No they don't lol. Who are you to make any such demand?! Get over it.

Once again, no.

I am a player of the game entitled to as much right to complain about the game as you are to praise it.

I don't want everyone to get too caught up here on my vocabulary. I simply meant we do not consider it an exploit in that it is not severe to the point that we will be actioning accounts/characters for it.

 

Players got creative in a way we did not originally intend, but we do not want to punish you for it. However, we also did not intend for it to be that way so we are making a temporary change to address it until we can get a more permanent solution in place.

Hi Eric , well you could just make it so that you have to be level 45+ for the Ilum bolster ? Anyways I'm glad you have thought of a quick fix for this weekends double xp weekend.

Cheers,

BadOrb.

No. BioWare needs to grow some cajones and do it the right way or not at all.

 

An exploit, in video games, is the use of a bug or glitches, rates, hit boxes, or speed, etc. by a player to their advantage in a manner not intended by the game's designers.

 

I agree. Good thing that people using double XP from mob grinding doesn't all in to that category.

But they also reserve the right to decide that people shouldn't be able to do that in a particular zone during a limited time event if they want to.

Life has complications sometimes, deal with it.

If it's an exploit they should say it, fix it and roll back accounts on which is was used.

 

If it's not an exploit they should leave it alone so that others can enjoy the fruits of this "creative" approach.

 

It's one or the other, not a little of each.

 

And BTW, they did not intend it is the very definition of an exploit.

No, this is the definition of an exploit:

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/exploit

verb (used with object)

1. to utilize, especially for profit; turn to practical account: to exploit a business opportunity.

2. to use selfishly for one's own ends: employers who exploit their workers.

3. to advance or further through exploitation; promote: He exploited his new movie through a series of guest appearances.

Truth of the matter is, for it to be a gaming exploit, you have to have two things: Explicit rule stating it and actually knowing you are breaking said explicit rule.

For it to be an actual abuse of the game, they would have had to spell out that only level 45 and up were allowed on Ilum. Or even better, as someone above me noted, just disallow anyone under level 45 onto Ilum. Really simple.

It would have had to be known to all that this behavior was disallowed. Now, it is. I'm sure there will still be a powerleveling group out on Ilum tonight, saying "it's going to be patched soon, get it while you can"...but I won't be taking part if so.

It's no longer deabtable as of now, going forward: It's been stated as an un-intended result and its pending patching. Ergo, continuing to do so NOW is exploiting, cheating, or whatever you want to call it.

No. BioWare needs to grow some cajones and do it the right way or not at all.

 

An exploit, in video games, is the use of a bug or glitches, rates, hit boxes, or speed, etc. by a player to their advantage in a manner not intended by the game's designers.

 

It is an exploit, but the amount of people who did it would mean they would probably need to just rollback everyone. Better to just stop it and let it go then rolling back your entire subscriber base. However, they should let it be known that it is an exploit instead of candy coating it lol. It's not that big of a deal as duping items or speed hacking, so no biggie.

edit: A public apology to Urael. I disagree with him, but do not mean in any way to offend him

Yes. He has totally pegged the opposing viewpoint.

Define "advantage". It could be argued that some are at an advantage from one point of view. The point is not this specific case, it is going forward. It goes to consistancy in judgement and punishment and it goes to the n00bness (yes I said it) of EA running MMORPGs and not fully understanding it's playerbase, our language, or what we expect as far as a steward in the company that runs the games we play to act as a mediator in our disputes. Weak statements par for the course ( not you TUX but EA ).

Everything in context. Saying that they have to react the same way to every single thing that happens ignores that every single case is different. Should the guy that flies to Ilum at level 10, looks around and picks up a couple lockboxes along the way, before going back to coruscant get banned? How about a person who camps at the chests on Ilum at level 10 collecting them every single time they appear for hours and days on end?

They both took advantage of something unintended by the developers, but one would likely get banned and not the other.

Once again, no.

 

I am a player of the game entitled to as much right to complain about the game as you are to praise it.

...huh?!

I am most certainly NOT praising this decision of theirs. I think it's the worst possible solution they could have come up with. I WISH they'd have said it was "unintended", but they'd let it continue for the length of the event, or better yet, leave it as it is forever. I LOVE the Bolster for lower level toons.

But it was not an exploit and Eric doesn't need to be badgered by a few players to say it was.

Again, what do you do at a yellow light?

I agree. Good thing that people using double XP from mob grinding doesn't all in to that category.

 

But they also reserve the right to decide that people shouldn't be able to do that in a particular zone during a limited time event if they want to.

 

Life has complications sometimes, deal with it.

Note the etc.. This was an exploit.

And again, no.

Some people didn't find out about this "creative method" of using the system until the weekend was over. Some people might want to use this "creativity" to level their own characters, but those people will be stopped from doing so while others that already did so will not be punished in any way.

Sorry, but that's not the right way to do things when it comes to stuff like this.

Thank you very much.

Hey folks,

 

I wanted to give you all an update on this now that I have all of the information in place.

 

First, we are not considering this an exploit so anyone who had fear of action being taken against their characters, etc, should not be afraid. We will not be doing anything to players who used the Ilum pylons to get to 50.

 

I will say that player ingenuity never ceases to amaze us all. This was not a part of the intended design of the Gree event running simultaneous to the Double XP Weekends. Due to this, we are going to be having a maintenance later this week to deploy a fix to this issue.

 

I wanted to talk a bit about the fix itself since it will mix up things on Ilum temporarily. Our immediate fix to this issue is that for the time being, we are going to disable bolster on Ilum. This will have a couple of different affects.

 

• Low level characters will no longer be treated as level 50 in regards to experience. They will now have the normal experience penalties associated to grouping with a player of a higher level. Meaning those players will now gain little to no experience when grouped.
  
• Players who are levels 45-49 will have a slightly harder time completing some Gree event quests as they are no longer bolstered to level 50.
  

I want to again reiterate that this is only a temporary solution. We are continuing to investigate the issue and intend to have a more permanent solution in place before the Gree event returns.

 

-eric

Let's call a spade a spade. Common sense would tell anyone that abusing an unintended game mechanic is an exploit and instead of letting people get away with it for 3 days, BioWare should have "fixed it" during the weekend and not let people get away with it and then do nothing about it because code monkeys failed to "anticipate" it. How does outthinking developers justify exploiting an unintended mechanic which you stated was unintended. I remember Stephen Reid espousing how BioWare takes the EULA & integrity of the game seriously etc...but apparently taking advantage of developer fail makes exploiting alright.

No, this is the definition of an exploit:

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/exploit

 

verb (used with object)

1. to utilize, especially for profit; turn to practical account: to exploit a business opportunity.

2. to use selfishly for one's own ends: employers who exploit their workers.

3. to advance or further through exploitation; promote: He exploited his new movie through a series of guest appearances.

 

Truth of the matter is, for it to be a gaming exploit, you have to have two things: Explicit rule stating it and actually knowing you are breaking said explicit rule.

 

For it to be an actual abuse of the game, they would have had to spell out that only level 45 and up were allowed on Ilum. Or even better, as someone above me noted, just disallow anyone under level 45 onto Ilum. Really simple.

 

It would have had to be known to all that this behavior was disallowed. Now, it is. I'm sure there will still be a powerleveling group out on Ilum tonight, saying "it's going to be patched soon, get it while you can"...but I won't be taking part if so.

 

It's no longer deabtable as of now, going forward: It's been stated as an un-intended result and its pending patching. Ergo, continuing to do so NOW is exploiting, cheating, or whatever you want to call it.

I see your definition and raise you the following:

An exploit, in video games, is the use of a bug or glitches, rates, hit boxes, or speed, etc. by a player to their advantage in a manner not intended by the game's designers.[1] It is often colloquially abbreviated sploit. Exploits have never been classified as a form of cheating; however, the precise determination of what is or is not considered an exploit can be controversial. This debate stems from a number of factors but typically involves the argument that the issues are part of the game and require no changes or external programs to take advantage of them.[2]

Meh so it's wiki but, I think it is the definition that many have in mind when one considers what an exploit is in relation to a game.

So, wait. What you're saying is that this is not considered an exploit for anyone who already did it, but you're going to fix it so that no one else can. That seems like a contradiction to me, Eric.

 

If it's not an exploit, leave it alone. If it is, fix it and take action against the players that used it.

 

That's not how the real world works. It is an exploit in their eyes but not punishable. You see, here in the real world we all make judgement calls on whether something warrants further action or not.

In this case it is an exploit but one which will not be followed by a punishment.

Stop asking for black and white definitions on everything. You sound like those school principals who put 1st graders on suspensions for kissing.

Let's call a spade a spade. Common sense would tell anyone that abusing an unintended game mechanic is an exploit and instead of letting people get away with it for 3 days, BioWare should have "fixed it" during the weekend and not let people get away with it and then do nothing about it because code monkeys failed to "anticipate" it. How does outthinking developers justify exploiting an unintended mechanic which you stated was unintended. I remember Stephen Reid espousing how BioWare takes the EULA & integrity of the game seriously etc...but apparently taking advantage of developer fail makes exploiting alright.

Oh come on. Calm down. This is their decision to patch it now. If you don't like it, tough.

That's not how the real world works. It is an exploit in their eyes but not punishable. You see, here in the real world we all make judgement calls on whether something warrants further action or not.

 

In this case it is an exploit but one which will not be followed by a punishment.

 

Stop asking for black and white definitions on everything. You sound like those school principals who put 1st graders on suspensions for kissing.

Dude, CoH had a number of similar situations to this in their tenure. They were called "exploits" then. They fixed them, ran through their files to determine who used it and on which characters and rolled back those characters to their pre-exploit levels. In some cases accounts were suspended and yes, even banned.

That's the right way to handle the use of this kind of exploit.

Dude, CoH had a number of similar situations to this in their tenure. They were called "exploits" then. They fixed them, ran through their files to determine who used it and on which characters and rolled back those characters to their pre-exploit levels. In some cases accounts were suspended and yes, even banned.

 

That's the right way to handle the use of this kind of exploit.

 

This isn't COD. It was a development oversight. Stop acting like they kicked ur dog.

3rd time...what do you do when you encounter a yellow light while driving? Do you make a judgement? Or am I assuming too much about ur age?

That's not how the real world works. It is an exploit in their eyes but not punishable. You see, here in the real world we all make judgement calls on whether something warrants further action or not.

 

In this case it is an exploit but one which will not be followed by a punishment.

 

Stop asking for black and white definitions on everything. You sound like those school principals who put 1st graders on suspensions for kissing.

I would be much happier if they expressed it in exactly that manner. Let them call it an exploit, and make it very clear that while this particular exploit will not be actionable, further "creative use" of in game mechanics, in this or any other situation, may lead to actions against accounts.

This isn't COD. It was a development oversight. Stop acting like they kicked ur dog.

 

3rd time...what do you do when you encounter a yellow light while driving? Do you make a judgement? Or am I assuming too much about ur age?

At a yellow light, I slow down and stop. Are you the type who mashes the gas pedal and if the light turns red before you get there, as long as no cop saw it, you did nothing wrong.

At a yellow light, I slow down and stop. Are you the type who mashes the gas pedal and if the light turns red before you get there, as long as no cop saw it, you did nothing wrong.

I don't care what you do, I was asking Mr. Black and white.

This isn't COD. It was a development oversight. Stop acting like they kicked ur dog.

 

3rd time...what do you do when you encounter a yellow light while driving? Do you make a judgement? Or am I assuming too much about ur age?

Stop trying to incite me to insults. It will not work.

Yellow means slow down and prepare to stop. I slow down and prepare to stop. It's not a judgement call. The fact that you consider it an option to speed up and try to make it before the light turns is not the proper way to drive and whomever taught you to do so was wrong.

I don't want everyone to get too caught up here on my vocabulary. I simply meant we do not consider it an exploit in that it is not severe to the point that we will be actioning accounts/characters for it.

 

Players got creative in a way we did not originally intend, but we do not want to punish you for it. However, we also did not intend for it to be that way so we are making a temporary change to address it until we can get a more permanent solution in place.

Will the patch also fix the issue with the Sphere being BOP to BOL?

Dude, CoH had a number of similar situations to this in their tenure. They were called "exploits" then. They fixed them, ran through their files to determine who used it and on which characters and rolled back those characters to their pre-exploit levels. In some cases accounts were suspended and yes, even banned.

 

That's the right way to handle the use of this kind of exploit.

 

If you read between the lines, bioware isn't going to ban or punish people for this because in their eyes, ITS NOT WORTH DOING. They let the exploit slip in and in this case, its simply not worth the time and energy to roll people back. It's their right to make that call. If anyone doesn't like it, get used to it. Life isn't fair.

And if you want to get technical, they don't even consider it an exploit.

That's a judgement call and its their right to make it.

And btw, I didn't do this because I was having too much fun leveling a new juggernaut in "story mode" as opposed to illum grind mode.

I said it before and I will say it again. In the purest definition of the word exploit, it was an exploit! Using an ingame mechanic that gives an advantage to one player or a disadvantage to another player THAT WAS NOT INTENDED by the developers is what the word exploit means.

Too many people here (and sadly, the dev included) are equating exploit with the word cheating or the just in a general sense "something bad".

Many new strategies are exploits (including on Xeno having the tank use a pillar or stealth to avoid thermal tolerance) in the purest sense of the word as well.

An exploit that results in punishment and/or is explicitly against the TOS is more appropriately called a cheat.

Many exploits are cheats but again that does not mean every exploit is a cheat. A later sanctioned exploit would more appropriately be called player innovation or similar words/phrases.

Let me raise this as a related topic:

What do you feel about the people that took advantage of this situation and didn't report it via in game ticket?

Should the people have alerted EA what was going on live as it was happening this weekend? Why didn't they "stop" in good conscience from contiuing to take advantage of the system?

Did anyone report this during the event?

I think this would be the more interesting discussion. I would also be interested in hearing what Eric et. al. think in this regards.

I don't care what you do, I was asking Mr. Black and white.

Holy bantha, we agree on something.