If you want a real recap:

 

-Pro matchmaking and xserver

-Anti separate queues

-Hit or miss on class changes, tune down rage, make bubble pop on caster only, make anni DoTs uncleansable (100% no, but un-nerf healing por favor) for examples

-Resolve doesn't really work, but wants something for snares/roots (no)

-Overall improve the game

Oh good... your first evaluation was spot on then... thanks for real tho. I could see it was well thought out but I've had far too much coffee to pay attention to one thing for that long...

Def agree on all counts from that except the annilhilation dots... as much as I love the spec. I think that would be a little much. Why those dots and not all dots? A little bias maybe? I would def like my 1% back tho.

I'm curious as to who thought the Resolve system was a good way to address the amount and frequency of CC in this game. There are people who like it and say that people who don't are baddies and don't know how to take advantage of it. I do get it, it is overly complicated, unreliable, and there are other mechanics from other games that solve the issue to better effect.

The chain CC is worse in this game then in WoW and WoW has the worst class balance of any MMO I've ever played.

Excellent post! I agree 100% BIOWARE please read!

I also support a DPS Buff to SORC/SAGE and MERC/COMM as needed.

I Completely Agree! 5 Stars/Sign what ever you need to get this thread observed by someone who can make some decisions. Unfortunately, I just unsubbed for the first time myself, I really wanted to give the ancient hypergate some play time but in 3 days of pvp, I got 1 AH pop. That's insane. So I have a brand new wz that I can't even play. makes no sense. You should add another paragraph about the wz random map selection also.... anyhow If they fix these problems....I'll sub again. I want to re-sub now but I know .....IT'S A TRAP! If Bioware even responds to this post...I'll re-sub just for them take a step in the right direction

I hate to leave another Star Wars game..I'm Trying to pay you guys money but you act like you don't want. Help me keep putting $15 per month in your wallets...PLEASE!

I agree with most of the post except the lament over the closing of the gear gap.

I fully support the cheaper War Hero and the small gap between said War Hero and Elite War Hero statwise.

Makes for a much more even playing field.

And I grinded out the gear just like you...with the bags, with the comms, whatever.

A very astute observation and one that I agree with; I would offer the following to fix the stun fest we have in PvP.

 

1. Do away with the resolve system completely. Anything that affects a player in the form of a stun, roots, slows, CC, or otherwise inhibits a player from acting should all fall under stun and can be stopped by popping their stun break.

 

2. Lower the CD of the stun break from 2 minutes to 1:30 seconds. When a player uses this power to break a stun, they should have an automatic immunity to all forms of stuns, roots, slows, CC, or whatever else that can be used to inhibit their ability to act for 1 full minute. When that minute expires, they have 30 seconds where they can be vulnerable to the above mentioned powers until their CD on their stun break is reset.

 

3. This will allow players to engage and fight to their heart's content without worrying about being stun locked until their immunity wears off. This will speed up play and promote more brutal combat in PvP as it should be.

 

4. This is something similar we had in CoX. We popped an inspiration and we were immune to any affect that inhibited our ability to act. That lasted for 1 minute. Combat in PvP was fast, furious, and deadly for everyone. We worried more about fighting than watching our characters die while they are stun locked as we see in SWTOR PvP.

 

There is nothing worse than sitting on a node being hit with a stun from an operative/smuggler/shadow/assassin and wait until it wears off before acting. Because as soon as you break it before the stun/cc wears off to stop them from capping, they nail you again and you're done.

 

Giving a player full immunity from being controlled by any and all means for a full minute will promote more intense play within the Warzone, just as it should be.

Worst *********** idea in the entire history of worst *********** ideas.

TLDR version: I play melee and I suck so much I can't be bothered with using CC tactically, so I want pvp where I don't have to do anything but attack.

If this game fixes rage spec, bubble stuns, mercs, cross server pvp is implemented I will probably upload a video of myself singing my humps.

Lol.. I feel your pain my friend. But you may not be singing anytime soon.

Bump

as well these are my ideas. Feel free to comment

- Carrnage no longer gets increased predation speed. This is because the other marauader specs are less viable because they do not have the increased speed. It hurts viability between marauder specs if only carnage has access to this necessary team utility.

-I agree with a previous poster. Dps operatives should get a regular re-stealth after getting a finishing blow. This would help some with their squishiness and help dps opertive problems with sustained damage.

-Nerf Guard. This is an incredibly game changing and powerful ability. reduce the damage transferred by guard down to 35%. In return make tank stats worthwhile to use in pvp (currently they are almost worthless). Make the tank stats increase the amount of damage transferred by guard with a maximum guard transfer cap at 50%.

-All dot based specs _ annihilation, lethality and madness need dot protection. Burst is already the king of pvp, and almost every class has a way to remove dots. (operative evasion, Assassin cloak, Marauder force camo and the various healer dispel variations. To spend all the time necessary to get these dots off just to have them removed easily just further buffs direct, burst type damage more.

-Removal of the interrupt from force charge. Part of the main reason sorc/merc dps isn't viable for rated generally is because of casting. Sniper by default has immunity to this problem, but with the wide variety of stuns, mez, knock-backs and interrupts off global cooldown getting any cast off without cover can be extremely hard against a confident player. It is painfully aggravating to play merc or sorc dps because both classes are hunted by the warrior advanced classes due to the limited defensive options of merc/sorc. Having a gap closer that also simultaneously interrupts makes this even more difficult as getting chain force charged not only chain roots you, but is also prevents you from casting. From a skillcap standpoint this actually makes warrior/knights better since you will maintain the option to interrupt the casti using your interrupt ability after a force charge , putting the abilty on cooldown rather than just stopping it.

-------------------------------------------------------

-Mercs have damage but almost no control options or defensive options. Merc dps should have some sort of ability to either make the immune to interupts, or make them immune to certain cc types. An example would be making a cooldown that reduced castime pushback by 30% and made you immune to interupts and knockbacks/pull. This would certainly not be overpowered but could definitely help mercs get some casting done. Having a ranged root or stun would also help tremendously in getting off casts against distant targets using LOS. Mobility is also a problem for mercs that needs to be addressed. Giving mercs a "jetpack" like ability so the could jump to a pretargted destination or jump backwards a large distance could help against melee and getting around the map.

- Sorceror/Sage Force speed should remove and make you immune to roots like it does in the healer tree. Sorc/Sage Melee abilites should benefit from main stat like every other class and preferably should have some sort of purpose with the specs. Bubble stun should only effect the caster and not be clickable. Whirlwind should be baseline instant cast. Full madness needs a better force regen mechanic and full lightning needs ways to get casting off similar to Merc. Even with polarity shift giving interrupt immunity, it is far from enough to help on a 2 minute cooldown. As soon as people see polarity shift smart players just stun, mez, knockback or pull you to interupt instead. As well the class needs a defensive cooldown and reliable/respectable burst.

-If the Sage/Sorc class is going to be based defensively off of kiting then it needs appropriate kiting abilities. Currently kiting against even two players becomes next to impossible. Full madness could have a 30% slow attached to overload. Another idea would be give force storm/force quake a cooldown but make it instant cast and require no channel. Other options metioned before would be to give full lightning spec an instant cast lightning strike or a moving cast lightning strike. The move already does pitiful damage and buffing the mobility of Full lightning would help it greatly.

-PT pyrotech gains back the range on some of its moves. Slightly lessened burst and give the class a little more survivability. It also seems silly that neither pyrotech mercs or PT use flamethrower. Give pyrotechs a proc that increases the damage (and the range for mercs) on flame thrower. The ticks on flamethrower could lower the remaining cooldown on reactive sheild (I think thats the same of the 25% reduction cooldown) by 2 seconds per flame thrower tick.

-Lower the damage of smash in rage specs

-Lower the damage of carnage ravage slightly

CC break on 1.4 minute cooldown. Makes you immune to cc for 4 seconds on use.

-Put unstoppable higher in the Juggernaut vengeance tree and give it an internal cooldown to the effect. Force charge, Force push, Force charge can give you around 8 seconds of cc immunity which is very overpowered. At the same time slightly improve the damage of the vengeance tree.

-Increase the damage of crushing blow in the immortal (tank) juggernaut tree

-Put unstoppable higher in the Juggernaut vengeance tree and give it an internal cooldown to the effect. Force charge, Force push, Force charge can give you around 8 seconds of cc immunity which is very overpowered.

Force Push is on a 1 minute cooldown. Please don't ask for further nerfs to Vigilance, be content with the Gather Strength nerf. The spec isn't really overpowered in any way or form. Lowering the damage of Master Strike/Ravage = gutting Vigilance/Vengeance. It'd also be a further nerf to Guardian tank's damage which is ridiculously poor as it is.

I also don't quite see why the Pyrotech/Assault tree needs any change - it definitely doesn't need longer range again as it's supposed to be a mid-range/melee spec. It's a high burst glass cannon, working as intended imho.

Force Push is on a 1 minute cooldown. Please don't ask for further nerfs to Vigilance, be content with the Gather Strength nerf. The spec isn't really overpowered in any way or form. Lowering the damage of Master Strike/Ravage = gutting Vigilance/Vengeance. It'd also be a further nerf to Guardian tank's damage which is ridiculously poor as it is.

 

I also don't quite see why the Pyrotech/Assault tree needs any change - it definitely doesn't need longer range again as it's supposed to be a mid-range/melee spec. It's a high burst glass cannon, working as intended imho.

Well unstoppable is very overpowered from the perspective of any class that's survivability is based around cc and kiting and is very OP in huttball. Vigilance/Vengence does need damage improvements. Sadly you read my post before I finished editing it. The Ravage mostly only hits too hard in carnage and I changed that as well as some of the mentions on jugg tank damage. I used to play full immortal Juggernaut in pvp until the nerfed the single target damage of crushing blow.

Well unstoppable is very overpowered from the perspective of any class that's survivability is based around cc and kiting and is very OP in huttball. Vigilance/Vengence does need damage improvements. Sadly you read my post before I finished editing it. The Ravage mostly only hits too hard in carnage and I changed that as well as some of the mentions on jugg tank damage. I used to play full immortal Juggernaut in pvp until the nerfed the single target damage of crushing blow.

It's very useful in Huttball. But no more "OP" than Harpoon, Rescue, Force Pull, Shroud, Force Speed etc... It's also Vigilance's only way to apply any burst damage at all so... saying it's overpowered from the perspective of any class that relies on CC and kiting is like saying that roots and Force Speed are overpowered from the perspective of a melee character.

-If the Sage/Sorc class is going to be based defensively off of kiting then it needs appropriate kiting abilities. Currently kiting against even two players becomes next to impossible.

And that is a problem because...? I'm not saying Sorcerers could not use some love but the reasoning behind it can't be that they can't survive against two players focusing them. Assuming equal gear and not retarded Sorcs, even a Sentinel will die if focused by two Sorcerers, does that mean Sentinels need more tools to deal with Sorcs?

Bioware,

 

First off, let me say that I have enjoyed your games for a very long time. I own all of these titles:

 

BG 1 & 2

Mass Effect 1, 2, and 3

Dragon Age 1 & 2

Neverwinter Nights 1 + Both Expansions

Neverwinter Nights 2

KOTOR 1 & 2

 

And of course SWTOR, pre ordered months ahead of time, have been subscribing and playing consistently for the past year. We are almost at the one year mark. It's hard to believe that a year has gone by. I have had a blast playing this game. It has replaced WoW as my goto multiplayer game. I have logged over 50 days of play time on my primary character, my Sith Warrior Marauder, Aluvian. That's roughly 1/6th of my time this past year, gone into playing your game, or, roughly 4 hours per day on average.

 

I have put up with a lot of faults with this game. The PvE end game content was nowhere near playable when it first came out. Riddled with bugs and imbalances, mechanics that only worked about 1/4 of the time, and little acknowledgement from your company that there were issues. Granted, I was one of the people that took a week off work and got to 50 within 1 week of playing, and was in ops within the first week of release. The end game content wasn't quite ready, and you guys were forced to push the game out early. OK, I understand that and I can even forgive it. I feel that you have finally gotten PvE pretty well tuned and you have a much better understanding of how to make PvE content and mechanics work with your Hero engine now. I am satisfied with PvE. However, I no longer do PvE content. I PvP solely now, because I find it much more competitive and challenging. So, on to the main issues of this post.

 

PvP. PvP in SWTOR gets me fired up like nothing since WoW PvP did in the early days of it. It has also gone through some pretty drastic changes lately, and I disagree with most of these changes. Indeed, I feel that many of these changes were not needed, and have made the PvP balance and level of fun in PvP worse. I am going to cover all of the issues that I feel need addressed here, and I welcome discussion - but no flaming or finger pointing please, rational discussion only, of these topics. I will start with more general topics, and get down to the more class specific balance issues later.

 

Resolve

 

I understand how resolve works, but I simply don't like it. It's a lackluster system. In return for being stunned for up to 18 seconds straight, you get a few seconds of cc immunity. During this CC immunity, you will likely be slowed or rooted and unable to act anyway. This can be punishing for ranged classes, but it is especially punishing to melee. Every class has multiple stuns, snares, slows, and roots available to them. In general, you can spend up to 30-40% of your time in a warzone unable to act. Loss of control is one of the biggest complaints that people have in PvP. A much better system would be similar to what WoW has in place, where stuns, snares, and roots all have diminishing returns - the more you get stunned/snared/rooted, the less effect they have on you. Someone has suggested a system like this that would even use resolve. Rather than resolve ticking down to zero once you hit the cap, it diminishes slowly over time, and the higher your resolve currently is, the more resistant to stuns, roots, mezes, and ballistics you are. For example, 80% resolve would give you an 80% reduction in the time you are stunned, amount of time rooted, amount of slow % applied, and % chance to be pulled or pushed. Resolve should also build faster, I think 1.5x the current rate would be fair. Resolve would constantly diminish at a rate of say 50 per second. This is just one of many suggestions, but the current resolve system is simply not adequate. It is not fun. Recent class balance changes have brought to light just how unfun it is.

 

Ranked Warzones & Cross Server Queue

 

After tonight, there will be little incentive for players to do ranked warzones. War Hero gear, which so many of us have worked so hard for over the past months, will become easily obtainable in a week or 2 by just about anyone via normal warzone comms. The new Elite War Hero set is a very minor upgrade. I understand that many players were complaining about the gear gap, but the gear gap between Battlemaster and War Hero was not that bad. The main problem was that people were unwilling to augment their BM gear, making it much worse than the augmented WH gear. These same people will be too lazy to augment their WH gear once EWH is out, and they will be just as bad off. The real issue here though, is that because WH and EWH are so close in stats, there is really no incentive to run ranked warzones now, and people rarely ever ran them before. You need to add some kind of incentive reward to do ranked besides a 1% boost to stats on better gear.

 

The problem with Ranked warzones, is that it takes a minimum of 16 player on at one time per server to run one. There are usually only around 300-600 players on between all the fleet instances at one time, and only a portion of them are lvl 50. Let's be optimistic and say 400 on. Of those 400, probably only half PvP, and of those 200, maybe 1/4 are serious enough to consider ranked. So we are left with 50 pvpers that might do ranked wrazones. That leaves us with 6 teams. 5 of those teams won't queue, because the other team always beats them, and they can't stand losing. If the pool was larger, and they only had a 1/20 chance of getting matched up against that really insane team, maybe they would queue, and ranked would be more active. To accomplish this, we NEED cross server queues. I can't put it any more plainly; cross server needs to happen for pvp to flourish. That, or the server size needs to increase by a lot. In other MMOs, there were THOUSANDS of players at max level on a single server all queueing for warzones, and they still implemented cross server.

 

Matchmaking PvP System

 

Another huge problem with PvP is that PUGs and non premades get stomped excessively hard in most warzones. While these players believe that the solution is to make two separate queues for premade and non premade, that would only cause queue times to become much much worse. What needs to be implemented is some kind of matchmaking system. There are many such systems out there that you can model this after - SC2 has an excellent one, the WoW Arena MMR as well is quite good. This system should not necessarily be based on gear, since you are closing the gear gap, but on wins/losses and other factors, such as dps/hps/objective point thresholds. I leave the math up to you, but something needs to be put in place to make team matchmaking more fair for the average player. As much as pugs get sick of teams like my guilds beating on them, we also get sick of having zero competition.

 

Class Balance

 

Here is where I feel things may get heated. These are my opinions, and my opinions are shared with the majority of players. Here are my list of grievances for class balance change. I am using the empire side names for things, because that is what I know, apologies to republic players.

 

Marauder / Sentinel

 

Rage needs to be tuned down a bit. It is unfair that I am critting people harder with an aoe ability than carnage and other specs can hit with single target abilities. Again, I leave the exact numbers and tweaks to you Bioware, but it needs to be turned down. I say this as a Rage Marauder with full best in slot min/maxed PvP gear. Someone who has critted for over 9k on a smash on one target in level 50 pvp.

 

Annihilation needs some kind of anti cleanse ability, or dots should not be cleansable. It is already the worst of the 3 specs for pvp, but being able to cleanse the dots makes it extremely weak.

 

Juggernaut / Guardian

 

Vengeance needs some love. Both for PvE and PvP. Damage output could be tweaked a little. Maybe not a ton, but a little. It should not do as much as rage for PvP, but it should be competitive with other single target specs. Jugg tank threat also needs a boost badly.

 

Sorcerer / Sage

 

Bubble stun for everyone has to go. Everyone can get bubble, but not everyone should get the stun portion. Keep the stun for sorcs, as in, the stun portion only works for bubbles popped on the caster. Since this ability can be used offensively, WHILE STUNNED by right clicking the bubble off, it needs to build resolve appropriate to an offensive ability, or remove the ability to right click it off and stun people.

 

Sorc DPS needs to be bumped up, or at least the burst does. Sorcs need a real defensive cooldown, like energy shield / saber ward, something similar.

 

Mercenaries / Commandos

 

They are currently trash in every spec. Lackluster heals, lackluster dps that requies a cast bar for nearly every ability and has unavoidable pushback. These guys need some serious love.

 

Concealment Operatives

 

They need some kind of mobility. As a primarily melee class with no way to close the gap, they suffer hugely after their initial burst. Once out of stealth, they are very vulnerable. They also lack sustained dps in both PvP and PvE.

 

Thank you for taking the time to look this over. I hope that you will take some of this into consideration. I simply do not agree with many of the changes made to classes recently. Buffing one of the strongest PvP dps specs (rage)? Nerfing the least used one (annihilation)? Ignoring the shortcomings of Mercenaries and Operatives, while making an already stunfest resolve system stun people even more? These are not the decisions of a company that listens to it's community feedback and plays it's own game at the higher levels of pvp play. With other developers, I may not always agree with some of their decisions, but I understand why they made them. With the last few months of changes to Star Wars: The Old Republic, I have been simply shocked and appalled at the decision making.

 

At this point, after being one of your most loyal fans, I am considering unsubscribing within a few months, or when the next big game comes along, if things here do not improve. I know, I am only one subscriber, Bioware probably doesn't care, but there it is. I am sure that I am not the only person that feels this way.

 

This is Star Wars, not Stun Wars. Fix it Bioware.

I guess I was correct when I said you and Jack were the only decent level headed ones in Infinite Darkness. Never ever have I read such a well thought out and well written post in all the months this game has been out. I agree with a good portion of everything that you have said Al and like you I have been here from this games pre-release. You know my main is a merc and they ruined the game for my class in pvp.

I am also fond of the pve aspect of this game but you are correct when you say it lacks extra content. After doing the ops and all of the planet stories there is no real insensitive to continue playing anything pve based.

While it saddens me greatly I have also been considering unsubbing for good since they continually ignore pvp and keep pumping out more pointless cosmetics and speeders.

Was good crossing paths with you and exchanging the many battles we did, even though you crushed my merc soundly you did it in a professional way and never once made it personal. For that you have always had my respect. Best wishes to you in whatever you decided to do from here on out Al.

Force Push is on a 1 minute cooldown. Please don't ask for further nerfs to Vigilance, be content with the Gather Strength nerf. The spec isn't really overpowered in any way or form. Lowering the damage of Master Strike/Ravage = gutting Vigilance/Vengeance. It'd also be a further nerf to Guardian tank's damage which is ridiculously poor as it is.

 

I also don't quite see why the Pyrotech/Assault tree needs any change - it definitely doesn't need longer range again as it's supposed to be a mid-range/melee spec. It's a high burst glass cannon, working as intended imho.

Do you have a Pyrotech Merc and do you have it fully geared? Our high burst damage was nerfed so much that it is rather unfair to say we are a glass cannon. We're just glass at this point....

Bump

 

as well these are my ideas. Feel free to comment

 

- Carrnage no longer gets increased predation speed. This is because the other marauader specs are less viable because they do not have the increased speed. It hurts viability between marauder specs if only carnage has access to this necessary team utility.

 

-I agree with a previous poster. Dps operatives should get a regular re-stealth after getting a finishing blow. This would help some with their squishiness and help dps opertive problems with sustained damage.

 

-Nerf Guard. This is an incredibly game changing and powerful ability. reduce the damage transferred by guard down to 35%. In return make tank stats worthwhile to use in pvp (currently they are almost worthless). Make the tank stats increase the amount of damage transferred by guard with a maximum guard transfer cap at 50%.

 

-All dot based specs _ annihilation, lethality and madness need dot protection. Burst is already the king of pvp, and almost every class has a way to remove dots. (operative evasion, Assassin cloak, Marauder force camo and the various healer dispel variations. To spend all the time necessary to get these dots off just to have them removed easily just further buffs direct, burst type damage more.

 

-Removal of the interrupt from force charge. Part of the main reason sorc/merc dps isn't viable for rated generally is because of casting. Sniper by default has immunity to this problem, but with the wide variety of stuns, mez, knock-backs and interrupts off global cooldown getting any cast off without cover can be extremely hard against a confident player. It is painfully aggravating to play merc or sorc dps because both classes are hunted by the warrior advanced classes due to the limited defensive options of merc/sorc. Having a gap closer that also simultaneously interrupts makes this even more difficult as getting chain force charged not only chain roots you, but is also prevents you from casting. From a skillcap standpoint this actually makes warrior/knights better since you will maintain the option to interrupt the casti using your interrupt ability after a force charge , putting the abilty on cooldown rather than just stopping it.

 

-------------------------------------------------------

-Mercs have damage but almost no control options or defensive options. Merc dps should have some sort of ability to either make the immune to interupts, or make them immune to certain cc types. An example would be making a cooldown that reduced castime pushback by 30% and made you immune to interupts and knockbacks/pull. This would certainly not be overpowered but could definitely help mercs get some casting done. Having a ranged root or stun would also help tremendously in getting off casts against distant targets using LOS. Mobility is also a problem for mercs that needs to be addressed. Giving mercs a "jetpack" like ability so the could jump to a pretargted destination or jump backwards a large distance could help against melee and getting around the map.

 

- Sorceror/Sage Force speed should remove and make you immune to roots like it does in the healer tree. Sorc/Sage Melee abilites should benefit from main stat like every other class and preferably should have some sort of purpose with the specs. Bubble stun should only effect the caster and not be clickable. Whirlwind should be baseline instant cast. Full madness needs a better force regen mechanic and full lightning needs ways to get casting off similar to Merc. Even with polarity shift giving interrupt immunity, it is far from enough to help on a 2 minute cooldown. As soon as people see polarity shift smart players just stun, mez, knockback or pull you to interupt instead. As well the class needs a defensive cooldown and reliable/respectable burst.

 

-If the Sage/Sorc class is going to be based defensively off of kiting then it needs appropriate kiting abilities. Currently kiting against even two players becomes next to impossible. Full madness could have a 30% slow attached to overload. Another idea would be give force storm/force quake a cooldown but make it instant cast and require no channel. Other options metioned before would be to give full lightning spec an instant cast lightning strike or a moving cast lightning strike. The move already does pitiful damage and buffing the mobility of Full lightning would help it greatly.

 

-PT pyrotech gains back the range on some of its moves. Slightly lessened burst and give the class a little more survivability. It also seems silly that neither pyrotech mercs or PT use flamethrower. Give pyrotechs a proc that increases the damage (and the range for mercs) on flame thrower. The ticks on flamethrower could lower the remaining cooldown on reactive sheild (I think thats the same of the 25% reduction cooldown) by 2 seconds per flame thrower tick.

 

-Lower the damage of smash in rage specs

 

-Lower the damage of carnage ravage slightly

 

CC break on 1.4 minute cooldown. Makes you immune to cc for 4 seconds on use.

 

-Put unstoppable higher in the Juggernaut vengeance tree and give it an internal cooldown to the effect. Force charge, Force push, Force charge can give you around 8 seconds of cc immunity which is very overpowered. At the same time slightly improve the damage of the vengeance tree.

 

-Increase the damage of crushing blow in the immortal (tank) juggernaut tree

It will most likely never be dealt with......it would be nice but I'm done holding my breath and waiting for a buff.

It's very useful in Huttball. But no more "OP" than Harpoon, Rescue, Force Pull, Shroud, Force Speed etc... It's also Vigilance's only way to apply any burst damage at all so... saying it's overpowered from the perspective of any class that relies on CC and kiting is like saying that roots and Force Speed are overpowered from the perspective of a melee character.

 

 

 

And that is a problem because...? I'm not saying Sorcerers could not use some love but the reasoning behind it can't be that they can't survive against two players focusing them. Assuming equal gear and not retarded Sorcs, even a Sentinel will die if focused by two Sorcerers, does that mean Sentinels need more tools to deal with Sorcs?

Sorcs are a 'kiting' class- that doesn't have a permanent ability to snare, or a single baseline root. They have no baseline ability to avoid CC, only the healing spec gets a 2 second root immunity.

Mara get a baseline root- and one spec adds 2 more, another adds one more. They also can easily perma snare, get multiple defensives, get an aoe instant mez, etc... Mara aren't a kiting class- even snipers, which aren't a kiting class have better kiting abilities... in fact, sorcs get some of the weakest kiting abilities in any mmo.

It's very useful in Huttball. But no more "OP" than Harpoon, Rescue, Force Pull, Shroud, Force Speed etc... It's also Vigilance's only way to apply any burst damage at all so... saying it's overpowered from the perspective of any class that relies on CC and kiting is like saying that roots and Force Speed are overpowered from the perspective of a melee character.

 

 

 

And that is a problem because...? I'm not saying Sorcerers could not use some love but the reasoning behind it can't be that they can't survive against two players focusing them. Assuming equal gear and not retarded Sorcs, even a Sentinel will die if focused by two Sorcerers, does that mean Sentinels need more tools to deal with Sorcs?

Sorcerers need some help in the kiting department or changes in the games system for several reasons. As currently running either full madness or hybrid 1v1 you do not have the ability to ever permanently keep away from any equally skilled melee target. This in itself is fine as melee shouldn't be able to be permanently kited, but when in melee range melee can produce more damage in 3 seconds than a Sorc/Sage may have created in the last 8 seconds of kiting. Being in melee range as a sorcerer is a death sentence, and it is even worse if you play full lightning spec. 1v1 the Sorc/Sage class at skill cap isn't too bad assuming you understand how to counter every spec variation of the enemy classes. If you don't understand exactly how to counter every class, those few seconds in melee range will cause your death.

The exact reason Sorc/Sage needs help is once another player enters the fight your chances of survival drop dramatically. Your only escape mechanics are the CC break and Force speed. With the large amounts of roots melee have in comparison to the sorcerer class (which at most can only have 1 root at any given time) force speed is usually rendered useless by skilled players. Force speed can be stopped by mezz, stun and roots leaving you defenseless in melee range with no way to get out. Overload is the weakest knockback in game and without the root does little to help you peel yourself. After that you have a 10 meter stun (1 min cooldown) and an 8 second mez (1 min cooldown) with a 2 second cast time unless speced halfway up the madness tree. Being that everyone has a interupt and that the interrupt is off global cooldown you have no way to protect yourself, cast to deal damage or escape.

I can easily take 2v1 situations on my Jugg and my sniper even though I am much more skilled and gear on my dps sorcerer. Both Jugg and Sniper have defensive cooldowns, better CC, better burst and better damage under pressure. No one should typically win in a 2v1 situation, but that doesn't mean you should be useless in a 2v1 situation. Just because the Sorc/Sage can operate in a 1v1 situation if played perfectly doesn't mean it is fine. This is a team game and being attacked by multiple targets is a very common situation for a Sorc/Sage, and they are attacked for this very reason. They don't have a way to fight back in a group situation.