That does indeed sound like THE most weird player ever.

 

I met some healers who apparently were only pressing one button (their strongest but slowest heal). This one may have tried to look smarter.

Well...weird people I usually eject from the Group or ignore:

 

- DPS that queued as a healer. We were really low level, so I kind of accepted it, but when we basically wiped on trash twice, I voted to eject him from the group. I don't stand for this.

 

- One guy couldn't stop jumping. I mean, his spacebar must have been a little stump that required him to replace his keyboard every two weeks. In the middle of a fight he was jumping, while we were waiting he was jumping...jump jump jump. Didn't eject him, but I thought it was really difficult for him to do anything considering he jumped a lot, even in combat. I didn't think he did much DPS.

 

- There was a Healer (which was a Healer) which pulled groups we planned on bypassing... not accidentally, mind you. It made the flashpoint 4x longer because EVERYTHING had to die. When we asked why he kept pulling, he said "I need more XP to level." It was a valid point, but I suggested to him to complete more quests, do some PvP, finish Bonus series, do space missions or get Heroic 2/4 quests as often as possible to get more efficient XP. He wouldn't listen to a lick of it, so I simply waited until we finished, put him on /ignore so I couldn't group with him again.

 

- I was in queue and this one healer kept on Refusing a group, putting my group back in queue and then requeuing. This happened about 10 times before I found the culprit and /ignore. I didn't know if he was a troll, or just simply didn't like someone that queued up, but I thought that was what /ignore was for.

 

- A very weird group, but there was a group in which two people were both tanks. They were decently geared, and I was severely overgeared as a DPS. They were fighting for top threat, which was odd, but it was quite comical. None of them used taunts (I guess it was per their rules), which annoyed me when I could crit 9x in a row, and practically max my damage. Had to use Defensive Cooldowns sometimes to prevent myself from dying a few times, and the healer had to pick up some of the slack.

Well there was one time I healed normal Hammer Station, things went fine up till the last boss at which point I'm sure the tank was trying to point him at the group. We wiped and while walking back the tank says "get your act together and heal". So I made the obvious reply of "get your act together and turn him away from the group." At which point the tank tells me not to tell him what to do and demonstrates his 3 legacy class emotes. Once I'd demonstrated my 5 he quit. +1 to the ignore list I guess.

 

- One guy couldn't stop jumping. I mean, his spacebar must have been a little stump that required him to replace his keyboard every two weeks. In the middle of a fight he was jumping, while we were waiting he was jumping...jump jump jump. Didn't eject him, but I thought it was really difficult for him to do anything considering he jumped a lot, even in combat. I didn't think he did much DPS.

 

If it weren't for the fact you're on Ebon hawk I'd think this was me, I do it sometimes on my sentinel. There actually isn't a whole lot of dps loss as it only prevent's you using 2 moves, force stasis and master strike. Of course your jumper may not have been a sent/mara.

If it weren't for the fact you're on Ebon hawk I'd think this was me, I do it sometimes on my sentinel. There actually isn't a whole lot of dps loss as it only prevent's you using 2 moves, force stasis and master strike. Of course your jumper may not have been a sent/mara.

I tend to jump around like crazy when I'm bored on my Operative healer, because most of my healing is instant unless someone is really getting hammered and needs the big stuff. Usually I try to make complete circles around the tank.

While playing a Vig Guardian in SM Cademimu, I once had a tank tell me to switch from Shien to Shii-Cho. I asked him why, and he said "because you're doing too much damage". He was dead serious. I wasn't even pulling aggro, at least not more than once. Thankfully, he didn't press the issue when I politely refused.

 

Also had a healer once in SM Hammer Station who responded to all questions/comments with nothing but "beep" or "boop". I guess he was really getting into being a "healbot" or something...?

Also had a healer once in SM Hammer Station who responded to all questions/comments with nothing but "beep" or "boop". I guess he was really getting into being a "healbot" or something...?

 

That is HILARIOUS.

 

When pugging a group, I've often considered only communicating through emotes... Haven't yet though.

Aaah so much to say here

 

This one time, 2 guildies and i joined in a KP nightmare, i was on my jugg tank. In the group were 3 people from another guild (other tank was probably guild master) and 2 random guys. It was a nightmare! First boss was fine, obviously one of the 2 randoms was a ninja and managed to steal all the tank gear that dropped (i was still 50 with bh gear). Somehow we managed to get to karagga...

The tank was using enraged defense on cooldown and in the middle of the fight with the puzle droid he went CAPS RAGE RAWRRR STOP STEALING AGGRO!!!. Worth to notice that when i taunted off him at 5 stacks, as is tradition, he taunted right back. I then proceeded to use my aoe taunt, and he did the same. Heals were great, probably a streak of crits which saved us (him). Luckily i was on vent with a jugg dps. We managed to time our taunts so that i would be able to keep the boss on myself until his stacks wore off.

One of the randoms asked the guy to put master looter to avoid further ninja... He (the tank) went mental! some **** about "no way i trust only my soldiers" and we were like "wut :/?". Turns out we had to explain him how master looter works. Before karagga he said "i tank him you switch to dps". Fortunately i didn't, because he simply didn't want to stop using enraged defense because "STOP STEALING AGGRO RAWRRRWRR" -> "stop dropping it you cnut" -> "I'M NOT WARFABGHRLLLL". Meh... anyway, speeder dropped, and he proceeded to take that for himself no rolls. A couple of days back i saw people on fleet calling him and his whole guild out for being ninja looter, and he was so happy for the bad advertising :/

 

 

 

Yesterday i entered 2 flashpoints. I'm tank so insta-q win anyway, first one is hammer station (hm). The 3 gf pugs are in the same guild. I thought "excellent, that is usually a good sign". Healer is a bit slow but meh, he's doing his job. We got to 1st boss and we wipe (i'm not a miracle tank, i can't survive more than 3 mining beams in a row in my gear). We respawn and i say "first time here isn't it?" "no we've done it a million times" yeah sure... only one of them had done this before. "okay then use purge on me during that laser please?". Epic response "I don't have it"... my jaw fell D: "wut!?" "i never needed it"... he was exiting area to go buy purge. Luckily he stopped when i used the slimy worm statue. Cleanses were coming in at 9 stacks if ever, so at the 5th beam i died again. I kindly explained that cleanse at 9 stacks was a bit too late, i'm not geared enough to eat them all... The simultaneous answers i got were "you aren't using a shield""you have no offhand""equip a shield" . I seriously considered leaving but meh... i ignored the comments and proceeded to try again. This time we managed. Bonus boss was pretty hard, but i managed to time cooldowns well enough to make it easy on the healer, no more wipes after those first 2....

 

Second flashpoint is mandalorian raiders. I join an in progress fp, that turns out hadn't even started. I didn't even inquire as to why the other tank left. After i had killed the handler before both dogs went down i started wondering... The marauder had no form active. I asked him to activate one. No answer... The guy didn't even have sprint active and was missing quite a few armoring in his gear, not to mention the tank relics and cunning implants. After i stopped dead on my tracks and asked pretty F*****G please, he finally activated juyo form (he was carnage spec'd). I facepalmed, but he did activate ataru form after a while of sitting there, and all i got from him was "FORGOT" He also proceeded to pull everything on our way forward, not by attacking but by getting too close. And the other 2 guys asked me to stop attacking everything :/ I was so flabbergasted i didn't even protest when they went on the wing to bug the hell out of the bonus boss... Final boss was another mess... the mara was pounding on the boss. After we wiped the healer blamed me because i wasn't in the aoe heals, i was...uh... tanking the damn turrets? And he, the mara that was pounding on the boss, said "turrets first". I didn't even... well we managed in the end...

 

Starting today i will advertise myself on fleet: Are you dps/healer in the eternal queue for a 55 flashpoint? Do you have functioning brain cells? You just found your tank! Whisper me for an invite.

Edited May 17, 2013 by Kawabonga

The tank was using enraged defense on cooldown

 

This is what you get when people get their advice of Noxxic.com.

A couple of days back i saw people on fleet calling him and his whole guild out for being ninja looter, and he was so happy for the bad advertising :/

 

A whole guild of ninja looters ? Mafia ?

This is what you get when people get their advice of Noxxic.com.

 

eh? I don't remember noxxic ever telling tanks to use threat dropping ability on cd :/

eh? I don't remember noxxic ever telling tanks to use threat dropping ability on cd :/

Then you haven't ever looked there.

 

Noxxic has always recommended for tanks to use their threat reducing abilities and still does it

 

http://www.noxxic.com/swtor/pve/sith-warrior/juggernaut/immortal/rotation-and-cooldowns

 

Go to any PvE guide for any tank spec in noxxic and you will find this text: "Survivability cooldowns are used to keep you alive, reduce aggro, and provide relief to healers."

 

And it is not just them using the same introductory text for tanks and dps, (which would be stupid too) but all of the tank "guides" there actually list threat reduction abilities like Enraged Defense in their list of abilities tanks should use.

 

(sure I can think of some rare situations where an off-tank might use threat drop in an operation where you have 2 tanks, but these are rare and exceptional situations, and the person using it is not tanking anything at the moment, but since Noxxic does not explain or specify in any way how and when to use these abilities, the default assumption is that they suggest them to be used as often as possible, even when you are tanking)

 

 

Saddest part is, I'm not even sure if this is the worst and stupidest bad advice given by Noxxic, since there are so many.

oh... it was just so far down the list, I didn't even see it as "must use" more like list of every CD juggs have - figured threat drop and tanking don't really go together :/ I have been using noxxic as general class and spec guide, so far fairly successfully, but if you have any better suggestions for where to get class information (for all classes basically, since I have one of each) I'd love to hear it

oh... it was just so far down the list, I didn't even see it as "must use" more like list of every CD juggs have - figured threat drop and tanking don't really go together :/ I have been using noxxic as general class and spec guide, so far fairly successfully, but if you have any better suggestions for where to get class information (for all classes basically, since I have one of each) I'd love to hear it

 

Yourself

 

Take the time to read the tooltips and let those brain cells exercise a bit

Yourself

 

Take the time to read the tooltips and let those brain cells exercise a bit

 

I'm sorry, I don't have enough of the brain cells to figure out all 8 advanced classes with equal skill, while still having time left over to actually play and enjoy the game without becoming another one of the weird people you meet in flashpoints and never want to see again AND maintain other hobbies, not to mention a job.

 

some of us are not gaming savants. I can figure out how not to be completely awful, but some guidance is helpful to be better than "not awful" for quite a few of us. this is why all those guides exist in a first place. because no single person can be great at everything and there's most certain NO need to keep reinventing the wheel out of some misguided sense of... I don't even know what.

I'm sorry, I don't have enough of the brain cells to figure out all 8 advanced classes with equal skill, while still having time left over to actually play and enjoy the game without becoming another one of the weird people you meet in flashpoints and never want to see again AND maintain other hobbies, not to mention a job.

 

some of us are not gaming savants. I can figure out how not to be completely awful, but some guidance is helpful to be better than "not awful" for quite a few of us. this is why all those guides exist in a first place. because no single person can be great at everything and there's most certain NO need to keep reinventing the wheel out of some misguided sense of... I don't even know what.

 

Relax Jeweledleah.

 

Basically, when reading a guide (any guide!) you should always take what it says with "a grain of salt". Read what the guide says, use it as a "guide" but take the time to think about what it says.

 

For example, it a tank guide recommends using an aggro dump abilitly, ask yourself why it would recommend that. If you can't figure out why, then try it out and see what happens. When you realize that it makes you loose control of the fight you have 2 choices:

a) stop using it and realize the guide was wrong on that point or

b) keep using it because the guide said you should and blame others because they don't know what they are doing.

 

If you chose (a): congratulations! you just showed that you can think for yourself (and you didn't have to give up your family/job/life to do it) and in the process you have improved your enjoyment of the game and that of others too.

 

If you chose (b)... well, if you chose (b) then I guess this thread is about you and others like you.

I'm sorry, I don't have enough of the brain cells to figure out all 8 advanced classes with equal skill, while still having time left over to actually play and enjoy the game without becoming another one of the weird people you meet in flashpoints and never want to see again AND maintain other hobbies, not to mention a job.

 

some of us are not gaming savants. I can figure out how not to be completely awful, but some guidance is helpful to be better than "not awful" for quite a few of us. this is why all those guides exist in a first place. because no single person can be great at everything and there's most certain NO need to keep reinventing the wheel out of some misguided sense of... I don't even know what.

 

reading the tooltips takes a lot less time than reading a well made guide :/ that and anyway, skill comes with exercise not with reading a guide, i'm sure you know that since you play all ACs

 

Also i just realized my comment came out pretty harsh... i meant absolutely no offense, i was just saying that in the end you will have to toy around with your toon anyway to become effective, a guide can't prepare you for every situation you encounter

I love how 90% of the stories about bads are Marauders.

I tend to jump around like crazy when I'm bored on my Operative healer, because most of my healing is instant unless someone is really getting hammered and needs the big stuff. Usually I try to make complete circles around the tank.

Ah, tank circling is pre-fight only for me, don't have much choice but to circle the mob in the fight, 4m range etc

Ah, just remembered one of my favorites:

 

I tanked a run of SM Boarding Party about a month ago on my Powertech. There was another Powertech in the group, queued as Damage. Pyrotech spec.

 

I noticed I was having an impossible time holding aggro — no matter what I did, this PT DPS would rip it off within seconds. I've never had trouble holding aggro before, ever! What's going on?? I checked my Cylinder... nope, Ion Gas, I didn't mess up.

 

So I noticed Combustible Gas on the targets — maybe PT Pyro DPS was made overpowered in 2.0? Maybe Combustible Gas is bugged and doing insane damage or something?

 

I started paying more attention to this PT Pyro DPS, trying to figure out what was going on. I noticed she never entered melee range, never even 10 meter range. The entire run, she literally did not fire a single Flame Burst or Rocket Punch. Instead, she stood at 30 meters and fired Unload on cooldown and filled with Rapid Shots and Missile Blasts.

 

That should be pretty bad DPS output, right? So why is she ripping threat off me?

 

I noticed she kept irritatingly Grappling all my targets over to her. At first I thought she was just being a lazy DPS, getting them into range for her close-range attacks. But then I checked the log and realized her Rocket Punch / Flame Burst total was exactly zero. Why was she Grappling stuff off me if she wasn't even using close-range attacks??

 

What I eventually realized was that she was standing at 30 meters and literally just pressing every single button that lit up.

 

Meaning, her Powertech Pyro "rotation" consisted of:

• Unload on cooldown
  
• Explosive Dart on cooldown (breaking CC constantly)
  
• Flame Thrower on cooldown (despite not hitting anything with it, and cancelling the channel immediately)
  
• Energy Shield on cooldown (despite not being attacked)
  
• Kolto Overload on cooldown (despite not being attacked)
  
• Hydraulic Overrides on cooldown (for no reason, because it lit up)
  
• Chaff Flare on cooldown (even when not aggro'd, because it lit up)
  
• Grapple on cooldown
  
• Neural Dart (taunt) on cooldown
  
• AoE taunt on cooldown
  
• Missile Blast until she overheated
  

 

It was... indescribable to watch. It remains one of the most absolutely bizarre things I have ever seen in Group Finder.

 

That's.. that's actually not so weird. I did it myself when I started playing because I was too lazy to read the tooltips and just hitting every button that lightened up worked.. kinda. Well, not long enough, sure, so I had to read them at some point, but still. I still do the same with my twinks. At the beginning you don't even have that many abilities. Though you'd think after a few wipes you notice why a certain ability (taunt) does no damage whatsover to the target. Funny times.

 

While playing a Vig Guardian in SM Cademimu, I once had a tank tell me to switch from Shien to Shii-Cho. I asked him why, and he said "because you're doing too much damage". He was dead serious. I wasn't even pulling aggro, at least not more than once. Thankfully, he didn't press the issue when I politely refused.

 

Also had a healer once in SM Hammer Station who responded to all questions/comments with nothing but "beep" or "boop". I guess he was really getting into being a "healbot" or something...?

 

A lot of people annoy me by saying I should turn a stance on. It takes them a while until they discover shien isn't actually the sprint.

 

I love how 90% of the stories about bads are Marauders.

 

Because they are so many of them and a few bad examples leaves you with the impression that all of them are bad.

My main is a dps, but jesus, most of them are really, really bad. In 98% of the time I was the only dps that knew what the kill order was. This is the thing that annoys the most. All the other dds seem incredibly stupid. I am so annoyed that I am always the one who has to walk to every single weak add to kill them, because the other dd thinks it's much nicer to hit the champion instead. Bah. I hate that especially if it's a ranged dd. Sure, as a jugg I have charge. But it has a cooldown. I can jump once and then I have to run. And there is nothing more annoying than running roughly 500 miles in a flashpoint to every single stupid add because the ranged dd is too good to bother with adds.

Just had a really funny experience in a random gf, i was running my slinger for the weekly and got a Vg tank and shadow dps from guilds ive never heard of and a sage healer from a competent guild and drew athiss.

 

The Vg tank is in gear with some defense stats scattered through it but more surge and crit than anything else and he is starting all fights from range, spamming his no cost filler shot (forget the name) then back pedaling all over the place trying to run away from the mobs, after awhile the shadow starts initiating the fights but stays in dps gear , stance and spec, some how we kill the first boss. After a few more trash pulls I am positive the VG thinks hes a ranged tank, so I tell him Vgs are not ranged, get in the middle of those mobs and make them hit you, its seems to work a little, but not for long.

 

We eventually make it to the second boss in athiss and I give the tank some advice, tank in front of the door and when he throws you run back to it, try to pick up the adds when they spawn. We start the fight, tank is back pedaling in a big circle around the area trying like hell to stay at range, shadow who im guessing doesn't speak English is screaming Full boss! Full boss! we all die and the healer leaves. It all would have usually pissed me off but for some reason it just made me laugh.

Edited May 17, 2013 by Mallorik

I'm sorry, I don't have enough of the brain cells to figure out all 8 advanced classes with equal skill, while still having time left over to actually play and enjoy the game without becoming another one of the weird people you meet in flashpoints and never want to see again AND maintain other hobbies, not to mention a job.

I'm sorry, but this is a flat-out terrible excuse. Taking time to read tooltips and think about your abilities/skill tree consumes maybe 1-2 hours total of your entire time leveling a character.

 

The ancient "I HAVE A JOB / LIFE / HOBBIES" excuse in MMOs (and pretty much any other area where people don't like being criticized) falls completely flat when you realize that the vast, vast majority of people you are playing with are actually:

• college age or older
  
• have a job, or a class schedule equivalent to or more demanding than a job, or both
  
• have many other hobbies besides gaming, like most human beings
  
• still manage to play adequately, well, or even exceptionally without being spoonfed quick-and-dirty information
  

 

Ultimately, once you have the basics sorted out, it's more about repeated practice than any pre-formed plan or guide. Plus, trying to play every single class "with equal skill" is a job for those "gaming savants". The core design assumption is you're playing one thing and taking a long time to figure it out — so you're putting a lot of extra pressure on yourself the game wasn't expecting to support.

 

Plus, there's nothing wrong with being the "weird one" in stories here. Most of these stories are amused, not angry. Everyone goes through a learning process. However, you can significantly improve the curve on that learning process by looking at your entire toolbox and actually thinking about it logically — you may not get the "optimal rotation" or whatever, but you will perform "fine" with a little thinking and organization.

Edited May 17, 2013 by SW_display_name

So having made the above post, I'll ante up and share some of the more questionable things I've done in Group Finder while I was still learning on my earlier characters.

 

Assassin is for fite

My first character was a Sith Assassin. I leveled as Darkness because it was easy, but respec'd Madness for Group Finder pops because I was afraid of tanking.

 

Habits from WoW taught me "you have dots! Multi-dot everything!" and I was so overwhelmed with everything else about the leveling process that I didn't stop and think this through completely as it relates to a resource-gated melee class.

 

So, for most of my leveling FPs, I spent every trash pull running all over like crazy, placing the Discharge lightning dot on every single target ... targets which the other DPS / tank would then kill like 5 seconds later. Finally I had a Boarding Party run where the Sniper said in party chat: "<my name>, you are doing like no damage and I'm carrying you on DPS". I was like

 

He was apparently some fancy super-SWTOR guy who was leveling his 700th character and running a DPS parser in leveling FPs. He said I was doing good damage on bosses but almost nothing on trash pulls.

 

After that I thought about what I was doing and started only Discharging the Strongs/Elites and not trying to do an actual rotation on the Weaks / Standards.

 

~~~

 

HK-47

Much later I leveled my Powertech and started tanking in the late 20s, because the DPS specs were so incredibly boring and I was looking for something to keep me interested in the character. This went fine until I got to The Foundry and encountered the HK-47 fight.

 

Up until now, I had been the Super Tank™. I took almost no damage, always held aggro, healers loved me and group runs went fast and smooth. My ego was at an all-time high.

 

Then I get to HK-47 and I'm completely trashed before I can even react, and the group wipes 5 times in a row before votekicking me. Ouch. Ego = officially crushed.

 

It turns out I was doing things like...

• Running out of range for Flame Thrower, then not getting back in melee range to stop Powerful Blast. Meaning I was "mysteriously" losing ~ 50% of my Health nonstop during the "tank HK" phases, OOM'ing our Sorc healer in no time flat.
  
• Trying to "tank" HK and taunt him during Snipe phases, leaving the group unprotected from the droids being created and prolonging the length of the Snipe phase
  
• Not turning him away from the group during Suppression Fire, causing tons of AoE damage after a Snipe phase (with a Sorc running on vapors from healing Powerful Blasts on me) and killing people
  

 

Basically, I was tanking that fight about as wrongly as I possibly could. It was such a shock after having non-stop success until then, with my new tanking role. The group didn't know what was going wrong, they just knew something was wrong and that other tanks didn't do this bad a job, so they booted me.

 

I crawled off to the forums like a beaten puppy looking for advice and eventually figured out what was going on, then strutted up and was like: "Don't worry folks, I'm a professional" and one-shot HK every time after that. But wow, was that ever a humbling experience!

@ Zeroplus - well naturally, some sort of personal judgement is involved. guides are guidlines though, they are like tutorials. its like drawing. can you become very good while self taught? of course. doesn't mean you should take lessons, or read books, practice exercises someone else created? of course not.

 

personally it didn't even occur to me to use aggro dropping ability while tanking (unless its a situation where tanks taunt off each other and for some reason the boss still goes for me, instead of the other tank)

 

@ Kawabanga - I only play 3 of those ac's with any true regularity and even then I'm only experienced with one of the trees, not all 3. so its actually faster for me to glance over a quick basic guide, then figure out each and every tooltip and how they correlate on my own. I can figure out healing trees without much help - (though I always accept good ideas and tricks when offered), but I've been playing healers as mains for years now.dps/tanks don't come with the same innate knack for me.

 

but I come from the time of game where you HAD to read book sized tutorial that came in a game box, you couldn't just jump in (and weren't expected to) and figure it all out on your own.

 

anyways, the point I'm trying to make I guess is that I don't understand why people would want to discourage someone to go outside for knowledge and help. whether you yourself need that same help or not is inconsequential - would you rather that that person that's not you sucked and became another odd pug story for someone because they are too uncomfortable to ask questions anymore?

like operatives who keep using cover and long range abilities... because that's what the trainer has been teaching them when they first started playing a character, those abilities popped out automatically on their toolbars, so if trainer kept offering them upgrades for those skills... that should mean they are still useful yes? and mouseover tooltip shows that they are supposed to deal a fair bit of damage too. see where I'm going with it?

what's obvious to you, is not necessarily obvious to someone else.

like that bounty hunter who kept using all abilities as they lit up... because she didn't know any better and because at that time no one bothered to ask her why.

I'm sorry, but this is a flat-out terrible excuse. Taking time to read tooltips and think about your abilities/skill tree consumes maybe 1-2 hours total of your entire time leveling a character.

 

The ancient "I HAVE A JOB / LIFE / HOBBIES" excuse in MMOs (and pretty much any other area where people don't like being criticized) falls completely flat when you realize that the vast, vast majority of people you are playing with are actually:

• college age or older
  
• have a job, or a class schedule equivalent to or more demanding than a job, or both
  
• have many other hobbies besides gaming, like most human beings
  
• still manage to play adequately, well, or even exceptionally without being spoonfed quick-and-dirty information
  

 

Ultimately, once you have the basics sorted out, it's more about repeated practice than any pre-formed plan or guide. Plus, trying to play every single class "with equal skill" is a job for those "gaming savants". The core design assumption is you're playing one thing and taking a long time to figure it out — so you're putting a lot of extra pressure on yourself the game wasn't expecting to support.

 

Plus, there's nothing wrong with being the "weird one" in stories here. Most of these stories are amused, not angry. Everyone goes through a learning process. However, you can significantly improve the curve on that learning process by looking at your entire toolbox and actually thinking about it logically — you may not get the "optimal rotation" or whatever, but you will perform "fine" with a little thinking and organization.

 

I think you are reading it as someone saying they don't have time to learn or don't want to.

 

what I'm saying I don't have time to learn it the hard way not to mention I actually respect the time of other people who end up victims of my learning the hard way. what is wrong with following the advice of others who already figured it out exactly?

 

I just don't understand that mentality, I really don't.

 

because you CAN significantly improve your learning curve by looking at a guide that explains those tooltips and how they work together. there's absolutely NO need to figure it out the "hard" way, when other options exist out there, when those other options were specifically created by people who wrote them for that reason - to share with those who come after them and make THEIR lives easier, not to mention those of the people that group with them.

 

I don't expect people to go outside and learn, but I appreciate those that do, and I've never EVER done the "figure it out yourself" thing when people do ask questions, whether it comes to videogames, or my other hobbies. it slows down progress when people hoard knowledge it in real life instead of sharing it.

Edited May 17, 2013 by Jeweledleah

I think you are reading it as someone saying they don't have time to learn or don't want to.

 

what I'm saying I don't have time to learn it the hard way not to mention I actually respect the time of other people who end up victims of my learning the hard way. what is wrong with following the advice of others who already figured it out exactly?

 

I just don't understand that mentality, I really don't.

 

because you CAN significantly improve your learning curve by looking at a guide that explains those tooltips and how they work together. there's absolutely NO need to figure it out the "hard" way, when other options exist out there, when those other options were specifically created by people who wrote them for that reason - to share with those who come after them and make THEIR lives easier, not to mention those of the people that group with them.

 

I don't expect people to go outside and learn, but I appreciate those that do, and I've never EVER done the "figure it out yourself" thing when people do ask questions, whether it comes to videogames, or my other hobbies. it slows down progress when people hoard knowledge it in real life instead of sharing it.

I believe that this aspect of the discussion starting with using Noxxic as a source of data.

 

There are plenty of really great guides available. Noxxic isn't one of them. Sometimes their advice is simply poor, sometimes it is actually destructive.

 

Due to the this, the response one gets when citing them as a source tends to be pretty strong.

 

Nothing wrong with using a guide. Just use a good one.