Butchering

- Increases the critical strike damage of the Force Scream by 15%/30% and all your internal damage abilities and damage over time effects by 7.5%/15%.

 

Invulnerable

- Increases your movement speed by 7.5%/15% and reduces area of effect damage by 15%/30%.

 

Sharpened Saber

- Increases the critical strike damage and damage of Impale and Vicious Slash by 15%.

Edited November 18, 2012 by PowerReaper

all solid ideas, though id rather see critical bonus applied to vicious throw than anything, or perhaps a bonus to periodic damage boost on targets under 30%.

 

i think the movement speed could easily be tacked onto the shien aspect of single saber master and the area damage reduction could either go onto deadly reprisal or just replace 'unyielding', and the effect of that could be made part of pooled hatred. i prefer that, since it would give the other specs the option to grab it. as for the crit bonus talent, id certainly give up sundering throw for it.

... give vig/veng 30percent armor penetration and an additional 30percent damage boost on all attacks. Enable force crush to automatically proc with each shatter strike(same dot as rage spec's force crush, but susceptible to all damage bonuses). Make sundering assault a stackable buff(5 ranks), that enables with each use, an increase to crit/critical strike damage(10,20,30,40,50 percent values).

Also make sure to increase the damage mitigation that unstoppable yields...increase from 20 percent up to 80 percent.

 

 

 

 

...you want to know what pleasant fiction is?

...it would be the end of fail-plz-buff vig/veng threads.

15%/30% Crit bonus to Impale and Vicious Throw (force scream might make it too similar to carnage)

 

And maybe a buff to all the dots once a target is past 30% health, like the pyro talent, which together with the vicious throw crits would give vengeance a definitive role in combat as a finisher.

15%/30% Crit bonus to Impale and Vicious Throw (force scream might make it too similar to carnage)

 

And maybe a buff to all the dots once a target is past 30% health, like the pyro talent, which together with the vicious throw crits would give vengeance a definitive role in combat as a finisher.

 

I can see the logic, but not sure I'm comfortable with back loading so much of our damage. I've seen that before in many other MMO's and it could end up making us much more single sided. I prefer the approach to increased DoT's and bonus damage as it ups our damage across the entire range of the fight, instead of making us a one-trick pony. I don't want my DPS across the board to suffer just so i can get some Huge burst right at the end. this is strictly from PvE perspective btw, don't to PvP.

The two things I'd like to see most for Juggs-

 

We get the root on Ravage that Carnage rauders get, I mean we're the class that does all the reprocs on it, would make us like a control class. Able to lockdown players with it, etc.

 

Make Shatter's dot stack up to three times. Would give reason to the 12second dot on a 9second CD move.

The two things I'd like to see most for Juggs-

 

We get the root on Ravage that Carnage rauders get, I mean we're the class that does all the reprocs on it, would make us like a control class. Able to lockdown players with it, etc.

 

Make Shatter's dot stack up to three times. Would give reason to the 12second dot on a 9second CD move.

 

I approve of both of these changes as they would make a big difference in pvp.

If veg dps still was a little behind in pve, I would also suggest changing draining scream. No more bleed, but instead allow it to lower the rage cost of force scream by 1/2 and increase the critical damage bonus of force scream by 20/40 %. This opens rage generation/rotation up a little and increases dps since force scream will crit 100% of the time.

The two things I'd like to see most for Juggs-

 

We get the root on Ravage that Carnage rauders get, I mean we're the class that does all the reprocs on it, would make us like a control class. Able to lockdown players with it, etc.

 

Make Shatter's dot stack up to three times. Would give reason to the 12second dot on a 9second CD move.

I am imagining how people will react in PvP when we can't be CC'd during Ravage, nor can anyone get away because of the root. Needless to say, more QQ threads than all the Marauder ones to the fifth power.

I am imagining how people will react in PvP when we can't be CC'd during Ravage, nor can anyone get away because of the root. Needless to say, more QQ threads than all the Marauder ones to the fifth power.

 

True but we also don't have the insane defensives that Marauders have. We are a lot squisher than rauders despite our heavy armor. In a pvp enraged defense is arugably our best defensive and that is but a shadow of what undying rage can do.

 

The root on Ravage would make it quite decent for pvp. Remember it is all weapon damage and we have no form of armor penetration as Vengeance so every ounce of mitigation someone has would kick in. In a pve evniornment it adds a bit more control to the Juggernaut as well.

 

@Pyrinoos- 20/40 seems a bit excessive I would say 7.5/15, remember Vengeance isn't all about that upfront damage but the sustained burn from decent damageing attacks that lay dots on the targets. My suggestion would either be extend the durration of the dot to above that of the move's cd itself (same with Impale) increase the dot's damage and make it stackable like my shatter change.

 

The other option I would suggest is have draining scream offer a form of armor penetration 15/30 or even 20/40. Vengeance has no form of armor penetration but the highest damageing skills within vengeance are kinetic damage.

 

Vengeance dosn't need Buffs per say, it need's adjustments. Impale and screams bleeds are just way too weak.

Woah, if ALL ideas in the OP would be implemented, Vigilance/Vengeance would become the most overpowered DPS spec in the game. By some distance. I don't think we really want that.

the only thing we need to bring us up to par with most other specs is:

 

Roll the talent for force scream and impale bleeds into one. And then replace the impale bleed talent with 1 of 3 things:

 

15% damage increase to bleeds

 

30% critical damage increase to impale/ravage/force scream.

 

30% armor penetration after impale for 9 seconds.

NO! the only thing i would sanction is either an aoe 30% reduction or a surge boost on scream and dots. Root on ravage would be epic OP. You also have to take into consideration hybrids. Currently vengeance/immortal hybrids are the most tanky spec in this game and still do very good damage. Trust me when I say you do NOT want to give that spec stupid damage or this game will turn into an epic joke.

First and formost for PvE they need to up the proc chance on Rampage 30% is too low and with so much of our overal dmg comming from Ravage I've seen fluctuations of about 100DPS when parsing on the dummy all because of poor RNG. While its probably unessicary a buff to the dots on Impale and Scream would be nice. And shorting the dot to 9secs on Shatter will prevent clipping when on a period of no Ravage procs and will improve the flow.

 

9secs seems to be Vengeances magic number with it being the CD of Impale, Shatter and Scream, and the CD of two Sunders as well as the ICD on Rampage procs.

 

For PvP the problem is Vengeance has is a lack of burst or more ot the point a more reliable way of delivering the burst it can bring to the table. Now the most obvious way is to buff Ravage but I'd like to see maybe a move away from being so dependant on it. It makes us too similar to Rage if we are all focused round on ensuring a single skill sucessfully hiting.

Edited November 23, 2012 by Lacedemon