Burst damage doesnt matter in pvp

Oh boy....

Oh boy....

Was a typo, as you could've expected

However though, I can hardly imagne bioware making burst completely obsolete in pvp.

No tight "enrage" timers on a relatively small add etc?

Indeed.

He could solo both of you together. I have seen the guy defend 1v3 and 2v5 for a whole match.

TLDR if you enjoy playing your assassin do some regs and/or become good at ninjas and nodeguarding for rateds. When that gets boring you might as well play something else because the class is never getting fixed.

Completely true. Sins are the best solo outworld PvP class.... if only we actually had some solo outworld PvP like other MMOs do.

Besides that, they are a baddies super-pro grinder class, it makes them go on the forums and scream nerf.

Scream nerf to the least useful PvE class of all (both as DPS and tanking) and the class (not spec, whole class) that is not accepted into ranked PvP if not exactly to guard nodes. No PvP tank and no PvP DPS, just guard nodes. The same nodes that come patch 2.4 won't be a factor any more.

Not really. Read:

 

Ever gotten opened on by a concealment operative that didn't crit anything? Yeah that damage is laughable.

When Hidden Strike crits though, the opener is at about the level it should be.

 

And it wouldn't be the first "autocrit". We have them as assassins too. Through an ability called recklessness.

Given it's hardly a real autocrit because of current crit levels.. but it should be. And that works just fine. As it should.

 

 

Autocrit is not necessarily bad or OP.

Recklessness only affects force. Assassins rely on maul for burst.

Burst damage doesnt matter in pve keep reading what you want to tell yourself thats not true. You base you dps on one or two abilities right out pf stealth and be crap dps the rest pf the fight. Nobody has been able to explain why sins parse majorly below any class. Oh thats right you want to cherry pick your info

Why would I be talking about how Deception does in PVE on a PVP forum? It's a PVP spec. If you're upset that Madness doesn't perform well in PVE, well then I agree with you, but this isn't the place to complain about it.

So, you're saying that Rage Marauders have sustain DPS?

Mauraders are the second highest parsing class, and unlike sins they don't have to worry about getting their opener or getting procs

Sins will never have their DPS adjusted because they added the recklessness talent. This makes them OP as **** under optimal circumstances and useless under suboptimal circumstances. So when the optimal circumstance arises, everyone sees this "op as ****" assassin blowing them up and comes crying to bioware about nerfing sins when reality is that they're only op against bad players.

This creates the unique situation where a class that is in actuality very bad for rated pvp dps is seen as overpowered by a large number of players. Good luck getting bioware to fix our class, you might as well regstar it up and enjoy the regs OPness.

 

Regarding the actual parses, bioware has stated that sins won't be upgraded from a dps perspective because "sins have the most to gain when switching from dummy targets to player targets dps-wise". Granted this information was looked at and proven to be factually the opposite of reality, but when has bioware ever let reality hold them back from making decisions in the past?

 

TLDR if you enjoy playing your assassin do some regs and/or become good at ninjas and nodeguarding for rateds. When that gets boring you might as well play something else because the class is never getting fixed.

This man speak truth.

If you look at ranked teams composition you see that there is almost no deception sins present - they are taken only as tanks and even then jugs are better choice for upcoming arena. Devs don't know how to fix this class - I think they are under impressions that burst from stealth is a lot more dangerous than burst after jump from nowhere, so they gave marauders all best toys while leaving sins as a victims for their mechanic.

I know of another spec that does it. Insane AOE burst and pretty decent sustained damages. Absurdely overpowered .

Sins are okay. They could certainly use a more usefull 51 ability and a slightly better survivability.

Apart from that ppl calling for a nerf don't know what they're talking about.

Rage spec's sustained single target damage is only around 2750. Marksman is around 3300. Deception is around 2750.

Assassin is fine as is.

Recklessness only affects force. Assassins rely on maul for burst.

Um what? So your saying my 6k+ Discharge and my 5k+ Shock isn't bursty? Oh wait I've got three stacks of Recklessness, Voltaic slash x2, Shock again.

Sins don't 'rely' on maul for burst. Yes it is a big part of their rotation but Crits on Discharge and Shock are just as nasty. Add to the fact that Maul is highly unpredictable when in comes to the RNG and you end up with a 4-5K one instead of 9k.

Recklessness only affects force. Assassins rely on maul for burst.

Lol, yeah no.

Burst does not matter in pve we need sustained damage i will refer you to all the parses for the. 100th time that shows we are 500 below other classes

So why are you in the PvP forums ?

Sins have crazy burst damage, and if they have their Defensive CD they near impossible to kill also. One reason Sins don't get high on the DPS chars is because they kill their targets so fast. Every time one sneaks up on my Gunslinger they take about 3/4 of my health before I even get 1 shot off. Once they're stealth and all their stuns and defensive abilities are on CD then their vulnerable, but until then they can pretty much destroy any class.

Sins are suppose to be played as a stealth class that attacks players who are engaged with other players, there not suppose to be a class that takes other classes head on... If you want that then roll another class because that's not how dps sins work.

Sins as they are now are maybe just slightly OP with their burst damage, I wouldn't really want them nerfed much because it would make the class useless.

If you want to talk about a OP class then look no further then a Jugg Spec Smash Monkey in Tank stance who easily gets 800k damage and 200k protection guarding a healer without breaking a sweat.

So why are you in the PvP forums ?

 

Sins have crazy burst damage, and if they have their Defensive CD they near impossible to kill also. One reason Sins don't get high on the DPS chars is because they kill their targets so fast. Every time one sneaks up on my Gunslinger they take about 3/4 of my health before I even get 1 shot off. Once they're stealth and all their stuns and defensive abilities are on CD then their vulnerable, but until then they can pretty much destroy any class.

 

Sins are suppose to be played as a stealth class that attacks players who are engaged with other players, there not suppose to be a class that takes other classes head on... If you want that then roll another class because that's not how dps sins work.

 

Sins as they are now are maybe just slightly OP with their burst damage, I wouldn't really want them nerfed much because it would make the class useless.

 

If you want to talk about a OP class then look no further then a Jugg Spec Smash Monkey in Tank stance who easily gets 800k damage and 200k protection guarding a healer without breaking a sweat.

So, why then deception sins has no place in 99% ranked teams?

So, why then deception sins has no place in 99% ranked teams?

I don't like to spoil the fun but rankeds are gone, or they soon will be. So this is completely irrelevant issue right now.

And tbh sins are very diverting class to play, they need some tweaking but not any serious ones . If some people are complaining about them in most cases it's a l2p thing than a class balance. This is a stealth class with some heaviest single target hitting attacks - so what's a issue again?

I don't like to spoil the fun but rankeds are gone, or they soon will be. So this is completely irrelevant issue right now.

 

And tbh sins are very diverting class to play, they need some tweaking but not any serious ones . If some people are complaining about them in most cases it's a l2p thing than a class balance. This is a stealth class with some heaviest single target hitting attacks - so what's a issue again?

So, you're telling that assassin/shadow class representatives have l2p issues posting "fix us" all over the class and test forums? And it's l2p play issue with all ranked sins that they had to spec into tank for their spot? And you think sins somehow miraculously will have spot in arenas because their dps, survivability and utility is comparable with marauders/sents for equally skilled players?

So, you're telling that assassin/shadow class representatives have l2p issues posting "fix us" all over the class and test forums? And it's l2p play issue with all ranked sins that they had to spec into tank for their spot? And you think sins somehow miraculously will have spot in arenas because their dps, survivability and utility is comparable with marauders/sents for equally skilled players?

Objective based RWZ are gone, so there is one problem less. How the arenas will play our we will see after the 2.4 patch. BW said that they are also waiting for the statistic datas after the 2.4 hits.

Pts is a its own entity with its own laws so it's hard to predict anything.

Second - it's not that sins are weak, it's maras who are Op and need Nerf badly. This class has many utilities, cds some hard hitting attacks and above all can go stealth. So many complains I've read here are more likely to be a l2p issues than real problems.

As I said maybe some tweaks are required - one more defensive ability would be nice but really performance of this class is not an issue like the knight /warrior Op (4 sec god mode and auto crit aoe attack on 30 sec CD). This must be changed, not buffing a class that if played right can be a superb addition to the team.

Objective based RWZ are gone, so there is one problem less. How the arenas will play our we will see after the 2.4 patch. BW said that they are also waiting for the statistic datas after the 2.4 hits.

Pts is a its own entity with its own laws so it's hard to predict anything.

 

Second - it's not that sins are weak, it's maras who are Op and need Nerf badly. This class has many utilities, cds some hard hitting attacks and above all can go stealth. So many complains I've read here are more likely to be a l2p issues than real problems.

 

As I said maybe some tweaks are required - one more defensive ability would be nice but really performance of this class is not an issue like the knight /warrior Op (4 sec god mode and auto crit aoe attack on 30 sec CD). This must be changed, not buffing a class that if played right can be a superb addition to the team.

I see. Well, I do agree that most complains about sins are from bad players (were it about nerf or boost claims). But majority of good sins/shadow players agree that sins have some difficulties in current meta and current PTS patch notes shows that there were no efforts made to fix it up despite of numerous posts from very respected players.

And I'm against of nerfing - becuase you'll end up nerfing more than one class. Better bring everyone on par with marauders and snipers in terms of dps, with juggernauts in terms of tanking and with operatives in terms of healing.

As it stands now we have a situation where previous 8 vs 8 teams could not afford to spend slot on dps sin, and now teams would have only 4 slots instead of 8 and no fixes for assassins. I honestly can't imagine what "data" devs need to see that sins still need fixes.

So, why then deception sins has no place in 99% ranked teams?

They are evidently too op!

With all those 200k crit openers and stuff, why bring anyone else to a WZ?

Oh wait, the opener half of the time does 3.5k (but nobody recalls the gank fails against them, only the ones that succeed), even with maxed crit rate the damage past the first 5 seconds is beyond pathetic and... stays at that level till the sin dies or stealths again.

Objective based RWZ are gone, so there is one problem less. How the arenas will play our we will see after the 2.4 patch. BW said that they are also waiting for the statistic datas after the 2.4 hits.

Pts is a its own entity with its own laws so it's hard to predict anything.

This is called "moving the goal". Sins SUCK at being competitive right now? Let's wait 1-2 years to see how arenas will do. Once SWTOR will have only 1 server left, we'll finally get a patch.

I see. Well, I do agree that most complains about sins are from bad players (were it about nerf or boost claims). But majority of good sins/shadow players agree that sins have some difficulties in current meta and current PTS patch notes shows that there were no efforts made to fix it up despite of numerous posts from very respected players.

 

And I'm against of nerfing - becuase you'll end up nerfing more than one class. Better bring everyone on par with marauders and snipers in terms of dps, with juggernauts in terms of tanking and with operatives in terms of healing.

 

As it stands now we have a situation where previous 8 vs 8 teams could not afford to spend slot on dps sin, and now teams would have only 4 slots instead of 8 and no fixes for assassins. I honestly can't imagine what "data" devs need to see that sins still need fixes.

Deception Sins suffer from utter lack of utility past the first "BOOM" 10 seconds since they unstealth.

With combat going on they can't just press a magic reset button and have their CDs (and most of all, the buffs those CDs give) back. They have 1 long CD to force re-stealth but you can't accept a class in a competitive team that is only worth a spot once every other minute.

The reason they parse so low is that they have extreme burst. If they had all the opening burst they have right now with enough dps afterwords to hang with the other top DPS classes, they'd be absurdly overpowered.

 

Now I'm speaking from deception/infiltration point of view. They could make balance/madness spec a more viable pve DPS spec.

Combat sentinels called and they wanna point out that in parses they have extreme burst and also top the charts. K? Thx, bai!

This is called "moving the goal". Sins SUCK at being competitive right now? Let's wait 1-2 years to see how arenas will do. Once SWTOR will have only 1 server left, we'll finally get a patch.

You know you're amusing when you're trying to proof anything about the sin / shadow class when some time ago you were showing pics how "bad" is one side on ToFN that is well known for being a dominant one while doing as a 55lvl shadow only 100k dmg, don't you? You need to change an account to be taken seriously in this matter

You know you're amusing when you're trying to proof anything about the sin / shadow class when some time ago you were showing pics how "bad" is one side on ToFN that is well known for being a dominant one while doing as a 55lvl shadow only 100k dmg, don't you? You need to change an account to be taken seriously in this matter

Sorry I don't play a monkey class. A non tank shadow without any support has to go "solo gank mode" and prey (possibly) on crippled opponents and get out.

So in the end if I kill 10 guys who had an average of 10k health left, I am going to do 100k. The long CDs prevent me from doing quicker solo ganks than that.

Also, you keep forgetting that doing 1M damage is hard when you must stand at a node doing nothing for the whole match.

Here's an example: Voidstar. I spent the whole first round... twisting my thumbs guarding the door.

So of course I am not going to have 1M damage nor to have 50 medals, I still got about 400k in half played time the others had.