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Sith warrior story fail, Malavai Quinn


Lassiec

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@JediElf

 

A slightly unhinged Quinn yes... over the top crazy .. No thanks. I also wonder how this would affect his personal relationship with the female SW, and not just the professional one that they may have had prior to this.

 

Though with the crew dealing with it, I suppose it depends on how the player answered his question at the end of that particular incident. I know my SW chose to keep it a secret just between the two of them, mostly because it really was just her and Quinn on that ship and can be kept a secret. However, that being said, she could potentially use that particular bit of information as leverage or blackmail if needed against him. I don't think that it would go that far though in her case but you never know.

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A slightly unhinged Quinn yes... over the top crazy .. No thanks.

 

Agreed. I don't think he'd lose complete control of himself, but, if he had a few little cracks forming, just around the edges....it would be interesting.

 

Though with the crew dealing with it, I suppose it depends on how the player answered his question at the end of that particular incident. I know my SW chose to keep it a secret just between the two of them, mostly because it really was just her and Quinn on that ship and can be kept a secret. However, that being said, she could potentially use that particular bit of information as leverage or blackmail if needed against him. I don't think that it would go that far though in her case but you never know.

 

I choose that option as well. However I was pondering if it may come out int he future, perhaps in a crisis moment with the crew, or in some other way.

 

This is why I love this arc so much! Even with the Sith Warrior Male (who sadly can't romance Quinn *sigh*) their is so much potential for deep, and complex storytelling.

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I don't think Baras said Quinn's debt was "paid in full". I believe he said Quinn had "sufficiently repaid" the debt owed to him. I interpret that as "you still owe me, but you've done enough for me to reward you from time to time, as opposed to just keep having you do things for free".

 

 

Hmm. Well said, I like that perspective.

 

Anybody know how I can get the line in the Big Scene where he says he owes Baras "more than you can imagine"? Or have a recording? I only got "Without Baras, I'd have no career."

 

The only way for Quinn to survive and have any hope of advancement was if his new boss both appreciated him and was also powerful enough to protect him, There were only 2 choices: go work behind a desk in Dromund Kaas and stay close to Baras, or follow the Sith Warrior and prove himself in the battle field. The choice seemed obvious.

 

Interesting. I figured Quinn was assigned to the Warrior as a spy - Baras, after all, already has some idea of how powerful you are and how powerful you can be. If he gives a small theatrical performance about this being freely chosen...well, we've seen greater efforts put forth to deceive Baras's potential competition. He ordered Draahg to always hold back in Vengean's presence - perhaps a very large effort for perhaps a very small advantage, but Baras valued that. Never let your target know what you're capable of. Always let your target believe you're happy to work for/with them.

 

I think someone else mentioned that even though Quinn is serving the Wrath, Baras is a long established Sith Lord and thus his history and power base are more concrete whereas the Wrath is a relative newcomer. It would playing the odds trying to decide between the veteran and the newbie.

 

Yeah. In evaluating anyone other than the player, Quinn isn't in the habit of underestimating threats. He isn't fool enough to underestimate Baras's reach. People talk about his being stupid to choose trigger-happy Baras over the Wrath, but while serving Baras guarantees his execution sooner or later, defecting from Baras guarantees his death sooner. Quinn knows this.

 

I think Quinn was stuck with one of the hardest and most painful decisions of his life. Something like that can affect people deeply, even a dutiful man like him, and between the lines, he mostly likely became a bit undone at the seams, he most likely felt he was dead either way...and sometimes, even when deeply in love, we can make the wrong decisions, especially under that kind of emotional pressure.

 

My mind keeps pondering how this will affect him int he future, and how he's going to deal with his on his own, and with the crew of the fury.

 

Personally I kinda hope he comes apart a little, a very unhinged Quinn might be just as much fun, if not more fun, than Dark Side Jessa.

 

I'm not sure I can picture him experiencing strain. This is the man whose sole ambition was nearly ruined by the petty defensiveness of one man; he proceeded to serve where permitted for ten years, then get off planet and exact revenge as soon as practicable. Then he felt better. His life's calling, on hold for a decade, and his entire concern was to get even and move on. Compared to that, how distressing can it possibly be to shiv his wife (or merely his boss) then salvage the situation and once again get even? Problem, solution, done. He has never demonstrated the capacity for introspection that real remorse would require.

 

...In all his time with the Warrior, did Malavai Quinn ever apologize for anything? "I know it is meaningless to express my deep regret" may be as close as he gets, and he was trying to talk his way out of summary execution there.

 

Now, if he finally stopped believing that loyalty gets you anywhere, and realized that following the prevailing winds was the only policy that ever brought him closer to both his ambition and his revenge...imagine a mind like that freed from its old notion of honor. Wow. It is a tragedy that this man was born Force-blind.

Edited by bright_ephemera
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Now, if he finally stopped believing that loyalty gets you anywhere, and realized that following the prevailing winds was the only policy that ever brought him closer to both his ambition and his revenge...imagine a mind like that freed from its old notion of honor. Wow. It is a tragedy that this man was born Force-blind.

 

That would be another interesting development, if it happened. Quinn free of Imperial loyalty, and the emotional suppression it demanded.

 

If Quinn gave up his rank and position, I wonder what kind of job he'd have. Professional Pazaak player? Or perhaps just become a professional assassin/bodyguard for the SW.....Heck he'd make a good smuggler/bounty hunter if he wanted to. *ponders*

 

Now that would make for a very different Chapter four.

Edited by JediElf
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@bright_ephemera

 

Found you a youtube link for that scene about debts with Baras:

 

Hope that helps some.

 

For myself, I believe that I contemplated the whole Quinn as spy line of thought after the incident as well, it was actually the first line of reasoning I went to. It didn't actually occur to me that Quinn may have approached the SW in order to protect his career in regards to Moff Broysce.

 

Also Ephemera, you brought up that point about how Quinn never really apologises, regret really isn't the same and yes we could argue that he's just trying to avoid execution there but it also sounded like he just wanted it over. Granted that particular interpretation of the voice work is VERY subjective. Even the whole scene on Corellia, which I didn't get because I didn't trust the jerk out of my sight :(, doesn't have him apologizing either.

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@bright_ephemera

Found you a youtube link for that scene about debts with Baras:

 

Hope that helps some.

 

That scene drives me nuts, if only because the SW accuses Quinn of rugged good looks. If a five o' clock shadow alone constituted rugged good looks...well, the world would be a pretty handsome place. Spend a few minutes considering Harrison Ford or Robert Redford, then get back to me. Fools. I'll give Quinn "classic," okay? Hrmph.

 

Grumble grumble. I bet a man wrote that line.

 

I thought there was a literal "more than you can imagine" debt statement somewhere, possibly in the late-game confrontation, and I'd love to hear how Quinn delivers it.

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Ephemera:

 

Found a couple of scenes for you .. first one male SW

there's some game play in this one so just skip to about 2minutes in.

 

Here's one with a female SW

Go into about 50secs and start from there.

 

I have a vague recollection of the line you're saying, in fact I remember Quinn saying something to that effect but I haven't been able to find it on Youtube, nor did I make a recording of it like I thought. Sadly, a second SW is low on my list to play through since I have pretty much over half the classes still to do.

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It's so fascinating how polarizing his character has become. Really I talked about him on the fleet, and with a small guild I'm a part of, and folks were, as well, completely divided between all consuming hatred, or complete mercy.

 

It was nearly an even split between...

 

The folks like me who took lite side points and forgave him, and the folks who took the dark side points and force choked him, with no one taking the no alignment option.

 

Seriously I think this is awesome, I hope the writers build on this. :D

Edited by JediElf
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Ephemera:

 

Found a couple of scenes for you .. first one male SW

there's some game play in this one so just skip to about 2minutes in.

 

Here's one with a female SW

Go into about 50secs and start from there.

 

Fascinating! I had never heard the "Baras has always been the anchor of my career and, in my opinion, of the Empire" line from that first one before.

 

The second one reminded me - Quinn does say "sorry," once in the game, to whatever companion you're with during the big scene. Even Pierce gets a deeply ironic apology. No love for the Warrior herself, though.

 

It's so fascinating how polarizing his character has become. Really I talked about him on the fleet, and with a small guild I'm a part of, and folks were, as well, completely divided between all consuming hatred, or complete mercy.

 

After considering these threads I think there might have been a way I could've not come to hate him with every fiber of my being. If I had taken things a little more slowly, and possibly not both created and power leveled the character just to get to know him, events might've happened in a different order (particularly the last few conversations vs. the big scene) and I might not have been quite so invested.

 

Well, too late to fix that one. :rolleyes: It's just this vicious self-reinforcing cycle now: 'Love' is too weak a word. I lurve him. I loave him. I luff him, two f's. I...I hate everything about him. I wish he was dead. I wish I had never met him. Dammit, I love him. And around it goes.

 

I'm dying for my friends to get to this. They all know something big goes down, because I couldn't restrain myself entirely; I just wish they could get to that part of the story themselves! But noooo, it's all Bounty Hunter and Knight and Trooper. Bah.

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I'm dying for my friends to get to this. They all know something big goes down, because I couldn't restrain myself entirely; I just wish they could get to that part of the story themselves! But noooo, it's all Bounty Hunter and Knight and Trooper. Bah.

 

Heh, I felt the same way. I have a friend playing a Juggernaut (I play a Marauder myself), and I was dying for him to finsh the class quest so I could ask him about his opinion of the Quinn betrayal.

 

His reaction was about the same as mine, it seemed; annoyed, but not surprised (though I'm far more attached to Quinn than he is). Ironically, it was his female friend who seemed more outraged at the betrayal than he is, since they often play together. (I couldn't help but wonder if she got rather attached to Quinn herself, heh.)

 

Anyways, my friend told me he took the LS choice when sparing Quinn, but ended up killing Baras at the very end (he originally started DS, but gradually turned LS during gameplay, partially because he was romancing Vette).

 

Personally, I spared Baras since I'm pure LS, but I really wanted to kill him for screwing with Quinn... (I'd like to believe that the nastiness Quinn shows the other companions during the betrayal is partly because Baras mind tricked him, since Quinn is usually so restrained in public. And the Smuggler storyline shows that while player characters can resist the mind trick, companions cannot; plus, it shows that Sith can also perform the mind trick.)

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Well, too late to fix that one. :rolleyes: It's just this vicious self-reinforcing cycle now: 'Love' is too weak a word. I lurve him. I loave him. I luff him, two f's. I...I hate everything about him. I wish he was dead. I wish I had never met him. Dammit, I love him. And around it goes.

 

It's such a credit to this game that we can feel so much for the characters, and I find my self both laughing, and crying, along with the story arcs, and decisions that I have to make....it's amazing. I swear I may never got back to an MMO where I have to read a boring text box, and then kill 10 rats.

 

(I'd like to believe that the nastiness Quinn shows the other companions during the betrayal is partly because Baras mind tricked him, since Quinn is usually so restrained in public. And the Smuggler storyline shows that while player characters can resist the mind trick, companions cannot; plus, it shows that Sith can also perform the mind trick.)

 

I'm leaning towards that line of thought , as well.

 

Oh and I also have...well..my own theory (http://www.swtor.com/community/showpost.php?p=4287838&postcount=31), as to why his loyalty was absolute....even if he didn't know it himself.

 

*adjusts her C3PO shaped tinfoil hat*

Edited by JediElf
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And the Smuggler storyline shows that while player characters can resist the mind trick, companions cannot; plus, it shows that Sith can also perform the mind trick.)

 

My absolute favorite "some can resist a Jedi mind trick and some can't" scene comes in the JK line on Hoth. I'll see if I can dig out a link when I get home; it's a mild spoiler for a step in the planetary line, nothing huge. And it's comedy.

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And the Smuggler storyline shows that while player characters can resist the mind trick, companions cannot; plus, it shows that Sith can also perform the mind trick.)

 

Not Sith, not companions, but it reminded me, the first thirty seconds here has my favorite NPC-mind-trick-resistance example:

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It's so fascinating how polarizing his character has become. Really I talked about him on the fleet, and with a small guild I'm a part of, and folks were, as well, completely divided between all consuming hatred, or complete mercy.

 

It was nearly an even split between...

 

The folks like me who took lite side points and forgave him, and the folks who took the dark side points and force choked him, with no one taking the no alignment option.

 

Seriously I think this is awesome, I hope the writers build on this. :D

 

Wait.. there was a neutral options?! If they had left the Force Choke = Quinn dies, then I probably would have taken that.

 

And why, why can't we the SW get an actual apology from the scuzebag.... wait when Quinn says "I'm sorry it's come to this..." is that an actual apology or just a reference to the whole situation?

 

I'm waiting for my husband to actually get to this scene, there's this running joke between us that I can't keep a secret about movies, tv, games or books and I've been really really good about this so far. He absolutely detests Quinn in general and his SW is still only on Quesh, I think. But nuuuuu, he wants to finish his JK and SI first... *sigh*

 

@Ephemera

I think you're right about the pacing though, I actually don't hate the guy even after the "incident", but keep in mind I knew it was going down beforehand mostly because I couldn't help myself and started watching youtube vids on the romance options and saw that one vid. Pacing things did help and really by the time I hit Taris I was already maxed affection with him and had to limit myself to doing his conversations one or two over the course of the day or planet. I had a lot of time off in the early part of the year so it was easy to level the SW quickly. The self imposed limits were mostly due to remember what happened on my JC with Iresso because I had pretty much finished all his conversations within the space of 3 days and it only took that long because I had a missing companion for a bit due to the class quest.

 

I think part of me as also just plain impressed that Quinn had the balls to try and take out the SW to begin with regardless of whether Quinn felt conflicted about it or not.

Edited by Kalterien
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I think part of me as also just plain impressed that Quinn had the balls to try and take out the SW to begin with regardless of whether Quinn felt conflicted about it or not.

 

Same here! That takes some big brass ones. :eek:

 

Also I think there was a third option...I think...I was emotional at the time, or I might be thinking of another choice....oh now i'm not sure. >_<

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I have quite a good solution to killing off companions. You get to kill them, and then you get a replacement for them in the form of a generic companion. For example, if you kill Quinn, you get an "Imperial Agent" who functionally identical, but you get no dialogue or story options with him. Therefore, the decision to kill quinn will only impact your story. I am surprised nobody at Bioware thought up this solution.
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I have quite a good solution to killing off companions. You get to kill them, and then you get a replacement for them in the form of a generic companion. For example, if you kill Quinn, you get an "Imperial Agent" who functionally identical, but you get no dialogue or story options with him. Therefore, the decision to kill quinn will only impact your story. I am surprised nobody at Bioware thought up this solution.

 

*runs off to hug her Quinn "It's okay, snuggle-bunny, an IA could never replace you."*

 

It would be nice to have those options, probably when they release more companions BW might bring back the option to kill or atleast release those companions you are less than fond of. Me, I like my backstabbie, traitorous Quinn who may or may not actually be loyal to me now that Darth Baras is dead.

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I found the "I owe him more than you can imagine" line! It happens if your femWarrior gets paranoid/jealous on the opening line:

 

"If you say 'it's not me, it's you,' I won't be held responsible for my actions." Love it :i_biggrin:

 

Also I think there was a third option...I think...I was emotional at the time, or I might be thinking of another choice....oh now i'm not sure. >_<

 

I've never seen anyone take the middle "You're still useful to me." Honestly, who's going to be feeling level-headed and morally neutral at a time like that?

 

I think part of me as also just plain impressed that Quinn had the balls to try and take out the SW to begin with regardless of whether Quinn felt conflicted about it or not.

 

Ballsy he may be, but as far as I'm concerned setting himself against me puts him firmly in "too dumb to live" territory. Where he was clever, I always helped him carry out his plans; where he was brave, I always backed him up with my strength; where he's fatally stupid, hey, I won't deny him his just and rational reward.

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I found the "I owe him more than you can imagine" line! It happens if your femWarrior gets paranoid/jealous on the opening line:

 

"If you say 'it's not me, it's you,' I won't be held responsible for my actions." Love it :i_biggrin:

 

I've never seen anyone take the middle "You're still useful to me." Honestly, who's going to be feeling level-headed and morally neutral at a time like that?

 

Ballsy he may be, but as far as I'm concerned setting himself against me puts him firmly in "too dumb to live" territory. Where he was clever, I always helped him carry out his plans; where he was brave, I always backed him up with my strength; where he's fatally stupid, hey, I won't deny him his just and rational reward.

 

Thanks for finding that, by the way. Now that you've mentioned that middle option, I have a vague recollection of picking it just to see how it played out AFTER I escaped out of choking the everliving crap out of Quinn a couple of times. Checked the other response too and just went back to the choke. :D

 

I remember listening to his response if you bascially break up with him at the end of that and I've never really been able to decide if his regret was for trying to kill you or that he's just going to miss getting laid on a regular-ish basis.

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The second one reminded me - Quinn does say "sorry," once in the game, to whatever companion you're with during the big scene. Even Pierce gets a deeply ironic apology. No love for the Warrior herself, though.

 

Not at all! Even after direct "I thought you loved me" all he says "I did not want to choose between you two". Love! Ha!

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I thought there was a literal "more than you can imagine" debt statement somewhere, possibly in the late-game confrontation, and I'd love to hear how Quinn delivers it.

 

This

has it. About 30 second into it. Basically, when the betrayal scene starts, if you chose the option "are you breaking up with me" Quinn tells you that it's not you or him, but it's Baras, and that he owes Baras more than you can imagine.

 

I paced my SW progress (yes, I was spoiled, too) and saved the last 3 conversations till after the betrayal, in the following order:

  1. Betryal
  2. Scene where he went all out to save the Darth, and subsequently said that he was making up for past indiscretions. At this point I chose to forgive him ("water under bridge" option)
  3. Technical Changes. I went the path of having him asking how long you were going to keep the distance attitude, and then he went on a limb since he's already dangling. At that point my SW admits that she felt the same way about him.
  4. Kill Draagh (for the 3rd time)
  5. Proposal (I thought story-wise, Quinn's statement of together they can achieve anything makes sense after defeating Draagh the 3rd time, especially since it was such a tough fight)
  6. Kill Baras (as a couple.)
  7. Final legacy conversation

 

The story felt smoother that way. The way the story played out for me was that Quinn joined the SW because that's the best and the only real option he has. (I really believe that's why he joined the SW. One of his post-marriage letter talking about if he was going to die young he would rather doing so fight in battle fields next to you instead of behind a desk in Dromund Kaas. To me, that implies he considered those being the only two career options, and stuck in Dromund Kaas is not really better than stuck in Balmorra).

 

Quinn spent the next few rounds of conversation trying to resist the SW's seductions because he's fully aware of the inevitable battle between SW and Baras. Unfortunately for him, his feelings betrayed him and he fell for the SW.

 

After Quesh, Baras thought SW was killed, and they were off his radar. Without the frequent presence of Baras to constantly pulling him the other direction, his feeling for the SW starts to get the upper hand. After SW helped him taking out the Boysce, he finally completely succumbed to his feeling for the SW and went into a relationship with her.

 

Unfortunately, taking out Boysce put them back on the radar and Baras realized that the SW was not dead, so he sent Draagh, for the second time, to take them out. When Draagh failed, Baras realized that he needed something more scheming and called in the debt that Quinn owes to him. I believe at this point Baras is fully aware that Quinn and the SW are involved. So whether or not Quinn succeeds, it's a big blow to the SW. It's a win-win for Baras.

 

To me, Quinn's decision to side with Baras is completely inline with his personality and values. I don't think Baras needed to do mind control. Quinn has always been conflicted about his relationship with the SW, concerned that it will cloud his judgement. Baras just needs to make Quinn believe that he was indeed compromised. Reason for siding with Baras is clear: it's for the Empire! Baras will lead the Empire to victory. He owes Baras everything. Everything just points that it's the right thing to do. Reason for siding with the SW is not as clear. SW is working for an absentee landlord whom Quinn does not believe has been doing his duty for the Empire. Siding with SW will be purely because of his relationship with the SW. So it's more for him and not for the Empire. Another word, siding with SW is a selfish act. It reminds me of those stories where the Mofia boss makes his most honorable/duty-bound son killing the woman he loves because she's "putting the family in danger". For someone as honorable and duty-bound as Quinn is, the conflict of interest alone requires him to take the path that results in his own personal pain.

 

Personally I don't think Quinn would ever betray the SW again. Quinn didn't betray the SW because of personal agenda or dislikes of the SW. Quinn's biggest tragedy is that he followed two masters, developed strong loyalty for both and has strong desire to see both succeed. When the two masters are in conflict he had to use his morale value to break the tie. After Baras's death and the Darth Council's approval of the SW, Quinn's moral values and personal desires are fully aligned. For the first time, he is truly "not conflicted". As long as the SW keeps Quinn by his/her side and don't enable the opportunity for Quinn to develop such loyalty for yet another master, Quinn will never betray the SW again.

 

(P.S. I really think the final legacy conversation of all classes is meant to be done much later, probably after the class quest. My female IA was not paced and married Vector as soon as she could, and his second letter talked about getting to know SCORPIO. My IA hasn't met SCORPIO, yet. It was so strange. I was like: who the hell is SCORPIO? Are you having an affair? :p)

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Okay, because I'm both pathetic and curious, I grabbed the first half dozen Youtube hits for this scene and constructed a 95% complete conversation tree for your reading pleasure:

 

A. SOLO INTRO

QUINN: My lord, I regret that our paths must diverge. Out of respect, I wanted to be here to witness your fate.

(DIALOGUE 1A)

  • 1. (What do you mean?) What fate, Quinn? What are you talking about? --go to C--
  • 2. (This sounds bad.) I've got a bad feeling about this.
    QUINN: Your senses have always been keen. --go to C--
  • 3 non-romance. (You're always so dramatic.) That's what I like about you, Quinn - your flair for the theatrical.
    QUINN: It's true. I have set this stage, my lord. --go to C--
  • 3a romance. (Are you breaking up with me?) Have you found someone else? If you say 'it's not me, it's you,' I won't be responsible for my actions.
    QUINN: It's not me or you. It's Darth Baras. I owe him more than you could imagine. --go to C--

 

B. INTRO WITH COMPANIONS

QUINN: My lord, I could not leave you to this fate without showing the respect of being here to witness it.

(DIALOGUE 1B)

  • 1. (What do you mean?) What fate, Quinn? What are you talking about? --go to C--
  • 2. (What are you doing here?) Get back to the ship, captain. I didn't say you could disembark.
    QUINN: I regret that I have been disobeying many of your orders of late, my lord. --go to C--
  • 3 non-romance. (You're always welcome.) [incomplete] --go to C--
  • 3a romance. ([Flirt] Did you get lonely?) You just can’t stand to be away from me, can you, dear?
    QUINN: I have enjoyed your company and companionship, my lord. That’s why this is so hard. --go to C--

 

C. QUINN: It pains me, but this entire scenario is a ruse. There's no martial law and no special signal emitter. Baras is my true master. He had me lure you here to have you killed.

(DIALOGUE 2)

  • 1 non-romance. (How could you?) This is the worst betrayal possible.
    QUINN: I act today with a heavy heart. Baras has always been the anchor of my career and, in my opinion, of the Empire. --go to D--
  • 1a romance. (Our romance dies in flames.) And here I thought you loved me. --go to D--
  • 2 non-romance. (Don't be rash.) Think this through, Quinn, before it goes too far.
    QUINN: You know me. I never act without consideration. Baras saved my career, and he'll save the Empire. --go to D--
  • 2a romance, may trigger on any female Warrior. (Don't I mean anything to you?) I thought our relationship was real. I thought we cared about each other. --go to D--
  • 3 non-romance. (Then you deserve death.) If you are allied with that fool, you will receive no mercy from me.
    QUINN: I arrived at this moment after much deliberation. Baras has always been the anchor of my career and, in my opinion, of the Empire. --go to D--
  • 3a romance, if Act 3 conversations have been completed: (I've fought for you!) After all we've been through together? I even helped you take out Moff Broysc.
    QUINN: You've helped me immensely. I act today with a heavy heart. But without Baras, I'd have no career. --go to D--
  • 3b romance, if Act 3 conversations are not yet completed: (How could you?) This is the worst betrayal possible.
    QUINN: I act today with a heavy heart. Baras has always been the anchor of my career and, in my opinion, of the Empire. --go to D--

 

 

D. QUINN: I didn't want to choose between the two of you. But he's forced my hand, and I must side with him. --go to E, F, G, H, I, or J depending on your active companion--

 

E. SOLO

QUINN: Once you're gone, your crew will either join Baras with me or be killed. --go to L--

 

F. VETTE

VETTE: Wow, Captain Boredom makes a wake-up call. Did not see this coming.

(DIALOGUE 3A)

  • 1. (Reserve the chatter.) Keep quiet, Vette, and ready yourself for the fight.
  • 2. (Nor I.) He fooled us both, all this time. (+45 affection)
    QUINN: It hasn't been easy keeping the truth hidden.
  • 3. (Quinn's just confused.) Don't worry, he'll realize he's making a big mistake.

 

QUINN, if Vette is collared: Vette, once my lord is gone, I’ll be in control of your shock collar, and your disciplining will make sense.

otherwise

QUINN: Vette, ever since my lord removed your shock collar, you have been an insufferable pain.

 

VETTE: You know what? I say we kill this Imperial punk.

QUINN: Charming to the last. No more time to waste. It's my extreme pleasure to take you out of the equation. --go to K--

 

G. DS JAESA

DS JAESA: This kind of intrigue makes my spine tingle. I'd love to kill a traitor.

QUINN: Jaesa, you have no idea how long I've held my breath hoping you wouldn't use your power on me. Baras specifically expressed that I should extend his welcoming hand to you. Join us.

DS JAESA: Are you kidding me? I may sense nothing but confidence in you, but...haha.

QUINN: Your powers will be a great benefit when Baras has turned you to him, Jaesa. For now, I can't have you disrupting my calculations. --Go to K--

 

H. LS JAESA

LS JAESA: Quinn, this is a terrible mistake. We will make the Empire better.

(DIALOGUE 3B)

  • 1. (Listen to her, Quinn.) You should pay attention. This is a bad career move.
  • 2. (Save your breath, Jaesa.) Let me do the talking, and be ready to strike.
  • 3. (‘Better’ is subjective.) Something tells me Quinn’s idea of ‘better’ may not coincide with ours.

 

QUINN: Jaesa, you have no idea how long I've held my breath hoping you wouldn't use your power on me. You could have stopped me long before my preparations were complete. Now I have the upper hand.

JAESA: Master, his confidence is quite high. I see little to no doubt in him.

QUINN: Your powers will be a great benefit when Baras has turned you to him, Jaesa. For now, I can't have you disrupting my calculations. --Go to K--

 

 

I. PIERCE

PIERCE: Knew there was a reason I wanted to put a gun to his head the minute I met him.

(DIALOGUE 3C)

  • 1. (Your wish is coming true.) You’re about to get your chance. (+120)
  • 2. (Steady, Lieutenant.) Let’s hear the man out, but be ready. (-3)
  • 3. (Quinn is not the enemy.) The captain will realize he’s making an incredible mistake.

 

QUINN: Pierce, Baras asked me if you’d be a valuable asset. I told him you were physically capable, but not worth the trouble. Sorry.

PIERCE: Ha. You think I’d join you and some cowardly puppeteer? You guys are going nowhere.

QUINN: Charming to the last. No more time to waste. It’s my extreme pleasure to take you out of the equation. --go to K--

 

J. BROONMARK

BROONMARK: More betrayal! We must cleanse the clan!

(DIALOGUE 3D)

  • 1. (Ready yourself.) Sharpen your claws, Broonmark. You're about to get them bloody. (+120)
  • 2. (Patience.) Hold still, Broonmark. We won't attack hastily. (-90)
  • 3. (A never-ending demand.) Yes, it seems there is always more cleansing to be done.

 

QUINN: Broonmark, Darth Baras has no quarrel with you. Join me, and he will welcome you to the fold.

BROONMARK: You insult us. We never betray. Our pledge is complete. Our pledge is always.

QUINN: 'Always' is about to become a very short amount of time. Sorry, Broonmark, but I can't have you disrupting my calculations. --go to K--

 

K. Quinn incapacitates the companion.

QUINN: Baras and I have been planning this for some time. You'll have to face this fight alone, my lord. –go to L--

 

L.

(DIALOGUE 4)

  • 1. (Baras is only out for himself.) Your master will run the Empire right into the ground.
    QUINN: Baras has always been one step ahead of every enemy. He will lead us to victory. --go to M--
  • 2. (Baras defies the Emperor.) You know who I'm working for now, Captain. If you stand with Baras, you stand against the Emperor himself.
    QUINN: The Emperor is an absentee landlord. Baras is doing what any real patriot would do. --go to M--
  • 3. (You're a fool, Quinn.) I really thought you were smarter than this.
    QUINN: I'll show you how smart I am. --go to M--

 

M. QUINN: After all this time observing you in battle, I have exhaustively noted your strengths and weaknesses. These war droids have been programmed specifically to combat you. I calculate a near zero percent chance of their failure.

(DIALOGUE 5)

  • 1. (Stats are unreliable.) Your confidence in the odds is your biggest weakness.
    QUINN: If anything, I'm underestimating my droids' chances. You'll find they are virtually immune to you. --go to N--
  • 2. (Shut up. [Attack]) You always did talk too much. (I LOVE how the male Warrior says this) --go to N--
  • 3. (Then I'm in trouble.) Sounds grim. I know how thorough you are, Quinn. I’m sure this will be my greatest test.
    QUINN: And if I’m right, your last. --go to N--

 

N. QUINN: I'm sorry it's come to this, my lord.

(combat starts)

 

 

O. POST FIGHT

QUINN: I should have known. I thought I'd programmed the perfect killing machine for you. I was painstakingly precise.

(DIALOGUE 6)

  • 1. (I cannot be killed.) After all our time together, have you not realized that I am unbeatable? (+15 if Vette is present)
    QUINN: I am at a loss. --go to P--
  • 2. (You're a failure.) This proves you are inept. I’m better off without someone who makes such a mistake. (+40 if Pierce is present)
    QUINN: Perhaps you’re right. --go to P--
  • 3. (Don't be so hard on yourself.) Your droids pushed me. It was a valiant attempt.
    QUINN: That's little consolation. --go to P--

 

P. QUINN: I have betrayed you. Conspired with your most hated enemy. I know it is meaningless to express my deep regret. I don't expect your mercy.

(DIALOGUE 7)

  • 1. (You'll live...barely. [Choke him]) It's useless to defy me. (+100 DS points, deeply satisfying cutscene) I will keep you alive. And we will see if you earn my trust again.
    QUINN: My lord, I'm...this is unexpected. Darth Baras would never forgive such a failure. --go to Q--
  • 2. (You're useful to me.) I will keep you alive. And we will see if you earn my trust again. (No cutscene action)
    QUINN: My lord, I'm...this is unexpected. Darth Baras would never forgive such a failure. --go to Q--
  • 3. (I can be merciful.) I understand your confusion. Baras can be very persuasive. I forgive you, Quinn. (+150 LS points)
    QUINN: My lord, I am deeply grateful. Darth Baras would never afford the same forgiveness.
    VETTE, if present: Quinn, your luck never seems to run out. --go to Q--

 

Q. QUINN: If you will permit me to stay in your charge, my dedication to you will never come into question again.

(DIALOGUE 8)

  • 1 non-romance. (We'll see.) I'll be keeping an eye on you just the same.
    QUINN: Of course, my lord. --go to R--
  • 1a romance. (We'll see.) Trust is difficult to rebuild, Quinn. But I'm willing to try.
    QUINN: I'll understand if things are different for a while. --go to R--
  • 2 non-romance. (I know.) The slate is clean, Quinn. --go to R--
  • 2a romance. (We are breaking up.) You can rejoin the crew, but you are no longer welcome in my quarters.
    QUINN: My actions have cost me dearly, then. --go to R--
  • 3 non-romance. (Be sure that is the case.) I will not hesitate to destroy you the next time.
    QUINN: There will be no next time, I swear. --go to R--
  • 3a romance. ([Flirt] All is forgiven.) You'll just have to make this up to me in private, Captain.
    QUINN: That can be arranged, my lord. --go to R--

 

R. QUINN: This interruption has delayed you enough. I'm eager to return to the ship and put this behind us.

WARRIOR: The ship is through there. Prepare for departure. I'll join you shortly.

VETTE, if present: Whatever you say.

BROONMARK, if present: We comply.

PIERCE, if present: Let's go, Quinn.

DS JAESA, if present: You heard the master, Quinn.

LS JAESA, if present: It will be good to get back to our standard routines.

QUINN: Of course, my lord. One thing, my lord - do you plan on telling the others what happened?

(DIALOGUE 9)

  • 1. (You'd be undermined.) No one else must know. It would compromise your ability to lead. Am I understood?
    BROONMARK, if present: You are our leader. --go to S--
    PIERCE, if present: Noted. --go to S--
    LS JAESA, if present: It is for the best. --go to S--
    VETTE, DS JAESA: [incomplete] --go to S--
  • 2. (They will be told sometime.) When it's appropriate, I will inform them. --go to S--
  • 3. (Your secret's safe with me(us if companion is present).) Don't worry. This will just be between the two(three) of us. Understood?
    VETTE, if present: I know Basic. --skip S; end of scene--
    LS JAESA: It is for the best. – go to S --
    DS JAESA, LS JAESA, PIERCE, BROONMARK: [incomplete]

 

S. QUINN: I appreciate it, my lord. I will see you back at the ship. [end of scene]

 

 

Sources:

(Unkind male) (1A.2, 2.1, 4.3, 5.1, 6.1, 7.1, 8.3, 9.2)

(Male, fairly impersonal, DS)(1A.1, 2.3, 4.3, 5.2, 6.1, 7.1, 8.3, 9.2)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oghPT4CM4aQ&feature=related (Male, DS)

(Male, a few less popular early choices, DS) (1.3, 2.2, 4.2, 5.1, 6.1, 7.1, 8.3, 9.2)

All companions! DS (1B.1, 2.3, 3A.1, 3A.2, 3A.3, 3D.1, 3D.2, 3D.3, 3C.1, 3C.2, 3C.3; 1a.2, 2.1a, 4.2, 4.3, 5.2, 6.2, 7.1, 8.1a, 9.2)

Female, DS, flirty (1A.3a, 2.1a, 4.3, 5.2, 6.2, 7.1, 8.3a, 9.1)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MaB1qdEDAeY Miscellaneous alternate options for a female SW in romance; DS (1A.3a, 2.2a, 4.3, 1A.1, 2.1a, 4.2)

(Male, with Vette, DS) (1B.2, 2.3, 3A.3, 4.3, 5.1, 6.2, 7.1, 8.3, 9.2)

(Male, with Vette, LS (!!!)) (1B.1, 2.2, 3A.1, 4.3, 5.1, 6.1, 7.3, 8.3, 9.2)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NADbF9aDwjg (Male, with Vette, neutral choice; multiple less popular post-fight choices) (1B.2, 2.1, 3A.3, 4.3, 5.1, 6.2, 7.2, 8.1, 6.1, 7.1, 8.2, 9.2, 6.3, 7.3, 8.3, 9.3)

 

End this with some keywords for ease of searching: Quinn betrayal scene script dialog tree transponder station

Edited by bright_ephemera
added facts, formatting
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I paced my SW progress (yes, I was spoiled, too) and saved the last 3 conversations till after the betrayal, in the following order:

  1. Betryal
  2. Scene where he went all out to save the Darth, and subsequently said that he was making up for past indiscretions. At this point I chose to forgive him ("water under bridge" option)
  3. Technical Changes. I went the path of having him asking how long you were going to keep the distance attitude, and then he went on a limb since he's already dangling. At that point my SW admits that she felt the same way about him.
  4. Kill Draagh (for the 3rd time)
  5. Proposal (I thought story-wise, Quinn's statement of together they can achieve anything makes sense after defeating Draagh the 3rd time, especially since it was such a tough fight)
  6. Kill Baras (as a couple.)
  7. Final legacy conversation

 

The story felt smoother that way.

 

Oh. Oh. See, this was the order of operations for me, stumbling blind through this plot:

 

  1. Open Act 3
  2. blitz through the nine queued conversations, from "finally I kissed him and got him to smile, which was the purpose of this entire character and playthrough" to "married with legacy talk"
  3. Kill Draagh some more
  4. Betrayal
  5. Drag the sorry sod to the Baras fight in hopes of triggering special conversation stuff (no luck)
  6. Wail and gnash my teeth on the forums
  7. Fantasize revenge as I have never done before

 

So it looked to me like once the man ran out of self-control he just decided to use me for all I was worth, aware every single minute of what he would ultimately do to me, then fed me to the wolves. The killer mecha wolves. Talking about children, in retrospect, just seems sadistic.

 

To make matters even better, right after the betrayal I finished all my other companions' conversation lines and they all talked about possible children. I had a sudden desire for a [punch Jaesa] option...really, girl? I just had the world's messiest divorce and you want to talk about my rosy kid-filled future!?

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Oh. Oh. See, this was the order of operations for me, stumbling blind through this plot:

 

  1. Open Act 3
  2. blitz through the nine queued conversations, from "finally I kissed him and got him to smile, which was the purpose of this entire character and playthrough" to "married with legacy talk"
  3. Kill Draagh some more
  4. Betrayal
  5. Drag the sorry sod to the Baras fight in hopes of triggering special conversation stuff (no luck)
  6. Wail and gnash my teeth on the forums
  7. Fantasize revenge as I have never done before

 

So it looked to me like once the man ran out of self-control he just decided to use me for all I was worth, aware every single minute of what he would ultimately do to me, then fed me to the wolves. The killer mecha wolves. Talking about children, in retrospect, just seems sadistic.

 

To make matters even better, right after the betrayal I finished all my other companions' conversation lines and they all talked about possible children. I had a sudden desire for a [punch Jaesa] option...really, girl? I just had the world's messiest divorce and you want to talk about my rosy kid-filled future!?

 

So.....

 

I understand this was a very traumatic experience for you, and I'm sorry. But.....

 

LOL!!!!! Sorry, the way you described it was very funny. I couldn't help it. :)

 

In seriousness, though, your experience is exactly why I think the final legacy conversation was always meant to happen after the class storyline is completed. The game does not open past conversation #5 until after the end of Chapter 1, and does not open past conversation #10 until after Chapter 2. They should have blocked the final legacy conversation (maybe even the final 3) until after Chapter 3 is completed.

 

Also, even in your flow, it doesn't necessary means he intends to betray you all along. I think the theory of him being called upon by Baras after you got married, as well as the reasoning for his compliance, can still hold. Again, think of the Mofia analogy. Mofia bosses do ask their people to kill their wives if the wive is an enemy. And a duty-bound and honorable mofia member do still obey if he believes the wive is indeed putting the family in danger. He will be heartbroken, but he will still do it.

Edited by Soteirian
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I have quite a good solution to killing off companions. You get to kill them, and then you get a replacement for them in the form of a generic companion. For example, if you kill Quinn, you get an "Imperial Agent" who functionally identical, but you get no dialogue or story options with him. Therefore, the decision to kill quinn will only impact your story. I am surprised nobody at Bioware thought up this solution.

 

Because then people would complain that they need to level up another warrior to get that companion bonus (Probably the same people who complain that they have to take off Vette's shock collar to show get her other conversations).

 

Giving them the bonus for killing quinn would then open more complaints about people who go to the effort of appeasing him/giving him gifts because they didn't kill him, but people who do get the reward immediately.

 

And if you could get affection with said generic agent would unlock the bonus, there'd be people complaining about having to start over with affection for him.

 

Frankly, it feels like there's always something to complain about in these games. People are dumb.

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