You are the only one who has spoken of banning people.

 

You are confused. Using an exploit does not = immediate ban. You really do need to understand this. The point is not to ban people - but to fix the way xp is awarded to stop the exploiting.

 

As for the rest of your comment - it's simply so profoundly ludicrous and inapplicable - it will have to otherwise be ignored.

If you exploit, you get banned. That is BW's policy, not mine. That is why they banned all those players exploiting valor in Ilum, those players who exploited the WZ bug to bring in more players, or those who exploit the game with hacks. If people aren't going to get banned doing something, it is NOT an exploit.

Also, you've still yet to provide any proof avoid xp is an exploit or that BW doesn't want us doing it. Just because something annoys you, and you don't like it, doesn't make it an exploit.

bioware does not need to waste developer time on this

Well I hope that they do. Maybe you'd like to make your own thread acknowledging the action yet stating you feel they shouldn't fix it. Yes, that would be very nice.

And yet you've still yet to provide any proof avoid xp is an exploit or that BW doesn't want us doing it.

That's fine. You go ahead and believe they want us doing it.

I will believe that it's an active exploit.

ok?

That's fine. You go ahead and believe they want us doing it.

 

I will believe that it's an active exploit.

 

ok?

So you're basically created another thread here to just whine? Aite.

i can understand that it is frustrating that there are morons who want to twink their 49s and pwn people in the sub-50 bracket. but what happens in the sub-50 bracket is irrelevant. real PvP doesnt start until level 50.

 

so instead of coming to the forums whining that people are doing this (there is no way to stop it btw) maybe finish leveling your toon, get to 50, and never have to see those twink morons again? take your licks in the lowbie warzones, get your XP, and then get to the real PvP.

 

this seems like a massive non-issue, and i certainly hope that bioware is not devoting resources to this problem

You are certainly entitled to your opinion. May the devs take it into consideration. As I hope they do mine.

Thanks for your input.

So you're basically created another thread here to just whine? Aite.

Another thread? Hmmm it's been like 6 months or so since I've made a thread. It's entirely within my right to do so.

Don't like it? Well I guess that's too *********** bad.

Now, how about that source?

And keep those replies coming -- keeps the thread bumped - ty

If you exploit, you get banned. That is BW's policy, not mine. That is why they banned all those players exploiting valor in Ilum, those players who exploited the WZ bug to bring in more players, or those who exploit the game with hacks. If people aren't going to get banned doing something, it is NOT an exploit.

 

Also, you've still yet to provide any proof avoid xp is an exploit or that BW doesn't want us doing it. Just because something annoys you, and you don't like it, doesn't make it an exploit.

No - it isn't "if you exploit you get banned" You are wrong wrong wrong wrong. The banning depends on the implications of the exploit.

here - since you aren't able to provide any real sources -- here's one on the ilium issues. It specifically states only a small number of accounts were banned:

http://massively.joystiq.com/2012/01/02/bioware-responds-to-ilum-exploits/

"In the post, Reid clarifies that only accounts suspected of gold farming were actually banned. Only a small number of accounts were temporarily suspended for the Ilum exploit, and also any action taken against an account may be appealed."

And with that - since you aren't even arguing with basic facts - I'm done replying to you. Please have a nice stay. But = feel free to bump this thread at will.

It's not an exploit.

 

"Let me start by explaining how we go about determining when to fix an issue in the live game, whether it is a bug or an exploit. Let’s begin with exploits – those cases when we determine that a bug in the code can give an unfair advantage to a player. (Remember, not all bugs are exploits!)"

 

http://www.swtor.com/blog/developer-blog-busting-bugs-and-fixing-exploits

 

Leaving WZs does not give the person leaving an advantage. The other stuff you mentioned like getting more than 8 people in a WZ is an exploit because it gives you an advantage.

Well:

Let me start by explaining how we go about determining when to fix an issue in the live game, whether it is a bug or an exploit. Let’s begin with exploits – those cases when we determine that a bug in the code can give an unfair advantage to a player. (Remember, not all bugs are exploits!)

Is there an in game way to turn off exp gain? No.

Does the option to leaving a warzone have an orginal, intended purpose? Yes.

Is that purpose to avoid gaining exp? No.

Does remaining 49 indefinitely via using a mechanic as it is not intended to be used giving a player an advantage that can not be obtained via in game, legal methods? Yes.

Well I hope that they do. Maybe you'd like to make your own thread acknowledging the action yet stating you feel they shouldn't fix it. Yes, that would be very nice.

there is no exploit, and no problem. if you do not like it, you dont have to participate in lowbie warzones.

yes, it sucks when people twink their 49s. ive seen a few on my alts. but lowbie warzones have no affect on anything.

if you really dont like it that much, i suggest powering through your class story and as many quests as you can find, and then getting into PvP after you hit 50.

No - it isn't "if you exploit you get banned" You are wrong wrong wrong wrong. The banning depends on the implications of the exploit.

 

here - since you aren't able to provide any real sources -- here's one on the ilium issues. It specifically states only a small number of accounts were banned:

 

 

http://massively.joystiq.com/2012/01/02/bioware-responds-to-ilum-exploits/

 

"In the post, Reid clarifies that only accounts suspected of gold farming were actually banned. Only a small number of accounts were temporarily suspended for the Ilum exploit, and also any action taken against an account may be appealed."

 

And with that - since you aren't even arguing with basic facts - I'm done replying to you. Please have a nice stay. But = feel free to bump this thread at will.

People still got banned, regardless of the amount or time. I've never heard of anyone getting banned for leaving WZs to avoid xp. Have you?

Well:

 

 

 

Is there an in game way to turn off exp gain? No.

 

Does the option to leaving a warzone have an orginal, intended purpose? Yes.

 

Is that purpose to avoid gaining exp? No.

 

Does remaining 49 indefinitely via using a mechanic as it is not intended to be used giving a player an advantage that can not be obtained via in game, legal methods? Yes.

For something to be considered an exploit by BW, it has to take an advantage of a bug in the game's cod. Leaving WZs is not a BUG at all. People leave WZs for various reasons: losing, dislikes WZ, went afk, backfilled, etc. The act of leaving a WZ is not a bug. BW designed this game so you can leave a WZ anytime you want, for whatever reason you choose to.

Leaving a WZ gives you no rewards and no advantages, hence no exploit.

For something to be considered an exploit by BW, it has to take an advantage of a bug in the game's cod. Leaving WZs is not a BUG at all. People leave WZs for various reasons: losing, dislikes WZ, went afk, backfilled, etc. The act of leaving a WZ is not a bug. BW designed this game so you can leave a WZ anytime you want, for whatever reason you choose to.

 

Leaving a WZ gives you no rewards and no advantages.

=P So /stuck isn't an exploit?

Any way, I'm tired of arguing. *Roll eyes* I forgot, logic doesn't apply here. It's not an exploit that really needs fixing or bothers too many people so meh...

=P So /stuck isn't an exploit?

 

Any way, I'm tired of arguing. *Roll eyes* I forgot, logic doesn't apply here. It's not an exploit that really needs fixing or bothers too many people so meh...

It's not an exploit by BW's standard. I've also never heard of anyone getting banned because of using /stuck.

I consider it cheap and wouldn't do it, but if others want to, good for them.

Lol at trying to insult me. Guess you got nothing better to say.

It's not an exploit by BW's standard. I've also never heard of anyone getting banned because of using /stuck.

 

I consider it cheap and wouldn't do it, but if others want to, good for them.

 

Lol at trying to insult me. Guess you got nothing better to say.

You. Do. Not. Know. If. Bioware. Considers. This. An. Exploit. Or. Not.

They have made no statement on it. They have made no statement on /stuck. They made -no- statement on the Kaon Under Seige exploit until they fixed it. You lack the data to say what bioware thinks or doesn't think.

Where as I've provided a logical pathway to determine if something is an exploit, which you've choosen to ignore. You can apply the process to anything in game, and determine if it's an exploit or not. It is then up to Bioware to decide whether to deal with it or leave it alone. Until they do, it is unlikely -any- of us will know what specific things they consider an exploit and what aren't.

All we can go on, is a logical progrssion of thought, based on how a mechanic is intended and how (and why) it's being used for other purposes.

and what about good players? they should be banned from lowbie pvp too.

I mean, they know all classes, and can outplay newbs up and down. This is unfair advantage. They know casbars, they prodobly have atleast 2 or more 50 lvl characters, fast internet, mouse with lots of buttons.... a brain, and they take care of objectives. how fair it is compared to that newbie operative who don't have stealth button binded to a key?

if you have more then 2 50 lvl chars, you should not be able to join 10-49 lvl pvp since you are prodobly better player.

People still got banned, regardless of the amount or time. I've never heard of anyone getting banned for leaving WZs to avoid xp. Have you?

You really argue with the poorest understanding of what an exploit is. Ok I'm being civil. You have NO understanding of what an exploit is. I think you are just making things up as you go.

To be an exploit - you don't have to be taking advantage of a "bug" as you stated. It can be intentionally taking advantage of normal game mechanics which ends up in unintended consequences that benefit you and prevent other's from enjoying natural progression of normal game play. End. Of. Story.

As for them not fixing it - the ONLY thing it means is, they haven't fixed it. That can be for several reasons. Maybe - just maybe - they aren't really aware of it. Or, maybe it hasn't been enough of an issue to cause a problem yet.

You see - what you refuse to acknowledge (I'm thinking understand really) is not only do they not ban people for using all exploits, they don't rush to fix all exploits. The decision to fix an exploit depends on that exploit's ramifications on game play. If enough people weren't doing this for it to cause a problem - HEY wadda you know? Few ramifications. That means little impetus to fix the exploit. Now enough people are doing it to cause ramifications. And it's increasing. So as it starts to cause more and more problems - NOW is when they might (hopefull will)

do something. (And I don't care that it hasn't affected you personally - or other's arguing this isn't a problem in this thread.) It's affected me, it's affected people I know, it's affected people I've teamed with in PvP and it's affected other's in this thread. In other words - it is now starting to have RAMIFICATIONS for people's game play.

I've been playing since pre-launch. I have 2 active accounts in my home. I have mutliple toons that I PvP with extensively (most pre-50 in fact. I personally enjoy it. . But - note I don't cheat to stay level 49) It has only in the last TWO WEEKS come to my attention and has beeen affecting my team's play in Warzones (To my knowledge. I'm now wondering about all t hose Huttball games where people left before the end of the game). NOW it is an issue. NOW I will make sure they know about this exploit as is my right on these forums. Like I said - don't like it? Don't agree? That's your choice. But it does nothing to my right to bring it to the devs attention that it is now a problem. And is getting worse daily.

Now I said I wouldn't reply to you - you aren't correct in what you say, you refuse to quote sources when you make your (blatantly wrong) assertions. This time, I really am through replying to you.

but what happens in the sub-50 bracket is irrelevant. real PvP doesnt start until level 50.

The sub-50 bracket isn't irrelevant. There is a reason a game doesn't automatically start people off with toons at max level, skills, and talents, they need to level to learn their class as they go. If they are PvP'ers they learn their class by PvP'ing. And from some of the clueless(not bads, but actually clueless about what to do in the WZ or with their class) people I've seen in 50 PvP, sub-50 PvP is very relevant and they should have been doing some sub-50 PvP if only to know W T F to do with their class and in the WZ.

if you really dont like it that much, i suggest powering through your class story and as many quests as you can find, and then getting into PvP after you hit 50.

You can't convert regular commendations into rated commendations until you hit valor rank 40. That would be a long *** grind to be able to start getting some decent gear if you start out PvP'ing only after hitting lvl 50. And what about valor rank requirements for gear, if they put that on the new PvP gear in 1.6? Sub-50 PvP is necessary if you want to at least start with some OK gear when you hit 50 instead of wearing sub-par gear for the whole grind to get up to the point you can start getting comms converted, and then to reach any valor rank requirements for gear(if they add any).

The sub-50 bracket isn't irrelevant. There is a reason a game doesn't automatically start people off with toons at max level, skills, and talents, they need to level to learn their class as they go. If they are PvP'ers they learn their class by PvP'ing. And from some of the clueless(not bads, but actually clueless about what to do in the WZ or with their class) people I've seen in 50 PvP, sub-50 PvP is very relevant and they should have been doing some sub-50 PvP if only to know W T F to do with their class and in the WZ.

 

 

 

You can't convert regular commendations into rated commendations until you hit valor rank 40. That would be a long *** grind to be able to start getting some decent gear if you start out PvP'ing only after hitting lvl 50 And what about valor rank requirements for gear, if they put that on the new PvP gear in 1.6? Sub-50 PvP is necessary if you want to at least start with some OK gear when you hit 50 instead of wearing sub-par gear for the whole grind to get up to the point you can start getting comms converted, and then to reach any valor rank requirements for gear(if they add any).

Add to to his why should anyone have to avoid PvP because other's are using an exploit? They shouldn't. EVER

And I soooo agree with you. NO one should wait until they are level 50 to PvP unless they have leveled one toon in PvP already (And even then, if it's a different AC you STILL shouldn't wait until 50). This is why sooooooo many people suck in level 50 pvp - they are too scared to pvp at a lower levels (not because of twinks usually but because of their egos), so start at 50 - and suck because they don't know what they are doing. Anyone who would even suggest doing this imo has no clue what THEY are doing.

I just thought I'd copy and paste this here, for the benefit of a certian Smash-Bro's peep whom likes to make statements about what Bioware considers an exploit or not.

The post can be found here http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=5491010#edit5491010 and it is post #67.

These are both great questions! First, every bug that we know about will not make it to the Known Issues, and there are a few reasons why we may not put something on the list right away, even when we know about it:

 

1.

Exploits.

Even when we know about them, we certainly want to keep players from abusing these bugs before we are able to fix them.

 

 

2.

Bugs we are actively investigating but don't have a definitive "who, what, when, where, why" for.

Often, these types of issues will end up in their own thread or post where we are gathering information. To answer your first question, this particular issue is one in this category. Yes, we know that schematics are disappearing for some players after they learn them. However, we are still trying to get more information about the topic, so acknowledging it here and asking for more information is the first step. When we know enough to confidently say what the issue actually is, then it will be added to the Known Issues list, because it effects gameplay.

 

 

3.

Performance issues.

Because we will always need to be collecting data from players about anything performance related, these types of issues will generally get their own thread in the Customer Support forums where we can get players to post logs, dxdiags, etc, to help the developers.

 

 

4.

It doesn’t affect gameplay enough, and the list needs to be kept to a reasonable size.

This is the reason that the second example you gave is not listed. Generally, this will include bugs with art (floating rock), typos, voice overs, sound effects, and other small things. However, there will always be exceptions to this, especially when the bug is related to combat.

 

 

Hopefully this helps you understand how we decide what goes on the Known Issues list, and we are happy that you look to it as a resource!

I wish to direct you to this part, namely the parts in bold:

These are both great questions! First, every bug that we know about will not make it to the Known Issues, and there are a few reasons why we may not put something on the list right away, even when we know about it:

 

 

 

1. Exploits. Even when we know about them, we certainly want to keep players from abusing these bugs before we are able to fix them.

I think I rest my case =P

I just thought I'd copy and paste this here, for the benefit of a certian Smash-Bro's peep whom likes to make statements about what Bioware considers an exploit or not.

 

The post can be found here http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=5491010#edit5491010 and it is post #67.

 

 

 

 

I wish to direct you to this part, namely the parts in bold:

 

 

 

I think I rest my case =P

it doesnt say they think it's an exploit, it only states they don't spread word of every exploit possible.

again, (and again, and again), by quitting wz, those peeps are not gaining anything but ego boost, ergo, it's not any kind of exploit that gives player an advantage over other player (well, if they leave they can't be killed, let's ban quitters). it is silly, waste of time, annoying (for some), but refusing to take reward is not an exploit. min maxing L 49 char is not an exploit (waste of time, but not an exploit). not saving word document is not an exploit.

if they change (mark, CHANGE, not FIX) it, fine, could not care less. but it doesn't deserve 25 pages of pointless argument.

it doesnt say they think it's an exploit, it only states they don't spread word of every exploit possible.

again, (and again, and again), by quitting wz, those peeps are not gaining anything but ego boost, ergo, it's not any kind of exploit that gives player an advantage over other player (well, if they leave they can't be killed, let's ban quitters). it is silly, waste of time, annoying (for some), but refusing to take reward is not an exploit. min maxing L 49 char is not an exploit (waste of time, but not an exploit). not saving word document is not an exploit.

 

if they change (mark, CHANGE, not FIX) it, fine, could not care less. but it doesn't deserve 25 pages of pointless argument.

You have as little understanding of what an exploit is - as smashdude does. But thanks for contributing to those 25 pages - that's a good thing!

it doesnt say they think it's an exploit, it only states they don't spread word of every exploit possible.

again, (and again, and again), by quitting wz, those peeps are not gaining anything but ego boost, ergo, it's not any kind of exploit that gives player an advantage over other player (well, if they leave they can't be killed, let's ban quitters). it is silly, waste of time, annoying (for some), but refusing to take reward is not an exploit. min maxing L 49 char is not an exploit (waste of time, but not an exploit). not saving word document is not an exploit.

 

if they change (mark, CHANGE, not FIX) it, fine, could not care less. but it doesn't deserve 25 pages of pointless argument.

=P my point was to the other poster, who thought saying "Bioware" doesn't consider it an exploit was an argument winner.

While I think we'll agree to disagree on whether abusing the system to stay 49 indefinitely is/isn't an exploit, I will agree it's not (whatever it is) something that really needs Dev attention. While 49 is vital for learning your class and preparing for 50's pvp, I don't think win/lose matters in that bracket. You still get some comms, valor (more than you need) and the most important part, Experience Points!

I mostly posted my last post because I have a pet peeve about people trying to speak as if they have authority, when they can not support their opinions with solid facts, logic, or atleast a believable ancedote.

You have as little understanding of what an exploit is - as smashdude does. But thanks for contributing to those 25 pages - that's a good thing!

Possible. All depends on point of view. For me exploit is

doing something that was not intended to gain advantage over some one else.

not gaining XP AND comms is intended on leaving WZ

on leaving WZ you are not gaining comms, ergo, not getting advantage.

if they would get comms while not gaining exp - that would be an exploit.

ego boost is not 'gain'.

@doom:

kay, i see.

i can understand that it is frustrating that there are morons who want to twink their 49s and pwn people in the sub-50 bracket. but what happens in the sub-50 bracket is irrelevant. real PvP doesnt start until level 50.

 

so instead of coming to the forums whining that people are doing this (there is no way to stop it btw) maybe finish leveling your toon, get to 50, and never have to see those twink morons again? take your licks in the lowbie warzones, get your XP, and then get to the real PvP.

 

this seems like a massive non-issue, and i certainly hope that bioware is not devoting resources to this problem

The fact is - it is to their advantage. Or, they wouldn't be doing it. Their taking advantage of an unintended game mechanic, their leaving warzones early - also negatively impacts other players, and gives them an unfair advantage (with respect to the saying level 49) over those players (at least in the players mind - hence them giving up at the START of the warzone when they see these toons - hence me complaining about it) -- this is another aspect of an exploit

It doesn't matter you feel an exploit is or isn't. Not one bit. Doesn't really matter what I feel one is either. It's all up to Bioware at this point. I will complain about it - it is my right. What you won't see me do is crying to nerf classes etc. THAT imo - is lame.. So is complaining about premades. But as lame as I think it is -- people have the RIGHT to do it. No matter what I say or think. Nor would I tell them their complaints/feeling weren't valid or that Bioware shouldn't consider them. That's ********.

And don't tell me how to play or level my toon. Thank-you. I have 2 level 50 WHs thanks. I have multiple alts and I level them with PvP. And I plan on continuing to do so.

My post

if you had a high 40s toon before 1.5, it became virtually impossible to obtain max comms before hitting 50 after that update. Since a loss awards virtually the same xp but many fewer comms, it makes sense to drop the wz if you're going to lose.

Your misfiring synapses compelled you to reply:

I have a level 45 now. I have no problems reaching max coms. None at all. Nor have I ever with any toon I've played.

45 would be 'mid 40s.' The point you missed, and which I am at pains to make explicit enough for you to grasp, was that there are players who, because of increased caps, will not be able to reach the new caps before hitting 50 if they accept all xp from wins and losses.

Since even village idiots are able to understand the connection between getting xp for a loss and leveling, you surprised me when you wrote:

The people in question aren't dropping warzones because they are losing - they are dropping in order to avoid leveling.

...seemingly oblivious to the fact that win or lose, you get xp (which, as you might have guessed by now, makes you level).

Thus far, I've forgiven your inability to multiquote, and I've tried to ignore your slipshod logic and presentation. If you would be so kind as to improve your reading comprehension (even slightly), I'm sure many of us would be grateful. You can still keep the condescending tone, unwarranted though it may be.

~Eggs