I think we can all agree that the all history is weird. (I dont say it's a lie or anything)

Another thing is that if you died then you actually didnt tanked the ops... you just died and then others took your job to avoid moar deaths/ wiping.

 

Maybe healers were trolling you?

 

I've actually been in ops where the healers got offended by the way a tank was acting and refused to heal him.

 

For instance, in 16man TFB SM 2 of the healers thought a tank was being rude to the main tank from their guild and completely stopped healing him at the second boss. The rude tank was one of those who says "I'm so good I can tank 40 stacks," not realizing that having gotten to 20+ stacks just proves how bad his group must have been at the time. So he ends up dieing at about 25 stacks because two healers weren't healing him and one of the other healers died to Doom because of not paying attention.

 

For the rest of the op the tank was much nicer. Apparently dieing once was all it took to burst his overinflated ego.

Just had a laugh out loud moment in Battle of Ilum HM. I was on my dps jugg (39k health, full Dread Forged) to get the 10 basic comms for the daily. There was a level 55 sorc healer, 30k health, a level 52 sin dps and a level 51 powertech tank with 18k health. The tank guards the healer, of course. After a while the healer says she has to leave, which may have had something to do with the tank being constantly afk. We decide to continue on as we are unlikely to get a replacement healer anytime soon, so the sin pulls out his very undergeared Talos, and everyone but me dies on the next boss. I offer to bring out my geared Quinn for some bigger heals and the group agrees. Out comes Quinn, and the tank guards him!! I nearly spat out my drink, I was laughing so much.

All this debate about HM DF (or any op really) being "easy" or not... everyone is right. I think the issue here is semantics.

 

There are a number of variables in play here, and one cannot simply call it "easy" and be done with it. As with anything else, it's a learning process which becomes easier with repetition. A new group might be overwhelmed at first and claim that it's hard, but once they become familiar with the new mechanics, the increased pace, and can properly coordinate with each other, their likelihood of success will increase. Then they might realize that it wasn't actually that hard to begin with - they just needed practice. So, I don't think it's a matter of easy vs hard, but rather getting used to a fight until it becomes easier (and, I guess, more boring, as some have said). That being said, some fights are easier than others.

 

Then, as Jeweldleah said, there’s the issue of having a competent group to run with consistently. You could be over geared and know the mechanics really well, but if you don’t have such a group to run with and are forced to do your HMs with unreliable random pugs, you’ll never get your loot.

 

So, we have to look at exactly what we mean when we say easy or hard. Is it easy because you and your group were determined to get it, and ran it so many times that it became boring? I could see that. Is it easy for someone in a guild with no HM group to successfully clear with random pugs? Not so easy. Is it easy for a consistent group to clear when people make mistakes? No. So it all depends.

 

Again, not doubting that you and many others find it easy to farm, and not trying to step on toes. Just saying that a little elaboration could clear things up.

You know there are guides and videos out there that cover everything about all the ops pretty much isnt it?

 

Am I the only one who takes enjoyment in a game by doing stuff myself? I have never read a single guide (that could be taken as incorrect if you consider reading the codex and pop-up screens as "guides") but instead prefer to learn the game myself. Doesn't that just sound more fun?

 

Another reason I don't read guides is my personal opinion of people who do, when you get to somewhere (KDY ship assembly springs to mind) and somebody asks how its done, theres always 1 who says "just a sec, ill go check Dulfy". Then comes back stating wrong build as they just opened the guide and at the top it probably says:

Build 1: merr sonn, infiltrator, powerhouse.

People then clearly stop reading at that point and come back to the game stating that, even though its possibly wrong. I end up telling people the right build but no1 listens as "*insert name here* checked it on Dulfy, hes right", goes without saying that its often wrong....

 

I often refer to these people as FAKE PRO's, claim to know everything there is to know but only because they read it somewhere, and I know from my work that you can read all the books about lathes/mills/CNC etc you want, but you still wont know how to switch the machine on. Reading a guide does not tell you how to do it, it tells you how afew specific people did it, and therefore how it ends up being done by those that cba to test things out.

Edited July 17, 2014 by BobFredJohn

I offer to bring out my geared Quinn for some bigger heals and the group agrees. Out comes Quinn, and the tank guards him!! I nearly spat out my drink, I was laughing so much.

HAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!

 

I laughed loud enough that I got some dirty looks from someone next to me on the phone.

Am I the only one who takes enjoyment in a game by doing stuff myself? I have never read a single guide (that could be taken as incorrect if you consider reading the codex and pop-up screens as "guides") but instead prefer to learn the game myself. Doesn't that just sound more fun?

 

Another reason I don't read guides is my personal opinion of people who do, when you get to somewhere (KDY ship assembly springs to mind) and somebody asks how its done, theres always 1 who says "just a sec, ill go check Dulfy". Then comes back stating wrong build as they just opened the guide and at the top it probably says:

Build 1: merr sonn, infiltrator, powerhouse.

People then clearly stop reading at that point and come back to the game stating that, even though its possibly wrong. I end up telling people the right build but no1 listens as "*insert name here* checked it on Dulfy, hes right", goes without saying that its often wrong....

 

I often refer to these people as FAKE PRO's, claim to know everything there is to know but only because they read it somewhere, and I know from my work that you can read all the books about lathes/mills/CNC etc you want, but you still wont know how to switch the machine on. Reading a guide does not tell you how to do it, it tells you how afew specific people did it, and therefore how it ends up being done by those that cba to test things out.

 

Again with the guide hatred?

 

I've leveled 2.5 toons in KDY, and I think I've seen 1 person say they're going to check Dulfy @ starship assembly. And if you know the right combo, why don't you just solve it yourself while they alt tab? It seems you are setting yourself up for frustration on purpose. And if the wrong combo is selected, it's THEIR fault for fail reading, because all of Dulfy's combos are correct.

 

Come to think of it, even in ops I rarely see anyone mention dulfy. Like, maybe a handful of times. And her ops guides explain, first and foremost, the basics of each fight, rather than what HER group specifically did. When she does mention what HER group did, she says it's what THEY felt comfortable with doing, but other groups may do it differently.

 

You are being very closed minded in this matter.

Edited July 17, 2014 by BigBreakfast

Guardian tanks and their knockback.

Wasted ~10 Incendiary Grenades / run today because of them.

 

Btw, does anyone know what's up with Shadows/Assassins moving around like they have 1000 rats in their pants?

Edited July 17, 2014 by Halinalle

Am I the only one who takes enjoyment in a game by doing stuff myself? I have never read a single guide (that could be taken as incorrect if you consider reading the codex and pop-up screens as "guides") but instead prefer to learn the game myself. Doesn't that just sound more fun?

I've gone in fresh with the new HM FPs that dropped in 2.0 (with some guildies in mumble). It is indeed fun to figure things out on your own.

 

But when I was a scrub running HM FPs for the first time in pugs? The last thing I wanted to be was some fool that had no idea what he was doing, making the run more difficult. I read the guides just so I could contribute more.

 

/shrug

Groupfinder run of SM 8m Dread Fortress. I was healing on my Commando alongside a Scoundrel healer. Tanks were a Shadow and a Guardian, and the DPS were IIRC a Saboteur Gunslinger, an Infiltration Shadow (ops leader, a bit of an idiot IMO), a Telekinetics Sage, and a Watchman Sentinel. About half of us were well-geared, the other half undergeared. About half the group wasn't used to Ops, but yay for Bolster. We ended up making a complete run, but a few weird things happened along the way:

 

After we kill Nefra, the Guardian tank wins the Arkanian boot token that drops.

Infiltration Shadow: "stop needing on loot, I'm not getting the pieces I want"

I inspect the Guardian and he's wearing mostly 168s, but he could definitely use the set bonus, which he doesn't currently have. Several others and I pipe up to defend the tank's Need roll, to which the Shadow responds by telling us that everyone's supposed to roll "greed" on loot. YEAH SURE, or maybe we could actually USE THE ROLL OPTIONS FOR THEIR INTENDED PURPOSE? I've heard of groups telling everyone to roll Need on certain items to prevent ninjas from Needing after others have Greeded, but never the other way around. We ignore him and continue.

 

Gate Commander Draxus is pretty uneventful. Shadow tank dies to a bajillion exploding subteroths on the first wave, but we rez her and we finish the fight. DPS are running around like idiots but it's storymode and so the Scoundrel and I can just heal through the Afflictions that get through. Tanks are awful about picking up Dismantlers but ah well, it's storymode.

 

Grob'thok was fun. The tanking was fairly good except for the Guardian turning the boss towards the group during a Roar a few times. The Sentinel stood in his lava feet and ended up at 3% before the healers rescued him. Oh yeah, and because so much of the group was standing in the center of the room at first, I ran in to do a quick Concussion Charge heal (Kolto Wave talent) and managed to get myself lifted.

 

Corrupter Zero...ah, good old Corrupter Zero. A few people nearly died from not spacing out during the missiles, and couple DPS stood in the Unified Beam at the end, but a solid kill over all.

 

Dread Master Brontes took three tries to down. The first two times, three people (including me both times, I am ashamed to admit) were caught unawares by the Reach of Brontes appearing and stumbled into the beam between them. The third time, someone dropped an ops marker to signify when the Reach were about to spawn, so we were able to finish the kill without losing too many DPS to manage the second Fingers/Hands phase. We did get this chat box gem from the Shadow tank, though.

"We just keep losing too many people to reta-- to the Reach phase."

 

I got my tauntaun and filled out my healing set bonus though, so it's all right in my book.

Guardian tanks and their knockback.

Wasted ~10 Incendiary Grenades / run today because of them.

 

Btw, does anyone know what's up with Shadows/Assassins moving around like they have 1000 rats in their pants?

 

The 1000 rats thing, well personally?

Boredom, most of the time. And some of the time it's so I can wither or discharge a group that is just outside of what those moves can hit. Plus we can get away with it more, our aggro gen and snap threat is higher then that of other tanks. So they can't go dancing around the mobs while still holding aggro.

 

Another personal reason; new keyboard. So I am still getting use to where the keys are somewhat. More then once I have tried to strafe right only to have "cannot do this out of stealth" or some such pop up as instead of E it turns out I am hitting R (which is my Spike keybind).

Again with the guide hatred?

 

I've leveled 2.5 toons in KDY, and I think I've seen 1 person say they're going to check Dulfy @ starship assembly. And if you know the right combo, why don't you just solve it yourself while they alt tab? It seems you are setting yourself up for frustration on purpose. And if the wrong combo is selected, it's THEIR fault for fail reading, because all of Dulfy's combos are correct.

 

Come to think of it, even in ops I rarely see anyone mention dulfy. Like, maybe a handful of times. And her ops guides explain, first and foremost, the basics of each fight, rather than what HER group specifically did. When she does mention what HER group did, she says it's what THEY felt comfortable with doing, but other groups may do it differently.

 

You are being very closed minded in this matter.

 

 

anyone with half brain can figure out the combos without using the dulfy guide. i never use it and when i am able to do the puzzle before some mouthbreather clicks the autoassembly i always get it right

why don't you just solve it yourself while they alt tab?

 

You are being very closed minded in this matter.

 

well I cant solo collect all 3 things before they get back from reading a guide, they are just too quick at reading it (probably the reason they come back thinking theres 1 solution).

 

I wouldnt say close minded, ill give afew examples:

 

LI HM first boss, no1 in the group had done it before. Tank suggested he reads a guide and explains it to us, I say not to bother we can figure it out as we go along. During the fight I get a blue circle under me, so I move away from it only to find it follows me. I therefore decide to move to the side of the room, out of the way to place whatever it is away from the fight. I then notice the floor is glowing red, whilst wondering why its red flames shoot out. Now I have only been playing 8 months or so but I have yet to find a situation where standing in flames is a good idea, so I decide I will avoid the red bits of floor. Sadly it seems I must be using some Stephen Hawking level of reasoning here, as the 2 dps and tank in the group all just stand in the middle, not moving their sticky aoe's to the side and completely ignoring the flames covering them.

 

SM colincoid, everyone in the group is new to it, get to the bit with the "puzzle" (tbh if someone considers that a puzzle im surprised they got that far). Everyone starts just randomly clicking things (1 of the dps doesnt realise he has to stand still after clicking it). As such we find there's 6 things to press and only 4 of us. Someone in the group throws out a "brb, ill check Dulfy." In the time he is away I get each person to cancel their channel and thereby work out exactly which barriers are controlled by which consoles, by the time the 4th bloke is back we have completed both "puzzle" sections.

 

My view is, the people who use guides for everything are usually those who are too lazy to use more than 5 brain cells at once. Im sure, considering these people know how to read and write, and use a computer, they are all capable of working these things out. They just assume its quicker to open internet, load Dulfy, read a guide, re-open the game, re-write the guide to the group. Is that really faster than just educated trial and error or, preferably, simple problem solving/Logic?

Edited July 17, 2014 by BobFredJohn

Am I the only one who takes enjoyment in a game by doing stuff myself? I have never read a single guide (that could be taken as incorrect if you consider reading the codex and pop-up screens as "guides") but instead prefer to learn the game myself. Doesn't that just sound more fun?

-snip-

 

There was a time when you didn't have the internet to go to find out how to do things. My happiest gaming memories was going to the schoolyard next day and share with my friends how far a level we went up to, crazy stages we had to clear, secret routes that some of us had found or little achievements we had discovered. The fun was in the mystery of gaming and being completely in the dark.

 

Nowadays, you get labeled with the 'idiot' sticker if you didn't look up a guide on how to do X instance. And naturally, everyone expects you to understand how the instance rolls just by reading, even though everyone has a different learning process. I'm so glad I never watched a TFB video and got a good guild to throw me some learning ropes. Not only that was fun but the way that parts of TFB are graphically gorgeous (as I like to call it, the Tron World), I feel like I would've ruined myself the enjoyable experience of seeing something brand new if I had watched it on the internet.

 

People want to advise others to watch/read guides? That's fine but I wish those people also realize not everyone learns the same way and some people actually like the element of discovery and adventure in their gameplay.

That's fine but I wish those people also realize not everyone learns the same way and some people actually like the element of discovery and adventure in their gameplay.

 

That's all well and good, and really hearkens back to the days of EQ. But if you're a PuG, going into a HM, I expect you to have done more than simply "leveled up" and obtained some gear.

About two weeks ago I grouped up with a guildie and popped hammer station. Before this I only ran FPs with all guildies or friends with this toon. This is on my level 15 PT tank and the guildies was dps. Since I have lag I come in a bit late and the others are already in combat. I quickly explain in chat that this is one of my first times tanking with my powertech and its my first time on this FP and go I join the others. Immediately after this the other dps replies in chat to leave. I ignore it and continue trying to tank the small mobs at the beginning of the FP. I also have a lvl 45 shadow tank, so I like to think I'm ok at tanking. I'm not the best by a long shot and always try my best to listen to the advice groups give me. We come to the part where you can use scavenging to activate the drill. I had no idea that I had to use scavenging on the machine to start the drill as it was my first time running it and I think my guildies as well, so I was really confused when the other dps and healer started saying hurry up and the dps swearing at me in chat. I finally figured out that I had to use my scavenging ability and we went through to the cave with the droid elite boss. I pulled and I thought I was doing ok but then the healer wasn't healing me so I wiped. At the start area my guildie who also wiped said that these guys were jerks and we should leave, so we do. The last thing on chat before I left was the dps saying we don't need you *****, we can two man it. I really hoped they would fail big time. Worst of all I forgot to put them on my ignore list.

Sadly it seems I must be using some Stephen Hawking level of reasoning here, as the 2 dps and tank in the group all just stand in the middle, not moving their sticky aoe's to the side and completely ignoring the flames covering them.

Ha! This made me laugh because I experienced the exact same thing in HM LI recently.

 

But it wasn't just the grates with fire coming out of them. The dps would stand inside the giant spherical energy coils that were sparking and draining their health alarmingly while I tried to keep them alive. O.o

 

I believe the problem with mechanic-heavy instances like Lost Island and Explosive Conflict isn't that people didn't read guides. It's that their attention is completely dispersed by all the random activity going on and they cannot focus.

 

I'm sure that the dps standing in the energy coils were so distracted by a) trying to interrupt the boss, b) getting hit by the adds, c) flames coming out of the floor and d) remembering their rotation, that they probably didn't even look at their health bar and notice it was dropping alarmingly.

 

This sort of stuff smooths out with time.

 

Give a complex camera to a greenhorn and have them take pictures, they're so fixated on the mechanism of the camera and how it works that they forget to pay attention to the environment. While a more experienced photographer is so comfortable with the camera that they don't have to think about it -- they're extroverted instead, and take better shots.

Congratulations ladies and gentlemen, we have hit 400 pages of herp a derp, mischief and tomfoolery. This thread had made me laugh everyday since it opened and produced a lot of gems. The butter guy is one I will continue to retell. So lets keep em coming.

...

 

So, I queue up for hmfps, still need two for the weekly, etc.

 

Its Athiss, as soon as I zone in, the healer has already bailed. I got slotted for dps, but I was already in pyro for pvp anyway, so I just swap out for my pve dps set.

 

We have a sorc, and a juggernaut tank. I call up Mako, who is wearing mostly 180s except for weapons, and we proceed. Health drops a little low, but its no big deal, things die quite fast (my dps set is pretty close to BiS apart from set bonus armourings).

 

The bomb satchel pull? It goes fine The droid pull? It goes fine. The first boss? It goes fine. All the trash up to the next one, the Beast of Vodal-Whatever? It goes FINE. Everyones happy.

 

We get up to the dog and, after a bit of "Huh, so now what?" discussion, I make the comment that we had probably better do that "tank the boss elsewhere thing" but that I have absolutely no idea how or where you are supposed to do that because frankly, theres never been a need to do it. The fight is incredibly easy as it is. So, someone else needs to know how to do it.

 

As far as I knew then, everything was still fine. But, apparently, the sorc was MIGHTILY offended that I had never felt the need to do this cave trick, cause you know, if youve got a full group, why bother? Somehow this was interpreted as a slight on them. They dont say anything, though.

 

So we get to the cave, and the sorc offers to try respeccing to heals, but that they will have to look up a guide on google on how to do it. (They had mentioned previously that they spent most of their time pubside on a healer and had made the sorc to get away from that, but they never mentioned what class.)

 

Since, the first character I ever really geared was a sorc healer, I gave them a brief rundown of what you do, rejuv, innervate, and etc.

 

Up until this point, as far as I knew, everything was still fine. But, apparently, the sorc was MIGHTILY offended that I assumed they did not know how to heal and that I did not assume that their healer pubside was a sage. Please note that not 5 seconds before this they were saying they needed to look up a guide on how to heal on a sorc.

 

The tank now speaks up, questioning if we have enough dps for the fight if the sorc is healing. Im slightly confused as all of the trash before hand had literally melted. I point out that I am kind of obscenely geared, in my dps set I have more hp than the tank does. I dont do this in a mean way. Or an argumentative way. Im just pointing out a fact. Its a "dude, dont worry, we got this." I dont do any sort of "Lol, noob, my gear is soo much better than yours."

 

Its at this point that the sorc freaks the eff out. Completely. Apparently, enough is enough, and Ive gone too far this time.

 

Im confused. Im very confused. I ask what the hell their problem is and I get this torrent of rage about how Im so arrogant and not everyone has as much gear as me and my stuff pubside is way better than yours.

 

I made literally one comment. And it was a "Well be fine" kind of comment. Literally, "Im overgeared. Ive got more hp than you. Dps will be fine. We can do this."

 

Now, at this point Im still confused as to how they could possibly misinterpret everything and Im starting to get rather offended. I tell them they are completely misinterpreting everything and that they are behaving in a completely ridiculous manner.

 

Now I get raged at for being offended. And for a whole lot of other things that didnt even come close to happening. So, I give them a thorough description of all of their shortcomings, inform them of just exactly what it is they can do with themselves. By this time, one of them starts a vote kick "Reason: Child."

 

The irony almost makes up for their utter stupidity. Almost. Sort of. Well, not really.

Edited July 18, 2014 by Dras_Keto

well I cant solo collect all 3 things before they get back from reading a guide, they are just too quick at reading it (probably the reason they come back thinking theres 1 solution).

 

My view is, the people who use guides for everything are usually those who are too lazy to use more than 5 brain cells at once. Im sure, considering these people know how to read and write, and use a computer, they are all capable of working these things out. They just assume its quicker to open internet, load Dulfy, read a guide, re-open the game, re-write the guide to the group. Is that really faster than just educated trial and error or, preferably, simple problem solving/Logic?

 

1. I can click all the consoles in starship first every time, usually before anyone else gets there.

 

2. If we're talking about a single or solo questing, or even playing with your friends, then yeah, I say figure it for yourself instead of always looking at a guide. BUT, when you have other people in your group who have possibly done it before, you don't want to hold them back just so you can figure it out. It's not a bad thing to want to read up on the fight so that you can actually contribute instead of running around in confusion. I've never heard of anyone actually getting angry at someone for reading a guide first. AND, i can't see a situation in which reading a guide would HINDER someone's performance. If you can figure it out on your own, great! But don't equate someone who reads guides to them being an idiot.

 

3. Your LI example doesn't have anything to do with reading guides or not.. that's just people standing in stupid and is a common problem that exists whether or not someone reads guides. Just because they read it doesn't mean they lose brain cells and forget how to do simple things.

...

 

So, I queue up for hmfps, still need two for the weekly, etc.

 

Its Athiss, as soon as I zone in, the healer has already bailed. I got slotted for dps, but I was already in pyro for pvp anyway, so I just swap out for my pve dps set.

 

We have a sorc, and a juggernaut tank. I call up Mako, who is wearing mostly 180s except for weapons, and we proceed. Health drops a little low, but its no big deal, things die quite fast (my dps set is pretty close to BiS apart from set bonus armourings).

 

The bomb satchel pull? It goes fine The droid pull? It goes fine. The first boss? It goes fine. All the trash up to the next one, the Beast of Vodal-Whatever? It goes FINE. Everyones happy.

 

We get up to the dog and, after a bit of "Huh, so now what?" discussion, I make the comment that we had probably better do that "tank the boss elsewhere thing" but that I have absolutely no idea how or where you are supposed to do that because frankly, theres never been a need to do it. The fight is incredibly easy as it is. So, someone else needs to know how to do it.

 

As far as I knew then, everything was still fine. But, apparently, the sorc was MIGHTILY offended that I had never felt the need to do this cave trick, cause you know, if youve got a full group, why bother? Somehow this was interpreted as a slight on them. They dont say anything, though.

 

So we get to the cave, and the sorc offers to try respeccing to heals, but that they will have to look up a guide on google on how to do it. (They had mentioned previously that they spent most of their time pubside on a healer and had made the sorc to get away from that, but they never mentioned what class.)

 

Since, the first character I ever really geared was a sorc healer, I gave them a brief rundown of what you do, rejuv, innervate, and etc.

 

Up until this point, as far as I knew, everything was still fine. But, apparently, the sorc was MIGHTILY offended that I assumed they did not know how to heal and that I did not assume that their healer pubside was a sage. Please note that not 5 seconds before this they were saying they needed to look up a guide on how to heal on a sorc.

 

The tank now speaks up, questioning if we have enough dps for the fight if the sorc is healing. Im slightly confused as all of the trash before hand had literally melted. I point out that I am kind of obscenely geared, in my dps set I have more hp than the tank does. I dont do this in a mean way. Or an argumentative way. Im just pointing out a fact. Its a "dude, dont worry, we got this." I dont do any sort of "Lol, noob, my gear is soo much better than yours."

 

Its at this point that the sorc freaks the eff out. Completely. Apparently, enough is enough, and Ive gone too far this time.

 

Im confused. Im very confused. I ask what the hell their problem is and I get this torrent of rage about how Im so arrogant and not everyone has as much gear as me and my stuff pubside is way better than yours.

 

I made literally one comment. And it was a "Well be fine" kind of comment. Literally, "Im overgeared. Ive got more hp than you. Dps will be fine. We can do this."

 

Now, at this point Im still confused as to how they could possibly misinterpret everything and Im starting to get rather offended. I tell them they are completely misinterpreting everything and that they are behaving in a completely ridiculous manner.

 

Now I get raged at for being offended. And for a whole lot of other things that didnt even come close to happening. So, I give them a thorough description of all of their shortcomings, inform them of just exactly what it is they can do with themselves. By this time, one of them starts a vote kick "Reason: Child."

 

The irony almost makes up for their utter stupidity. Almost. Sort of. Well, not really.

 

Classic case of internet misuse to pickup context/nuances. That's why I never take anything at face-value because there's no way to tell all the time if someone's serious or not. Personally, if I was that sorc and you told me it was a misunderstanding, I would've accepted it because I'm not the insecure type of person. Hell, I don't even think I would've initiated any sort of argument if you told me it was gonna be all right cause I like my runs to be cakeslice.

 

Those guys, clearly do NOT like cake.

The 1000 rats thing, well personally?

Boredom, most of the time. And some of the time it's so I can wither or discharge a group that is just outside of what those moves can hit. Plus we can get away with it more, our aggro gen and snap threat is higher then that of other tanks. So they can't go dancing around the mobs while still holding aggro.

 

Another personal reason; new keyboard. So I am still getting use to where the keys are somewhat. More then once I have tried to strafe right only to have "cannot do this out of stealth" or some such pop up as instead of E it turns out I am hitting R (which is my Spike keybind).

 

What I mean is this:

10 left, right, left, right (this continues for few seconds at very high speed)

20 backpedal

30 run or jump forward

40 goto 10

 

All this while spamming Saber Strike and occasional FiB/Death Field.

I believe the problem with mechanic-heavy instances like Lost Island and Explosive Conflict isn't that people didn't read guides. It's that their attention is completely dispersed by all the random activity going on and they cannot focus.

 

Id go farther and say they dont want to focus. A lot of people in ToR are here because STAR WARS! and are just looking for some mindless entertainment (IE, Solitaire players, not Freecell). Which then causes a problem when the game requires them to fire a few synapses.

 

I cannot count the number of times Ive seen someone fail some sort of positional mechanic (stood in unnecessary fire, maybe died) fail it over, and over, and over again.

 

Heh, warzones. The team chases the attackers far from the node on Voidstar, and gets snookered by some stealthy who just walked right by. 20 seconds later, "Boom." Then they go and do the exact same thing. They keep making the same mistake.

 

I once heard a definition of insanity along the lines of "keep doing the same thing and expecting different results.

 

It is probably the most frustrating thing to deal with in this game.

There's two that come to mind right off the bat. About a couple of months ago, I was leveling up my sorc healer during double exp. I que up for a fp to get the daily done and out of the way. I glance at who my companions are. I notice that the tank isn't in the tanking stance ( he was a assassin tank btw) But I just shrugged it off, seeing if he would change stances later, and to be honest, I had handled worse. Besides, I didn't feel like waiting for another que. So, things are going fairly well. A few mistakes were made, but nothing horrible. However, as we get to the first boss on Caddie the tank tells us to wait. The tank goes into stealth mode, runs up to the boss, and tries to mez the boss. When nothing happens, he types into group chat, "Why didn't that work?" All I could do was stand there with my jaw to the ground....

 

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My second encounter was when I was leveling my Sniper. I'm about 50ish 50+ and qued for HM FP with my tanking buddie. We get a que for False Emperor. We wipe on the very first mob. No one said anything and pressed on. However, my tanking friend starts to notice that our Sorc healer isn't giving out any heals. Trying to figure out why, I check the Sorcs gear for curiosity. The Sorc had all *AIM* stats. Stunned, I politely mention into group chat if he was aware that all his stats were wrong for that class? The Sorc instantly goes nuts and replies, "You do realize I don't give a*crap* about what you think right?" Needless to say, he was kicked. We que for another healer. Not wanting to wait, the three of us press on, with Treek (in tank gear) as the healer. We managed to do the bonus boss and complete the FP with ease.

Talking about the use of guides.

 

You want to go blind ok, perfect is funny i like it too but do it solo-playing or playing with a guild/group that likes that style.

 

If you pug an ops and you go blind you're a liability to the group. If it's sm they will carry you most of the time and probably no one will complain (i dont like being carried) and if it's hm you're a jerk causing innecessary wipes to them.

At any rate, the way I see it, as Tank my duty is not only to survive, but also to ensure my team can down the boss. I sacrifice myself quite often if I see that there's no other way to beat the encounter, because my repair bill is something I can manage on my own.

 

I prefer to die myself, rather than have the whole team wipe. Can't blame me for that, right?

 

I don't see how a tank sacrificing himself enables the group to kill a boss. Especially when you take into account the small fact of the tank being the only thing between the group and the boss.