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Nerf Denova?


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The top few of the hardcore raiders which is only roughly a smidgeon of the player base is outspoken about not these not being nerfed.

 

They are also the ones that requested things to be more challenging.

 

As a hardcore gamer, I feel it's necessary to make things difficult but not to the point of ridiculous within a certain amount of consideration for time spent learning the mechanics and working as a team to accomplish the goal.

 

As a tier 2 operation, the necessity to have the entire group go in with the highest level equipment that was farmed for the guild in previous levels of difficulty is the responsibility of the raid itself.

 

On that note, farm the storymode difficulty enough times to build up your raid just like you farmed other operations to build up equipment and player understanding of the mechanics THEN go into the hard mode and do that one.

 

Guilds who are just jumping straight into the EC HM (denova) right off the bat in full rakata will have more trouble then those that have spent a few or more weeks in the regular storymode.

 

HOWEVER. IF a guild of full rakata+ go and of course get passed toth and zorn then do stormcaller and spend 3-4 nights of 5-6 hours each doing stormcaller and only to not be able to pass the rage timer on them - there's something wrong with the event. Which then of course needs a little consideration in adjusting it.

 

The DPS change from rakata -> campaign is minute at best. Which makes the difficulty of the encounter a bit more stringent and requires a specific raid makeup - and when a required group make up is a necessity it leaves out players that are capable and want to enjoy the game; even if they are hard core.

 

Much like the LI HM, the 2nd boss - it's VERY doable with ranged dps on that boss and a extraneously more difficult with melee + ranged as the dps. Not to mention having a guardian/jugg tank instead of shadow again increases its difficulty. The same goes with Denova.

 

If a raid has a necessity to take only certain classes it needs to be "adjusted". Although some people might argue that - that isn't the case do not really recognize the game as it is played and acknowledge it.

 

So, if you can read through this jumble of thoughts you will notice that I am not really against nerfing it and am for people farming the storymode first - however I am also in favor of adjusting certain encounters to be more forgiving for the raid makeup.

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It's overturned. It's called "story mode" for a supposed reason.

 

It's not about people wanting gear handed to to them, it's not about people wanting to walk into an instance and bosses fall over. It's about the lowest level of 1.2 raiding steamrolling casual guilds, and being nearly impossible for pugs.

 

It's simply overtuned and way too unforgiving for the playerbase it was designed for.

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Fair enough, just dont get mad when they stop producing content for 5% of the population

 

Sorry to say this but get over yourself. Its not 5% of the population, its actually doing the content. The difficulty of this raid is perfect for tier 2 and allows a good amount of diversity. Raids are not meant to be simple, easy, or straightforward.

 

Honestly, its not catering to the 5% of the population, its rewarding players for learning and improving. Once something becomes easily accomplished in raiding where working for something becomes simple to the most unskilled and unattentive of players, there is an issue.

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Much like the LI HM, the 2nd boss - it's VERY doable with ranged dps on that boss and a extraneously more difficult with melee + ranged as the dps. Not to mention having a guardian/jugg tank instead of shadow again increases its difficulty. The same goes with Denova.

 

Did it with a Powertech and Marauder on my Juggernaut tank and I'm telling you ... not a lot of fun, but possible.

Won't repeat the experience though. Ever.

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Did it with a Powertech and Marauder on my Juggernaut tank and I'm telling you ... not a lot of fun, but possible.

Won't repeat the experience though. Ever.

 

^ didn't say it was impossible - said that it was more difficult the more out of -core- setup of group you get.

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Toth and Zorn encounter is fine.

 

I play a Marauder, and run a casual 8 man ops group. We are NOT the top 5%, or even the top 20%, but we got the first boss in 2 hrs worth of pulls. It's not that bad for melee, but the usual "run away a lot" rules do apply.

Edited by Damodude
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Sorry to say this but get over yourself. Its not 5% of the population, its actually doing the content. The difficulty of this raid is perfect for tier 2 and allows a good amount of diversity. Raids are not meant to be simple, easy, or straightforward.

 

Honestly, its not catering to the 5% of the population, its rewarding players for learning and improving. Once something becomes easily accomplished in raiding where working for something becomes simple to the most unskilled and unattentive of players, there is an issue.

 

I'm not sure where you are seeing this great diversity. EV/KP story mode raiders are done, their next step is HM EV/KP and if they could do that they wouldn't be story mode EV/KP raiders. Even if every other raider continues to raid the raiding population just took a hit. Nevermend the hardmode raiders that bail on the new raid. So much for diversity.

 

With less people raiding creating raids becomes a lower priority. It simple business logic whether you like it or not.

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Do you honestly want no challenge?

 

This is what I don't understand about MMO players. If something isn't conquered right away they start to cry about it's difficulty. I would be truly mad if this new (really enjoyable imo) operation offered no additional challenge to players. That is what kills progression, and when you have no progression, you have no game.

 

If Denova went down as easily as EV or KP, then what is the point of raiding in this game? Challenge yourself for once. The instance drops rakata and black hole gear for a reason.

 

I have no problem with the level of difficulty. I have done both Reg and HM and NM EV/KP. I have got all the way to Last boss in Story mode in EC. But the post i was quoting was that fact that he was saying that they shouldn't raid if they cant figure out the mechanics of it.

 

But there are people out there that cant handle the difficulty, if it is made easier then gear as well should be caped at T2 at the most. and if they want to do HM then it should be T3 and T4.

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Considering our raid is made up of 90% of people aged 25+ with families, jobs and lives (I myself am 33 and have a wife and 4 year old son getting ready to start school this year), and a few college students.

 

We raid 2 nights a week - 4 hours those nights.

 

We are casual.

 

We easily beat story mode on 16 man and 8 man, we have beaten 3/4 on hard mode.

 

Your whole argument of elitist and casual is 100% completely wrong.

 

Time spent playing =/= skill. Period.

 

And it doesn't take much skill for the new operations - it just requires people to actually pay attention.

 

I'm so proud of you, good for you, your not the 95%. not everybody is the same, not everybody is like you and your group. so my argument does stand. just because you and your Group have done it all, I say woopi- de-do. again they pay for content, they should have a right to said content. its not for you to decide who gets to see what. why does it bother you so much if story mode gets nerfed? how does it impact you in the least? I will answer it for you. it doesn't. if you want A challenge do HM and Nightmare mode. that's why there there for the people that have to be elitist and say o ooh we got a server first

Edited by Snakeyees
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It's overturned. It's called "story mode" for a supposed reason.

 

It's not about people wanting gear handed to to them, it's not about people wanting to walk into an instance and bosses fall over. It's about the lowest level of 1.2 raiding steamrolling casual guilds, and being nearly impossible for pugs.

 

It's simply overtuned and way too unforgiving for the playerbase it was designed for.

My casual raiding guild just cleared to Kephess over the weekend on our first try at the operation. Using three pugs.

 

It's a step up from KP and EV, as it should be since the loot is also a step up. It forces people to pay attention to mechanics instead of just being able to heal through them. Just because you can't do it doesn't mean it's too hard.

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I'm so proud of you, good for you, your not the 95%. not everybody is the same, not everybody is like you and your group. so my argument does stand. just because you and your Group have done it all, I say woopi- de-do. again they pay for content, they should have a right to said content. its not for you to decide who gets to see what. why does it bother you so much if story mode gets nerfed? how does it impact you in the least? I will answer it for you. it doesn't. if you want A challenge do HM and Nightmare mode. that's why there there for the people that have to be elitist and say o ooh we got a server first

 

Better idea; how about you just actually pay attention? Are you saying you can't avoid simple damage that gives you plenty of time to avoid? And how it affects the "elitist," simple.... That just puts the raid on farm and it becomes a faceroll. Oh and before you say, "well, you don't have to do it then if it's so easy" well, you don't have to raid if it's so "difficult."

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There is no reason to nerf this operation, AT ALL. Just because it says story mode, doesn't mean it should be as easy as people are trying to want it to be. It's still tier 2 content, doesn't matter if it's story mode. I'm not here to play this game and have everything handed out to me, or have operations of farm status.

 

I still don't understand how people in Rakata can't complete this operation on Story Mode. It makes zero sense.

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It either needs nerfed or raiding for "casuals" is over in this game.

 

Not everyone considers wiping all night trying to learn the dance steps as fun. Many will come into this place wipe a half a dozen times and just quit raiding.

 

Then when it's down to 5% of the population raiding it won't make sense to devote a bunch of devs to that content.

 

I completely agree.

 

Although you'll find that most people who post here will disagree and BW definitely will not listen. That has been their problem all along and they are still moving further in the wrong direction.

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The place doesn't need to be nerfed. The players need to be better.

 

IF they do anything it better ONLY be to story mode....let the baddies have that and leave HM and NM (when it comes) alone.

 

enjoy playing the game by yourself in 6 months.

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Better idea; how about you just actually pay attention? Are you saying you can't avoid simple damage that gives you plenty of time to avoid? And how it affects the "elitist," simple.... That just puts the raid on farm and it becomes a faceroll. Oh and before you say, "well, you don't have to do it then if it's so easy" well, you don't have to raid if it's so "difficult."

 

A lot of people aren't raiding because it's too "difficult". Those people are leaving the game, in a few more months the game will be barren and you can enjoy what you and others on the forum have reaped.

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But there are people out there that cant handle the difficulty, if it is made easier then gear as well should be caped at T2 at the most. and if they want to do HM then it should be T3 and T4.

 

The problem is that the people who find it too difficult are about 80% of the player base. Also we should just be happy with our T2 knowing that we can't achieve T3 or T4? Yeah people will stick around for that.

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I'm not sure where you are seeing this great diversity. EV/KP story mode raiders are done, their next step is HM EV/KP and if they could do that they wouldn't be story mode EV/KP raiders. Even if every other raider continues to raid the raiding population just took a hit. Nevermend the hardmode raiders that bail on the new raid. So much for diversity.

 

With less people raiding creating raids becomes a lower priority. It simple business logic whether you like it or not.

 

I agree with everything except, that, people wont just stop raiding. They will quit. The servers where getting bare before with the current level of difficulty. Since BW went with making the ops harder, that pretty much killed the game.

 

People came back for 1.2, where disappointed with the new raid, now they will all leave again and even some of the people who stuck it out will leave now also. BW has made a HUGE mistake.

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Why are you making post after post. Do you not know how to use the quote feature?

 

Who are these people that are disappointed with the new raid? If anything I see more people raiding on my server now. Stop with your anecdotal evidence. Just admit that you can't accomplish a simple task such as Story Mode Denova, and you want it to be made easier so you can get the best gear with no effort.

Edited by KonohaFlash
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I really don't see a reason to nerf storymode, you shouldn't be able to just walk into this fight and get it done without ANY co-ordination at all. Having kills in both modes I can tell you Story Mode is considerably a lot easier and allows room for error.
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