To me this game feels way more like new star wars than KOTOR. Its been years since Ive played KOTOR but I dont remember any of this stuff about separatists and troopers that look exactly like clone troopers. There were mandolorians, regular soldiers, and sith. I find it hard to swallow that the republic held onto that trooper design for 3000 years, and I keep seeing a lot of technology and designs that I would not expect to exist yet. I liked KOTOR because it was a completely different look on the Star Wars universe, but this game is feeling like it was set not long before Phantom Menace. Edited May 17, 2013 by coolmccoolson

Yeah, people have been making the complaint that TOR looks more like the trilogies than KotOR did. And in some ways, it's very valid, because the devs sort of twisted lore to get things to look more like the Star Wars everybody knew and loved from the movies, regardless of whether the timeline worked out.

 

But the thing is, that's what KotOR itself did a decade ago, too. In Tales of the Jedi, which told the story of the Great Sith War, the aesthetic was very different, almost archaic, compared to KotOR's trilogy-style blaster weapons and clothing. Take a look at Ulic Qel-Droma's invasion of Coruscant. Looks kind of out of place when you compare it even to KotOR, right?

 

It is what it is. And people have spent a lot of time justifying it in Star Wars EU lore. Take a look at the Essential Guide to Warfare, which specifically had to deal with the issue of reconciling the video games' tech with that of Tales of the Jedi. Here's a link to Jason Fry and Paul Urquhart's endnotes, published on Fry's blog, where Urquhart talks about the mechanics of doing that realistically.

Don't view it as holding the same trooper design for 3000 years, view as the same design being cycled back into use.

Don't view it as holding the same trooper design for 3000 years, view as the same design being cycled back into use.

 

Besides this, from a marketing standpoint, what do people want to play? That's right! Characters from the movies!

 

What do people constantly ask for? That's right! Designs from the movies!

 

Putting it in the past continues to be the worst idea ever, as they'll let it slide on some outfits, but on ship designs? X-Wings, Imperial Shuttle, where are the ships I love?!

Even in our history, aesthetics are reused after a while. Think of it as this but on a longer timeline.

 

Also, the Empire is eventually merged with the Republic, which is why the Republic has ships similar to the current Empire. It's why they didn't keep the old design (the design of ships the Rebels had), because it works.

Edited May 19, 2013 by Pingonaut

They retro-fit the games to the movies, basically. Because really, while many of us played and loved KOTOR, most people just see Star Wars and go from there. They don't care about the history as much as those who played KOTOR did. And from what I've seen, KOTOR has little to no influence in this universe, which makes me sad since this was supposed to be based heavily on the events of those stories.

They retro-fit the games to the movies, basically. Because really, while many of us played and loved KOTOR, most people just see Star Wars and go from there. They don't care about the history as much as those who played KOTOR did. And from what I've seen, KOTOR has little to no influence in this universe, which makes me sad since this was supposed to be based heavily on the events of those stories.

 

This is just not true. Yes, they did merge some of the original movie elements into the Old Republic, but you have KOTOR influence everywhere, but mostly in Empire areas.. Tales of the Jedi armor setpieces are everywhere, pureblood sith running around, korriban, dromund kaas... a TON of areas have the Old Republic feel to them.

 

Just check out this all of these screenshots http://imgur.com/a/IHXIl

 

In fact its mind bobbling how you can even say that... everywhere I go in this game I am reminded of KOTOR and Tales of the Jedi.

Edited May 19, 2013 by Jemfisto

Yeah, people have been making the complaint that TOR looks more like the trilogies than KotOR did. And in some ways, it's very valid, because the devs sort of twisted lore to get things to look more like the Star Wars everybody knew and loved from the movies, regardless of whether the timeline worked out.

 

But the thing is, that's what KotOR itself did a decade ago, too. In Tales of the Jedi, which told the story of the Great Sith War, the aesthetic was very different, almost archaic, compared to KotOR's trilogy-style blaster weapons and clothing. Take a look at Ulic Qel-Droma's invasion of Coruscant. Looks kind of out of place when you compare it even to KotOR, right?

 

It is what it is. And people have spent a lot of time justifying it in Star Wars EU lore. Take a look at the Essential Guide to Warfare, which specifically had to deal with the issue of reconciling the video games' tech with that of Tales of the Jedi. Here's a link to Jason Fry and Paul Urquhart's endnotes, published on Fry's blog, where Urquhart talks about the mechanics of doing that realistically.

 

Man I love when someone knows a lot about this kinda stuff . I take the more movie like Jedi in KOTOR to be explained in the Redemption arc ToTJ when Nomi Sunrider mentions "we will create a new Jedi Council" during the Jedi convocation. A lot of reform is implied with her leadership. But yeah, the more ancient technology in ToTJ is not easily explained, but I can overlook aesthetic differences in different material, as long as the story is cohesive!

 

Since you seem to know a lot about the Old Republic era, what do you think happened to Nomi and her daughter during KOTOR and KOTOR 2?

Edited May 19, 2013 by Jemfisto

Spoiler ahead.

 

I don't see nearly enough of KOTOR as they advertised. They have Pureblood Sith in other incarnations. They have Taris, the have Tatooine, everything in the game they have somewhere else. Revan is mentioned a few times in the game, but not nearly enough to make me think that what he did has really impacted the current playthroughs. None of the classes stories have to do with Revan. And (SPOILER ALERT) in the one instance where Revan shows up, he dies. And none of his companions outside of HK-51, who is just a model of HK-47, is even mentioned, at least not in the main stories.

 

It feels like they toss his name around a few times, but in a passing comment kind of way. "Revan was here once, now lets move on to something else important."

 

I'm sorry, I just don't see enough of KOTOR in there for me to feel like this is a true sequel.

Edited May 19, 2013 by Yermog

Spoiler ahead.

 

I don't see nearly enough of KOTOR as they advertised. They have Pureblood Sith in other incarnations. They have Taris, the have Tatooine, everything in the game they have somewhere else. Revan is mentioned a few times in the game, but not nearly enough to make me think that what he did has really impacted the current playthroughs. None of the classes stories have to do with Revan. And (SPOILER ALERT) in the one instance where Revan shows up, he dies. And none of his companions outside of HK-51, who is just a model of HK-47, is even mentioned, at least not in the main stories.

 

It feels like they toss his name around a few times, but in a passing comment kind of way. "Revan was here once, now lets move on to something else important."

 

I'm sorry, I just don't see enough of KOTOR in there for me to feel like this is a true sequel.

 

Well this does take place 300 years after KOTOR. Have you read the Revan novel? Because the JK story is heavily tied in and basically IS kotor3.

Well this does take place 300 years after KOTOR. Have you read the Revan novel? Because the JK story is heavily tied in and basically IS kotor3.

 

No, I wasn't aware there was a novel. I'll take your word for it on the JK storyline, but for the rest of it, it's just different lives played out in different ways that don't have much, or even anything, to do with Revan so far. Maybe if I had read the book it would feel more connected to KOTOR, but right now, not so much.

Also, there are several references to "Clan Ordo" in the Bounty Hunter story (as in Canderous Ordo) and you even can check out Canderous's skull as a smuggler. It's on the treasure ship and has a hole in it, poor guy--went out fighting, let's hope!

 

The smuggler also delivers the head of Darth Bandon in Chapter 1 to a client on Alderaan. That's Darth Bandon, Malak's padawan who attacked Revan on Korriban in KotOR 1.

 

I know I've seen a few more sprinkled nods to the original, such as a Miraluka jedi with the last name Marr (Visas Marr's descendent, perhaps??) and of course the more copious mentions of Revan throughout (Revanites on Dromond Kaas, Infinity Engine quest on Nar Shadda, Maelstrom, The Foundry, etc.)

No, I wasn't aware there was a novel. I'll take your word for it on the JK storyline, but for the rest of it, it's just different lives played out in different ways that don't have much, or even anything, to do with Revan so far. Maybe if I had read the book it would feel more connected to KOTOR, but right now, not so much.

 

Please check it out. Its awesome. I heavily recommend the audiobook for music and sound effects, plus you can listen while you play TOR!

Edited May 20, 2013 by Jemfisto

No, I wasn't aware there was a novel. I'll take your word for it on the JK storyline, but for the rest of it, it's just different lives played out in different ways that don't have much, or even anything, to do with Revan so far. Maybe if I had read the book it would feel more connected to KOTOR, but right now, not so much.

 

What you seem to want is basically Kotor 3 or a BW developed Kotor 2. A lot of things are the way they are in TOR because it's an MMO. Everything else is always going to come second to that fact.

 

Note the reason the game is set 300 years later was to intentionally create distance from all that existing content so that they wouldn't have to explain all that stuff in game and could give themselves some breathing room.

 

Oh and Bastila Shaun plays a part in the Jedi Consular storyline. Most of the class storylines dont have anything to do with KOTOR though and there's really no reason to. Hell there's really not much of a reason to explain any of that stuff in game. What is there was done as fan service, ie The Revanites.

 

The KOTOR series isn't meant to be the Revan series. Of the 3 games only 1 focused on him.

When I launched the game for the first time (over a year ago now) the first thought that popped into my head was, "man technology has not changed much in 3000 years ." But as others have said, the reasoning is simple, they wanted the game's ambient design to resemble the movies as closely as possible so that anyone walking off the street would instantly know what side was what. Not everyone who plays this game has played KOTOR or read the EU.

What you seem to want is basically Kotor 3 or a BW developed Kotor 2. A lot of things are the way they are in TOR because it's an MMO.

 

No, that's not what I want from these games. I like them as thy are. I was simply stating that there is, overall, little to do with the KOTOR games since they (the devs) figure the big bucks are in movies. I don't mind it. I was saying it in response to someone saying that he could see KOTOR influences in the game.

Edited May 20, 2013 by Yermog

don't get me wrong there are a lot of aspects that I like and some that really bug me as a star wars fan

 

the ones that have jumped out at me

 

the "empire cap ships and shuttles" showing definatel links to equipment that was NEW designs for the galactic empire

troops whos armor looks an awful lot like storm trooper /clone trooper gear

the same manufactures around that are around in the ANH era (I get really suspicious when corrilian enterprises is still making ships after ~4000 years or more?

Spoiler ahead.

 

I don't see nearly enough of KOTOR as they advertised. They have Pureblood Sith in other incarnations. They have Taris, the have Tatooine, everything in the game they have somewhere else. Revan is mentioned a few times in the game, but not nearly enough to make me think that what he did has really impacted the current playthroughs. None of the classes stories have to do with Revan. And (SPOILER ALERT) in the one instance where Revan shows up, he dies. And none of his companions outside of HK-51, who is just a model of HK-47, is even mentioned, at least not in the main stories.

 

It feels like they toss his name around a few times, but in a passing comment kind of way. "Revan was here once, now lets move on to something else important."

 

I'm sorry, I just don't see enough of KOTOR in there for me to feel like this is a true sequel.

 

Here's the thing, this was never intended to be a true sequel to KOTOR. It's more of a spiritual successor if you will. KOTOR was the story of Revan. That game is done and his story over. SWTOR is the story of Darth Nox / The Barsen'thor / The Commander of Havoc / Cipher Nine, etc. It was always advertised as such too; I'm not sure why you're thinking it was.

World War I occurred over 100 years ago. No one today ever hardly talks about it anymore, because hardly anyone cares. Revan and everything he did was about 300 years before SWTOR. The new generations simply do not talk about him, his name, actions, and importance has faded with time.

world war i occurred over 100 years ago

 

1914-1918

1914-1918

 

99 years ago since the start then to be exact

 

But anyway, I think the story of Revan is pretty much over. He was a good guy, turned evil, became good again, was locked away for 300 years, presumed dead, returned and then got killed. For him to come back -again- would be a little overkill in my opinion. End the story during it's prime time, instead of finding new ways to continue the story of Revan and eventually make him a boring man who keeps coming back.

To me this game feels way more like new star wars than KOTOR. Its been years since Ive played KOTOR but I dont remember any of this stuff about separatists and troopers that look exactly like clone troopers. There were mandolorians, regular soldiers, and sith. I find it hard to swallow that the republic held onto that trooper design for 3000 years, and I keep seeing a lot of technology and designs that I would not expect to exist yet. I liked KOTOR because it was a completely different look on the Star Wars universe, but this game is feeling like it was set not long before Phantom Menace.

 

There were also echani and zalbrak. (Gotta love that scene in the Manaan bar)

Well this does take place 300 years after KOTOR. Have you read the Revan novel? Because the JK story is heavily tied in and basically IS kotor3.

 

That's just an insult to the incredibly high calibre of writing in kotor compared to Mary Sue with a chip on her shoulder in this game.

 

I've played the knight story, and it's no kotor 3.

Edited May 21, 2013 by EnzoForMe

1914-1918

 

I couldn't remember exactly.

99 years ago since the start then to be exact

 

But anyway, I think the story of Revan is pretty much over. He was a good guy, turned evil, became good again, was locked away for 300 years, presumed dead, returned and then got killed. For him to come back -again- would be a little overkill in my opinion. End the story during it's prime time, instead of finding new ways to continue the story of Revan and eventually make him a boring man who keeps coming back.

This is why I was disappointed that Revan was still alive. Apart from utterly destroying any claim the Republic and the Jedi might have had to being the 'good guys' in the war, the Foundry FP seemed like kind of a weak way out. Yeah, it gave the Revan story a little bit of closure - you know, assuming you don't think that he's still alive (and considers the whole thing to be a triumph and a huge success).

 

But that closure meant turning Revan from a galaxy-saving redeemed hero into a psychopathic loon who couldn't stop flirting with the dark side until the Emperor finally dragged him under. Before, he was a good guy who fell for what seemed like decent reasons, but was saved. After the Foundry, it's hard to see him as ever having been committed to the light at all. His later actions color those from before. He ends up looking like just a loose cannon that the Council periodically got desperate enough to turn on their enemies, just to keep their own hands from getting dirty. There was some moral ambiguity in the Revanchists' war with the Mandalorians: is it right to fight a war to save people, or not? But there's zero moral ambiguity whatsoever in attempting total genocide.

 

At least the Exile didn't get tarred with the same brush. But she avoided that fate by going out like a punk in the novel. Oh well.