I've been running as a sorc healer for a long time in warzones and feel that it's time for a change of pace. I've decided on a tank (or at least being able to guard+taunt), but I'm trying to better understand the pros and cons of the tank classes. I'm looking for Survivability, Utility, Damage in Pvp environments. Does anyone have a link to where this is already outlined? Can level 50 tanks speak up as to what they feel they can bring to the table better/worse than other tanks?

im not a pro pvper, but I have tanked a lot in pvp.

 

I know there is thsi whole thing about defense being a useless stat, it probably is I dunno.

Im a level 37 Jg and have recently been tanking in pvp. Loving it to death.

 

I devote myself entirely to guarding, taunting ( my taunts are always on cool down) and interrupting and generally annoying the crap out of healers... I get a kill in here or there but man I am really hard to take down especially with a healer on me.

 

Every single match win or lose I take home 5-7 medals In just 2-3 days of pvp I bought the whole lvl 40 tank set cant wait to wear it it looks awesome.

 

What I can say is this, dont go into pvp with the mindset your an unstoppable juggernaut who can outlast every class and rack up tons of kills theres you basically hit liek a wet noodle unless you got dps gear on, but I dont I stay pure tank and I think im a lot more sucessful.

 

Ive seen other JG's and other people who try to rack up protection dmg...but every single WZ im in im the only one who does it significantly. I am usually at 80-90k protection and the next guy under me is at 25-30k which tells me he probably just throws a guard up somewhere.

 

You can make a lot of difference as a Tank... cant tell you how many times my team has survived onslaughts because ive taunted and guarded the healer when the empire comes in for the center point on alderaan.

 

I noticed once the other side figured out what i was doing and why there dmg was so crappy ( especially when I aoe taunt) they focused me down hard so be prepared for that, but as a healer im sure you are already.

As a 50 Powertech these are the pros and cons from the top of my head:

 

PRO:

- Most survivable out of all the non-heal-specced classes.

- Lots of Utility (Juggernaut tanks get more stuns, Assassins get Force Pull, Powertechs get Charge)

- Guarding is awesome and gives you instantly 4 medals usually

- You make an awesome ballcarrier in huttball

- OK to good damage depending on your spec (hybrid or full tank)

 

CONS:

- You won't solo kill a healer. Ever.

- Overall you lack burst.

If you guard a healer, try to give him a wink and let him know that you're providing the guard. That way he knows healing you is a bit of a priority for his own survival and he might try to stay within the 15 meter guard range.

 

If there are no healers on your team, just guard once or twice to pick up the free extra medals and then play the rest of the match as dps.

If there are no healers on your team, just guard once or twice to pick up the free extra medals and then play the rest of the match as dps.

 

If there is no healer or all the healers are guarded already, I always guard a Marauder. They simply RAVAGE the enemies when they are guarded.

Some good stuff here, but I'm not really looking for the pros and cons of a tank in pvp. I'm trying to compare the different tank specs. I actually run with a pet tank vanguard all the time and we are basically unstoppable when he's guarding me. I went from level 10 to BM in pvp with him, so I know tanks are good. However, I don't know all of the ends and outs of each tank and how they compare to each other.

 

EDIT: I suppose I should also mention that my tank friend is rolling a healer, so I will have a pet healer that I'll be protecting/guarding.

Edited February 13, 2012 by Xallionn

I've been running as a sorc healer for a long time in warzones and feel that it's time for a change of pace. I've decided on a tank (or at least being able to guard+taunt), but I'm trying to better understand the pros and cons of the tank classes. I'm looking for Survivability, Utility, Damage in Pvp environments. Does anyone have a link to where this is already outlined? Can level 50 tanks speak up as to what they feel they can bring to the table better/worse than other tanks?

 

Taunts can be done in any stance, you don't need to be a tank to do it.

 

Guard is largely useless, unless you're getting heals. In many cases, it is actually a negative. What Guard does is reduce damage 5% on your target, and then split the remaining damage between you two. What happens if you are not getting healed is, the enemy will lock down and focus fire your target, and you will die roughly at the same time as your target. So, instead of chasing and killing TWO targets, the enemy has to chase and kill just one. Yes, damage required to do it is doubled, but they also get a double kill for it. In other words, Guard is for when you have heals or to keep the ball carrier alive a little longer. That's about it.

 

Tanking gear and tanking stats are largely useless in PvP. Plenty of posts about it detailing why. For example, a crit cannot be shielded. Ever. Now consider how many classes have skills/talents/procs that make the next attack an automatic crit. Huge number. Now consider how many classes have buffs to their crit chance. Recklessness for Inquisitors, +60% crit chance for next 2 attacks. Explosive Fuel for Powertechs, +25% crit chance for next 15 seconds. Etc., etc. Add all of that together, and you won't be shielding much of anything.

 

Armor? Consider how many classes have armor bypass/reduction. Carnage Marauder can ignore 100% of the armor. Deception Sin's backstabs ignore 50% armor. Concealment Operatives ignore 30% of the armor (or whatever it is after the nerf, used to be 50%?). Mercs and Juggs can debuff your armor by 25%. Etc., etc.

 

In other words, in PvP tanks are FAR squishier than in PvE. Lately, I see more and more tank classes playing DPS specs in PvP, or hybrid specs, rather than tanking specs. The loss of DPS vs the small gain in survival just doesn't make it worth it.

 

EDIT: And tanks are all more or less the same. Assassins have less armor rating, but higher defense chance. PTs have a best (arguably) mix. Juggs I think have the most armor rating? Each class has some defensive cooldowns.

 

Sins have 3-5 seconds of 100% immunity to force/tech, and 50% ranged/melee deflection for 15 sec.

PTs have 12 seconds of -25% damage taken from all sources, and 15% heal over 10 seconds (on 3 min cooldown).

Juggs have deflection and Invincible, which is 40% reduction to all for 10 seconds (also 3 min CD).

 

It'll be easier for you to just look this stuff up on TorHead.com or wherever.

Edited February 13, 2012 by Sabbathius

Personally I don't feel like there's a point to being a tank in PVP. I've played a Juggernaut as all three specs.

 

DPS can taunt at the same effectiveness as you.

Guard is just an invitation to die faster (You take the same damage as the person you guarded, at their mitigation, effectively rendering your mitigation pointless)

As an immortal juggernaut, you gain only one extra tanking cool down (40% damage reduction on a long timer)

You gain a 4 second stun and don't have the channel force choke. However, both nearly fill up the resolve bar.

You deal about 1/5 the damage of the other two specs.

(Personally) I felt more survivable as Vengeance due to the reduced damage and healing when charging/intercepting

 

 

if you want to play a tank in PVP, i recommend just playing as one of the tanking classes but as a DPS spec.

Guard is just an invitation to die faster (You take the same damage as the person you guarded, at their mitigation, effectively rendering your mitigation pointless)

 

According to http://www.sithwarrior.com someone had asked Georg Zoeller. He said that the tank does mitigate the damage, however it's unclear as to how much of that damage the tank actually mitigates (all or only half). Granted most of the tank's mitigation is pointless, but I'm sure their cooldowns are still quite helpful.

Source: http://sithwarrior.com/forums/Thread-Tank-Healer-combo

When I'm a healer, any tank who puts guard on me not only gets my vote, but they will almost never die so long as they stay near me. Guard + healer makes it incredibly difficult to kill the healer. And the healer keeps the tank alive because they love guard.

 

Regardless, this is off topic. I'd be fine with a dps spec so long as I'm able to utilize guard. I just want to be able to do the following:

Guard my healer.

Protect my healer with good cc or effects like harpoon. (in addition to taunt/AOEtaunt/guard)

Kill or severely hinder opposing healers.

Do good dps (not great).

 

I'm just trying to see how effective the 3 different tank classes can do this.

Guard is the major thing separating tanks from DPS. DPS can still use taunt, but can not use guard while in their DPS 'stance.'

 

I've tested out guard with a couple of friends. A hit that was dealing about 750-850 damage on him was dealing about half (Slightly less, 5% damage reduction on guard) that to both he and I, with no less damage taken by me.

 

 

but I'm sure their cooldowns are still quite helpful.

Being a jugg, the only cool down I gain over a DPS spec is invincible. 40% less damage taken.

 

Hope that helps.

Edited February 13, 2012 by Mumit

According to http://www.sithwarrior.com someone had asked Georg Zoeller. He said that the tank does mitigate the damage, however it's unclear as to how much of that damage the tank actually mitigates (all or only half). Granted most of the tank's mitigation is pointless, but I'm sure their cooldowns are still quite helpful.

Source: http://sithwarrior.com/forums/Thread-Tank-Healer-combo

When I'm a healer, any tank who puts guard on me not only gets my vote, but they will almost never die so long as they stay near me. Guard + healer makes it incredibly difficult to kill the healer. And the healer keeps the tank alive because they love guard.

 

Regardless, this is off topic. I'd be fine with a dps spec so long as I'm able to utilize guard. I just want to be able to do the following:

Guard my healer. Juggernaut has, obvi

Protect my healer with good cc or effects like harpoon. (in addition to taunt/AOEtaunt/guard)Jugg has total of -- 50% free no cd AoE slow, 3 sec no channel stun, 4 second stun, 2 second pushback/down, 6 second AoE mezz, 2-3 second snare

Kill or severely hinder opposing healers.You will be able to stunlock and interrupt them for a long time (Start with interrupt, wait for next heal to nearly finish then stun, wait for stun to finish then interrupt, rinse repeat)

Do good dps (not great).Good burst from force charge/choke/smash combo

 

I'm just trying to see how effective the 3 different tank classes can do this.

 

Take a look at this juggernaut build. http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#101fbGbkr0ozZZGr0rkbM.1

 

Pros:

Extra Defensive CD - Invincible, +40% mitigation.

4 second stun - Backhand

No channel force choke (CC is better when you dont have to channel it)

Free AoE slow (this is insanely useful for voidstar and huttball)

Still has burst with force charge/choke/ravage/smash combo.

Cons:

You decide them.

Edited February 13, 2012 by Auhfel

Guard is the major thing separating tanks from DPS. DPS can still use taunt, but can not use guard while in their DPS 'stance.'

 

I've tested out guard with a couple of friends. A hit that was dealing about 750-850 damage on him was dealing about half (Slightly less, 5% damage reduction on guard) that to both he and I, with no less damage taken by me.

 

 

 

Being a jugg, the only cool down I gain over a DPS spec is invincible. 40% less damage taken.

 

Hope that helps.

 

Very interesting. What type of hit did you use to test this? Was this simple melee strikes or some type of special attack? I may have to do my own tests when I get home.

Either way, I know from experience that guard makes a huge difference in healer survivability and in turn my own survivability so I know I'm wanting it (even more than taunt).

Take a look at this juggernaut build. http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#101fbGbkr0ozZZGr0rkbM.1

 

Pros:

Extra Defensive CD - Invincible, +40% mitigation.

4 second stun - Backhand

No channel force choke (CC is better when you dont have to channel it)

Free AoE slow (this is insanely useful for voidstar and huttball)

Still has burst with force charge/choke/ravage/smash combo.

Cons:

You decide them.

 

Extremely helpful. Thank you for your input. Can someone who plays a Bodyguard and Sith Darkness also respond?

Very interesting. What type of hit did you use to test this? Was this simple melee strikes or some type of special attack? I may have to do my own tests when I get home.

Either way, I know from experience that guard makes a huge difference in healer survivability and in turn my own survivability so I know I'm wanting it (even more than taunt).

 

Simple melee attack. If I recall correctly it was sundering strike from a rage specced juggernaut.

Edited February 13, 2012 by Mumit

I've been running as a sorc healer for a long time in warzones and feel that it's time for a change of pace. I've decided on a tank (or at least being able to guard+taunt), but I'm trying to better understand the pros and cons of the tank classes. I'm looking for Survivability, Utility, Damage in Pvp environments. Does anyone have a link to where this is already outlined? Can level 50 tanks speak up as to what they feel they can bring to the table better/worse than other tanks?

 

I haven't played a Vanguard (BH Equivalent) tank, but I've played the Shadow and Guardian (Assassin and Juggernaut?) equivalent.

 

I notice my Shadow relies a lot on procs and seems to have a bit less mitigation for overall damage. In return he does more damage and has a better AOE arsenal. Also stealth is a huge mobility benefit. You can guard from stealth btw - unless this has been fixed.

 

My Guardian has great mitigation and survivability, but gives up some mobility. I think the added guardian leap mitigation for a healer is a great boost in their survivability.

 

I think a lot of it will depend on your playstyle and what you like to do. If you want stealth and plan to play more situationally a Shadow would be great. More utility and in your face time, along with great gap closure - Guardian. I assume that Vanguards have better range and can pew pew things without having to always be right in their face. Also have heard they do great AOE threat/damage - which can be a huge help in WZs.

 

Any more Guardian specific info you can see the linkys in my sig - have a few pvp videos showing general gameplay that you can use to compare.

Extremely helpful. Thank you for your input. Can someone who plays a Bodyguard and Sith Darkness also respond?

 

Bodyguards are the Bounty Hunter healers. Powertechs / Shieldtech are the tank. Anyway...

 

Powertech: http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#301GRGb0RboZ0MZbIbbdh.1

 

Pros:

- Jet Charge + Grapple

- Grapple roots for 3 seconds

- Passive snare proc on most of your attacks

- Rocket punch guarantees a snare proc

- Spammable AOE to prevent captures

- Railshot ignores 70% armor

- Shielding resets rocket punch which in turn resets Rail shot = nice burst when it procs

- Shielding vents heat, Railshots on burning targets vent heat = good resource management

- Probably the highest damage out of the 3 tanks (dunno how Assassins compare, mine is only 38 but AFAIK they also do A LOT of damage)

- Most ranged attacks out of the 3 tanks

 

Cons:

- Your cooldowns suck. The -25% damage shield is OK, but Kolto Overload is so bad it's not even worth the global cooldown.

My Guardian has great mitigation and survivability, but gives up some mobility. I think the added guardian leap mitigation for a healer is a great boost in their survivability.

 

I'm a little confused about this comment. Guardians have 3 leaps (assuming you use a spec like Auhful suggested). Force Leap, Zealous Leap, and Guardian Leap. Force Leap even refreshes on 'choking' an enemy. That to me is incredible mobility. Am I missing something here? Do these share a cooldown or something? Also Malissant, why do you choose a "pure" tank spec over a hybrid build?

 

I'm actually liking what I see on a Vanguard and Guardian, but I think I'm going to go with the greater utility and better cooldowns of a guardian. Though I will say there is nothing more pleasing as a healer than seeing a sith leap you and having a vanguard or shadow harpoon him away. Ooh well.

 

Auhful, I'm planning on using a spec very similar to yours but I had a few questions on it. You have no points in Enraged Sunder. Is Sundering Assault rarely used at higher levels? Or is the extra generation just not needed?

It looks like a number of the higher up Rage Talents build up your Smash for a massive hit. Would it make sense to take 2 points out of Lash Out and 1 point out of Blade Barricade and put them into Heavy Handed to get +15% damage on Smash? Is Retaliation proc'd often enough to warrant a cost reduction on it? From a theory perspective, I'd imagine I'd be focusing on healers and other ranged, or protecting my guard target most of the time. Those targets either aren't going to be attacking me or aren't going to attack with something I can parry.

I play guardian, and I can tell you that while I prefer to PvP in a dps spec, I'm always in my tank stance, wearing a shield, and using Guard, and it's not a huge hindrance to my damage. I don't know if the other tanks can run dps specs in their tanking cylinder/charge without being really gimped.

 

My impression is that of the three tanks, guardian has the least damage, and trooper/bh peels slightly better, but I do think that guardian probably has the best mitigation and mobility because of guardian leap.

I can bring Powertech and Darkness (I play Kinetic Shadow) pvp tanking experience to the mix.

 

For me, it comes down to the resource mechanics. I don't like the Powertech for that...heat is a PITA resource for a tank in PvP, because as noted elsewhere shielding does not proc in PvP nearly as much as it does in PvE. Much of the Powertech's tank tree focus on shielding procs...resetting DPS skill cooldowns *and* heat recharge.

 

I found that when I needed to burst damage, or use the AE to stop caps, it was incredibly expensive. That said, if you "weave" between melee, mid and long ranges it helps quite a bit due to more use of base attack not costing heat. If you stay in melee range a lot you'll be using a lot of it, without your primary (tank) skills helping out much due to low shielding in pvp. It's doable, it's fun, but the resource management is a PITA.

 

Darkness on the other hand has a more "standard" resource utility...with an "always on" resource buff in the tank tree...30% increased regen on your resource. It's nice. Also, your instant AE "get off my node ability", your knockback, is very rarely unavailable when you need it, because its not something you spam whenever its off cooldown during hot and heavy fights when you really need to get three guys who are trying to cap your node off that node RIGHT NOW. You've been busy doing other things that don't require your knockback, it's it's available...(at least it is for me).

 

Your self heals as darkness are just another form of mitigation, but they *do* help your dedicated pocket healer keep you up longer. If I'm running with a healer (him guarded obviously), we completely wreck face.

 

With my playstyle, I do more damage with my Shadow (darkness equiv) than I did with my Powertech...pretty sure it's because the resource is easier to manage for me. Other's might get different mileage there.

 

A big question here in your choice...which healer is your partner going to be running? If it's an operative, then I think your answer is already made...

 

Imagine a heal/tank both stealth combo running around in Civil War, defending doors in Voidstar and even better on the attack side in Voidstar. That would be awesomesauce.

 

EDIT: as a scenario...the other day an op healer and I were on guard duty at left node in civil war...we both stayed stealth the whole time. It was a veritable *magnet* for the bad guys (who owned mid). They'd go up the ramp, see my node undefended, and just come charging to cap it. At which point we'd pick which target we'd focus, come and and knock 'em down like bowling pins. Was a lot of fun.

Edited February 14, 2012 by Thuull

I'm a little confused about this comment. Guardians have 3 leaps (assuming you use a spec like Auhful suggested). Force Leap, Zealous Leap, and Guardian Leap. Force Leap even refreshes on 'choking' an enemy. That to me is incredible mobility. Am I missing something here? Do these share a cooldown or something? Also Malissant, why do you choose a "pure" tank spec over a hybrid build?

 

I'm actually liking what I see on a Vanguard and Guardian, but I think I'm going to go with the greater utility and better cooldowns of a guardian. Though I will say there is nothing more pleasing as a healer than seeing a sith leap you and having a vanguard or shadow harpoon him away. Ooh well.

 

Auhful, I'm planning on using a spec very similar to yours but I had a few questions on it. You have no points in Enraged Sunder. Is Sundering Assault rarely used at higher levels? Or is the extra generation just not needed?

It looks like a number of the higher up Rage Talents build up your Smash for a massive hit. Would it make sense to take 2 points out of Lash Out and 1 point out of Blade Barricade and put them into Heavy Handed to get +15% damage on Smash? Is Retaliation proc'd often enough to warrant a cost reduction on it? From a theory perspective, I'd imagine I'd be focusing on healers and other ranged, or protecting my guard target most of the time. Those targets either aren't going to be attacking me or aren't going to attack with something I can parry.

 

Foce push resets Force Leap. Leap - Push - Leap again.

 

Which is awesome is huttball because you can double jump people (jump over the acid, Force push to reset, then jump up top onto someone for an easy score).

I'm a little confused about this comment. Guardians have 3 leaps (assuming you use a spec like Auhful suggested). Force Leap, Zealous Leap, and Guardian Leap. Force Leap even refreshes on 'choking' an enemy. That to me is incredible mobility. Am I missing something here? Do these share a cooldown or something? Also Malissant, why do you choose a "pure" tank spec over a hybrid build?

 

I'm actually liking what I see on a Vanguard and Guardian, but I think I'm going to go with the greater utility and better cooldowns of a guardian. Though I will say there is nothing more pleasing as a healer than seeing a sith leap you and having a vanguard or shadow harpoon him away. Ooh well.

 

Auhful, I'm planning on using a spec very similar to yours but I had a few questions on it. You have no points in Enraged Sunder. Is Sundering Assault rarely used at higher levels? Or is the extra generation just not needed?

It looks like a number of the higher up Rage Talents build up your Smash for a massive hit. Would it make sense to take 2 points out of Lash Out and 1 point out of Blade Barricade and put them into Heavy Handed to get +15% damage on Smash? Is Retaliation proc'd often enough to warrant a cost reduction on it? From a theory perspective, I'd imagine I'd be focusing on healers and other ranged, or protecting my guard target most of the time. Those targets either aren't going to be attacking me or aren't going to attack with something I can parry.

 

Juggernauts (Sith version of guardian) have 3 leaps with this spec, with one having the ability to reset on use of "Force Push". Force charge is a 10m-30m castable ability that snares and jumps to a target, with like 20 second cd or so. This ability's cooldown can be reset by using Force Push, a 10m range 2 second knockback/down. They also have Obliterate (Talented), which is a 10m range jump that costs rage and does not snare the target, but it can also trigger procs for smash crits and free force screams. Finally, they get "Intercede" which is a 30m range jump to an ally that also gives the ally some mitigation. So, Guardians/Juggernauts have 3 jumps, with one of those being able to be reset with force push for an effective 4 jumps.

 

For Sundering Assault, I just don't find the need for the extra rage. Saber throw generates 3 rage, then force charge generates 3 more, and then force choke generates another 3, pretty much filling your rage bar instantly. Juggernaughts also have a 1min cooldown instant 5-rage generator, all of these combined mean that you don't really need the extra rage. You could always force push your target, saber throw, and jump to him again if you need more rage.

 

Retaliation can be used ever 6 seconds if procc'd -- it costs 3 rage untalented, 1 rage talented. It procs often enough if you have focus, which will probably happen once the enemies realize you are guarding/taunting for the healer or whomever. Without the points in Lash Out, you would require more rage generation. Your main rage spenders seem to be Vicious Slash, Smash, Obliterate, and retaliation (Force scream will usually be proc'd to be free). the rage reduction imo is more worthwhile. You could easily take out the blade barricade, though. realize though that you can only force grip every 50 seconds, so there will be some lulls in your combo. 31pt ragers get their additional ability that procs the increased damage on smash, so it's no issue there. You could go a 10/0/31 build for more damage, while still being able to guard and taunt, but your CC and survivability would be reduced greatly (No 4 second stun from backhand, you ahve to channel your choke (can now be interrupted)). It does give you a nifty speed boost to obliterate, though.

Darkness on the other hand has a more "standard" resource utility...with an "always on" resource buff in the tank tree...30% increased regen on your resource. It's nice. Also, your instant AE "get off my node ability", your knockback, is very rarely unavailable when you need it, because its not something you spam whenever its off cooldown during hot and heavy fights when you really need to get three guys who are trying to cap your node off that node RIGHT NOW. You've been busy doing other things that don't require your knockback, it's it's available...(at least it is for me).

 

Your self heals as darkness are just another form of mitigation, but they *do* help your dedicated pocket healer keep you up longer. If I'm running with a healer (him guarded obviously), we completely wreck face.

 

With my playstyle, I do more damage with my Shadow (darkness equiv) than I did with my Powertech...pretty sure it's because the resource is easier to manage for me. Other's might get different mileage there.

 

A lot can be said for an AoE knockback. I use it often on my sorc healer. The main problem with this spec though, for me is that it doesn't have a charge. I'm used to having a sprint which is amazing, but I kinda want to play with charge. The "quad" charges of a Guardian means it's very difficult to kite the tank.

 

A big question here in your choice...which healer is your partner going to be running? If it's an operative, then I think your answer is already made...

 

Imagine a heal/tank both stealth combo running around in Civil War, defending doors in Voidstar and even better on the attack side in Voidstar. That would be awesomesauce.

 

EDIT: as a scenario...the other day an op healer and I were on guard duty at left node in civil war...we both stayed stealth the whole time. It was a veritable *magnet* for the bad guys (who owned mid). They'd go up the ramp, see my node undefended, and just come charging to cap it. At which point we'd pick which target we'd focus, come and and knock 'em down like bowling pins. Was a lot of fun.

 

You make a very excellent point here. He is in fact playing a scoundrel (operative). That ... that just sounds almost too awesome. If only Shadow had charge... Gah. I may have to level them both up just to have some fun with this. I'm certainly intrigued.

 

For Sundering Assault, I just don't find the need for the extra rage. Saber throw generates 3 rage, then force charge generates 3 more, and then force choke generates another 3, pretty much filling your rage bar instantly. Juggernaughts also have a 1min cooldown instant 5-rage generator, all of these combined mean that you don't really need the extra rage. You could always force push your target, saber throw, and jump to him again if you need more rage.

 

Retaliation can be used ever 6 seconds if procc'd -- it costs 3 rage untalented, 1 rage talented. It procs often enough if you have focus, which will probably happen once the enemies realize you are guarding/taunting for the healer or whomever. Without the points in Lash Out, you would require more rage generation. Your main rage spenders seem to be Vicious Slash, Smash, Obliterate, and retaliation (Force scream will usually be proc'd to be free). the rage reduction imo is more worthwhile. You could easily take out the blade barricade, though. realize though that you can only force grip every 50 seconds, so there will be some lulls in your combo. 31pt ragers get their additional ability that procs the increased damage on smash, so it's no issue there. You could go a 10/0/31 build for more damage, while still being able to guard and taunt, but your CC and survivability would be reduced greatly (No 4 second stun from backhand, you ahve to channel your choke (can now be interrupted)). It does give you a nifty speed boost to obliterate, though.

 

This makes sense. With as much as I respec, I'm sure I'll play around with it. Based on what you said, I think I'll mirror your build but with a single point in Heavy Handed (out of Blade Barricade). I'll start removing points out of Lash Out one at a time if I'm having excess rage. Blade Barricade just seems weak to me in a PvP setting. Obviously it's essential in PvE.

 

I can't see me doing a 31 build rager. What draws me to this class is the utility and many CCs. The rage build loses some of this. Plus, I want a very sturdy tank. I'm okay with sacrificing some dps to achieve this.

 

 

not seeinga problem here

 

 

not seeinga problem here

 

Looking at the actual numbers for the big hits and comparing that to the amount the enemy health bar drops, I would say a fairly significant part of that damage is due to the Vanguards BM gear and the enemies zero or very little gear.

 

Not saying he is a bad player, but gear and some skill gives a massive advantage over undergeared people.

Edited February 14, 2012 by Loxion

Some good stuff here, but I'm not really looking for the pros and cons of a tank in pvp. I'm trying to compare the different tank specs. I actually run with a pet tank vanguard all the time and we are basically unstoppable when he's guarding me. I went from level 10 to BM in pvp with him, so I know tanks are good. However, I don't know all of the ends and outs of each tank and how they compare to each other.

 

EDIT: I suppose I should also mention that my tank friend is rolling a healer, so I will have a pet healer that I'll be protecting/guarding.

 

Well he should be able to give you all the info on the vanguard. The ability to charge and pull, is awesome.