Jump to content

Why we need a legacy ignore


AndrewAlberts

Recommended Posts

I don't want to name names on the forums, but anyone on the DM server can probably guess the name of the player I use as an example of why we need a legacy ignore. This player does nothing except troll fleet chat, loudly announces when he logs in like he's some sort of big shot, rant about how the game is dying and proceed to share his plans on what he's doing on the games as if he's narrating his life story. I get that due to the rules being what they are, BW can do little about him, but can we please have a function that allows all our characters in our legacy to ignore him without having to re-add him to the ignore list every time we make another toon? He's doing this on both factions, so there's no escaping him.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Is making a note of this persons name and just ignoring him again so hard? take you all of 2 seconds to do when you see this person spam again.

 

I would rather the dev's concentrate on things more worthy of attention than your little issue I am sorry to say.

Edited by DizzyrupTor
Link to comment
Share on other sites

When I first saw the title, I thought you were referring to "ignoring" a player's entire legacy rather than just the one alt, which would be a nice idea. Having a "legacy ignore" function as you describe, would also be nice. Having both would be ideal.

But, until (if ever) that happens the easiest thing to do is to simply not pay attention to general chat. From what you've said, this person doesn't seem to be harassing you personally, so why even take note of it. You can turn off general chat, or make your chat window small enough to easily ignore. (I can ignore chat so easily that I often don't see team messages during FPs, etc. :) )

 

Note - I do realize that some people are playing at low resolutions (anything lower than 1600x900 I would consider low rez) and therefore some screen elements are relatively large. But then again, some people don't seem to know how to adjust the size of some elements either.

Edited by JediQuaker
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Let's stipulate the following:

 

1) I'm no tech expert, but other games have done this with ease.

 

2) The example the OP gives is not terribly persuasive.

 

But...

 

While I have never been subject to in-game stalking, or guild stalking, I can bear witness to those that have.

 

Seems to me this is low hanging fruit in 2019 and should be done.

 

Dasty

Link to comment
Share on other sites

While I understand the desire to have a legacy ignore feature in the game - sometimes I also feel like ignoring all characters of a particularly nasty person - I think there is a good reason why BioWare is very hesitant to even consider it. And it has nothing to do with technical problems.

As low as the population has gotten over the years, giving players the option to ignore entire legacies has a high risk of being quite detrimental to the overall group finder functionality and making it far more difficult to find a group in the process.

 

Granted there are some players that would not care about this at all and also some other players that don't do any group activities in the first place, but opening this pandora's box could be extremely risky.

Edited by Phazonfreak
Link to comment
Share on other sites

While I understand the desire to have a legacy ignore feature in the game - sometimes I also feel like ignoring all characters of a particularly nasty person - I think there is a good reason why BioWare is very hesitant to even consider it. And it has nothing to do with technical problems.

As low as the population has gotten over the years, giving players the option to ignore entire legacies has a high risk of being quite detrimental to the overall group finder functionality and making it far more difficult to find a group in the process.

 

Granted there are some players that would not care about this at all and also some other players that don't do any group activities in the first place, but opening this pandora's box could be extremely risky.

 

Here's why I disagree. If someone is nasty on one character, why wouldn't they be nasty on the other?

 

The argument that they are only RP-ing a jerk on one character and not the other is highly suspect. Not saying you are making the RP argument, but my view is -- once an ***, always an ***.

 

If enough people are ignoring an entire legacy, that says a lot about the person who owns said legacy.

 

Dasty

Edited by Jdast
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Here's why I disagree. If someone is nasty on one character, why wouldn't they be nasty on the other?

 

The argument that they are only RP-ing a jerk on one character and not the other is highly suspect.

 

If enough people are ignoring an entire legacy, that says a lot about the person who owns said legacy.

 

Dasty

 

I think there are quite a lot of players who create specific characters to be nasty or edgy and also have "regular" characters in their legacy. Sometimes you can even tell by the character name. Just a couple of days ago I had to report another player that used a character name very similar to a prominent figure in Nazi Germany.

 

My problem is not with the shunning of nasty players. Like I said, I sometimes also feel like we should be able to ignore an entire legacy. I just think that giving this option will also have the potential for dire consequences with certain other aspects of the game.

 

Let me put it this way: If you ignored all the players that sometimes exhibited bad form or nasty attitudes, I think we would be left with a very low population of "good and nice" players that cannot do group content anymore.

Edited by Phazonfreak
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Let's stipulate the following:

 

1) I'm no tech expert, but other games have done this with ease.

 

2) The example the OP gives is not terribly persuasive.

 

But...

 

While I have never been subject to in-game stalking, or guild stalking, I can bear witness to those that have.

 

Seems to me this is low hanging fruit in 2019 and should be done.

 

Dasty

 

You and I are on the same page here !! And believe it or not almost point for point ... actually ! :eek:

 

I would like to add on other point: Often times player temperaments, attitudes and or abusive eccentricities are all but unilaterally extended to whatever character a player will log on to ! It therefore is only logical that if ignored by a player or group of players under one name ... just log in under another (or create another toon). If the "ignore" goes account wide (legacy) then that becomes considerably more effective. I would suppose that from a database or availability of space each player has in the "ignore list" file would less likely in need of an expansion (something that has also been requested) .. since many of the name belong to the same group of players to begin with.

 

IMO.. legacy tracked "ignore list" is a win - win for players and BW both !

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think there are quite a lot of players who create specific characters to be nasty or edgy and also have "regular" characters in their legacy. Sometimes you can even tell by the character name. Just a couple of days ago I had to report another player that used a character name very similar to a prominent figure in Nazi Germany.

 

My problem is not with the shunning of nasty players. Like I said, I sometimes also feel like we should be able to ignore an entire legacy. I just think that giving this option will also have the potential for dire consequences with certain other aspects of the game.

 

Let me put it this way: If you ignored all the players that sometimes exhibited bad form or nasty attitudes, I think we would be left with a very low population of "good and nice" players that cannot do group content anymore.

 

Fair enough. But in a PuG setting, I'm talking about the following scenario...

 

I'm healing EdgeLord Sith who keeps screaming "Go, go, go" in a FP. They stand in the middle of the fire and scream at the healer (me) about why I didn't save their butt.

 

Next day, they are on SuperTrooper Commando and scream "Go, go, go" in a FP. They stand in the middle of the fire and scream at the healer (me) about why I didn't save their butt.

 

I would prefer to deal with that person only once. One and done...

 

<<which is not going the be case with the second martini I'm about to imbibe>> :rak_03:

 

Dasty

 

P.S. I understand your point, but also appreciate you understanding the broader harassment point -- fortunately -- something I've never been subject to in games. I guess maybe I'm just selfish and hate dealing with morons. :rak_03:

Edited by Jdast
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Fair enough. But in a PuG setting, I'm talking about the following scenario...

 

I'm healing EdgeLord Sith who keeps screaming "Go, go, go" in a FP. They stand in the middle of the fire and scream at the healer (me) about why I didn't save their butt.

 

Next day, they are on SuperTrooper Commando and scream "Go, go, go" in a FP. They stand in the middle of the fire and scream at the healer (me) about why I didn't save their butt.

 

I would prefer to deal with that person only once. One and done...

 

<<which is not going the be case with the second martini I'm about to imbibe>> :rak_03:

 

Dasty

 

P.S. I understand your point, but also appreciate you understanding the broader harassment point -- fortunately -- something I've never been subject to in games. I guess maybe I'm just selfish and hate dealing with morons. :rak_03:

 

well said... Although it might be for an assortment of reasons: One and done ! Much simpler .. more efficient !

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Fair enough. But in a PuG setting, I'm talking about the following scenario...

 

I'm healing EdgeLord Sith who keeps screaming "Go, go, go" in a FP. They stand in the middle of the fire and scream at the healer (me) about why I didn't save their butt.

 

Next day, they are on SuperTrooper Commando and scream "Go, go, go" in a FP. They stand in the middle of the fire and scream at the healer (me) about why I didn't save their butt.

 

I would prefer to deal with that person only once. One and done...

 

<<which is not going the be case with the second martini I'm about to imbibe>> :rak_03:

 

Dasty

 

P.S. I understand your point, but also appreciate you understanding the broader harassment point -- fortunately -- something I've never been subject to in games. I guess maybe I'm just selfish and hate dealing with morons. :rak_03:

 

I think I made it pretty clear that I understand the broader harassment point and why there is a strong argument for it. If it boils down to outright harassment, there are ways and means to address it without offering everyone a legacy ban option and BioWare should be diligant in their fight to stop it. I was just trying to explain why BioWare might not jump on the overall legacy ignore bandwagon so willingly due to not liking how someone else plays the game, because there is also another broader group building point to consider.

 

I know that there are other MMOs with this feature and it is nice to have. Those MMOs either boast a much larger population where account ignores are not affecting other mechanics negatively or they differ considerably in their core mechanics. There have also been other forum posts recently calling for either a penalty for players canceling group finder pops or adding the option to see who canceled it to put them on the ignore list.

 

We could do all that and give each player the option to ignore everyone else in this game for whatever reason and put the penalty hammer down. We would most certainly get a very nice game. I just want to caution that we might also get a very vacant game with far less interaction and a non-functioning group finder, so that all group content will only be accessible to dedicated guilds.

Edited by Phazonfreak
Link to comment
Share on other sites

...

We could do all that and give each player the option to ignore everyone else in this game for whatever reason and put the penalty hammer down. We would most certainly get a very nice game. I just want to caution that we might also get a very vacant game with far less interaction and a non-functioning group finder, so that all group content will only be accessible to dedicated guilds.

 

I don't think it would get to that point. McNasty will eventually figure out that he seems to be having a hard time finding teams since so many people are globally ignorring him. If players realize being an a-- on one character adversely effects all of their characters, they will probably moderate their nastiness. Can't just make a throwaway character for when I feel like being a troll, and occasionally replace it when enough people have ignored it.

 

On the other hand, people who get too happy with the global/Legacy ignore button will also find themselves having trouble finding groups after they have ignored a significant portion of the active population for relitively trivial reasons. That will self limit.

 

Eventually the chronic trolls and chronic ignorers will find themselves very much alone and maybe moderate their behavior.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't think it would get to that point. McNasty will eventually figure out that he seems to be having a hard time finding teams since so many people are globally ignorring him. If players realize being an a-- on one character adversely effects all of their characters, they will probably moderate their nastiness. Can't just make a throwaway character for when I feel like being a troll, and occasionally replace it when enough people have ignored it.

 

On the other hand, people who get too happy with the global/Legacy ignore button will also find themselves having trouble finding groups after they have ignored a significant portion of the active population for relitively trivial reasons. That will self limit.

 

Eventually the chronic trolls and chronic ignorers will find themselves very much alone and maybe moderate their behavior.

 

I agree, if it had an adverse effect on anyone it would be the trolls and jerks, and that would be fine by me. If someone realized that being a jerk on one character could have the consequence of getting every character in their legacy ignored and thus locked out of group activities they might want to do, perhaps they'd knock off their unpleasant and maladjusted behavior.

 

As for people who ignore a lot of other players for trivial reasons, I don't think that's anything anyone needs to worry about. We all have the right to filter our experience as we wish, and if someone's ignoring that many players I daresay they might not be that interested in the social or group aspects of the game anyway.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Here's why I disagree. If someone is nasty on one character, why wouldn't they be nasty on the other?

 

The argument that they are only RP-ing a jerk on one character and not the other is highly suspect. Not saying you are making the RP argument, but my view is -- once an ***, always an ***.

 

If enough people are ignoring an entire legacy, that says a lot about the person who owns said legacy.

 

Dasty

I agree. I would imagine the impact to group finder would be negligible. But honestly, if it did negatively impact group finder, I'd think that says more about the issues with the game's population than it does for being reason not to create a legacy ignore feature. In other words, if the game's population is so bad that a few people legacy ignoring each other destroys queue times, we've probably got way bigger problems.

 

There is also (in theory) a way around this as a potential problem. Something along the lines of, for example, notifying somebody in a system message that queue would have popped if not for X player on their ignore list. Or some other form of info along those lines. This way people aren't guessing as to why and blaming it on the wrong thing if queue isn't popping.

 

Mainly, I think the people who have most reason to be afraid of a feature like this are the habitual trolls/jerks, because it would shrink their audience so quickly and effectively. Certainly some mostly nice people could get caught in the crossfire here and there, but that's already the case now with an ignore feature, it's just easily bypassed on accident if you're an altoholic.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

We could do all that and give each player the option to ignore everyone else in this game for whatever reason and put the penalty hammer down. We would most certainly get a very nice game. I just want to caution that we might also get a very vacant game with far less interaction and a non-functioning group finder, so that all group content will only be accessible to dedicated guilds.

 

Conversely, when people queue into groupfinder and keep finding jerks in their groups, they quit queuing into groupfinder. Forcing people to keep playing with jerks is no way to build a social community. So which is more harmful to the queue? People restricting their potential teammates and having a longer queue time or people quitting group content all together?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't want to name names on the forums, but anyone on the DM server can probably guess the name of the player I use as an example of why we need a legacy ignore. This player does nothing except troll fleet chat, loudly announces when he logs in like he's some sort of big shot, rant about how the game is dying and proceed to share his plans on what he's doing on the games as if he's narrating his life story. I get that due to the rules being what they are, BW can do little about him, but can we please have a function that allows all our characters in our legacy to ignore him without having to re-add him to the ignore list every time we make another toon? He's doing this on both factions, so there's no escaping him.

 

I'm on the same server and have a pretty good idea of whom you're referring to. The only reason I haven't put this person on ignore is because I find it entertaining to watch this tool implode in General Chat. I have no doubt this person is on a multitude of ignore lists. This person spews their vitriol at anyone that disagrees with him/her at any given moment. Either bipolar or there's a screw loose somewhere.

 

Legacy ignore should have been implemented years ago.

Edited by Pirana
Link to comment
Share on other sites

@ OP, as a primary DM server player I know whom you speak of. He is a known troll. But somehow peoples always takes his bait. Just ignore him and thats it. Have you heard about not to feed the troll. :D

 

Although legacy ignore should have been implemented long ago. Since it's not here... it's probably never going to happen. :cool:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I agree. I would imagine the impact to group finder would be negligible. But honestly, if it did negatively impact group finder, I'd think that says more about the issues with the game's population than it does for being reason not to create a legacy ignore feature. In other words, if the game's population is so bad that a few people legacy ignoring each other destroys queue times, we've probably got way bigger problems.

 

Exactly, and I think we have got way bigger problems that could be reinforced with a legacy ignore feature.

 

Conversely, when people queue into groupfinder and keep finding jerks in their groups, they quit queuing into groupfinder. Forcing people to keep playing with jerks is no way to build a social community. So which is more harmful to the queue? People restricting their potential teammates and having a longer queue time or people quitting group content all together?

 

Yes, both can be harmful to queues. I am not advocating to force people to play with jerks, there is a character ignore feature after all. People have been asking for a legacy ignore feature for ages now and BioWare is not even addressing it for the most part. I don't think that there are any technical problems preventing it from being implemented, even if they might claim it to be the case. I think there is a concern on BioWare's end when it comes to population and the group finder functionality. I also think that this reasoning is in line with their general apathy when it comes to banning accounts and penalizing PvP/Conquest cheaters/exploiters.

Edited by Phazonfreak
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm on the opposite end of the spectrum, i find ignore features useless, a waste of time and effort to police. If you got the attention of the wrong type of persistent troll, he can get around a character ignore by going to another and another and another, but the same can be said of those on a legacy ignore, they can go between accounts and do it again and again. it undermines the entire purpose of such a feature.

 

Besides this, if people aren't willing to chat to each other, then what hope is there for any of us? unpleasant conversations and unlucky happenstance happens all the time, nothing will change that, but it isn't anything to lose your head over.

 

some people are a little too oversensitive as well and they think you are some monster from the German 3rd empire or something along those lines, they'll put you on ignore as soon as you sneeze or you look at them funny. so anyone on that end is abusing the feature for no other purpose but to abuse it.

Edited by Celise
Link to comment
Share on other sites

We need the ability to Ignore by Legacy because we need the ability to block bullies from harassing us.

Toons aren't real, players are. I don't care what graphics he's sporting when he comes at me. Why should that matter?

It's silly to say oh.. well, your bully is going by a new name so he can come harass you again.

People shouldn't have to go through a confrontation over and over and over, adding to an Ignore list, knowing it will never end.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm on the same server and have a pretty good idea of whom you're referring to. The only reason I haven't put this person on ignore is because I find it entertaining to watch this tool implode in General Chat. I have no doubt this person is on a multitude of ignore lists. This person spews their vitriol at anyone that disagrees with him/her at any given moment. Either bipolar or there's a screw loose somewhere.

 

Legacy ignore should have been implemented years ago.

 

IMO... It's one of those features that gives people that need it the option of using it. Let's face it. Some players are just plain ummmm... well you know... Aggressively Horrible ... and are frequently Antagonistic .

 

Legacy Ignore would definitely help BOTH directions: Legacy wide Ignore for the player who implements the action (not having to "ignore the same player on multiple account names" as well as "Ignore multiple names all belonging to the same offender".

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, both can be harmful to queues. I am not advocating to force people to play with jerks, there is a character ignore feature after all.

 

When I say "forced to play with jerks" I'm specifically referring to only having a character ignore and not an account ignore. If I do a flashpoint this week and a player was so horrible that I never want to see them again and ignore them, then next week I end up in a flashpoint with one for their alts and have another horrible experience, that is essentially the lack of proper tools forcing me to play with them again. Does it sound better if I say I was tricked into playing with them a second time? I won't know it's the same jerk, so instead of being able to avoid that jerk completely, I'm more likely to think the population is riddled with numerous jerks and that flashpoints are simply too toxic to bother with. Then I quit queuing and only do flahspoints with my guild avoiding pugs completely. So instead of me queueing with a smaller pool of players, I'm not queuing with anyone at all.

 

If you read threads about the lack of tanks and healers in groupfinder you will read many, many testimonials from tanks and healers who quit doing pugs because of jerks. Ditto if you read threads about people who only solo. Playing with jerks drives people away from group content. Removing players entirely from the queue is worse for the queue as a whole than removing them from only a select portion of the queue.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

IMO... It's one of those features that gives people that need it the option of using it. Let's face it. Some players are just plain ummmm... well you know... Aggressively Horrible ... and are frequently Antagonistic .

 

Legacy Ignore would definitely help BOTH directions: Legacy wide Ignore for the player who implements the action (not having to "ignore the same player on multiple account names" as well as "Ignore multiple names all belonging to the same offender".

 

Exactly.

 

If I'm some azzhat that wants to act up in General Chat I would expect to be put on ignore and in turn that limits what I can do group wise, something most don't care about or don't think about. I have pretty thick skin so most of the stuff that is put in chat doesn't bother me. About the only time I'll put someone on ignore is if I'm tanking or healing and some dps keeps pulling and won't stop when asked to. (I'm a pretty fast tank, so if someone is out-pulling me they're a track star, and I especially don't move so fast that it doesn't allow the healer to catch up). In other words I rarely put people on ignore, and if I do, it's deserving.

 

Legacy ignore is a much needed feature simply because if someone is being an ahole on one character doesn't mean they'll change their tune on an alt.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If I remember correctly, Keith has addressed this in either a forum post or stream or podcast and said they have discussed doing it.

The reason they haven’t is because of technical difficulties due to the legacy and the character ignore systems being so different. (I think most of us understand how much of a Frankenstein game engine this is).

Correct me if I’m wrong, but I’m sure he said they want to do it. But it will come down to priorities and how much time it will take vs more important things (that’s code for content development).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If I remember correctly, Keith has addressed this in either a forum post or stream or podcast and said they have discussed doing it.

The reason they haven’t is because of technical difficulties due to the legacy and the character ignore systems being so different. (I think most of us understand how much of a Frankenstein game engine this is).

Correct me if I’m wrong, but I’m sure he said they want to do it. But it will come down to priorities and how much time it will take vs more important things (that’s code for content development).

 

Yes I think one of the devs addressed that point a long while ago.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

×
×
  • Create New...