Speaking of Theron, another thought popped into my head as to what would happen to Revan's legacy as in his family tree. To my knowledge, Theron is the last of his direct descendant, excluding Satele as she's the previous generation. I don't think Satele has a sister/brother. What I am getting at is if Theron were to be killed off (the word is "if"), wouldn't that have a repercussion to Revan's legacy? He left to fight the Empire 300 years ago before SWTOR starts. That's about like 4-5 generations of descendants (assuming avg lifespan of 80 yrs). Revan can appear in Holocron and his teachings can still affect the galaxy as a whole but in terms of actual family, if Theron dies then that's it.

Or if he ends up with a Commander who just doesn't want/can't have kids.

I heard that change in my Smuggler who've been kept neutral alignment, but mostly choose LS on the kotfe major choices. Perhaps one gets that sound line when one goes a certain dialogue tree. But thought to share because in case people didn't know. I didn't hear that when I ran kotfe first time with my SI & SW. It just adds more to Theron as a character, imo. Tbh, Theron came off as just annoyed and whiny when Satele was brought up as a topic. Kinda glad they expanded the dynamic in little ways.

 

Speaking of Theron, another thought popped into my head as to what would happen to Revan's legacy as in his family tree. To my knowledge, Theron is the last of his direct descendant, excluding Satele as she's the previous generation. I don't think Satele has a sister/brother. What I am getting at is if Theron were to be killed off (the word is "if"), wouldn't that have a repercussion to Revan's legacy? He left to fight the Empire 300 years ago before SWTOR starts. That's about like 4-5 generations of descendants (assuming avg lifespan of 80 yrs). Revan can appear in Holocron and his teachings can still affect the galaxy as a whole but in terms of actual family, if Theron dies then that's it.

I wonder how much it matters. Depending on who is playing, Theron won't be able to have descendants of his own either. Wouldn't that also mean that it's "that's it" too? I mean he can be in love with a male. Unless it always ends up with Theron leaving said male for a female. Which is odd all together.

I wonder how much it matters. Depending on who is playing, Theron won't be able to have descendants of his own either. Wouldn't that also mean that it's "that's it" too? I mean he can be in love with a male. Unless it always ends up with Theron leaving said male for a female. Which is odd all together.

Hey, Theron's kid could always have two daddies. Or he could be with a woman who doesn't want kids. My (female) characters don't swing straight, but even if they did, they'd run screaming from the idea of having kids.

But aside from that, it's so many generations back that it's more than a little likely that Revan has other descendants. It's a running joke in ancestry studies that everyone in Europe is related to Charlemagne, and actually, at this point, he has literally millions of descendants. Revan had one kid, but two grandchildren, and five more generations for that family tree to branch in different directions. So it's unlikely Theron's the only one.

I wonder how much it matters. Depending on who is playing, Theron won't be able to have descendants of his own either. Wouldn't that also mean that it's "that's it" too? I mean he can be in love with a male. Unless it always ends up with Theron leaving said male for a female. Which is odd all together.

They won't canonically give Theron kids now he's romancable by player-characters unless they create a brand new unknown "npc" mother for them, it would not be the player character since there's too many variations in the couples and players.

So yeah, unless they do that he is the last of that bloodline, no other options. Headcanon for "but my character!" does not count in this type of discussion either xD everyone or nothing when it comes to in-universe stuff.

I'm sure Bioware knows they just ended their favourite Revan bloodline on their own the moment they added him as LI option (provided they don't take my thought just there ^ ), they're not that stupid. I doubt it matters that much to them having it end, they got a good run out of it. I think it consisted of approx 10 generations of jedi, between Vaner and Theron. Unless Revan/Bastila had been counted in that number given to us. I think I read it in a book? or it was Rep-side SoR dialogue.. can't remember exactly where but Theron mentions it.

They won't canonically give Theron kids now he's romancable by player-characters unless they create a brand new unknown "npc" mother for them, it would not be the player character since there's too many variations in the couples and players.

You mean like a "baby momma" from a past romantic interlude? Because otherwise, once Theron ends up with a player character who doesn't want/can't have kids, that's pretty much all she wrote. And as you said, BioWare will not canonically add children to the equation when there are so many players out there who wouldn't want that for their characters. I get the heebeegeebies just from the forced "offspring" conversations from the original class companions. Eeech.

I doubt Revan's bloodline is truly ended. After a few hundred years, it's doubtful that there is only one, unless every single person carrying Revan's blood only had one offspring.

Maybe Theron isn't the only latest descendent of Revan? There's been 300+ years since Kotor ... what if Bastila's son's son had two daughters?

Ther could be another Revan bloodline out there.

Maybe Theron isn't the only latest descendent of Revan? There's been 300+ years since Kotor ... what if Bastila's son's son had two daughters?

 

Ther could be another Revan bloodline out there.

I was reading the whole set of theories thinking the same thing that there are likely a lot of descendents of Revan and Bastila, so Theron being the end of the line is not likely.

That said I have spent the last few hours reading from the OP to this point. The OP was very well thought out as were most of the others posted. Agree or disagree, it has all been a good read and I love the various thoughts and theories you have come up with.

I am also of the belief that Theron is helping the alliance and not hurting them. He is an accurate long ranged shooter and would not have missed shooting Lana 3 meters in front of him, or the commander. He created a way for them to get off the train and his halo call to taunt them was his way of checking to ensure they made it off the train safely.

But I will say this -

When he is reunited with my Jedi Knight, she may have been all sweet in telling him she still loves him and to come home, but after she has had time to think about it, he will have some splainin to do and it better be good cause she'll be standing there with her saber and will not hesitate to start eliminating body parts.

When he is reunited with my Jedi Knight, she may have been all sweet in telling him she still loves him and to come home, but after she has had time to think about it, he will have some splainin to do and it better be good cause she'll be standing there with her saber and will not hesitate to start eliminating body parts.

For my smuggler, I am hoping for the option to sock Theron a good punch. Just like she had with Koth after the whole "YOU DID A WHAT" with a quantum BOMB. That was hilarious especially landing in Iokath the first time, Koth is like "can't talk much because my jaw is sore from your punch." Non-Force users in kotfe/et don't make much sense to me, but I love my smuggler in some moments.

For my smuggler, I am hoping for the option to sock Theron a good punch. Just like she had with Koth after the whole "YOU DID A WHAT" with a quantum BOMB. That was hilarious especially landing in Iokath the first time, Koth is like "can't talk much because my jaw is sore from your punch." Non-Force users in kotfe/et don't make much sense to me, but I love my smuggler in some moments.

The best part about that punch was the 'thank you' from Lana for doing it, LOL.

My SW would be down with socking Theron, too. Even if he's on the right side of things, he's caused a bit of drama, to put it lightly...

The best part about that punch was the 'thank you' from Lana for doing it, LOL.

 

My SW would be down with socking Theron, too. Even if he's on the right side of things, he's caused a bit of drama, to put it lightly...

IKR! XD

Considering all PC can punch Saresh after she tried to take over, I am hoping for an option to punch Theron in the face for all classes. I know Sith can Force choke, but I don't wanna go that far... unless it's a legit DS path ... like hoping for one utterly DS Inquisitor, muhahahaha.....

Theron: "Commander, I - "

PC: *punches him in the face*

Theron: "Ow. Ok, I deserved that."

IKR! XD

 

Considering all PC can punch Saresh after she tried to take over, I am hoping for an option to punch Theron in the face for all classes. I know Sith can Force choke, but I don't wanna go that far... unless it's a legit DS path ... like hoping for one utterly DS Inquisitor, muhahahaha.....

 

Theron: "Commander, I - "

PC: *punches him in the face*

Theron: "Ow. Ok, I deserved that."

I don't think my Nox could ever Force choke him. In my head, she threw him up against a wall and threatened him with it on Ziost in an effort to scare him, and it didn't work. But to actually do it, nope. Punch him? Oh yes, I hope we have that option. If not, it's still happening in my head, lol.

IKR! XD

 

Considering all PC can punch Saresh after she tried to take over, I am hoping for an option to punch Theron in the face for all classes. I know Sith can Force choke, but I don't wanna go that far... unless it's a legit DS path ... like hoping for one utterly DS Inquisitor, muhahahaha.....

 

Theron: "Commander, I - "

PC: *punches him in the face*

Theron: "Ow. Ok, I deserved that."

Add to this the option to kiss him.

Theron: "....ok I'm really getting mixed signals here"

SW: "Shut up, Theron"

Theron: "Ok"

I wonder how much it matters. Depending on who is playing, Theron won't be able to have descendants of his own either. Wouldn't that also mean that it's "that's it" too? I mean he can be in love with a male. Unless it always ends up with Theron leaving said male for a female. Which is odd all together.

You could play Revan as black or Asian, female, with Carth, celibate, DS or LS, that didn't stop them from completely overwriting the characters we played in favor of the generic focus test straight, white, dark haired, stubbled male who knocked up Bastilla default they wanted for EU materials and later SWtOR. I doubt they'll hesitate to do the same thing to our SWtOR characters if they want something specific to happen. I expect they'll go with a LS straight white human male JK with dark hair and stubble who romances Lana.

You could play Revan as black or Asian, female, with Carth, celibate, DS or LS, that didn't stop them from completely overwriting the characters we played in favor of the generic focus test straight, white, dark haired, stubbled male who knocked up Bastilla default they wanted for EU materials and later SWtOR. I doubt they'll hesitate to do the same thing to our SWtOR characters if they want something specific to happen. I expect they'll go with a LS straight white human male JK with dark hair and stubble who romances Lana.

You're probably right! I also think k the description of the JK seems accurate.

I was reading the whole set of theories thinking the same thing that there are likely a lot of descendents of Revan and Bastila, so Theron being the end of the line is not likely.

As if Theron's current family situation isn't complicated already, lmao. *barks laughter* The reaction would be priceless XD

You could play Revan as black or Asian, female, with Carth, celibate, DS or LS, that didn't stop them from completely overwriting the characters we played in favor of the generic focus test straight, white, dark haired, stubbled male who knocked up Bastilla default they wanted for EU materials and later SWtOR. I doubt they'll hesitate to do the same thing to our SWtOR characters if they want something specific to happen. I expect they'll go with a LS straight white human male JK with dark hair and stubble who romances Lana.

Whoa, whoa, whoa...

I think the devs like looking at breasts all day, SO it's more likely they'll go with LS lesbian blonde haired, blue eyed JK to go with Lana instead.

Whoa, whoa, whoa...

 

I think the devs like looking at breasts all day, SO it's more likely they'll go with LS lesbian blonde haired, blue eyed JK to go with Lana instead.

Works for me.

Other than the gut-punch a twitchy Warrior might have with being betrayed a 2nd time...I can easily see most other Commanders seeing right through this...and potentially playing along. Theron was so over-the-top hamming things up that it was almost laughable.

 

And the difference between Quinn's betrayal and this "betrayal," is that Quinn was indeed trying to kill the Warrior. This was not a true betrayal. He wasn't trying to kill the Commander at all - it was all an act staged to get him inside the Order (of Zildrog). He had someone listening in and he had to play things up. He's an operative - a good one. And he had to maintain his cover story to get on the inside.

 

All this gasping surprise over a spy doing spy stuff is just...really. C'mon. If you haven't read the book/comics, do so, because they will give much needed insight to Theron's character. This shouldn't have come as a surprise at all. It's what he does. He's well known to take matters into his own hands and go off half-cocked. Did he go about things the right way? Probably not...he probably should have brought the Commander in on the know, but I can also see the argument that there was no guarantee the Commander would be able to be convincing, or would try to talk him out if it. But, again, Theron isn't well known for thinking things through all the way before just leaping to action.

I really hope that it is NOT the order of Zildrog. Some lame little street gang on Zakuul is all the devs at Bioware can come up with? I am hoping the Order is something far better than that, especially given the codex entry we received from doing the Uprisings.

I also get why you say that Theron wasn't really trying to kill us. However, he made so many attempts - way more than Quinn. And Quinn fell on his knees basically and begged for forgiveness while pledging his loyalty to never do this again. Theron on the other hand, just kept on trying to "fake kill you"? I just have a hard time swallowing that one that Bioware seems to want to dish out. Also, Theron may be a good spy but he sure has had his share of muck ups - like Ziost and as far as I'm concerned this new one. Theron isn't used to working in teams. He admits it but also says he is trying. I have to say, I love the line my Sith Warrior said in Umbara about him "Once a spy, always a spy". It is so true on Theron.

I really liked the insight of the OP on this topic. Thank you for breaking down the uprisings and how they are connected.

Whoa, whoa, whoa...

 

I think the devs like looking at breasts all day, SO it's more likely they'll go with LS lesbian blonde haired, blue eyed JK to go with Lana instead.

Nah, because as much as their supposed "excited" 13 year old boy audience likes to see girl on girl action, they don't like to actually PLAY as a girl or see a girl as the main character. They want the main character to always be the same generic straight white human guy with dark brown hair and stubble. (Also look at the JK they use for all the trailers, it's the same type of focus test guy)

You could play Revan as black or Asian, female, with Carth, celibate, DS or LS, that didn't stop them from completely overwriting the characters we played in favor of the generic focus test straight, white, dark haired, stubbled male who knocked up Bastilla default they wanted for EU materials and later SWtOR. I doubt they'll hesitate to do the same thing to our SWtOR characters if they want something specific to happen.

I know, right? My Revan was actually the spitting image of the DK Revanite quest chain "Revan" (Lord Tari Darkspanner), so for just a little while I was amazed that Bioware had got it "right."

It's hard to see how Bioware could've made Revan perfectly in line with our own Revans and still given us the same Revan-related story. They could've kept Revan masked and voice modulated. And I guess, in the case of a female Revan who was with Carth, the "Shan" name inherited by Satele and Theron could've come from Carth and Revan's kid being raised with the help of Bastila as adopted mother after Revan's disappearance, but that is far less neat, and still doesn't allow for a celibate Revan. There was probably no way to keep everyone happy and still tell the story they wanted to tell.

I know, right? My Revan was actually the spitting image of the DK Revanite quest chain "Revan" (Lord Tari Darkspanner), so for just a little while I was amazed that Bioware had got it "right."

 

It's hard to see how Bioware could've made Revan perfectly in line with our own Revans and still given us the same Revan-related story. They could've kept Revan masked and voice modulated. And I guess, in the case of a female Revan who was with Carth, the "Shan" name inherited by Satele and Theron could've come from Carth and Revan's kid being raised with the help of Bastila as adopted mother after Revan's disappearance, but that is far less neat, and still doesn't allow for a celibate Revan. There was probably no way to keep everyone happy and still tell the story they wanted to tell.

I never wanted any of those Revan spinoffs and liked that the initial SWtOR quest with the Revanites and other quests that mentioned Revan were vague and never showed a face or gender. Just little mentions. I think a Bastila + Revan descendant could have been either from a male Revan and Bastilla directly or something like Revan's daughter marrying Bastilla's son. I refused to play the vanilla flashpoints with that stupid generic default Revan and I liked SoR because of everything BUT him. He could have been substituted with any other generic evil guy with a boneheaded plan that will kill a bunch of people and it would have been exactly the same. I was disappointed that he got to peacefully merge with the force at the end, I wanted to carve that pretender up like a Christmas ham.

I never wanted any of those Revan spinoffs and liked that the initial SWtOR quest with the Revanites and other quests that mentioned Revan were vague and never showed a face or gender. Just little mentions. I think a Bastila + Revan descendant could have been either from a male Revan and Bastilla directly or something like Revan's daughter marrying Bastilla's son. I refused to play the vanilla flashpoints with that stupid generic default Revan and I liked SoR because of everything BUT him. He could have been substituted with any other generic evil guy with a boneheaded plan that will kill a bunch of people and it would have been exactly the same. I was disappointed that he got to peacefully merge with the force at the end, I wanted to carve that pretender up like a Christmas ham.

Good point about an alternate route for the Shan descendant of Revan. I personally liked the end of SoR, simply because the first time I played I was completely convinced the entire time that the person on Rishi plotting with pirates and torturing poor Theron wasn't actually Revan, just some thug wearing the mask. His schemes seemed so ludicrously petty. So when ghost Revan showed up I was all "aha, I was right!" That made the reveal that they were both Revan legitimately surprising. In retrospect, the story doesn't hold up as well. It's easy to pick holes in it. But I still appreciate it for that first great playthrough experience.

With the server merge, I got back to thinking about swtor conspiracy stuff annnnd my mind landed on the Gravestone. Particularly the relationship of Gravestone + Eternal Fleet + Eternal Throne. Because when the PC sits on the Throne, it does the electric shock thing similar to Iokath's although less in intensity. Initially, I thought Valkorion maybe fashioned it from scratch, but now I'm thinking he just built his palace around the Throne. I wouldn't be surprised if Valkorion's the kind that appropriates anything to fit his needs; he doesn't really build anything.

There's a defined relationship between Gravestone and Eternal Fleet as former have a leg up on destroying the latter. But is the Gravestone really designed to just destroy the Eternal Fleet? Why would it have been made by Iokath masters? Eternal Fleet by itself seem to regulate itself well when controlled. Could Gravestone be something more than how it was used in FEET? Could it have been part of the Eternal Fleet long ago? How did it end up in the swamp of all things instead of floating into empty space past galaxy?

Secrets and mysteries of the Gravestone have not been answered much. Is it really wise to just use a weapon that one does not fully understand? I think I read somewhere on tumblr about Gravestone possibly being Zildrog? Or one of the Gods? Just ... Gravestone. Answers unanswered. It's bugging me. Eeeeeeeurrrgh.

With War on Iokath, the next setting looks to be back to Imp vs Pub factions, but I think it would be anticlimactic to just jump back into that without a proper conclusion to Zakuul and Alliance.

I think it'll be something to do with the Zilrog guys teaming up with the Scions (who themselves with have their own objective) trying to 'free' (?) Zakuul from Alliance control.

Not sure why Theron would go 'co-co' crazy over this ... either they've infiltrated the base already, or, they've got their hands on a doomsday machine.