The deception assasin spec is a worthless tree. Anyone that says its fine, does not play against equally geared players. Our dps sucks. Voltic slash= weak shock=weak maul= stupid, you need to attack a target up 6 times to get exploit weakness to proc. Not to mention being force starved. Scoundrels and ops will kill you in 3 to 4 attacks plus heal themself in combat (ability heal), not to mention criting on average 4.5 to 5.4k. But I guess as others claim the deceptoin tree is fine? Come to Nadd's Sarcophagus and fight Grape , Paralle or Aijaiz. If the spec is as good as you say you should have a pretty equal shot at winning a fight with one of these guys (lol good luck).

QQ much?

I enjoy the spec. I'm guessing you don't. But the good news is BW has allowed us a choice of not only class but specialization as well. Meaning if you don't believe one class or spec is to your liking, you can always try a new spec or re-roll a different class. But thanks for the feedback on your experiences.

Deception isn't very strong but Operative is one of the matchup that is greatly in favor of Assassins in all specs since you still have Force Shroud, which is the Force/Tech killer.

deception is fine, sry you cant beat every class. i know the only time i can beat an op is when they are not on me. they hit us once for 4k and it sucks. but i hit the for 3K 3 times.

 

if you say our dps sucks as decption then im afraid your doing it all wrong. we die easy cus we do so much dmg.

deception is fine, sry you cant beat every class. i know the only time i can beat an op is when they are not on me. they hit us once for 4k and it sucks. but i hit the for 3K 3 times.

 

if you say our dps sucks as decption then im afraid your doing it all wrong. we die easy cus we do so much dmg.

 

We do have good damage, and if played correctly you should be able to keep up and possibly top the damage of any war-zone. However, I do feel there are some spec's that are currently in need of a nerf in damage output.

 

My current deception spec has a lot more survivability along with hitting very hard. How ever I do constantly debate switching to darkness when I see others (Darkness) putting out equivalent damage. I feel though that it could be just because they stay alive longer but put out less damage.

 

To really benefit from deception, get a pocket healer. Ops/Smug basically have their own pocket healer if spec'd right. As for the burst damage of the Ops/Smug, I hear a nerf is in the works for them.

Um, pocket healer isn't a way to make up for your spec sucking. I've seen people push close to 400K damage in Deception with a dedicated healer, except any two good DPS should be able to break 400K combined comfortably so you're coming out with a net negative DPS for the Deception + pocket healer compared to even just 2 random DPS. If a healer is healing a Deception Assassin, they're probably healing the wrong guy and costing their team the game if it's at all close. Deception is roughly average damage + nonexistent survivality, and since healing is weak in this game you can't afford to waste heals on just an average DPS with arguably the worst survivality in the game. You'd be far better off healing say a Marauder in every single case, and even Marauders die pretty often in this game.

Pretty sure Im playing the class right. And if you are doing 400k in a warzone you are in a premade being gaurded with heals or playing against undergeared players. Assasins on average crit for no more than 3.5k, where as scoundrels and ops are hitting for 4.5k to 5.5k on average. I would like to know what servers you guys are on doing all this damage in deception spec.

I play on belgoths beacon.

 

yea we only hit for about 3.5k but we can control when we do it with recklessness. so when you shock for 3.5k then discharge for 3.5k immediately after, thats 7k damage. i pop reck when my target is about 70% cus then i know that they will be in assinate range and that has crited for as high as 4.5k for me on certain classes.

 

the best part is with pvp stalker gear you get 3 charges of reck so you could jus shock, discharge, shock, and assinate and get a kill 9/10 times.

our damage is fine, I once beat down a sorceror whom I was stupid enough to let him get the heal node in void star he got it at 50% pretty much took him to 100 % but our damage is so good I still managed to beat him much to his embarrassment I would assume.

 

nothing wrong with the Deception/ Infilitration build as far as kills go. You may have trouble with some classes but all classes have counter points the problem with deception in pvp is that its never 1 on 1.

 

Deception is a tough break in objective based pvp. it kills people just fine...its surviving thats the problem. Once you break stealth you best kill your target fast and get out of there.

 

For this reason the best way to play this spec is to choose your targets wisely, make use of oppertunity, recognize that you hit like a truck but are made of wet paper towel. In my brief stint into infiltration ( ultimately I found that balance works better in pvp for me ) I survived by taking out weakened targets and healers.

 

voidstar was probably the worse WZ for this spec, and alderaan is probably the best

 

Deception is a tough break in objective based pvp. it kills people just fine...its surviving thats the problem. Once you break stealth you best kill your target fast and get out of there.

 

For this reason the best way to play this spec is to choose your targets wisely, make use of oppertunity, recognize that you hit like a truck but are made of wet paper towel. In my brief stint into infiltration ( ultimately I found that balance works better in pvp for me ) I survived by taking out weakened targets and healers.

 

voidstar was probably the worse WZ for this spec, and alderaan is probably the best

 

 

This!!!

 

Deception is fine as a damage spec if played like it's designed to be played. The damage/output is fine. Darkness and Madness have better survivability so their total damage over the course of an Op is going to be higher. However, their dps output is not quite as high as the deception.

 

If you are losing to a Scoundrel/Op as a deception than you are getting caught in the open and exposed. Your job is to stealth around find a target, kill it, and get out. The biggest issue with so many Deception pvpers is they think they are Knight/Warriors with the ability to stealth. You don't jump into the fray. You take the outskirts and blow someone up and then vanish away.

 

If you want to go toe to toe once visible than go Darkness, Madness, or reroll as a warrior.

Pretty sure Im playing the class right. And if you are doing 400k in a warzone you are in a premade being gaurded with heals or playing against undergeared players. Assasins on average crit for no more than 3.5k, where as scoundrels and ops are hitting for 4.5k to 5.5k on average. I would like to know what servers you guys are on doing all this damage in deception spec.

 

Or you're pulling 600-700k as balance without pocket healer or premade? Try it.

The 'pick your battle' thing is really just an excuse. If you got 5 enemies in the middle of Alderran or 5 guys coming to a door in Voidstar, you don't get to 'pick your battle'. You've to fight those 5 guys and you don't get to leave that battle unless you count dying as a way of disengagement. Note that since the Darkness Assassin is a hard counter to every form of stealth cap tactic (including the mirror match) you can't expect to contribute elsewhere with your stealth either unless you think the enemy has no Darkness Assassin defending their node (he will be stealthed, so he will always have the jump on you because you must unstealth to cap).

Honestly, I understand the OP's point. I believe the issue rests solely on the way armor treats force damage vs physical damage.

 

Deception Assassins don't have a lot of "force" damage abilities; so, if you run up against a player with competent armor, life will get rough.

 

It's not the Dec spec itself, it's just how the game mechanics work.

 

Now, if they change some of the mechanics in 1.2; such as adjusting the way tech and force damage is mitigated by armor, things will get better. However, if Dec Assassins keep trying to take on 2 players at a time or running around like a tank, they will still die quick.

 

I find my spec to be of great use during flashpoints. There are sections we just blow by because I along with another Assassin can deal with objectives without causing a lot of alarm.

 

Constricted Warzones are not a friendly place for squishy toons with our specs. However, large open world areas are great for our spec. We can roam around and choose our targets. We can cc a companion before we burn down a player without worrying too much. If things go wrong we can sprint and cloak.

 

This is not a warzone class. Sucks,

Honestly, I understand the OP's point. I believe the issue rests solely on the way armor treats force damage vs physical damage.

 

Deception Assassins don't have a lot of "force" damage abilities; so, if you run up against a player with competent armor, life will get rough.

 

 

Force damage is generally mitigated by armor. Very few classes have elemental/internal attacks that does significant damage.

Pretty sure Im playing the class right. And if you are doing 400k in a warzone you are in a premade being gaurded with heals or playing against undergeared players. Assasins on average crit for no more than 3.5k, where as scoundrels and ops are hitting for 4.5k to 5.5k on average. I would like to know what servers you guys are on doing all this damage in deception spec.

 

Did 400k damage just the other day on void star, granted it was a half decent team with a healer(only 1 mind you) but it was a total pug, i wasn't guarded and they other team was equally geared.

 

Now if you are in a bad team with zero healing it is somewhat hard to do well but then your whole team generally doesn't do well anyway not just you.

 

The idea that you think you need a premade team with guarded and healed while fighting an under geared team just to pull off some good damage tells me you really are doing something wrong.

The idea that you think you need a premade team with guarded and healed while fighting an under geared team just to pull off some good damage tells me you really are doing something wrong.

 

As usual ppl are missing the point of this discussion its not that you can not make deception tolerable to play in pugs, but Darkness is just so much more reliable compared to deception.

 

And if you do happen to play vs a premade you wont be able to do anything even with your own premade, everytime you pop out to burst you will get taunted, and end up hitting a guarded target, while ppl **** you because you got light armor and no defense.

 

Now if you are in a bad team with zero healing it is somewhat hard to do well but then your whole team generally doesn't do well anyway not just you.

 

This was a game I played some time ago, team I was on was horrible, the one goal we got was by me with no backup etc, not to mention the amount of goals I prevented the enemy team from scoring, we still ended up loosing though.

 

Scoreboard

 

If I had played deception I wouldnt have done the same kind of dmg, been able to prevent as many scores as I did put out protection in the fashion I did. And ye no healer on our team.

 

 

 

Long story short Darkness > Deception, that said deception can be fun, and you can perform okay, but dont kid yourself. You die faster, your burst is to easy to nulify, your utility is a joke, you basicly bring nothing to the team that a darkness sin, or another class cant do.

As usual ppl are missing the point of this discussion its not that you can not make deception tolerable to play in pugs, but Darkness is just so much more reliable compared to deception.

 

And if you do happen to play vs a premade you wont be able to do anything even with your own premade, everytime you pop out to burst you will get taunted, and end up hitting a guarded target, while ppl **** you because you got light armor and no defense.

 

 

 

This was a game I played some time ago, team I was on was horrible, the one goal we got was by me with no backup etc, not to mention the amount of goals I prevented the enemy team from scoring, we still ended up loosing though.

 

Scoreboard

 

If I had played deception I wouldnt have done the same kind of dmg, been able to prevent as many scores as I did put out protection in the fashion I did. And ye no healer on our team.

 

 

 

Long story short Darkness > Deception, that said deception can be fun, and you can perform okay, but dont kid yourself. You die faster, your burst is to easy to nulify, your utility is a joke, you basicly bring nothing to the team that a darkness sin, or another class cant do.

 

So sounds to me that darkness is the problem, it's too powerful, you shouldn't be able to make to the goal line alone, nerf darkness clearly, i still say deception is fine, it's just your are comparing it to a spec that is Over Powered.

Edited March 23, 2012 by deags

Any class that has a speed ability are very powerful in an objective based match. PT AP marauders and sorcs all have the ability to solo a hutball run. These classes are also obnoxious during voidstar as they are the only ones that can jump the gap in engine room.

Deception is crit dependent and yes it seems weak against players who have equal gear.Cracking blast grants you %50 crit damage increase for shock and discharge but it doesnt increase non-crit damage of shock/discharge.I lack only 4 pieces of BM equipment.I used crit/suge mods , enchancements I have %35 crit with buffs. As a class who needs to stack buffs from volcanic slash , 5x buff for discharge even %35 crit is very low.If crackling blast was increasing both crit and noncrit damage of shock and discharge we would perform perfect. %50 damage increase is too op maybe it could be a little bit less like %35-40 but not limited to crits.Recklessness is very useful here by granting you %60 more crit chance but 1m 15 second cooldowd is high I think. It could be around 45-50 seconds as an alternative to crackling blast .

 

For survivalbility issues , I dont think we need any change.We are stealth classes we arent supposed to survive long unstealthed.However you can still use cooldowns like +%50 defence to keep your hp high and restealth.I am using low stash as an interrupt for ranged and as a cc when I have some melee nuking me.

Edited March 23, 2012 by kijthae

Atm deception is unbeatable in 1v1, but we kinda do have problems in a warzone cause of the constant zerg and short spawn time. Pick your targets carefully, and enjoy the game.

Atm deception is unbeatable in 1v1, but we kinda do have problems in a warzone cause of the constant zerg and short spawn time. Pick your targets carefully, and enjoy the game.

 

What are you smoking? You are obviously under level 50 dont fight teams of BM geared people

Atm deception is unbeatable in 1v1, but we kinda do have problems in a warzone cause of the constant zerg and short spawn time. Pick your targets carefully, and enjoy the game.

 

rofl....

 

oh lord you have no clue. any player that picks deception right now hasn't had their face melted by equally geared assn that is darkness.

 

there is absolutely NO WAY for deception to win against a darkness assn right now.

 

 

darkness is a fantastic tree and unattended you can wreck even more havok then deception can.

there is absolutely NO WAY for deception to win against a darkness assn right now.

 

Not true. I for one can beat a equally equipped darkness. It's not easy, but it's doable.

 

I agree darkness is stronger right now, but deception isn't the useless crap people think.

Atm deception is unbeatable in 1v1, but we kinda do have problems in a warzone cause of the constant zerg and short spawn time. Pick your targets carefully, and enjoy the game.

 

LOL. You are most welcome to try my shadow as balance, I even give you opener from stealth while I stay unstealthed, if you take me under 60% hp before you die, you get a pro tag on your deception sin as well.