The statistics on your link are interesting, but the results drawn are faulty. Presuming that critical success on a mission is truly a random event and green boxes are the culprit (to the point of yielding less that a white box). How can crits not detrimentally affect the abundant missions yet favorably affect the rich missions?

Its because abundant missions return green lockboxes on crits, and white otherwise. Rich missions return blue lockboxes on crits, but green otherwise. Because of this, a crit on an abundant mission is a slight loss, while a crit on a rich mission is a huge gain.

I did the math (see #191, above).

 

Admittedly, I only ran 400 missions post-1.2 for that analysis, but given that the standard errors are so small for everything but the rich missions, and I can work around that with the math I went through above... running more missions to collect data... isn't the best use of time.

 

Maybe a better way of presenting the previous post is like this:

Average earnings by type / grade of mission
 5 Abundant         5 Moderate              5 Rich            6 Abundant         6 Moderate 
    249.2381            368.2857            178.8148            166.3246            229.7692 
      (38.61)               (57.31)               (250.38)              (29.95)               (30.76)

 

according to this you can still make a tiny profit from the lock boxes (about 10% of what it used to be) so slicing can still make decent credits when you get a mission discovery to sell on the GTN. but even if you are very lucky and crit often your better off going with a different mission crew skill such as diplomacy which gives you companion gifts to sell.

Response to my ticket on this issue, sounds promising:

Greetings [REDACTED]

I am Protocol Droid [REDACTED], Human-Cyborg Relations.

I have received your transmission regarding an error that you have encountered where in the Credit Rewards for the Crew Skill, Slicing, yields credits that are lower than the amount needed to start the Gathering Mission. Rich and Bountiful missions are also yielding very low amount of credits as rewards. Thank you for bringing this matter into our concern and we understand that this issue can cause a great deal of frustration and/or confusion.

Rest assured that your report has been forwarded to our development team, who will investigate further. Please be aware that when a ticket is escalated for such an investigation, it will no longer be visible to you through the in-game helpcenter.

We regret that we will be unable to provide you with further updates on this issue, but recommend checking the latest patch notes at http://www.swtor.com/patchnotes for information on any fixes or changes related to this issue.

We would like to apologize for any inconvenience this may have caused, and to thank you again for the valuable feedback you have provided. Please do not hesitate to report any other issues you may encounter while playing.

Galactic Support is our specialty...

Sincerely,

Protocol Droid [REDACTED]

Star Wars: The Old Republic - Customer Service

For me it's just getting frustrating. It feels like we do this every patch, and only once was there ever any word (or even apology) from Bioware acknowledging a change to Slicing (back when it was way too profitable). If I'm not mistaken, not once has there ever been any culpability or ownership of a bug introduced to Slicing (whether beneficial or not). There will be numerous posts on these forums with hard data substantiating our claims, yet the silence from Bioware is deafening.

I'm still a fanboy, but that kind of disregard is disheartening and disappointing.

I think all we're asking is someone saying, "Hey. This is a bug. Our bad. We're working on it. We'll let you know when we know more."

And while I'm wishing, if it was a bug through some kind of tweak, it'd be nice to at least have something in the patch notes saying that they're tweaking or playing with Slicing to tune/balance it. That way, we'd have some warning that a bug might be rolling out and thereby stave off the tinfoil hats.

Response to my ticket on this issue, sounds promising:

 

Greetings [REDACTED]

 

 

I am Protocol Droid [REDACTED], Human-Cyborg Relations.

 

I have received your transmission regarding an error that you have encountered where in the Credit Rewards for the Crew Skill, Slicing, yields credits that are lower than the amount needed to start the Gathering Mission. Rich and Bountiful missions are also yielding very low amount of credits as rewards. Thank you for bringing this matter into our concern and we understand that this issue can cause a great deal of frustration and/or confusion.

[snip]

 

Galactic Support is our specialty...

 

 

Sincerely,

 

Protocol Droid [REDACTED]

Star Wars: The Old Republic - Customer Service

Wow, looks like they might fix this! The response I got (a week ago) was to the effect that everything was working as intended and that they couldn't help me with anything.

I'm feeling it as well. Ironically enough, I swapped underworld trading for cybertech just before 1.2 released, since I like to have a toon on each side for slicing and didn't have one atm. Did I know about this ninja nerf? NO. But as I returned to my trooper after having a mediocre experience on my other toons post 1.2, I realized something. I was losing credits on slicing missions. A LOT OF CREDITS.

Some of the feedback seems positive, so I can only hope that Bioware is trying to address the problem. Otherwise, leveling slicing is going to be a HUGE cash dump until the very end, in which you have to gamble on getting a crit or losing half of your investment. They can nerf crits; I don't care. I thought they were a little high anyway. But please, for God's sake, don't kill our returns on everything else.

Its because abundant missions return green lockboxes on crits, and white otherwise. Rich missions return blue lockboxes on crits, but green otherwise. Because of this, a crit on an abundant mission is a slight loss, while a crit on a rich mission is a huge gain.

Thank you!

Ok THIS explains what I've been seeing!

I've done almost exclusively Moderate and Abundant missions.

For almost every mission, I'd get a lockbox with more (not always a lot, but at least some profit) credits in it then the mission cost to run, UNELSS I've critted.

At first I tought it was because they reduced the amount given on a crit because they expected you to make it up from selling off the schematic/Mission discovery, but Green Lockboxes being bugged makes much more sense.

Here's my logs since 2.1:

Wow, looks like they might fix this! The response I got (a week ago) was to the effect that everything was working as intended and that they couldn't help me with anything.

Yeah, I got this response AGAIN. Except this time I asked if it was WAI - why were there no patch notes, no developer comments, no reponses to threads/tweets, etc. I was politely told (effectively) to shove off, and that I should take it up with BWAcommunity. I mean WTH are THEY going to do about it.

Oh well, I am going to continue tweeting SWTOR daily until I get some sort of response from them (I'm not going to harass the personal twitter accounts though)

I can understand the Devs wanting to reduce the yields from Rich and Bountiful missions, but I do wish they'd done that by toning down the profits from critical success, not making every non-crit a massive loss. And like I said before, what really rankles me is that they didn't even give us a warning like they did last time they (justifiably) nerfed Slicing.

How is it understandable? Slicing was not that profitable, and from what I am seeing in my bug report response, the change was intended to balance the crew skills. The logical conclusion then is that Bioware wants crew skills to be money losers. Thus, no use doing them.

Wow, looks like they might fix this! The response I got (a week ago) was to the effect that everything was working as intended and that they couldn't help me with anything.

I submitted a bug report today and got the 'working as intended' response. I will wait for more reliable data from Bioware, either in the form of a fix or a post/tweet about this.

ok i have news...

i had a chat with an in game CSR today and was told that "these changes to the green lock-boxes was completely un-intended as there was meant to be no change to them in patch 1.2."

this was a reply to a question i made re the green lock boxes being broken (yielding approx 60% less) in the missions you send your companions on, the quest reward ones AND the gathered boxes.

so it seems that if this is correct it may have been an un-intended consequence of the slicing changes so hopefully there will be a yellow post soon.

(id copy paste the convo as proof but you cant copy paste in game CSR convos )

** just realised i could have screen shotted it <-- massive sadface

Hey all, thank you for reports into this issue. We escalated this to the development team and after investigation, got confirmation that this was a bug.

It's being worked on now and a fix should be rolled out in a future patch. In the meantime, it'll be added to our known issues list.

Hey all, thank you for reports into this issue. We escalated this to the development team and after investigation, got confirmation that this was a bug.

 

It's being worked on now and a fix should be rolled out in a future patch. In the meantime, it'll be added to our known issues list.

Thank you very much for letting us know. Given the past record of non-communication about slicing nerfs, this is a major step in the right direction. Even were it an intentional (but nonsensical) nerf, we would want to know about it.

Hey all, thank you for reports into this issue. We escalated this to the development team and after investigation, got confirmation that this was a bug.

 

It's being worked on now and a fix should be rolled out in a future patch. In the meantime, it'll be added to our known issues list.

Agreed with the post above. Thanks for telling us. I've slowed down my slicing missions considerably because of this. It's nice to know that it's unintentional. I appreciate the response!

Hey all, thank you for reports into this issue. We escalated this to the development team and after investigation, got confirmation that this was a bug.

 

It's being worked on now and a fix should be rolled out in a future patch. In the meantime, it'll be added to our known issues list.

stephen were you the little droid i spoke to?

HAHAHA BTW THANK YOU, i really appreciate this response as it will put behind everyone the crazy speculation and i am glad that at some point it will be fixed , whenever i dont really mind atleast we know what the story it is. so yeah really appreciated

and as to my prediction/hope of a yellow post, it was the next one.. winnah

Thank you very much for letting us know. Given the past record of non-communication about slicing nerfs, this is a major step in the right direction. Even were it an intentional (but nonsensical) nerf, we would want to know about it.

Honestly, it seemed kind of obvious to me... White lockboxes (from any source) unchanged... blue lockboxes (from any source) unchanged.. green lockboxes (from any source) diminished returns. That kind of behavior screams bug to me.

Glad to hear I was right.

Hey all, thank you for reports into this issue. We escalated this to the development team and after investigation, got confirmation that this was a bug.

 

It's being worked on now and a fix should be rolled out in a future patch. In the meantime, it'll be added to our known issues list.

Thanks for the confirmation and happy to see it's on the "get fixed" list.

Hey all, thank you for reports into this issue. We escalated this to the development team and after investigation, got confirmation that this was a bug.

 

It's being worked on now and a fix should be rolled out in a future patch. In the meantime, it'll be added to our known issues list.

That's nice to hear Stephen but what is the point of testing and reporting this on the PTS if you don't take action until it's reported on live. This was reported both via /bug in game and I created a post detailing the results of 100 slicing missions in the PTS forums.

Testing is only of value if you act on the feedback.

Alodar

Hey all, thank you for reports into this issue. We escalated this to the development team and after investigation, got confirmation that this was a bug.

 

It's being worked on now and a fix should be rolled out in a future patch. In the meantime, it'll be added to our known issues list.

1.2 introduced a lotta new (and old) bugs Stephen - may I ask if these were oversights from the internal QA team or is it due to the lack of testers you were able to transfer over to the PTS? I'm just shocked that so many made it through and it worries me that quality may not be a priority for Bioware any longer...which I HATE to even think of given your past reputation as a company.

This certainly made me happy to see, I was a very sad panda to see myself getting MAYBE 900 credits for a 1450 credit mission

Still, it does bring up the question why you guys didn't catch this in the PTS.

Still, it does bring up the question why you guys didn't catch this in the PTS.

The players did...

Hey all, thank you for reports into this issue. We escalated this to the development team and after investigation, got confirmation that this was a bug.

 

It's being worked on now and a fix should be rolled out in a future patch. In the meantime, it'll be added to our known issues list.

I knew it. Thanks for taking the time to acknowledge the problem. Now please include in the weekly patch next week

Hey all, thank you for reports into this issue. We escalated this to the development team and after investigation, got confirmation that this was a bug.

 

It's being worked on now and a fix should be rolled out in a future patch. In the meantime, it'll be added to our known issues list.

I (and I imagine many others) greatly appreciate your response. Thank you.

Since we have received the desired response, would a moderator please close this thread?

Hey all, thank you for reports into this issue. We escalated this to the development team and after investigation, got confirmation that this was a bug.

 

It's being worked on now and a fix should be rolled out in a future patch. In the meantime, it'll be added to our known issues list.

Thank you very much for this response. I am still confused, and concerned that as recently as yesterday, CSRs via the bug report feature in game were giving responses that this was an intended change. As these folks are your primary front line contact with your customers, it is a major issue for them to be giving wrong information to the customers. Even the 'we've escalated' response is better than what I got yesterday. If I had not been a more community orientated person, that response would have angered me, and likely meant my being very angry at your company for a long time, until this was revealed as a bug and fixed in a more publicly noticeable way.

Again, thank you for your response, and I am relieved to hear this is a bug, and will be fixed. Sadly, I already made a big loss on a lot of cases when 1.2 hit, but I will look forward to going back into heavy production on slicing missions once this is fixed.