George Lucas has said the Dark Side of the Force is more powerful in the commentaries for the movies. That is why Obi-wan was able to kill Darth Maul, because Obi-Wan tapped the Dark Side in order to jump up and kill Darth Maul...(Or wound aka Clone Wars Return to be). The Dark Side is always more powerful, that is why it's so tempting. Yoda was a weak-minded fool. Yoda is severely over rated, and he got the beating he deserved by Emperor Palpatine.

"Execute Order 66"

Austin-

TK-1649 (501st Legion, Mountain Garrsion)

Athazoth-

Sith Marauder lvl 10 (Guild: Dark Prophesy, Server: Space Slug)

Yoda could still be more powerful than Sidious and still lose. Sidious could be the better strategist and most likely have no problem to play dirty.

I just don't think Yoda would do everything possible to kill Sidious, he was going to do it the Jedi way or not at all.

Just because someone wins doesn't mean they are stronger or more powerful.

e.g Odysseus Vs Polpyphemos

Yoda could still be more powerful than Sidious and still lose. Sidious could be the better strategist and most likely have no problem to play dirty.

I just don't think Yoda would do everything possible to kill Sidious, he was going to do it the Jedi way or not at all.

 

Just because someone wins doesn't mean they are stronger or more powerful.

e.g Odysseus Vs Polpyphemos

Yoda wasn't as powerful as Sidious. Leland Chee said so. Yoda WAS there to destroy Sidious. He pretty much told Obi Wan he was going to have to kill Anakin. He was fighting to kill at that point.

As to the other poster.. Jedi are allowed to get angry but they're not allowed to be controlled by it or act out in anger. You can be angry that someone stole your car but the proper method is to call the police. Finding the perpetrator and beating him to living hell or killing him isn't the proper course of action.

In Star Wars terms the Jedi would control their anger and arrest the guy for his actions. A Sith would find the thief and murder him. Also note force users are more susceptible to both the light and the dark. Their actions hold greater consequences.

Yoda wasn't as powerful as Sidious. Leland Chee said so. Yoda WAS there to destroy Sidious. He pretty much told Obi Wan he was going to have to kill Anakin. He was fighting to kill at that point.

My argument was more about the posters that state because Sidious won the duel between him and Yoda, he therefore is automatically the more powerful one. Which doesn't have to be the case.

Also i didn't say Yoda wasn't going/planning to kill Sidious, i was suggesting that it would be harder for Yoda to kill Sidious the jedi way without tapping to much into the dark side.

I think most of you need to re-watch the fight between Yoda and Sidious. It looks very 50/50 to me. Yoda matches a lot of Sidious's attacks, even when Sidious uses his force lightning near the end Yoda was able to hold him off !!

Which most likely drained him a lot and therefore retreating from the fight. I'm sure at this point of the fight, if Sidious could of escaped, he would of done. (he actually did try to avoid fighting with Yoda at the start)

But you can clearly see that both of them are struggling against each other during the fight.

Yoda Vs Sidious - Eps III

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MFEjcvIRMDo&feature=fvwrel

Isn't Nihilus even more powerful?

... Should I answer?

My argument was more about the posters that state because Sidious won the duel between him and Yoda, he therefore is automatically the more powerful one. Which doesn't have to be the case.

 

Also i didn't say Yoda wasn't going/planning to kill Sidious, i was suggesting that it would be harder for Yoda to kill Sidious the jedi way without tapping to much into the dark side.

 

 

I think most of you need to re-watch the fight between Yoda and Sidious. It looks very 50/50 to me. Yoda matches a lot of Sidious's attacks, even when Sidious uses his force lightning near the end Yoda was able to hold him off !!

Which most likely drained him a lot and therefore retreating from the fight. I'm sure at this point of the fight, if Sidious could of escaped, he would of done. (he actually did try to avoid fighting with Yoda at the start)

 

But you can clearly see that both of them are struggling against each other during the fight.

 

Yoda Vs Sidious - Eps III

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MFEjcvIRMDo&feature=fvwrel

I think you think, that we think(Lot of thinks in this sentence, you think?) that Sidious outmatches Yoda in power by allot. Sidious is stronger only by a small hair. Even the novel states Yoda almost won. Sidious was just.. stronger by a little and thats why he had victory.

I think you think, that we think(Lot of thinks in this sentence, you think?) that Sidious outmatches Yoda in power by allot. Sidious is stronger only by a small hair. Even the novel states Yoda almost won. Sidious was just.. stronger by a little and thats why he had victory.

Yoda hadnt any chance at all to win, he knew and he didnt want to die because he knew he must wait till the oportunity, Luke, come. So even if you say it was a little difference, no chance at all makes for me a big difference.

Why you always say Luke is the strongest one? He was smart and very powerful but without Anakin aka DV he would had died.

Yoda hadnt any chance at all to win, he knew and he didnt want to die because he knew he must wait till the oportunity, Luke, come. So even if you say it was a little difference, no chance at all makes for me a big difference.

 

Why you always say Luke is the strongest one? He was smart and very powerful but without Anakin aka DV he would had died.

After The Movies, read the books son! And if you don't read the books, read his Wookieepedia page. His abilities are tremendous. He created Blackholes!

After The Movies, read the books son! And if you don't read the books, read his Wookieepedia page. His abilities are tremendous. He created Blackholes!

Have to agree. Having read everything up to 'Fate' (haven't started that yet) I must say that some of the things he pulled of are unbelievable

Neither is more powerful, at least if we should trust what've been displayed. In the final part of the confrontation, Yoda overcame Sidious full power, eventhough it clearly was to much for him. Just as he was about to break, he focused and stared back into the sithlord's eye, overcame all odds, and interrupted his attack, causing a huge explosion. Yoda was very small, therefore he was pushed back further than Sidious, and fell down. Sidious didn't defeat him.

Yoda was a master of the light side, Sidious of the dark side, thus none of them could have any hope to succeed in killing the other one. They were equals.

Just to add some fuel to the discussion, here's part of the Matthew Stover novelization of Revenge of the Sith (which, btw, is a great read and makes Anakin's character more logical and interesting).

There came a turning point in the clash of the light against the dark.

 

It did not come from a flash of lightning or slash of energy blade, though there were these in plenty; it did not come from a flying kick or a surgically precise punch, though these were traded, too.

 

It came as the battle shifted from the holding office to the great Chancellor's Podium; it came as the hydraulic lift beneath the Podium raised it on its tower of durasteel a hundred meters and more, so that it became a laserpoint of battle flaring at the focus of the vast emptiness of the Senate Arena; it came as the Force and the podium's controls ripped delegation pods free of the curving walls and made of them hammers, battering rams, catapult stones crashing and crushing against each other in a rolling thunder-roar that echoed the Senate's cheers for the galaxy's new Emperor.

 

It came when the avatar of light resolved into the lineage of the Jedi; when the lineage of the Jedi refined into one single Jedi.

 

It came when Yoda found himself alone against the dark.

 

In that lightning-speared tornado of feet and fists and blades and bashing machines, his vision finally pierced the darkness that had clouded the Force.

 

Finally, he saw the truth.

 

This truth: that he, the avatar of light, Supreme Master of the Jedi Order, the fiercest, most implacable, most devastatingly powerful foe the darkness had ever known...

 

just--

 

didn't--

 

have it.

 

He'd never had it. He had lost before he started.

 

He had lost before he was born.

 

The Sith had changed. The Sith had grown, had adapted, had invested a thousand years' intensive study into every aspect of not only the Force but Jedi lore itself, in preparation for exactly this day. The Sith had remade themselves.

 

They had become new.

 

While the Jedi--

 

The Jedi had spent that same millennium training to refight the last war.

 

The new Sith could not be destroyed with a lightsaber; they could not be burned away by any torch of the Force. The brighter the light, the darker their shadow. How could one win a war against the dark, when the war itself had become the dark's own weapon?

 

He knew, at that instant, that this insight held the hope of the galaxy. But if he fell here, that hope would die with him.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=inTbUf5Swfc

If you actually watch it Sidious didn't even "win." Yoda dropped his lightsaber, and fought to a standstill on the lightning attack at the end blowing them both back except Yoda didn't have anywhere to go but a long fall. After that he realised he didn't have the time to defeat Sidious. At the begining of the fight Sidious tries to run away.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=inTbUf5Swfc

 

If you actually watch it Sidious didn't even "win." Yoda dropped his lightsaber, and fought to a standstill on the lightning attack at the end blowing them both back except Yoda didn't have anywhere to go but a long fall. After that he realised he didn't have the time to defeat Sidious. At the begining of the fight Sidious tries to run away.

Sidious disarmed Yoda with his powerful lightning. That wasn't a drop your lightsaber move.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=inTbUf5Swfc

 

If you actually watch it Sidious didn't even "win." Yoda dropped his lightsaber, and fought to a standstill on the lightning attack at the end blowing them both back except Yoda didn't have anywhere to go but a long fall. After that he realised he didn't have the time to defeat Sidious. At the begining of the fight Sidious tries to run away.

Incorrect. Sidious won. Leland Chee said so and various quotes have said as much. Yoda's lightsaber fell out of his hand from Sidious lightning. Sidious still had his lightsaber. Yes Yoda couldabsorb and knock them both back but Sidious could have then engaged an unarmed opponent in saber combat. Not to mention we don't know how much of Yoda's "energy" it took to do that. We do know from what we've seen Sidious wasn't even taking Yoda seriously.

what I don't understand is why are focrce users so mentally unstable? a normal person can use anger and emotion for resolve without becoming a psychopathic killer in the process

I think the term 'force-sensitive' is pretty literal. You can't just use the Force, you're sensitive to the Force. If there's currents and eddies of Force energy all over the place, and you can feel them, you can get swept away if you don't stay focussed.

Anyone else curious about how on the Darth Plaeguis Summary on the back of the book states him being the most powerful Sith Lord ever?

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Star_Wars:_Darth_Plagueis

Anyone else curious about how on the Darth Plaeguis Summary on the back of the book states him being the most powerful Sith Lord ever?

 

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Star_Wars:_Darth_Plagueis

"Plagueis was the most powerful Sith Lord who ever lived. But could he be the only one who never died?"

The wording implies that it's taken during the time of the book. We'll have to see when we read but during his time and during the time he was teaching Sidious. He was indeed the most powerful Sith. Interesting enough it hints to the possibility that he doesn't die. If that's the case he could truly secretly be the most powerful but it begs the question if this is true.. where has he been?

"Plagueis was the most powerful Sith Lord who ever lived. But could he be the only one who never died?"

 

The wording implies that it's taken during the time of the book. We'll have to see when we read but during his time and during the time he was teaching Sidious. He was indeed the most powerful Sith. Interesting enough it hints to the possibility that he doesn't die. If that's the case he could truly secretly be the most powerful but it begs the question if this is true.. where has he been?

I know, this is what I wonder as well. Maybe Plaguis pulled a Qui-Gon and was a guide for Sidious on becoming immortal/That essence stuff.

That would actually make sense. I doubt Plagueis, who seeked immortality, would teach Sidious about the secrets of Plagueis's immortality, so maybe he did when he was dead/spirit?

And, that quote also interests me because, I feel as though there is someone else involved. Not just Sidious. It also shows Darth Maul on the back cover... I don't know Maul never seemed to bright to me to become immortal.

Curious. I'm tired, probably everything I just said would violate canon, maybe it won't. How many licks does it take to get to the center of the Star Wars? The World May never Know.

Qui gon jinn is the most powerful jedi... he was the first to split his spirit into an apparition (in canon starwars), and taught Yoda and Obi-wan how to do it also

http://www.starwars.com/explore/encyclopedia/characters/quigonjinn/#!/media

http://www.starwars.com/explore/encyclopedia/characters/quigonjinn/#!/media

Qui gon even through death attempted to intervene with Anakins slaughter of the sand people in revenge of his mothers death

2:51 ^

Yoda also never permitted Qui Gon on to the jedi counsel purely out of spite towards Qui gons superiority and defiance to the jedi code, but qui gon knew better then to think strictly to a set of ideals that had been thought out

Qui gon: feel, dont think, use you instincts

Yoda after recieving Quigons teaching:

Yoda to luke: You must feelthe force around you

You have to face it.. Qui Gon was completely underrated and some even argue that if it was he that survived the fight with Darth Maul and trained Anakin, Anakin would have never fell to the darkside

the main argument anyone would bring up is why would he die if hes so powerful.. well thats just it, ever wonder why Qui gon entered a meditative state while he waited for the shield generators to drop? because he could see through the shroud of the darkside and knew he was going to be slain, preparing his body to reach the apparition form he trained himself to take after death. its funny that Obi Wan also did the same thing when being struck down by Vader in the 4th movie almost as if to pass the torch to Luke who would ultimately destroy what remained of the sith..

there was a thread I read on these forums about what if Obi Wan beat Vader or tried to fight him in stead of sacrificing himself.. I think at that point of his training Obi Wan could also see the outcomes of his decisions and with him sacrificing himself he ultimately gave strength to his apprentice to defeat his father and sidious.. like wise one can only conclude that is also was an outcome of Qui Gons intuition... its so poetic and possible it has to be true, which begs the question why is it that a noble sacrifice happens at the beginning of each trilogy? well watch the end of ROTJ to find out.. the good guys win just as Qui Gon in his power intended it to end

Qui gon should be on everyones list as rank number 1

heres a video assisting my belief, and the beliefs of many others:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2OHdHKEr5A

Immortality and Power are not the same.

And do you forget he *lost* to Darth Maul.

Qui-Gon, cool dude. Nowhere near Luke.

 

And do you forget he *lost* to Darth Maul.

 

you read 1 paragraph of my post

Now, I heard multiple times from multiple posters on the old forums(Pre-Wipe) that Yoda was the most powerful Force User Until Skywalker stated by GL or LucasArts. Every time I asked for evidence.. I was either ignored, passed by or whatever. The reason I asked for Evidence was because in my opinion and my evidence of Episode 3, that Sidious was a more powerful Force User than Yoda.

 

In Episode 3, though it was an extremely close fight, Sidious defeated Yoda. That is canon. I mean was Yoda no longer in his prime during this time? Or is the statement of Yoda being the most powerful Force User before Luke not true and it is myth?

 

 

 

Because how I see my List.

 

1. Luke Skywalker

2. Abeloth(Here is a difficult decision. Until I see Abeloth do something that can truly defeat or surpass Luke, I am putting her under Luke)

3. Sidious

4. Yoda

 

 

 

Help?!?

Luke is not the most powerful. He isn't as powerful as Vader....

"Who is more powerful than Darth Vader?" "Some will be drawn to Luke because he is the good guy, but we all know Vader is far more powerful than he is." "It becomes obvious that he is because he, (Vader) is the ultimate Father, who is all powerful." -George Lucas.

Luke is not the most powerful. He isn't as powerful as Vader....

 

 

"Who is more powerful than Darth Vader?" "Some will be drawn to Luke because he is the good guy, but we all know Vader is far more powerful than he is." "It becomes obvious that he is because he, (Vader) is the ultimate Father, who is all powerful." -George Lucas.

Luke later becomes FAR more powerful than Vader. Check Post ROTJ books.