you, sir, seems to have entirely forgotten about satellite humping. A good scout could hold a node from 7 people. Now, with mine layers, that isn't possible anymore: THATS A GOOD THING (it was usually me doing the pillar humping, too)

You said it exactly. A GOOD scout could hold a satellite against several attackers.

But now, even a braindead monkey with zero piloting skills can hold a satellite in his bomber.

Very good thing, yeah. So much has changed.

A few days ago, i tried the minelayer for the first time. I had only T1 upgrades and T2 reinforced armor and turbo reactor.

After capping B in Kuat Mesa i've put all power to shields, circled around the sat to avoid enemy fire and finished off fleeing enemies with my heavies.

It was a premade vs. premade match with a lot of experienced pilots and mastered ships.

At the end of the match i got the highest kill score, highest assist, highest damage and i didn't die a single time.

Most dominion matches after 2.6 follow only one rule: Who has the most bombers and gunships.

At the beginning of a match, everyone rushes to the satellites, deploys their mines and drones and for rest of the match, nothing changes.

I haven't got a single gold medal for capping since 2.6, myself. -.-

Dominion has become a very boring gameplay mode.

Bombers are already extremely powerful and give even the most experienced pilots with their mastered ships a very hard time and most bombers currently don't even have good upgrades.

Wait until people have mastered their bombers...

I don't really want to bash but...

To all the gunship pilots that complain about shooting drones and mines,

Please learn to aim

 

Yes they are tiny targets but you have a few pixels to aim at, ofcourse lower resolutions will benefit being able to hit the target better

Personally I have very little trouble AoEing down entire swaths of mines and drones for my teammates to swoop in and clean up the sattelites.

What most people haven't realized yet is, since 2.6 the hitboxes of turrets, mines and drones are displayed through objets just like ships.

However, since their hitboxes are so freaking tiny, the greyed out part that indicates that they are behind an obstacle is almost invisible. This makes it hard to distinguish if your target is in front or behind the satellite.

That's why so many people complain that they cannot hit the mines and drones. They just haven't realized, their target is behind the satellite.

Mines I can understand and generally think are ok. it's really the missile and railgun drones that I think are causing the most frustration.

I really wish the bombers could lay a few mines to help protect areas/satellites, be equipped with powerful missiles to help attack large targets (in the future this would be cap ships and/or emplacements), and then have active, targeted abilities to heal or repair friendly ship hulls. So they would be strategic offensive weapons, but also tactical true support ships. For example, imagine launching repair drones where you would need to lock on to a friendly target like you would with a missile. Or "lasers" that would instead splash and add themselves to a friendly target's shields.

Thanks a padload Bioware for completely ruining GSF. Starfighting in the Star Wars setting is, by definition, fast-paced, on the edge dogfighting. Now half the people putt putt along in their tank slugs and dogfighting has become a thing of the past. GSF gave me, for the first time in a very long time, a type of pvp that I can truly enjoy. I was completely hooked. Now you devs have ruined that for us GSF lovers. Flying around killing an endless chain of drones and mines that you can't even target with a gunship much less kill with a fighter or scout without being killed yourself is NOT starfighting!!

 

Now if someone like myself who NEVER gets on the forums takes to time to post then you know LOADS of other people are extremely dissatisfied with what GSF has become since you've added those flying tank turds.

 

People have griped in the past about gunships but they actually have very balanced strengths and weaknesses and fit in the GSF landscape quite well. If you're skilled enough gunships are not invincible. To be a successful gunship pilot one has to actually have skills. To be a successful bomber pilot, on the other hand, all one has to do is get a moderate amount of points into their ship and be able to mash the right and left mouse buttons repeatedly.

 

I liked GSF so much that I had pilots on both side of the factions. I have an imp pilot and a pub pilot on two different servers. Most folks on the Ebon Hawk and Jedi Covenant servers know or have heard of Baelyn-tiel. So anyone who knows me or knows of me, knows that I play a LOT of GSF and had always defended it against people criticized it because they couldn't master it in two days. Now any Roger Rookie can rack up the kills and assists just by flying a bomber. I tried out the bomber and I was getting in the top five on the lists with NOT ONE SINGLE POINT put into ship upgrades. That is ludicrous! Moreover, flying a bomber is slow-paced and boring.

 

I'm pretty much ready to quit GSF altogether. It's not because I think bombers are invincible. It is because they've turned starfighting into a drone/mine clean up match. That's not the GSF I have come to love to play.

 

I really got into GSF because I've maxed-leveled pretty much all of my characters. I'm actually thinking about cancelling my subscription that I've had since beta.

 

Thanks devs for ruining a brilliant stroke in pvp.

 

- Baelyn-tiel, former GSF junky

OP Chased a bomber through an asteroid field.

I just disagree with everything in the OP. Bombers have dramatically improved the game.

 

1- Not everyone is bribed into flying Flashfires.

2- Turret builders are super interesting and strategic.

3- Something with a lot of hull changes which weapons are good.

4- Something with a slow speed changes which weapons are good.

5- Something with no missile break raises the value of missiles.

 

The weak design parts about bombers are mostly based on the heavy reliance on AI components.

 

I don't feel that everything is a "drone mine cleanup match". Drones are a huge cooldown and a priority target. Mines are just mostly things to avoid, but can be aoed down.

 

I also really like the EMP components.

 

Really liking bombers.

Agreed. Personally I find that Bombers have greatly improved the game balance, offering a counter to the Scouts and elevated the Strike fighters' value as a multirole fighter. Instead of being specialized in taking out a specific role, it is effective against all of them, but not as effective as the specialist (and is, conversely, vulnerable equally against all roles).

It certainly had the biggest impact on Scout pilots though, who may feel the most targeted by the introduction of bombers. Which is fair, because they actually were: a direct counter to their role was introduced, and so scouts are no longer the kings of GSF they used to be.

But let's be clear, Scouts still kick arse, and I regularly see the good scout pilots top the charts (especially in domination), and they still serve a very important role: they're the counters to gunships who are the counters to bombers who are the counters to scouts. Without scouts around, enemy gunships are much more effective, and it can be said that scouts are also the best suited for dealing with Strike fighters.

But the days of the scouts being able to cap and hold nodes in Domination, and dominate every other ship through dogfighting are over.

That said, so far in my experience battles have NOT devolved into nothing but gunships and bombers, and the team with the more balanced makeup will generally have an edge. Mines and Drones are very visible, and mine/drone fields CAN be dealt with.

The situation is not that dire, and while bombers certainly will need some balancing tweaks (since they've never been live tested with full upgrades so far), the basic concept of the role and its introduction did more good for GSF than it did harm.

Here's the issue I'm having.

On my server and play times GSF matches are generally dominated by well coordinated groups on the other side. Whenever my team would win, it would usually be a very close match. It's easy to see and remember the names or attack patterns of the same 4-8 people. What was nice was that despite being so heavily outmatched, myself and 1-2 others could give the other good team (I will refer to them as Aces) a run for their money.

I found this to be extremely fun. We would win some and lose some, but I believe even the other side's Aces would get their blood pumping whenever they saw some of our names pop up. At least it felt that way because they were always coming after me.

Unfortunately due to 2.6, this standard of 4-8 aces per match and 1-3 on my side has completely disrupted the balance. Where we once had a fighting chance to at least have a fun match has turned into a completely one sided slaughterfest. Bombers will completely lock down satellites making capturing them impossible.

On top of each one is usually a gunship and a scout or strike ready to intercept anyone the gunship misses. At least when gunships were guarding satellites you had a chance to kill them by going into their blind spot. Bombers just drop their drones all around and hide then put all power to shields. It's not uncommon for me to unload overload, bypass, and rocket pods and only get one down to 3/4 health at best. And that's only after I've killed the gunship and blown all their one shot tracker drones to death.

I don't fault the Aces on the other team for going with the best setup. If I were in their position I would likely do the same thing. However there are just not enough Aces on my side to even make it worth while. It's unfortunate though that the friends and adversaries I've made since GSF was first introduced have gone to dust, but there is no fun in a completely unwinnable battle.

Much drama.

Such complain. So unsub. Wow.

I think bombers could use SOME balancing, but I disagree wholeheartedly that they have ruined GSF, in fact they've vastly improved it, and this is coming from a Flashfire pilot. No longer can I simply circle a satellite, laughing at the 7 people trying to damage me as I constantly circle it. Now all that has to happen to stop me doing that is for a bomber to drop a few mines and suddenly I develop a fatal case of explosionitis.

I will agree that the reliance on AI probably needs to be reduced, but of course the fact that the drones are AI also makes them very vulnerable, since as we all know, AI are about as smart as a rock with some moss on it in most games, and they are stationary which does not help them any. Strike Fighters actually serve a purpose now, gunships have been given something fat and juicy to shoot at, and the game is no longer completely dominated by lolscouts.

I think bombers could use SOME balancing, but I disagree wholeheartedly that they have ruined GSF, in fact they've vastly improved it, and this is coming from a Flashfire pilot. No longer can I simply circle a satellite, laughing at the 7 people trying to damage me as I constantly circle it. Now all that has to happen to stop me doing that is for a bomber to drop a few mines and suddenly I develop a fatal case of explosionitis.

It has always been easy to stop a circling Scout. Just stop chasing and open a short distance. Next time they circle around, boom.

While I don't think the situation is that drastic, I certainly can't disagree with anything you've said.

It's that drastic.

My only real grievance thus far is that they've gotten rid of scout hugging satelite antics - which is fine - and replaced them with bomber hugging satelite antics. Sort of defeats the point a little.

Let's compair the 2.

1) Scouts hugging satellites. Boy they are fast and slick and those Burst lasers that they have to aim carefully hit hard. If you go to remove one you can expect a heck of a dog fight. It would be super fast paced epic battle as skill goes against skill in a twisting turning (don't hit the node) feat of maneuverability and fire power. If that's not your game you could snipe them with a GS. Now I ask you. Is that a bad thing in a space fighter game?

2) Bombers hugging satellites. as soon as there team clears one for them they put in real slow. They don't need fast engines as that would require skill and those that choose bombers would likely just run into something if they where fast. Once they get there they drop 6 mines or a bunch of drones and hide. there shields can withstand GS hits so they quickly hide on a different side if a GS shoots at them. Anything else that comes in gets blown up on there mines or by there drones. They pop more out quite often and hide again. Less skill is required with bombers than operating an aimbot hack on some other games. No they are just there not contributing, not fighting, not aiming or even shooting blasters most of the time. They are just there and by being there they deny the space or the satellite to the opposing force. Let me ask you again, is this something that is good for a space fighter game?

Scouts can be annoying like a stubbed toe. The way they used Bombers to fix the problem is amputating the leg.

Let's compair the 2.

Scouts can be annoying like a stubbed toe. The way they used Bombers to fix the problem is amputating the leg.

We'll have to disagree on that one.

The big difference is that before bombers, Scouts were great at _EVERYTHING_. Their speed, maneuverability, evasion, and of course Burst Lasers made them the best satellite humpers AND the best at pretty much everything else.

Bombers, on the other, are basically good at fortifying and holding positions, which includes satellites. They've displaced the Scout in the "humping" role and serve as a counter to the scouts.

This is a GOOD thing, as it re-establishes game balance: there no longer is a role that is best at everything. Each role is great at some things, and vulnerable in others (except Strikes, which are decent at everything, but not as good as the specialists, and of course they're just as equally vulnerable).

And to be honest, I find bombers a lot easier to handle as sat humpers. They're a lot easier to hit, and despite their tanking they still go down fairly well under fire. Yes, the mines and drones ARE a challenge, but if you're not a scout they are quite manageable. I've cleared minefields before, and it's perfectly doable if you're careful.

So yes, scout sat humpers were replaced by bomber sat humpers. If sat humping was a problem, then I guess it isn't much progress... but it certainly helped balance scouts and more clearly defined their role. As for the bombers, well, I do believe there should be something to prevent or weaken bomber stacking (can only have x number of mines active in an area, or mine explosions should set off drones and mines nearby, as Nemarus suggested), but overall I think the change was a positive one.

We'll have to disagree on that one.

 

The big difference is that before bombers, Scouts were great at _EVERYTHING_. Their speed, maneuverability, evasion, and of course Burst Lasers made them the best satellite humpers AND the best at pretty much everything else.

 

Bombers, on the other, are basically good at fortifying and holding positions, which includes satellites. They've displaced the Scout in the "humping" role and serve as a counter to the scouts.

 

This is a GOOD thing, as it re-establishes game balance: there no longer is a role that is best at everything. Each role is great at some things, and vulnerable in others (except Strikes, which are decent at everything, but not as good as the specialists, and of course they're just as equally vulnerable).

 

And to be honest, I find bombers a lot easier to handle as sat humpers. They're a lot easier to hit, and despite their tanking they still go down fairly well under fire. Yes, the mines and drones ARE a challenge, but if you're not a scout they are quite manageable. I've cleared minefields before, and it's perfectly doable if you're careful.

 

So yes, scout sat humpers were replaced by bomber sat humpers. If sat humping was a problem, then I guess it isn't much progress... but it certainly helped balance scouts and more clearly defined their role. As for the bombers, well, I do believe there should be something to prevent or weaken bomber stacking (can only have x number of mines active in an area, or mine explosions should set off drones and mines nearby, as Nemarus suggested), but overall I think the change was a positive one.

This, basically. Excessive mines are a problem, but this could be fixed. Minefields can be cleared, and bombers are fairly simple to destroy as sat humpers once you've cleared the defenses. Sure, they have tons of shields and health, but then they're also a lot slower than scout sat humpers which makes them much easier to target.

Let's compair the 2.

 

1) Scouts hugging satellites. Boy they are fast and slick and those Burst lasers that they have to aim carefully hit hard. If you go to remove one you can expect a heck of a dog fight. It would be super fast paced epic battle as skill goes against skill in a twisting turning (don't hit the node) feat of maneuverability and fire power. If that's not your game you could snipe them with a GS. Now I ask you. Is that a bad thing in a space fighter game?

 

2) Bombers hugging satellites. as soon as there team clears one for them they put in real slow. They don't need fast engines as that would require skill and those that choose bombers would likely just run into something if they where fast. Once they get there they drop 6 mines or a bunch of drones and hide. there shields can withstand GS hits so they quickly hide on a different side if a GS shoots at them. Anything else that comes in gets blown up on there mines or by there drones. They pop more out quite often and hide again. Less skill is required with bombers than operating an aimbot hack on some other games. No they are just there not contributing, not fighting, not aiming or even shooting blasters most of the time. They are just there and by being there they deny the space or the satellite to the opposing force. Let me ask you again, is this something that is good for a space fighter game?

 

Scouts can be annoying like a stubbed toe. The way they used Bombers to fix the problem is amputating the leg.

AMEN BROTHA!! Now THAT ^^ is exactly what I'm saying! I have no problem at all with the devs putting in a counter to scouts, but put in a ship that takes actual skill to pilot. People have complained ad nauseum about gunships. I've never had a problem with the concept. They hit hard as hell but I've flown one and they are damn paper and slow as hell to boot, so it takes real skill to properly pilot one. Just ask anyone who's gone up against Delphi on the Ebon Hawk server. They will tell you there is a VAST difference in going up against a seasoned gunship pilot as opposed to roger rookie that thinks that just hopping into a gunship gives you the ability to own anyone in the warzone.

The gunship in and of itself presents no real challenge to a good scout or fighter pilot but if you put someone like Delphi in that ship and you better respect who you are up against. I'm glad Delphi is out there because he/she is the worthy adversary. I truly enjoy the challenge of going against a truly mustered pilot.

Bombers on the other hand take no real skill to pilot. The drones and mines do all the work for you.

Step 1: fly to a sat that's already been cleared out for you.

Step 2: drop your mines and drones and hide.

Step 3: PROFIT!!

Explain to me where piloting skill comes into play..

That's not entirely true Lugaidh .

Minelayers are fairly harmless unless you are stupid enough to get close....stay at range and you won't have a problem; even a really good player in a minelayer is going to go down hard if he cannot use his mines against you.

Dronelayers are a little different; I find that most of the time the drones aren't hugely effective at kills and generally just "stat pad" the damage meters; sure the missile or railgun turrent does pick up a few kills but they have a 120 second or so cool down and can be killed off very quickly.

The main issue is that people either get too close to minelayers or don't focus the drones down first on dronelayers. The main difficulty I think people have is when there are multiple bombers and they can stack their drones or mines..but the question is how do you balance a role around the number of other bombers you may have in a game?

I've had games of 20 kills 15 assists and 90k damage..or the reverse of 15 kills 33 assists and 88k damage..granted I am a good player..but I did so well because I just sat back and farted out drones all game and nobody killed them!

I've had games of 20 kills 15 assists and 90k damage..or the reverse of 15 kills 33 assists and 88k damage..granted I am a good player..but I did so well because I just sat back and farted out drones all game and nobody killed them!

IMO, when you put effort into killing drones it makes you an easy target to other players including the bomber who "farted" them out. This is why I just avoid them 99.9% of the time and put most of my efforts into taking down the bomber itself...no bomber..no drones.

Edit: Only drone I will sometimes go out of my way to destroy is the repair drone..its the most dangerous imo.

Edit 2: In any match Gunships and fighters with EMP should be clearing drones...problem is most Gunship pilots are more interested in getting player kills or find drones too hard to target so they usually don't bother.

Before 2.6: Gunships are ruining GSF!!!

 

After 2.6: Bombers are ruining GSF!!!

 

(Facepalm)

Gunships were nerfed in 2.6 FYI so they aren't nearly so bad anymore.

That's not entirely true Lugaidh .

 

Minelayers are fairly harmless unless you are stupid enough to get close....stay at range and you won't have a problem; even a really good player in a minelayer is going to go down hard if he cannot use his mines against you.

 

Dronelayers are a little different; I find that most of the time the drones aren't hugely effective at kills and generally just "stat pad" the damage meters; sure the missile or railgun turrent does pick up a few kills but they have a 120 second or so cool down and can be killed off very quickly.

 

The main issue is that people either get too close to minelayers or don't focus the drones down first on dronelayers. The main difficulty I think people have is when there are multiple bombers and they can stack their drones or mines..but the question is how do you balance a role around the number of other bombers you may have in a game?

 

I've had games of 20 kills 15 assists and 90k damage..or the reverse of 15 kills 33 assists and 88k damage..granted I am a good player..but I did so well because I just sat back and farted out drones all game and nobody killed them!

Maybe make the drones and mines even easier to destroy or make them easier to target?

That's not entirely true Lugaidh .

 

Minelayers are fairly harmless unless you are stupid enough to get close....stay at range and you won't have a problem; even a really good player in a minelayer is going to go down hard if he cannot use his mines against you.

A good bomber pilot won't stay passive and wait until you shot him down. He'll come at YOU and drop his mines right on your face, while shooting you with his lasers.

I don't say he'll win the fight, but saying he's going down hard because he can't use his mines is very naive.

Well, I took a bomber out today. Got shot down multiple times no matter how many drones/seeker mines I launched.

Someone was saying it was easy and required no skill? Yeah, right.

(They say the same about gunships. I tend to die more with those too.)