality within a class. This has resulted in the puzzling class rebalancing choices that BW has made. But that is how class balance is managed in ToR.

Edited by Macroeconomics
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I wouldnt worry. I have mained a sniper since early access and there are always lots of sniper is the below 50 braket.

 

Once they get to 50 they get their assess handed to them and give up before they can properly gear and learn to play. Sniping is an aquired taste. Most dont like the area denial aspect and overlook the major strengths

 

But with all this flavour of the month talk, i have rolled an operative and making life a living hell for anyone playing a sniper or gunslinger. sniper rage quits are becomming common

 

Thats rigth, gtf0 of my class. damn fotm re rollers make me sick XD

Edited by Kalliadies
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This thread is a very good demonstration why ppl suck at metagame (original poster as well).

 

You guys should have rolled snipers IMMEDIATELY after 1.4 smash buffs. What did you do? You became part of the a very problem (rolled smash specs) instead of trying to solve it with the class that counters it.

 

But you? You roll a class after you get bored to hell with smashing the crap out of everyone and someone tells you that sniper got buffs.

 

Snipers counter smash? Ha, thanks for the laugh. :o

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Nope, that's now how class rebalancing works in ToR. BW bases their class rebalancing on which class is performing best ingame. And "best" is defined using their extensive ingame stat collection system. Which is to say it is using meta average comparisons. So when a class becomes FotM, what you see is a horde of undergeared players still learning to play the class surge into warzones. This actually reduces the meta average productivity of the class and this results in BW buffing that class. This is why snipers are being buffed in 2.0. And that is why they will be further buffed in 2.1. Count on it.

 

In contrast unpopular classes such as Merc dps and Anni Mara will continue to be nerfed. Once a class gets it's first nerf, certain players leave that class. And the first to do so are the lower performing ones. The better players who can remain viable with the class tend to stay. Thus subclasses that get nerfed actually see their meta average productivity RISE. Which leads to them being nerfed again. This is what happened to operative dps in 1.1 and 1.2. This is what happened to Merc dps multiple times since 1.2. This is what has happened to Anni Mara. And this is what is going to happen in a big way to PT Pyro.

 

The bottom line here is that BW's ingame stat collection system is unable to account for player migration and shifts in player quality within a class. This has resulted in the puzzling class rebalancing choices that BW has made. But that is how class balance is managed in ToR.

 

bioware needs this guy on their staff.

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Nope, that's now how class rebalancing works in ToR. BW bases their class rebalancing on which class is performing best ingame. And "best" is defined using their extensive ingame stat collection system. Which is to say it is using meta average comparisons. So when a class becomes FotM, what you see is a horde of undergeared players still learning to play the class surge into warzones. This actually reduces the meta average productivity of the class and this results in BW buffing that class. This is why snipers are being buffed in 2.0. And that is why they will be further buffed in 2.1. Count on it.

 

In contrast unpopular classes such as Merc dps and Anni Mara will continue to be nerfed. Once a class gets it's first nerf, certain players leave that class. And the first to do so are the lower performing ones. The better players who can remain viable with the class tend to stay. Thus subclasses that get nerfed actually see their meta average productivity RISE. Which leads to them being nerfed again. This is what happened to operative dps in 1.1 and 1.2. This is what happened to Merc dps multiple times since 1.2. This is what has happened to Anni Mara. And this is what is going to happen in a big way to PT Pyro.

 

The bottom line here is that BW's ingame stat collection system is unable to account for player migration and shifts in player quality within a class. This has resulted in the puzzling class rebalancing choices that BW has made. But that is how class balance is managed in ToR.

 

For the TLDR people:

 

Bioware has no clue what they are doing.

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Nope, that's now how class rebalancing works in ToR. BW bases their class rebalancing on which class is performing best ingame. And "best" is defined using their extensive ingame stat collection system. Which is to say it is using meta average comparisons. So when a class becomes FotM, what you see is a horde of undergeared players still learning to play the class surge into warzones. This actually reduces the meta average productivity of the class and this results in BW buffing that class. This is why snipers are being buffed in 2.0. And that is why they will be further buffed in 2.1. Count on it.

 

In contrast unpopular classes such as Merc dps and Anni Mara will continue to be nerfed. Once a class gets it's first nerf, certain players leave that class. And the first to do so are the lower performing ones. The better players who can remain viable with the class tend to stay. Thus subclasses that get nerfed actually see their meta average productivity RISE. Which leads to them being nerfed again. This is what happened to operative dps in 1.1 and 1.2. This is what happened to Merc dps multiple times since 1.2. This is what has happened to Anni Mara. And this is what is going to happen in a big way to PT Pyro.

 

The bottom line here is that BW's ingame stat collection system is unable to account for player migration and shifts in player quality within a class. This has resulted in the puzzling class rebalancing choices that BW has made. But that is how class balance is managed in ToR.

 

Freaking amazing post.

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Nope, that's now how class rebalancing works in ToR. BW bases their class rebalancing on which class is performing best ingame. And "best" is defined using their extensive ingame stat collection system. Which is to say it is using meta average comparisons. So when a class becomes FotM, what you see is a horde of undergeared players still learning to play the class surge into warzones. This actually reduces the meta average productivity of the class and this results in BW buffing that class. This is why snipers are being buffed in 2.0. And that is why they will be further buffed in 2.1. Count on it.

 

In contrast unpopular classes such as Merc dps and Anni Mara will continue to be nerfed. Once a class gets it's first nerf, certain players leave that class. And the first to do so are the lower performing ones. The better players who can remain viable with the class tend to stay. Thus subclasses that get nerfed actually see their meta average productivity RISE. Which leads to them being nerfed again. This is what happened to operative dps in 1.1 and 1.2. This is what happened to Merc dps multiple times since 1.2. This is what has happened to Anni Mara. And this is what is going to happen in a big way to PT Pyro.

 

The bottom line here is that BW's ingame stat collection system is unable to account for player migration and shifts in player quality within a class. This has resulted in the puzzling class rebalancing choices that BW has made. But that is how class balance is managed in ToR.

 

Re-posting this entire quote millions of times, maybe BEaware will recognize the flaws and fix them.

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Re-posting this entire quote millions of times, maybe BEaware will recognize the flaws and fix them.

 

Macro has been reposting that for many, many months. I'm sure BW has seen it.

 

Some of us (myself included) think he's probably at least partially right, some don't. Either way, nothing will change. If he's wrong, BW shrugs - something else was to blame for the mindboggling balance changes.

 

If he's right however, and despite his pointing out the flaws, BW have continued to rely heavily on this methodology for so long, then they are utterly wedded to it. Their stat analysis has become such a sacred cow, that no matter how many people poke wide gaping holes in it, nothing will change.

Edited by Jherad
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Nope, that's now how class rebalancing works in ToR. BW bases their class rebalancing on which class is performing best ingame. And "best" is defined using their extensive ingame stat collection system. Which is to say it is using meta average comparisons. So when a class becomes FotM, what you see is a horde of undergeared players still learning to play the class surge into warzones. This actually reduces the meta average productivity of the class and this results in BW buffing that class. This is why snipers are being buffed in 2.0. And that is why they will be further buffed in 2.1. Count on it.

 

In contrast unpopular classes such as Merc dps and Anni Mara will continue to be nerfed. Once a class gets it's first nerf, certain players leave that class. And the first to do so are the lower performing ones. The better players who can remain viable with the class tend to stay. Thus subclasses that get nerfed actually see their meta average productivity RISE. Which leads to them being nerfed again. This is what happened to operative dps in 1.1 and 1.2. This is what happened to Merc dps multiple times since 1.2. This is what has happened to Anni Mara. And this is what is going to happen in a big way to PT Pyro.

 

The bottom line here is that BW's ingame stat collection system is unable to account for player migration and shifts in player quality within a class. This has resulted in the puzzling class rebalancing choices that BW has made. But that is how class balance is managed in ToR.

 

 

This post needed a bump

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Nope, that's now how class rebalancing works in ToR. BW bases their class rebalancing on which class is performing best ingame. And "best" is defined using their extensive ingame stat collection system. Which is to say it is using meta average comparisons. So when a class becomes FotM, what you see is a horde of undergeared players still learning to play the class surge into warzones. This actually reduces the meta average productivity of the class and this results in BW buffing that class. This is why snipers are being buffed in 2.0. And that is why they will be further buffed in 2.1. Count on it.

 

In contrast unpopular classes such as Merc dps and Anni Mara will continue to be nerfed. Once a class gets it's first nerf, certain players leave that class. And the first to do so are the lower performing ones. The better players who can remain viable with the class tend to stay. Thus subclasses that get nerfed actually see their meta average productivity RISE. Which leads to them being nerfed again. This is what happened to operative dps in 1.1 and 1.2. This is what happened to Merc dps multiple times since 1.2. This is what has happened to Anni Mara. And this is what is going to happen in a big way to PT Pyro.

 

The bottom line here is that BW's ingame stat collection system is unable to account for player migration and shifts in player quality within a class. This has resulted in the puzzling class rebalancing choices that BW has made. But that is how class balance is managed in ToR.

 

bump^

Edited by Kaedusz
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As having a sniper since launch (sometimes 2) and just loving the way the class plays, I have to say I am concerned with the buffs incoming. My only hope is that other classes are getting some buffs as well to where it will minimize my beloved sniper becoming FOTM but I doubt that will happen.

 

.

 

It's too late man, right now the 10-49 warzones are so packed with sniper rerolls its't not even funny. Very common to see upwards of 9-11 snipers/GS per match.

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