Considering there's a top 3 reward, I wouldn't be surprised if they made it based on the last day's rating . I think that way's better honestly, as long as they release percentile marks for reward tiers instead of straight up Elo marks.

Well if you change it so it's based on the last day ELO rating it would encourage people to get their rating and then sit on it. I did it for season 1 because I hate ranked arenas so after I got my 1500 rating I stopped queuing. At least if it is based on highest ELO achieved people can still queue afterwards without fear of losing their rewards.

I'm not sure how the % thing would work or what the % is based off of. I'm also curious what % of people managed a 1500 rating or higher. I never see more than myself and maybe one other person on fleet with a rancor mount.

Sorry Alex but I really think you're missing the forest through the trees here.

When setting any reward you must think of the behaviour you are incentivising. A warzone comm based reward based on wins will work for those who want warzone comms.

As a ranked PvP player the last thing I need or want is more ranked or normal warzone comms - if I'm stepping into ranked without full min/max brutaliser then I am not taking ranked or my rating seriously.

Comms have no meaning to me - they are only useful for the player gearing up (excepting medpacs of course).

So we need to assess the thing I value most as a ranked player - and that is - more rating.

A PVE player has no value for rating so is not incentivised to do a daily that rewards it. Conversely it will promote people who have high rating to keep playing to continue to escalate in score when the competition might only yield marginal increases.

"But we can't reward more rating based on a daily - it will only inflate the maximum possible ratings" - then boundary test the system to see how decay will work at high rating although I suspect the current MMR regime should work largely intact (unless a player never ever loses and then I'd be asking questions).

But how much should we set the values at?

Well low - for daily +10 rating and +20 for weekly but feel free to adjust based on testing.

I love ranked - and want more participation of serious competitors in s2 - a daily and weekly that has an appropriate incentive will do that - but it must be closely linked to the objective ranked pvp'rs desire.

This is understandable and will happen to many players, even me no doubt =/

 

However we feel that having wins be the only criteria is a better way to go instead of making them games played. This is because of the incentive to play the gamemode for the right reasons (to win) is much lower for someone who is just interested in completing the daily/weekly. A percentage of the Ranked population would be queuing just to complete a quest and that would be detrimental to the team. We feel Games Played with an incentive (Double counts for Wins) is more acceptable in Unranked games because of the larger team size (less personal impact on if your team wins or loses) and more casual atmosphere.

 

This is our current philosophy on the choice we made but if it isn't working out we will make adjustments where and when possible.

 

Cheers!

Dude, stick to your guns. You guys got it for once.

At this point, progression is a lot less important because you are getting ranked comms from ranked, unlike regs where you don't get ranked comms, you can only convert them. If losses gave wins, scrubs could just lose their way to lots of ranked comms, an unfavorable situation and a detriment to a ranked community that is based on a rating system.

In addition, wins and losses should not be the only thing that is affected by rating. Medals, kills, healing done, damage done, and match length should influence rating. The reasoning for this, is that a ROFL stomp should decrease your rating more so that you compete with players at your level, whilst a close hairpullingly long match is more indictive that this is a good level for you to compete in, and should not adjust your rating significantly.

I also think that you guys should test a matchmajing system that measures the added up gear rating of your gear and attempts to organize matches to meet average gear rates.

Because the dailies and weeklies are awarded via wins only I think that giving a small, keyword, SMALL rating increase will be beneficial.

Sorry Alex but I really think you're missing the forest through the trees here.

 

When setting any reward you must think of the behaviour you are incentivising. A warzone comm based reward based on wins will work for those who want warzone comms.

 

As a ranked PvP player the last thing I need or want is more ranked or normal warzone comms - if I'm stepping into ranked without full min/max brutaliser then I am not taking ranked or my rating seriously.

 

Comms have no meaning to me - they are only useful for the player gearing up (excepting medpacs of course).

 

So we need to assess the thing I value most as a ranked player - and that is - more rating.

 

A PVE player has no value for rating so is not incentivised to do a daily that rewards it. Conversely it will promote people who have high rating to keep playing to continue to escalate in score when the competition might only yield marginal increases.

 

"But we can't reward more rating based on a daily - it will only inflate the maximum possible ratings" - then boundary test the system to see how decay will work at high rating although I suspect the current MMR regime should work largely intact (unless a player never ever loses and then I'd be asking questions).

 

But how much should we set the values at?

 

Well low - for daily +10 rating and +20 for weekly but feel free to adjust based on testing.

 

I love ranked - and want more participation of serious competitors in s2 - a daily and weekly that has an appropriate incentive will do that - but it must be closely linked to the objective ranked pvp'rs desire.

If you knew how Elo works, you would know why you can't give rating as a reward for dailies......Like seriously?

Feeling bad for the devs right now. They do something right for once.......and while the people who know what's up thank them for it, all these clueless bads come out of the woodwork and complain.

And to those saying that your performance in the match should influence your rating gains/losses: no. A win is a win, a loss is a loss-period. That is how all competitive games operate. Just because such a system would personally benefit me and other good players doesn't mean it's a good idea for the health of the game. It also would be very difficult to determine how in-game performance affected rating change, considering that you have to balance damage, protection, heals, AND class differences (you don't give a sorc more rating every time just because he had the common sense to bubble his teammates). And what about CC? If you don't get rating from using CC, you might as well tunnel PvE dps to get as much rating as possible. Unless you want players farming stats, win/loss HAS to be the only determinant.

That word doesn't mean what you think it does, and you clearly have no idea what BiS is as well.

 

General rule, if you don't know what a word or term means, it's a good idea to spare yourself potential embarrassment.

Lol this guy.

If you knew how Elo works, you would know why you can't give rating as a reward for dailies......Like seriously? .

Can you explain why not then? I thought I had a good handle on how Elo works but if I'm missing something I'm all ears.

yeah. I'm not mr. intensity. win at all costs. elite pvper. but this is just...I mean...it's what rated is, man. alex seems to have said as much. and it's the polar opposite of what musco said in the faq.

 

there's nothing wrong with being bad or mediocre or w/e. your rating will plummet. eventually things will sort themselves out. but there's something wrong with still grinding your gear in the middle of ranked play.

You seem to misunderstand.

Many, many, many, many players have used Yolo Queue as a means to coast there way to faster Ranked Gear. They contribute next to nothing, openly admit to being there solely for the purpose of grinding gear, and still reach their goal despite being nothing but dead weight to every team they are on.

*THAT* is not what Ranked is for. If you want to earn your Ranked gear while you participate in Ranked *whilst contributing to the team*, go for it. But do not attempt to justify people that use Ranked as a means to coast to better gear.

The PVP community is so small you really can't call ranked games a competitive environment.

The competitive population is small, so lets just make everything super-casual? Brilliant logic.

You seem to misunderstand.

 

Many, many, many, many players have used Yolo Queue as a means to coast there way to faster Ranked Gear. They contribute next to nothing, openly admit to being there solely for the purpose of grinding gear, and still reach their goal despite being nothing but dead weight to every team they are on.

 

 

*THAT* is not what Ranked is for. If you want to earn your Ranked gear while you participate in Ranked *whilst contributing to the team*, go for it. But do not attempt to justify people that use Ranked as a means to coast to better gear.

 

 

 

The competitive population is small, so lets just make everything super-casual? Brilliant logic.

This might be off topic, but what the hell is yolo queue? It is like a revolution on these forums with using that phrase. I know what yolo is, but what is it in relation to queuing?

You do understand that I'm advocating for separate quests for solo AND group, with only wins counting towards solo ranked quest completion, and losses counting 1x and wins counting 2X for group ranked quest completion. Right?

Yes, I didn't agree with the whole idea of having both dailies, but I agreed with your explanation of the benefit of group-queues relative to the missions.

The reason I don't think there should be missions for solo-queue is very simple. If all the undergeareds and bads are queuing for solo queue, leaving matches and doing nothing, is solo ranked any different from regs? The rewards at the end are different, yes, but this will effectively kill the solo ranked queue type altogether. Leaderboards will be based solely on extreme luck, whereas now the skilled player can be the deciding factor.

This might be off topic, but what the hell is yolo queue? It is like a revolution on these forums with using that phrase. I know what yolo is, but what is it in relation to queuing?

Yolo Queue = Solo Ranked Queue. It earned that name b/c the significant RNG factor in the Solo Ranked Queue.

Please Please Please make them wins only count, and you need 4 or even 6 a day.

 

We do not want Ranked filled with the PvE'ers in there PvE gear just taking up space to get the relics they want. It's bad enough there in regs getting killed from behind by sorcs doing there keyboard turning wondering where the dmg is coming from.

 

Please make it so you have to win to get credit.

A good player in PvE gear will do better than 90% of people in pvp gear because the bolster system is far to generous, most people are rubbish regardless of what they are wearing.

Can you explain why not then? I thought I had a good handle on how Elo works but if I'm missing something I'm all ears.

Well for one, having the daily grant rating would penalize people for not doing the daily every day. I'm a hardcore PvPer, but even I think that's stupid.

Another problem, which you brought up and then pretended to address, was rating inflation. 1200 is the .500 mark for Elo. Introducing a method to increase rating outside of games via quests, without any loss of rating to balance this, would have to inflate this. As the season progressed, the average rating would go up. That would be bad.

We? So, your speaking for thousands of people?

 

Making wins the only way to get this stuff is stupid. You could do 20 games and not get one single win, NO that is not a reflection on YOU as a player, that was the problem with it being wins before. I remember when the weekly PVP required wins and doing 20 games with still and not getting one single win because half the rest of the teams were just kill farming. So, this "win" requirement is nonsense.

 

Furthermore, I get real sick of this elitist "hardcore" attitude from alot of PVPers. Take your rude, gloating, ego elsewhere.

You are the one seemingly with a chip on your shoulder, people could say they are sick of the entitled nature of many players to get something for nothing.

This game is far to easy to get pvp geared, and this will not change with having wins counting to dailies/weeklys, its comically effortless, I pvpd back with centurion, champion and battlemaster gear when gearing was incredibly hard and even when you got the gear you needed the relevent valor to wear it and sans the ilum valor exploiting it wasnt fast to level valor. My worst day ever consisted of 17 matches before I got my 3 wins in but that was the exception, not the rule, the fact that there is no barrier to going in and farming ranked makes everything comical and you are crying because you want free weeklys as well.

The upcoming (in 2.7.1) Ranked Missions only progress from wins. They are completed with 3 wins for the daily and 9 for the weekly. We will see how those amounts work in the wild and adjust accordingly.

All that does is reward the teams that stomp for winning and punish the losers for getting no progress at all.

It didn't work in the past, having the Daily/Weekly require wins only made it extremely frustrating and required me to dozens and dozens of Warzones a week just to get the Weekly. Dozens and dozens of losses in a row, and having to basically do nothing but PvP to even get it... I couldn't even look at the rest of the game until that was done.

Now you're doing it again but with Ranked, which is even MORE lopsided? Most Arenas are a brutal slaughter by the same people, playing the same classes over and over again. And matching silly teams against workable teams (2 DPS 2 Tanks VS 2 DPS 2 Healers??).

Here's whats going to happen: Once I finish my Oboran set I will que only for Ranked since I'll need so many Ranked comms to get Berserker. I will get destroyed over and over and over again, but I'll still be earning a tiny amount of Ranked comms (which is more than I'll get from regular PvP). I will keep queing despite getting destroyed until I'm sick of doing it for the day, and maybe by chance I'll get a win or two in as well despite everything.

Put that on repeat for 7 days until the Weekly resets, and I'll have done dozens of games, be miserable, as well as any poor soul matched with me. And I'll keep doing that until I get full Berserker.

At least if the Daily/Weekly counts losses, as it should, you have a realistic goal. Even if it's 9 wins, or 18 losses for the Weekly that's still 18 games at the most and you're there. Meanwhile if it's just 9 wins, I can do 200 games and still be at 0/9 progress. I'm sure everyone else will be happy I'm in there games 200 times, right (well the opposite team to me will be happy sure)?

All making it only count wins, AGAIN, does is make people not bother to que at all, or they que ad infinitium and simply lose over and over again as already said "making the rich richer and the poor poorer". At least after losing so many games that count lets you reach the goal and leave, instead I'll simply be "ruining games" for other people infinitely until I get matched into something I can win.

Ranked is not about participation. Its about winning.

Then I hope you're ready to enjoy not winning, because the few new people that bother queing are going to lose. A lot.

Winning should be about the massive increase in comms, rating, and getting the Daily/Weekly done at super speed. It shouldn't be able getting 1 point to the Daily/Weekly at all.

The reason I don't think there should be missions for solo-queue is very simple. If all the undergeareds and bads are queuing for solo queue, leaving matches and doing nothing, is solo ranked any different from regs? The rewards at the end are different, yes, but this will effectively kill the solo ranked queue type altogether. Leaderboards will be based solely on extreme luck, whereas now the skilled player can be the deciding factor.

Ok, why the f*** do so many people think a simple daily ranked quest is going to cause all the bads to come flooding in. You already get ranked comms from the match itself- this daily will just be an augment to that. There is nothing fundamental about the rewards from this quest. It is not a big deal. It is basically just getting a little extra comms for your first few wins every day. This might bring some more terribads/undergeareds, but most of them aren't gonna be stupid enough to leave a game just because they don't think they're gonna win, unless they just get roflstomped the first round- in which case their team's not gonna win anyway. You already get far more comms from winning a ranked game than losing- a quest just somewhat magnifies this reality. I'll take bets now that this will not "kill the solo ranked queue type altogether". Like honestly, think.

Long post, skimmed through it, but what I got was that you don't enjoy doing ranked because you lose a lot because of reasons. However, you're going to cowboy up and take it, so that you can grind out a full set of Berserker, after grinding out a full set of Obroan from regs.

I don't/didn't enjoy PvP as a whole pre-server merge because on my server Imperials dominated PvP and I was Republic, so at the time doing the Daily usually didn't happen and the Weekly was basically impossible most weeks and that was only 7 wins.

Already have a full set of Conqueror now, so full expertise, but since I can't exchange that for Obroan anymore I do have to basically "rebuy" the lowest set all over again yes.

But I have a question: What are you going to do after you've gotten full Berserker?

 

Continue participating in ranked and getting stomped by the same players?

 

Go back to regs and stomp undergeared PvE carebears trying to get relics for their healer alts?

 

Sit in a dark room and cry?

 

 

I mean, is there a thing that happens when you get full Berserker? Does Jaesa Wilsaam pop out of your monitor and suck you off or something?

 

Why is getting full Berserker the goal of your entire play, instead of having fun doing the things you like?

Assuming I get to full Berserker I'll go back to regular Warzones and use those regular comms to buy any PvP items I still like the look of (gamble boxes, mount/pets that kinda of thing). More importantly it'll mean I'll finally "up to par" for the current tier, and I'll actually be able to upgrade from Berserker to whatever-the-next-tier-is directly in months/a year down the line.

But why have that goal at all, why "ruin my games you filthy noob" to get there? Guild mostly. And because I choose to PvP, and no matter how low people's opinions of me I'm still trying to win, I'm not throwing or afking, and simply because you don't like it doesn't prevent me from queing.

Then I hope you're ready to enjoy not winning, because the few new people that bother queing are going to lose. A lot.

 

Winning should be about the massive increase in comms, rating, and getting the Daily/Weekly done at super speed. It shouldn't be able getting 1 point to the Daily/Weekly at all.

I am done with the joke that is Ranked PvP in this game. Sub canceled, yada yada yada.

Inevitably the devs will likely cave to the ever growing crowd of casual baddies, and Ranked will get participation rewards (it already does btw, you get comms for losing still).

But I say again, Ranked is not about participation; its about winning. If you lose, figure out why. There is going to always be something different you can do in the next one to improve your game. However, there are a minuscule number of players interested in improving their own play. If they lose, its the other teams fault: they had better class composition, they had better players, my team sucked, the other side had a premade, etc etc. Sometimes, those are valid reasons for losing. But if you are losing a lot (more than you win), those are no longer valid reasons.

Personal responsibility for ones own performance is almost non-existent. If you want to win in Ranked, learn how to play better.

Long post, skimmed through it, but what I got was that you don't enjoy doing ranked because you lose a lot because of reasons. However, you're going to cowboy up and take it, so that you can grind out a full set of Berserker, after grinding out a full set of Obroan from regs.

 

But I have a question: What are you going to do after you've gotten full Berserker?

 

Continue participating in ranked and getting stomped by the same players?

 

Go back to regs and stomp undergeared PvE carebears trying to get relics for their healer alts?

 

Sit in a dark room and cry?

 

 

I mean, is there a thing that happens when you get full Berserker? Does Jaesa Wilsaam pop out of your monitor and suck you off or something?

 

Why is getting full Berserker the goal of your entire play, instead of having fun doing the things you like?

WTB

/5char

Why is getting full Berserker the goal of your entire play, instead of having fun doing the things you like?

Better gear for better gear's sake is part of playing an MMO RPG. At level 55, climbing gear ranks is a form of progression.

Better gear for better gear's sake is part of playing an MMO RPG. At level 55, climbing gear ranks is a form of progression.

For bads maybe.

I am done with the joke that is Ranked PvP in this game. Sub canceled, yada yada yada.

 

Inevitably the devs will likely cave to the ever growing crowd of casual baddies, and Ranked will get participation rewards (it already does btw, you get comms for losing still).

 

But I say again, Ranked is not about participation; its about winning. If you lose, figure out why. There is going to always be something different you can do in the next one to improve your game. However, there are a minuscule number of players interested in improving their own play. If they lose, its the other teams fault: they had better class composition, they had better players, my team sucked, the other side had a premade, etc etc. Sometimes, those are valid reasons for losing. But if you are losing a lot (more than you win), those are no longer valid reasons.

 

Personal responsibility for ones own performance is almost non-existent. If you want to win in Ranked, learn how to play better.

Obligatory "You're just bad" response. If it were 1 v 1 then maybe it'd hold weight, because it'd be very clear where one is going wrong. Less so when it's 4 v 4 and certain classes are head and shoulders above the rest, and certain specs are simply just awful in comparison. That's not an exaggeration either.

I'm just not the type of person who dumps their main to reroll a "viable" class just so I can PvP.

Now you're doing it again but with Ranked, which is even MORE lopsided? Most Arenas are a brutal slaughter by the same people, playing the same classes over and over again. And matching silly teams against workable teams (2 DPS 2 Tanks VS 2 DPS 2 Healers??).

That does not happen in ranked, you're thinking of reg arenas.

Here's whats going to happen: Once I finish my Oboran set I will que only for Ranked since I'll need so many Ranked comms to get Berserker. I will get destroyed over and over and over again, but I'll still be earning a tiny amount of Ranked comms (which is more than I'll get from regular PvP). I will keep queing despite getting destroyed until I'm sick of doing it for the day, and maybe by chance I'll get a win or two in as well despite everything.

You can already do this now. A new daily quest is not going to significantly incentivize gearing up this way.

Why do most PvPers not queue for ranked? 1) They don't like arenas. These quests will not affect them, since ranked is already a superior form of gearing up to regs: so if they cared about getting gearing up faster enough to overcome their dislike of arenas, they'd already be doing ranked. 2) They're undergeared and don't want to get roflstomped. This will also not affect them. 3) Regs pop faster, ranked is not a guaranteed pop. This might affect them, as the presence of a quest could provide the notion of "ranked might pop faster now since people probably want to make use of this new quest". Increase the general perception that more people are queuing, and more people will queue. That's what this quest is for.

For bads maybe.

I'm not sure I agree that people who want better gear just because it's better are bads. Especially as working to get better and better gear seems the cornerstone of end game content.

Presumably there's a reason BioWare doesn't just hand out full Brutilizer sets when you hit level 55 and say "We're sure you'll continue playing PvP all the time now that there are no external rewards and the matches are all about skill!"