To be totally fair, Unremitting/Unstoppable makes them especially helpless against Vigilance/Vengeance. Even more helpless than against other melee classes. And they have no defensive cooldown to negate the Master Strike/Ravage that surely follows immediately.

 

Due to the overabundance of Smashers, most Mercenaries now use knockback or stun immediately when they see a leaper - can't blame them but it's a death sentence against Vigilance.

 

I wouldn't do that against Venegance because the animation of Unstoppable is clearly visible but Vigilance is a bit more confusing because those aura animations of jedi sentinels looks pretty the same to me. I agree that we lack defensive cooldowns. The shield is simply not enough. Jet boost is useles on flat ground. Concussion missle is useless due to long cast time and interruptibility (really not worth spending the instant cooldown on this skill). Electro dart not too much of a use due to 10m nerf. Rocket puch is 4 secs which gives you enough time to get away, but that is about it.

 

All this just shows how unexperienced BW is with MMOS and especially PvP balancing melee vs. ranged. As an example I would set WoW and all the skills mages and hunters got there to keep melees at bay. Mercs cannot even compare to that with the lack of skills and many of useless skill you still have at lvl 50 which you don't even get to your skillbar.

I wouldn't do that against Venegance because the animation of Unstoppable is clearly visible but Vigilance is a bit more confusing because those aura animations of jedi sentinels looks pretty the same to me. I agree that we lack defensive cooldowns. The shield is simply not enough. Jet boost is useles on flat ground. Concussion missle is useless due to long cast time and interruptibility (really not worth spending the instant cooldown on this skill). Electro dart not too much of a use due to 10m nerf. Rocket puch is 4 secs which gives you enough time to get away, but that is about it.

 

All this just shows how unexperienced BW is with MMOS and especially PvP balancing melee vs. ranged. As an example I would set WoW and all the skills mages and hunters got there to keep melees at bay. Mercs cannot even compare to that with the lack of skills and many of useless skill you still have at lvl 50 which you don't even get to your skillbar.

 

You have a better use for Tech override than instant concussion round? I love it personally. Sad that its the only way our mez has any real use in PVP.

You have a better use for Tech override than instant concussion round? I love it personally. Sad that its the only way our mez has any real use in PVP.

 

I use it paired with Healing scan when in trouble or Fusion missle as an opener. No use do it with Concussion missle when any damage just breaks the effect or affected player just uses his CC breaker. Not to mention you have to choose between Electro dart or Jet boost afterwards because it fills the targets resolve bar to full on the second CC which is quite bad when fighting a melee.

Edited January 29, 2013 by Buzna

I use it paired with Healing scan when in trouble or Fusion missle as an opener. No use do it with Concussion missle when any damage just breaks the effect or affected player just uses his CC breaker. Not to mention you have to choose between Electro dart or Jet boost afterwards because it fills the targets resolve bar to full on the second CC which is quite bad when fighting a melee.

 

Instant Concussion Round > Start healing. Preferably right in front of them. Works wonders, and you just know they're seething as you sit there and heal yourself back up to full. Best used after you know they've used their trinket of course.

 

In the zerg there's definitely an argument for TO > Medical Probe. Possibly followed by an Advanced Medical Probe if you're gunnery and have 5 stacks of charged barrel you didn't want to use hurting someone. Also nice to get off an instant grav round.

 

Honestly, using it to insta cast plasma grenade is about the worst use I can think of it. That ability is too good as an interrupt baiter.

remove interrupt on movement while casting, i.e. casting while moving, and adjust damage accordingly. also, change PS to elemental and adjust damage.

 

having played a couple games where you are not limited to standing still while casting evens the playing field, SIGNIFICANTLY!

 

add a root and improve defensive CD, problem solved.

 

a couple simple fixes, fixes the Merc class.

 

Tech override for concussion missile or fusion missile (the latter with the zero-cost cd as well) is essential in PvP. Getting fusion missile off instantly and at zero resource cost is very important for 1v1 encounters, because you know you're against a mediochre or depleted mdps if they let you stand there and cast it the whole time (the animation for fusion missile is very obvious, on both mirror ACs). Still, considering the ammo cost and cooldown time, it's a little miserly that there's also a long stationary cast time as well. Same with concussion missile - getting concussion missile off in a WZ is sometimes next to impossible due to LoS, interrupts and knockbacks. Many times I've tried 3, 4, 5 times to fire it over a short time before giving up. Considering that it's our only mezz, and a single target one at that, you'd think they'd throw us a bone.

 

Tech override is on a loooong cooldown. Add a proc'd reset or shorter cd to the list of "quality of life" PvP tweaks in the absence of a wholesale overhaul of the class design.

I really hope that Tech Override is one of the first quality of life changed which come to Commando/Mercenary.

 

It's such a small change that I think would make a huge difference for the AC as a whole. I think the cooldown should be on the range of 20-30 seconds. I know as a healer, if there is a single ability on my toolbar I wish I could use more regularly, it would be Tech Override. You can use it to heal (MP/AMP), CC (Concussive Round, especially for you silly smashers that break out of my Cyro Grenades), and break up caps (Plasma Grenade). Unfortunately it doesn't work on Emergency Medical Probe (the in combat revive), but it would be a solid first step.

Edited January 29, 2013 by SpaniardInfinity

DPS is not a problem with mercs.

DPS is not a problem with mercs.

 

LOL!!! EL OH EL!!!

 

like i just got done discussing in another post, torparse, my testing, and every other bit of information i have gathered proves otherwise.

 

how can you PROVE your statement?

 

i can sure prove mine [that Merc DPS is NOT fine], and have.

DPS is not a problem with mercs.

 

Broken a million damage in a warzone yet have you?

Broken a million damage in a warzone yet have you?

 

Twice. but im not proud of it totally due to 3 good healers on both sides. I average about 300k damage per round but good games go up too 450 - 500k. DPS has never been our problem, we have too many cast, just cant move about a lot.

yeah, im going to agree that DPS output is not our issue.

 

its the ability to maintain that DPS output that is the problem.

Twice. but im not proud of it totally due to 3 good healers on both sides. I average about 300k damage per round but good games go up too 450 - 500k. DPS has never been our problem, we have too many cast, just cant move about a lot.

 

Fantastic, I look forward to a screenshot. If true, that may well make you the highest damage Merc in the entire game. Given that all the screenshots you post point to 'good but not spectacular pvp DPS for a merc' (700 or so), put me in the 'doubting thomas' camp.

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=5791323#post5791323

 

Heh.

 

Now go check out the PvP records thread and see what real DPS can do.

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=572972

 

Obviously dominated by Juggs, Maras, PTs and Sins (or their mirrors). I used to believe we did pretty good damage - heck, I'm no slouch - but I'm now convinced that there isn't a merc/mando playing who can do that kind of damage.

Edited January 29, 2013 by Jherad

yeah, im going to agree that DPS output is not our issue.

 

its the ability to maintain that DPS output that is the problem.

 

semantics, brotha.

 

even in ideal situations, where the class can maximize it DPS potential, Merc is still roughly 10% less that it's PT/VG counterpart. and even lesser than Snipers and Marauders.

 

plug in the fact that for a Merc and ideal situations is allowing them to cast unmolested, that scenario is quite rarer.

 

which is why you see so few top damage SS's of Mercs and even fewer top parses in PvE from Mercs.

 

proof is in the pudding...dps is NOT fine.

Fantastic, I look forward to a screenshot. If true, that may well make you the highest damage Merc in the entire game. Given that all the screenshots you post point to 'good but not spectacular pvp DPS for a merc' (700 or so), put me in the 'doubting thomas' camp.

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=5791323#post5791323

 

Heh.

 

Now go check out the PvP records thread and see what real DPS can do.

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=572972

 

Obviously dominated by Juggs, Maras, PTs and Sins (or their mirrors).

 

this guy gets it

Fantastic, I look forward to a screenshot. If true, that may well make you the highest damage Merc in the entire game. Given that all the screenshots you post point to 'good but not spectacular pvp DPS for a merc' (700 or so), put me in the 'doubting thomas' camp.

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=5791323#post5791323

 

Heh.

 

Now go check out the PvP records thread and see what real DPS can do.

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=572972

 

Obviously dominated by Juggs, Maras, PTs and Sins (or their mirrors). I used to believe we did pretty good damage - heck, I'm no slouch - but I'm now convinced that there isn't a merc/mando playing who can do that kind of damage.

 

its coz i havent loaded them up onto the net, its because like i said it was teams of healers, everyone had high numbers and its not worth bragging about.

 

What i do get excited about is games with 40 kills no deaths and 400k + damage because thats proving something imo.. but i will load those SS for you after work.

 

And i have seen bigger DPS scores on merc than mine FYI

its coz i havent loaded them up onto the net, its because like i said it was teams of healers, everyone had high numbers and its not worth bragging about.

 

What i do get excited about is games with 40 kills no deaths and 400k + damage because thats proving something imo.. but i will load those SS for you after work.

 

And i have seen bigger DPS scores on merc than mine FYI

 

I'm uploading a video now from the other night where I broke 900 dps (It looks like about 460k damage over a warzone a little over 8 mins long). Its still a looooong way from coming anywhere close to the output of the real DPS classes.

 

Which is my point. There are some of the top mercs posting here. You, me, ArchangelLBC, Cash, Skillex (is back I think), Phaser and many more. We represent a wealth of experience, and have beaten the odds in more ways than one. And our damage output is *pitiful* in comparison to the top players from other classes. Forget 900-1000 dps in a warzone. Try 1700. Forget a million damage, try 1.5 million.

Edited January 29, 2013 by Jherad

its coz i havent loaded them up onto the net, its because like i said it was teams of healers, everyone had high numbers and its not worth bragging about.

 

What i do get excited about is games with 40 kills no deaths and 400k + damage because thats proving something imo.. but i will load those SS for you after work.

 

And i have seen bigger DPS scores on merc than mine FYI

 

this guy has the right idea.

 

that stupid "utlimate records" thread makes me laugh. ive hit 800k once on my Merc and it was ages ago, pre-WH iirc. that entire thread is farms against crappy players.

 

want to know how to get 1mil+ damage? the other team needs 3+ healers, and you need everyone on your team to NOT shoot them.

 

if your team actually focuses healers, youre never going to put up 1mil damage.

if your team accomplishes objectives efficiently and ends the warzone quickly, youre never going to put up 1mil damage.

 

damage farm WZs are not impressive. i dont understand why people use them as some kind of benchmark, as the circumstances required to reproduce those kinds of stats is far more dependent on the composition of the other team.

 

here is the highest damage screenshot: http://i.imgur.com/V67N0.jpg

>3million healing on the opposing team, and the top healer never died. 1.65 MILLION damage and 30 kills. that is 55,000 damage for every kill. what an impressive show of offensive prowess:rolleyes:

 

the faster you kill things the worse your DPS will be, as you are losing uptime against your targets. how often do you go an entire warzone engaged in combat start to finish? probably never. you die, your opponents die, they run away, etc. something breaks combat. and in that time, your DPS for the entire warzone is falling like a rock b/c you are doing no damage.

Edited January 30, 2013 by cashogy_reborn

I get your point, I really do. And yes, those staged warzones aren't 'real pvp'.

 

But you know what? There's nobody here *capable* of that, staged or not (I'm talking about class mechanics here, not talent). If there were, you'd see examples of it, if only for fun.

 

Heck, I know people on my server who break a million+, and they're not messing around.

Edited January 30, 2013 by Jherad

I've only read the first and last 2 pages. I used to think that Commando/Merc damage was fine, I no longer do. I have several reasons for my feelings. One, I have both a vanguard and commando (and merc) at 50. My commando and vanguard share a fully augmented set of WH/EWH gear using legacy armor as a normalizer. I consistently do in the neighborhood of 100k more damage on my vanguard than I do on my commando. On top of the damage I've got taunts and an aoe stun. I typically do 150-200k more on my guardian (lol smash). My second source is the ranked parses on torparse.com. Commandos and to a slightly lesser extent mercs are severly under represented in the rankings. There are only a couple of commandos ranked in with the gs/snipers, marauders/sents, pts/vgs. Its pretty eye opening to see the lack of mercs and commandos ranked there.

What about you stop playing arsenal and play pyro ?

 

If BW buffs arsenal the way most ppl want we gonna have a new FOTM for sure =). Arsenal is only good if you are being ignored deal with it, if you want that changed ie immunity to interrupts more roots etc, then there should be a damage nerf to account for the survivability increase. All that needs to be fixed is to add a on demand root on the pyro tree, maybe a root + gap maker like a jetpack burst that paralizes the target and sends you flying over him landing 20m over his back. But imo that should only be accessible on the pyro tree, not arsenal.

 

Why would there need to be a damage reduction if mercs/commandos received interrupt immunity?

 

A sniper/gunslinger left alone and allowed to free cast will do quite a bit more damage than a commando or a merc under the same circumstances and they do have the interrupt immunity, along with more ranged options than either, and still provides more team support.

This is what i look for in a WZ and i think these are what people are talking about. http://i.imgur.com/KwrWJKK.jpg

Its Top DPS in a VS, the round only went for just over half a round, Ive got top DPS by 100k no probs there but also NO deaths. we have 1 healer on our team they have 2 but not what i call huge numbers.

 

In the round ive out DPSed 2 Pyros on our team on what is a map thats made for Melee IMO.

 

The class isnt broken by any means it just needs a few tweaks.

In the round ive out DPSed 2 Pyros on our team on what is a map thats made for Melee IMO..

 

Do you want to know why?

 

Because they were AFK, in recruit gear, or bad. I have a whole heap of videos starring baddies. Search youtube, baddies are everywhere. That does not a balanced class make.

MY RL friend started playing a week or two ago. He asked about various classes and he came to a decision to play a PT. Being somewhat new to the game, he would sometimes complain to me that his toon sucked. Last nite he stopped by my house and logged on his toon.

 

I spent 2 minutes and remapped:

Rapid Shot

Flame Burst

Rail Shot

Thermal Detonator

Rocket Punch

Electro Dart

 

Those were the only abilities on my toolbar. Having never played for a single second as a PT I joined a 10-49 WZ as lvl 40 I believe. I got 2nd place overall damage.

 

It reminded me of the first time I switched my PvP Mara Alt to Rage spec. The more I played, the more pis*sed off I got because of how simple it was to own anyone.

Edited January 30, 2013 by DarthBloodloss

Do you want to know why?

 

Because they were AFK, in recruit gear, or bad. I have a whole heap of videos starring baddies. Search youtube, baddies are everywhere. That does not a balanced class make.

 

Nope 1 of them(Madalyn) is a guild mate, full time PVPer and a great player all round, the second person in SS is a great player also.

 

One thing i do get sick of is people picking out a SS and coming up with excuses after they have been proved wrong. I personally go out there every game and have a great game. Im going to start using FRAP's soon and then maybe some of you others can see what your doing wrong.