Another GS/Sniper can counter well if they're skilled.

 

Exactly, Marksman/Sharpshooter specs are especially easy to takeout as a DF, Generally I'll make them my first priority as they can be fairly nasty if left unattended.

 

Additionally, I just enjoy the interplay with other Snipers/Gunslingers and seeing how they play.

I heard Gunslingers are supposed to be a hard counter to melee classes.....

 

Where did this come from? I'd figure range would be their advantage, and they should be disadvantaged vs melee. But hey, maybe they are indeed supposed to be the counter to melee.

 

But are they not also the counter to ranged classes? Cover protects against ranged fire.

 

 

I'm honestly missing what is supposed to counter Gunslingers. Powertechs used to be able to stun and grapple then down off a catwalk (if they get that rare window where they aren't Hunker'd Down immune to CC for 20 sec on a 1 min cooldown, or white bar resolve)..... but the change to the stun distance really removed that.

 

It doesn't seem like you could win a shooting war with one, because of the advantage of Cover.

 

And, they seem to melee better than melee classes, with Orbital Strike and AoE Fire cast directly on top of themselves, cluster bombs, Hunker Down, big knockback with roots, stun knife, leg shooting, flashbangs, etc.

 

I'm really at a loss on what counters this class. Would love to hear some discussion on this.

 

 

IN BEFORE - Random Trolling

 

IN BEFORE - Some poster says "just run away and LoS them"

 

IN BEFORE - Nerf Smash posts

 

IN BEFORE - The comics of the Gunslinger at Voidstar/NC gets linked

 

IN BEFORE - Hero posters write "I eat Gunslingers and Snipers for breakfast, I don't know what your problem is"

 

Stealth classes and ranged dot classes. Also, rage/focus warriors/knights can leap to them.

As a sniper being my main basiaclly if they see you first you are done, you have to knock them out of cover and cc them. Dps powertechs, dps assasians, and dps sorcerers can manage against them. the big thing is to cc them after knocking them out of cover and using interupts. It is best to come at them from behind. If they are marksmanship it is nearly immpossible to win without using cc's because they are in god mode while in cover. Leathiality can manage without cover but you can beat them while in cover too. Edited December 11, 2012 by hunterthesloth

assassins

concealment operatives

Stealth, and especially a tank assassin. Any half decent one will always kill a sniper/gunslinger, even if the sniper is really good.

 

idk i mean using leg shot, cover pulse, disabilitate, and flash bang can make up for the damage they did to the sniper while cc'ed

Engineering Sniper is probably one of the best 1v1 specs in the game provided you can maintain LoS.

 

I think that's intended. But Snipers are for area denial, and wouldn't usually be engaging in many 1v1 situations provided you are playing the warzone objectively. They're going to be incredibly powerful if you try to just stand there and facetank them in the area that they specifically denied.

 

If you LoS them then they have a few choices:

- Leave cover and try to chase you down

- Stay there and pick a different target

- Stay there and die to your DoTs. With effectively no self-healing we are susceptible to Madness Sorcs dotting up and LoSing.

 

A Sniper without cover is a sitting duck. A Sniper who is out of cover is even weaker than an Arsenal Mercenary, believe it or not. As an Engineer Sniper I try to be mobile whenever possible (means leaving cover), but if I make a mistake and misjudge the leap cooldowns and/or locations of an enemy SW/JK then more than likely I'll be dead in a few seconds after they get the leap on me.

 

So yes, stealthers and people with a brain are very good against Snipers but that's not the point - the Sniper's main job is to deny areas to the enemy team either through AoEs or threat of direct attack.

 

P.S. Even though Assassins are great against Snipers I find that you can simply hunker down after the initial stun, drop an Orbital Strike on your own location once they pop Force Shroud to force a stalemate, either they stand there and take massive damage or decide to break off the engagement and wait till your cooldowns are not available.

Edited December 11, 2012 by Jenzali

its always bothered me how snipers/slingers, or any ranged class for that matter, auto-turn when you get behind them. I play a sniper and benefit from this but it really does take an important skill aspect out of playing a ranged class to have them do this. I played rogue in wow would position myself behind many a caster and move with them as they would try to turn and face me. In this game ranged classes auto turn. It's kinda ez mode. Like I said I benefit from this as well on my sniper it just seems kinda silly that I can take a sip of my soda with my mouse hand while I have a melee on me regardless of their position.

its always bothered me how snipers/slingers, or any ranged class for that matter, auto-turn when you get behind them. I play a sniper and benefit from this but it really does take an important skill aspect out of playing a ranged class to have them do this. I played rogue in wow would position myself behind many a caster and move with them as they would try to turn and face me. In this game ranged classes auto turn. It's kinda ez mode. Like I said I benefit from this as well on my sniper it just seems kinda silly that I can take a sip of my soda with my mouse hand while I have a melee on me regardless of their position.

 

Cover and snipers would be pretty damn useless if they had to leave and re-enter cover just because a melee got behind them.

Cover and snipers would be pretty damn useless if they had to leave and re-enter cover just because a melee got behind them.

 

lol especially with the spassers that try to run back and forth. (I know because I do that on my scrapper. Can always spot a terrible Marauder that way. Lucky for them, there is smash)

Cover and snipers would be pretty damn useless if they had to leave and re-enter cover just because a melee got behind them.

 

clearly I don't mean that you could have to leave cover. Have you played any other mmo's ranged classes? You would just have to turn your character around while they stayed stationary and in cover. Like I said, I benefit from it, it's just ez mode.

lol especially with the spassers that try to run back and forth. (I know because I do that on my scrapper. Can always spot a terrible Marauder that way. Lucky for them, there is smash)

 

exactly! melee classes have to turn and face you but ranged classes don't.

exactly! melee classes have to turn and face you but ranged classes don't.

 

They could get rid of that all together for all I care. Really; as far as imbalance goes in this game, this ones got to be near the bottom and as pointless as they come. Especially when Sniper is the only ranged class that really hangs with the melee ones in the game right now.

Edited December 11, 2012 by Technohic

They could get rid of that all together for all I care. Really; as far as imbalance goes in this game, this ones got to be near the bottom and as pointless as they come. Especially when Sniper is the only ranged class that really hangs with the melee ones in the game right now.

 

ok.... but I don't think it should be because the game auto-targets the attacking melee person and thats the only point I'm trying to make. Mages and hunters do just fine in that other game, sure some key turning bads get pwnt, but there are plenty who can move their character themselves.

ok.... but I don't think it should be because the game auto-targets the attacking melee person and thats the only point I'm trying to make. Mages and hunters do just fine in that other game, sure some key turning bads get pwnt, but there are plenty who can move their character themselves.

 

It is what it is, but I really could do without the spastic zig zags. After a while; people figure out whats going on and learn to turn without a keyboard and it just gets to be annoying. If it is for a realism thing, then at least add collision detection so you can't run through the other player at least.

 

Again; I use it as well against melee, but it's still just annoying to most players.

It is what it is, but I really could do without the spastic zig zags. After a while; people figure out whats going on and learn to turn without a keyboard and it just gets to be annoying. If it is for a realism thing, then at least add collision detection so you can't run through the other player at least.

 

Again; I use it as well against melee, but it's still just annoying to most players.

 

yeah but when you get behind a melee they have to MANUALLY turn their character around to face you, the game doesnt do it for them... understand?

... delete this... Edited December 11, 2012 by Nieosatlio

1) LOS is the first counter.

2) Another counter I use a lot is a stun, which brings them out of their turret stance. When it wears off (or they break it), they often forget to recrouch, which leaves them open to being pushed, thrown, and interrupted.

3) As a cloaked char, you can also cloak out of battle, and knock them out of cover too, which gives you a third counter. and leaves them open to the attacks in 2)

4) Finally, the last one is the simplest to counter them, keep running in circles around behind them. Yes, they can still attack you with some attacks, but not all, so the player will likely be swiveling his mouse around to try and face you which will make it more difficult for him to manage his abilities.

 

As a shadow (force techniques teir), here's how I take on a sniper:

1) if I can sneak up cloaked, I whirlwind him to knock him off balance. Use force breach and backstab him until I build a charge of instant use force crush.

2) I use force potency and then force crush, rock throw, and project combo.

- by this time, he's up again, probably crouched and about to snipe me or he's stunned me (I break stun) and shield up. I will then force stun him if I can, force breach, and backstab (then mind crush if instant hit has built up)

-before stun wears off, I will push him, cloak out of battle (with the increased cloak), and then do combo 1). Then combo 2) again if it's ready. If not, then I'll alternate with breach and melee attack until instant force crush builds up.

3) and when he's close enough, I switch to force breach and the critical hit until the instant force crush builds up and I can do 2).

However, if he's running around, it's harder to do all this, so I use force slow, speed, and the other two force attacks that come with my tier to attack from a distance and keep close when I can.

 

If I can get two uses of combo 1 and combo 2 each, plus using instant force crush a few times, I can usually bring a sniper down before I get below half health. Ops and scoundrel are a different story altogether though. I still have trouble managing them..

yeah but when you get behind a melee they have to MANUALLY turn their character around to face you, the game doesnt do it for them... understand?

 

Yes; I get that and have got that. That is why I say just get rid of making them have to turn to be just like ranged classes. No more advantage to anyone. Or make it work for both but add collision detection so you can't run right through people, but the easier thing to do for a problem we don't really need, is to just get rid of the part where melee has to turn and face the target. It's not like smash needs it anyway.

Edited December 11, 2012 by Technohic

1) LOS is the first counter.

2) Another counter I use a lot is a stun, which brings them out of their turret stance. When it wears off (or they break it), they often forget to recrouch, which leaves them open to being pushed, thrown, and interrupted.

3) As a cloaked char, you can also cloak out of battle, and knock them out of cover too, which gives you a third counter. and leaves them open to the attacks in 2)

4) Finally, the last one is the simplest to counter them, keep running in circles around behind them. Yes, they can still attack you with some attacks, but not all, so the player will likely be swiveling his mouse around to try and face you which will make it more difficult for him to manage his abilities.

 

As a shadow (force techniques teir), here's how I take on a sniper:

1) if I can sneak up cloaked, I whirlwind him to knock him off balance. Use force breach and backstab him until I build a charge of instant use force crush.

2) I use force potency and then force crush, rock throw, and project combo.

- by this time, he's up again, probably crouched and about to snipe me or he's stunned me (I break stun) and shield up. I will then force stun him if I can, force breach, and backstab (then mind crush if instant hit has built up)

-before stun wears off, I will push him, cloak out of battle (with the increased cloak), and then do combo 1). Then combo 2) again if it's ready. If not, then I'll alternate with breach and melee attack until instant force crush builds up.

3) and when he's close enough, I switch to force breach and the critical hit until the instant force crush builds up and I can do 2).

However, if he's running around, it's harder to do all this, so I use force slow, speed, and the other two force attacks that come with my tier to attack from a distance and keep close when I can.

 

If I can get two uses of combo 1 and combo 2 each, plus using instant force crush a few times, I can usually bring a sniper down before I get below half health. Ops and scoundrel are a different story altogether though. I still have trouble managing them..

 

I'll tell you what not to do. If you have to cast whirlwind 9as in not instant); probably better not do it right in front of the sniper one on one.

 

Had a sorcerer do this the other day as I was solo guarding a node. I hit entrench when they were almost done, and had called incoming before they even got in range. I kind of paused to laugh as I saw them just procede to the node and start trying to cap, oblivious to the fact that I was not in a whirlwind. Then I shot them, and they turned and tried to hit me with their stun while entrench was still up. LMAO

Edited December 11, 2012 by Technohic

Yes; I get that and have got that. That is why I say just get rid of making them have to turn to be just like ranged classes. No more advantage to anyone. Or make it work for both but add collision detection so you can't run right through people, but the easier thing to do for a problem we don't really need, is to just get rid of the part where melee has to turn and face the target. It's not like smash needs it anyway.

 

ok but this thread is about how to deal with snipers/slingers and someone said to get behind them and I was simply saying that regardless of the skill of the sniper getting behind them really isn't going to do you any good since the game will turn the sniper to face you no matter what you do.

ok but this thread is about how to deal with snipers/slingers and someone said to get behind them and I was simply saying that regardless of the skill of the sniper getting behind them really isn't going to do you any good since the game will turn the sniper to face you no matter what you do.

 

It will make a difference if they are behind hard cover, I believe. They will still turn but they lose the defense the hard cover provides. Maybe thats what the person meant?

clearly I don't mean that you could have to leave cover. Have you played any other mmo's ranged classes? You would just have to turn your character around while they stayed stationary and in cover. Like I said, I benefit from it, it's just ez mode.

 

In beta they had autoturn as in click a skill and it autoturned you. Lots complained cause the spaz didnt work well and they removed it. What they did leave in was if you start a ability you autoturn but if your behind someone before they trigger it then they will have to turn to trigger an attack.

 

I honestly think they would have been better have collision like they did in war then there would be no spaz since you couldnt run thru a person you had to run around them.

So, what I got from this thread is that Snipers are hard countered by every class/spec in the game because all fights are 1v1 with nothing but LoS around where the Sniper never gets the opener.

 

TL;DR: Don't nerf me, bro.

TL;DR: Don't nerf me, bro.

 

Hey... EyesmindASSASSIN... they've nerfed you like 3 times... still viable... clearly need another nerf.

So, what I got from this thread is that Snipers are hard countered by every class/spec in the game because all fights are 1v1 with nothing but LoS around where the Sniper never gets the opener.

 

TL;DR: Don't nerf me, bro.

 

i think people forget that a sniper can just cc you, get up, walk over to you and kill you then and just use cc's and roots to keep you close