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Pre 50 Mob skipping and players who are too high level.


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I am seeing this more and more and I have to say, because of this I am queuing less and less. There are too many people who are queuing for Flashpoints who have far out leveled the thing, and they are just hurting the XP for those of us who are within that level range. These players who are doing this are obviously not going to stop, so the problem in itself needs to be addressed and fixed by Bioware.

 

Furthermore, player pre 50 are skipping mobs and going completely out of their way to avoid having to kill anything in these Flashpoints. They act like they are level 50 and all they want are the comms. This also needs to be addressed and fixed.

 

Players are obviously not going to stop, so it needs to be fixed. I am sick of sitting in a Flashpoint queue for what seems to be an eternity just to get on a team that either has a player way too high for the Flashpoint or getting in with a team that seems to think they need to skip all the mobs. Do players not realize how fast you can level if you take the time to kill the mobs in these things? As long as everyone is within the 3 level range of each toher, the XP is insane, yet people want to skip them.

 

It's getting to a point that I am never queuing for Flashpoints anymore.

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I must say I agree with this to an extent. Story Mode FPs, especially sub 50 ones are for XP, loot and some comms. I was abhorred the last time I ran Foundry and someone insisted we skip the bonuses! I suspect that group finder isn't entirely to blame though, it has a lot to do with the game being over a year old at this point and people on alts playing just like they're 50.

 

Aside from that, I do think that GF should lower the maximum level you can queue for most FPs. At the top end of the level range you get no XP from the trash mobs and only minimal XP from the bosses while also lowering everyone else's XP by a large margin. Atleast it tells you what level everyone is before you accept the group. I decline groups that have anyone more that 2 levels above me and I decline groups that I'm more than 4 levels above someone. I don't like getting greatly reduced XP and I don't like forcing that on other players.

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While this is bad behaviour, it really is a dev generated problem. I just recently levelled a new toon and was frustrates that at level 44 the groupfinder insisted I queue for Maelstrom Prison/Foundry. A flashpoint I will get zero benefit from and penalize the other players. If you are more than five levels above and the fp is grayed out why does BW try and force me to select it.

As I said, does not excuse rudeness, but fix this already.

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The best you can do is try to reason with these people who seem to forget they're not playing on their level 50s. Unless they're maybe the tank or healer they've also waited a long time to get in there and are hopefully somewhat intelligent.

 

As to people being overlevelled, that's more the fault of the group finder. They likely just signed up for a random FP and got put into the lowest level one in their range. They should update it so that you will never be put in an FP where the mobs and objectives are grey to you - though on the flipside without them being put in your group your wait might have been even longer.

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As it turns out, you can deselect FPs you don't want to do. You won't be eligible for the daily bonus like that, but once you've done the first one, you pick what you want. Personally I don't mind having several higher level people, it usually means I get all the gear.
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Hi, this is my first post on these forums, and I would have to say the issue of over-leveled players in Flashpoints is largely caused by the Group Finder.

 

As a *new* level 50 (I only subscribed after dinging 50), I decided I should run the level 50 flashpoints (False Emperor, Kaon Under Seige, etc.) on story mode before attempting hard mode. The problem is, in order to qualify for the Group Finder's daily reward, I have to queue for all available flashpoints. That meant queuing for Red Reaper, which is what, a level 45 mission? Why the hell am I queuing for a mission that a) has no useful loot and b) poses absolutely no challenge? To top it off, you almost always seem to get dropped into the lowest FP you queued for. I got dropped into Red Reaper three days in a row before deciding to say screw it and just queue for the FPs I wanted.

 

This is also a problem before 50. I remember as a level 48-49 having to queue for Colicoid War Games, which at that point was just faceroll easy.

 

Basically, the level range of missions you can/need to queue for in the Group Finder really needs to be reduced. In order to get the daily reward, you really shouldn't have to queue for a FP that is 5, 6 or even 7 levels below you.

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I wish they included the following toggle options to better match people's preferences:

Skip convos?

Bonus?

Speed run?

Loot instance?: no more battle looting.

 

I don't like trying to convince people to do the run my ways, and I'm sick of people trying to convince me. I don't think it's outside the realm of possibility to attempt to auto-group people of similar preferences.

Just give us more filters in group finder so we don't have to force our preferences on each other

Edited by ubermouth
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As it turns out, you can deselect FPs you don't want to do. You won't be eligible for the daily bonus like that, but once you've done the first one, you pick what you want. Personally I don't mind having several higher level people, it usually means I get all the gear.

 

You really think that we did not know that? Over half the point of doing a flashpoint IS the groupfinder reward. I do one with all selected, then maybe one more with only the highest selected.

 

What a waste of a post.

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You really think that we did not know that? Over half the point of doing a flashpoint IS the groupfinder reward. I do one with all selected, then maybe one more with only the highest selected.

 

What a waste of a post.

 

My point was, do the one run with all selected, get your daily reward, then deselect the ones you don't want to do.

 

What a bigger waste of a post. Followed by this one.

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How over-level are we talking here, because you don't get the daily GF reward unless you queue for all eligible runs. Yeah, it sucks that I have to run FPs where literally none of the loot is useful - but hey, gets the daily taken care of on easy-mode and I can uncheck that box for the next group.

 

Mob -skipping is a different story - personally, I go with whatever the group is doing, but it does seem a bit silly to pass up XP when every point counts.

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The two issues are actually very related.

 

If I've popped for my random to a FP that is way below me level wise (which happens frequently because I usually play a tank or healer), then I have zero incentive to do all of the trash mobs. I have slightly more incentive to do the bonuses as I at least get XP for those. I will be getting no gear, little XP and I'm killing the XP for the other people in the group. That being said I frequently will not accept a way too low level mission if I'm on my tank or heals as I know I can requeue and get in pretty quickly. But if I've waited 20 mins to get a group pop I'm going to take that one, blast through it as quickly as possible to get the random reward and move onto another toon....

 

 

However, I will point out that learning how to skip the trash mobs in the sub 50 regular modes prepares you well for skipping things post 50....

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Yes, a specific kind if skill: navigational awareness.

People wanting to skip mobs is a product of individuals who would rather spend their time in a flashpoint the out questing. I like flashpointsnmire than questing, thus I've run them a million times. The problem is that you learn the quickest way through the dungeon, and sort of wih other people wanted to move as quickly as possible. I don't get mad or anything, but I wish I could just get auto-grouped with other people who also value the technical nature

of a speed run.

I enjoy experiencing his technical element more than what I experience while questing across huge maps.

One preference isn't better than they other.

Thus people need ways to get group with others of same preference with group-finder functionality.

Then no run is faster or slower than what the entire group wants it to be.

 

Ps. I'm not anti-social. I just like options.

Edited by ubermouth
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Players are not at fault for the heavy XP penalty applied to groups with a difference of more than a couple of levels, that rest solely at Bioware's feet. Players simply want to get their daily done, and queue random to do get the daily and GF daily completed together.

 

Queuing random though means a player might get put in an FP they over level by 5 or more levels, resulting in little XP for the player as the mobs are all green (and possibly grey) while also resulting in the other players getting very little due to the heavy penalty lower level players receive when grouped with higher level players.

 

Some solutions include narrowing the bands for each flashpoint (not recommended as wait times already suck) or changing the XP formulas for groups using GF (normalize all XP per player as though each player is killing same level mobs with same level group mates).

 

As for skipping, I skip anything that is annoying or out of the way.

 

Want to kill the champ droids in Cademimu - good luck tanking it yourself or waiting for another.

 

Want to kill X droids in Foundry - no problem, most are killed along the way and the extra ones only take a few moments.

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i never care about the xp penalty. i always ask people if they want a full run and if they want the bonus. same thing if in a HM i see someone undergeared: he has the right to see any drop the instance can provide. just talk..if you are short in time you shouldn't start a fp..
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I wish they included the following toggle options to better match people's preferences:

Skip convos?

Bonus?

Speed run?

Loot instance?: no more battle looting.

 

I don't like trying to convince people to do the run my ways, and I'm sick of people trying to convince me. I don't think it's outside the realm of possibility to attempt to auto-group people of similar preferences.

Just give us more filters in group finder so we don't have to force our preferences on each other

 

give me a Speed run option I m all for that :)))) yea yea if they gave us that id prolly get more HM FP for the daily done faster on my now 6 50's two more inc after this weekend ..maybe one more the last weekend of the 8th ..

Edited by moonshoter
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i never care about the xp penalty. i always ask people if they want a full run and if they want the bonus. same thing if in a HM i see someone undergeared: he has the right to see any drop the instance can provide. just talk..if you are short in time you shouldn't start a fp..

 

I do something the same way unless I'm feeling bad want it done is ... IF I see they are under geared I'll ask them ..

 

or other wise I let them know I will be skipping whatever I can .. and with groups were there geared I don't need to ask we just do it and skip all we can ..

Edited by moonshoter
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to me its not bad behavior at 50 in HM FP and all MMO to date they do it , SWTOR will never be any diff to that degree :) .. but yea when I run anything below that I try to clear it all :) for the xp alone .. I have yet need to any loot per 50 in any game I have played till max level, I don't even bro till max level and only replace here or there .. as needed , unless I see some gear id want at max level that looks cool and is mod able ,,,,, then yea I want that .. in this game .. Edited by moonshoter
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Narrowing the level range eligible for the flashpoint would cause a new problem--only being eligible for 1-2 flashpoints at a time. People already complain about how often they get Flashpoint X. How ugly do you think it would get if the ONLY options were X and Y? There are not enough "leveling" flashpoints for this way to work.

 

If they alter the way xp penalties work, then people can level to 50 while farming trivial content. Maybe that doesn't matter but it just seems wrong. Find most efficient flashpoint, grind to 50. Meh.

 

And what happens when knowledgeable tanks/healers start kicking over-leveled dps to get around this problem?

 

Tough problem to fix.

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I vote against anything that would make the queues longer than they already are. It can be a pain for dps to get to a fp at all.

 

And for mob skipping, if there is no bonus, I'd prefer to skip everything I can. Why? Because I do fps because I want to do something else than killing random enemies that offer me no challenge at all. If I want to do just that, I can just do normal quests. However, if the mobs actually provide some challenge (There's at least 1 at Hammer Station that can cause a wipe, and also a few in red reaper, love fighting those), and I'm more than happy to fight them, but for me, killing everything in the fp is like leveling by running around the planet killing random mobs instead of doing missions.

BUT, if the fp has a bonus, then I'm all in for doing it, because it gives an additional boss, and bosses are the reason I do fps. They are fun to fight.

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i think i'm probably the cause of most of these complaints. especially when at the begining of the run, you specifically ask whether or not you want a speed run, everyone agrees and then half way through they're like "well lets do the bonus".

I was in a group with my sentinal the other day doing Taral V, the time it took for this group to do the run once with all the bonus' we could have done it at least 3 times skipping through things, and have gotten more xp in the same amount of time than they did doing it just once with the bonus. it took almost 1.5 hours to get it done with all the bonus' A good speed run for Taral V is less than 25 mins.

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I am seeing this more and more and I have to say, because of this I am queuing less and less. There are too many people who are queuing for Flashpoints who have far out leveled the thing, and they are just hurting the XP for those of us who are within that level range. These players who are doing this are obviously not going to stop, so the problem in itself needs to be addressed and fixed by Bioware.

 

Furthermore, player pre 50 are skipping mobs and going completely out of their way to avoid having to kill anything in these Flashpoints. They act like they are level 50 and all they want are the comms. This also needs to be addressed and fixed.

 

Players are obviously not going to stop, so it needs to be fixed. I am sick of sitting in a Flashpoint queue for what seems to be an eternity just to get on a team that either has a player way too high for the Flashpoint or getting in with a team that seems to think they need to skip all the mobs. Do players not realize how fast you can level if you take the time to kill the mobs in these things? As long as everyone is within the 3 level range of each toher, the XP is insane, yet people want to skip them.

 

It's getting to a point that I am never queuing for Flashpoints anymore.

 

Dude, don't come to the forums and complain, fix it yourself.

 

Just ask the group if you can kill the mobs for the XP. Mention that it gives a lot.

 

Hell, adverstise the idea of LFG to do flashpoint X and kill all the mobs for the XP on the appropriate level planet. You'll get people to bite and none of them will be overleveled.

 

If that still doesn't work, roll a tank. THAT will definitely work.

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...killing everything in the fp is like leveling by running around the planet killing random mobs instead of doing missions.

BUT, if the fp has a bonus, then I'm all in for doing it, because it gives an additional boss, and bosses are the reason I do fps. They are fun to fight.

 

You hit the nail on the head right there. Most of the XP from doing a FP comes from the reward for the mission for completing the FP itself, bonus missions and the daily terminal mission. Killing anything that can be avoided that isn't needed for the bonus is just a waste of time, you would gain much more by going back to whatever planet you where on and use the time saved to kill mobs while also doing normal missions.

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You hit the nail on the head right there. Most of the XP from doing a FP comes from the reward for the mission for completing the FP itself, bonus missions and the daily terminal mission. Killing anything that can be avoided that isn't needed for the bonus is just a waste of time, you would gain much more by going back to whatever planet you where on and use the time saved to kill mobs while also doing normal missions.

 

I disagree with the above statement. If you've spent any credits on the Bonus XP for FP's, while lvling if you kill the majority of the mobs in FP your going to get more XP than running around a planet killing mobs. If you q at a proper lvl you can bang out about 1/3-1/2 of a lvl with just killing mobs. If you do bonuses and have the daily quest and the quest to complete said FP you can gain almost 1 whole lvl in roughly 30-40 mins. I'm not talking going in and killing every single mob in the instance, but if you kill the ones in your path it's well worth the time spent.

 

Actually I took about a month+ break and just started playing again sunday. Last night I qed for a FP with my 33 Mara. It put me in Cademimu which I over lvl. I wasn't pleased but hey I wanted some PVE. While going down the big elevator the healer jumped and killed himself then rezzed. He said wait im the healer, the tank responded by saying it's ok were skipping all this, we'll be fine pulling the next mob. I then said " I don't care because I over-level this place and im not getting much xp anyways, but what is the reason behind skipping all these mobs while lvling, you need xp. Got a classic response "Just F'n leave". The tank tried to get me to leave the entire FP talking trash telling me i'm a typical mara and I don't understand anyting, im just a noob. Yet I was the only one killing weak to strong.Actually getting yelled at for not attacking his target.He wsn't using guard and if I remember he got his AOE taunt at 29 for a PT which I never saw used once he was lvl 30. I just laughed him of tho, I have all 3 tanks and have cleared all content(except new ilum) on them except on the juggy he's on a different server.

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i never care about the xp penalty. i always ask people if they want a full run and if they want the bonus. same thing if in a HM i see someone undergeared: he has the right to see any drop the instance can provide. just talk..if you are short in time you shouldn't start a fp..

 

My opinion exactly. It is about communication and accepting majority rule. If you want to kill everything and the other three want to skip (or vice versa), you have a choice to either accept their choice and move on or leave the group.

 

Narrowing the level range eligible for the flashpoint would cause a new problem--only being eligible for 1-2 flashpoints at a time. People already complain about how often they get Flashpoint X. How ugly do you think it would get if the ONLY options were X and Y? There are not enough "leveling" flashpoints for this way to work.

 

This is happening already. As you level you never have access to more than three flashpoints through the group finder, and sometimes it is only one (starts off with BT/Essless only, then you get access to Athis, then BT/Ess drops off and you get Hammer station, then you get MR added, but then Athis and HS fall off quickly and Cademimu gets added, etc etc).

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