OK about this: Snipe > TD > FT

 

This makes Zero sense to me, no sense what-so-ever, nothing at all. That said I will certainly read your reply with an open mind.

 

so Snipe does 3 things in MM

- procs Follow Through but doesn't reset the CD

- Shortens Ambush cast time by 0.25s/snipe up to 0.5s

- 2 Snipes reset FT CD and proc FT

 

so what does Snipe > TD > FT achieve? specifically what does the Snipe in there actually do?

 

MY use of Take down goes like this, when Take Down is available you use it immediately after the next Follow Through then proceed with your rotation as normal.

The Snipe does nothing.. It just fills the hole while TD doesall the work... Snipe is just a filler here.

I did test this out, but unfortunately, it doesn't make a positive impact in terms of rotational fluidity and DPS. It's really nonsensical to use Target Acquired within the Sniper Volley window just to shave 10 seconds off of its CD when you can be potentially dealing more damage with double Penetrating Blasts. Just because Alacrity is redesigned to reduce cooldowns in terms of abilities and CDs doesn't mean the priority of offensive CDs should change. Also, hitting Target Acquired within the Sniper Volley window would mean gaining too much energy back, and trust me, I have much better use for TA whenever appropriate.

 

I admit, it was an interesting discovery but unfortunately, it won't work for the sake of DPS gain nor resolve any filler problems.

Well.. I stand corrected about TA..... Now onto the numbers avaible for SV...

This is the rotation I figured out.....

The Snipe does nothing.. It just fills the hole while TD doesall the work... Snipe is just a filler here.

Ok I'm getting closer to understanding what your doing. Unfortunately as I understand it your doing things wrong. It would seem your filler snipe there is a waste of 3 seconds, There is no reason I've been able to determine to lead TD with a snipe.

In fact in my experience you never really need a filler in MM. As described in my pervious post you can insert TD anywhere in your rotation by simply following your next follow through. This makes TD a rotation expander meaning more abilities get time to cool down.

Ok I'm getting closer to understanding what your doing. Unfortunately as I understand it your doing things wrong. It would seem your filler snipe there is a waste of 3 seconds, There is no reason I've been able to determine to lead TD with a snipe.

 

In fact in my experience you never really need a filler in MM. As described in my pervious post you can insert TD anywhere in your rotation by simply following your next follow through. This makes TD a rotation expander meaning more abilities get time to cool down.

Which lower your DPS and your burst.. MM has five GCD fillers by Sniper Volley CD. Two being Corrosive Dart. TD > FT forces three more GCD between your Sniper Volley's. Replacing the Sn > Sn > FT by TD >FT buy you one 0.66 GCD (Ambush taking 1.33 GCD to cast without Zeroing Shot). GOing with Sn > TD > FT forces you to lose exactly one filler.. Which makes the rotation sustainable.. Keeps everything as close to their CD as possible....

Note that this is assuming Sniper Volley CD is affected by its own buff making it a 40.9 CD.

Which lower your DPS and your burst.. MM has five GCD fillers by Sniper Volley CD. Two being Corrosive Dart. TD > FT forces three more GCD between your Sniper Volley's. Replacing the Sn > Sn > FT by TD >FT buy you one 0.66 GCD (Ambush taking 1.33 GCD to cast without Zeroing Shot). GOing with Sn > TD > FT forces you to lose exactly one filler.. Which makes the rotation sustainable.. Keeps everything as close to their CD as possible....

 

Note that this is assuming Sniper Volley CD is affected by its own buff making it a 40.9 CD.

Yup still not on the same page.

Perhaps it's your use of the word "filler". By my reckoning there are no fillers in MM rotation. Not even corrosive Dart do I consider to be a filler as it's DPS gains are undeniable.

I feel like your perspective is that MM has sniper volley at it's core. While I will agree that SV is the ability that defines when MM rotation begins and ends as it had the longest CD. I believe that MM is defined by APM and this is maximized by committing your rotation to FT proc/CD reset.

So for clarity. A FILLER is an ability one uses to fill gaps in one's rotation.

But MM is 100% fluid(between 100-30%) so it has no fillers.

Now what your saying is drop 2×snipe and exchange for a TD. This by my reconing depends highly on Crit happening to see s dps gain.

Moreover while it may appear on a dummy parse. It is possibly more of a liabilty on an actual boss kill.

Yup still not on the same page.

 

Perhaps it's your use of the word "filler". By my reckoning there are no fillers in MM rotation. Not even corrosive Dart do I consider to be a filler as it's DPS gains are undeniable.

 

I feel like your perspective is that MM has sniper volley at it's core. While I will agree that SV is the ability that defines when MM rotation begins and ends as it had the longest CD. I believe that MM is defined by APM and this is maximized by committing your rotation to FT proc/CD reset.

 

So for clarity. A FILLER is an ability one uses to fill gaps in one's rotation.

 

But MM is 100% fluid(between 100-30%) so it has no fillers.

 

Now what your saying is drop 2×snipe and exchange for a TD. This by my reconing depends highly on Crit happening to see s dps gain.

 

Moreover while it may appear on a dummy parse. It is possibly more of a liabilty on an actual boss kill.

"Fillers" means "ability whit a CD that doesn't fit right with 15 or 40s CD". So Corrossive Dart is a filler as far as we can tell.

But yeah we could go with your definition. MM basic rotation of 3x(PB > FT >Sn > Sn > FT > Am >FT) > PR > FT + SV has five drifting GCD in it. Two are used for Corrossive Dart. The pthers for energy management.. So Snipe if your energy allows it or Rifle Shot if it doesn't. Those drifting GCD are used to allow Ambush to come off CD because of the 12 sec CD + 1,5s cast time. Using two between each cast (except the third because of PR > FT + SV >PR) make sure it is off CD every single time (anyway you need them to get an exact 42.5s rotation.

Now I replace the second Snipe by TD 'cause it does much more damage... And you only lose 0.33 GCD on AMbush with only one Zeroing Shot, which can be absorbed by removing one Rifle Shot and the filler between the third and the first Ambush (which isn't needed).

Assuming every debuffs are up, you have 3 Honed Shots stacks... Assuming a bonus damage of 1000, a base weapon damage average of 506, a base level damage of 3185, 100%/110% accuracy, 25% crit chance and 70% crit damage.... Quickdraw does an average of 4600 damage and Charged Burst, an average of 3700 damage. Trickshot is at 3700 damage too. I guess the damage for a Sniper won't change much

Sniper Volley is your BURST. MM is a burst spec. You highest DPS ability is PB. Ambush is just behind. Two PB back to back is your burst.. Not FT.

Those numbers are using the latest coefficient datamined.. If you have the new ones.. Feel free to let me know.

Is it really a burst spec though?

In PvP, Laze Target + Ambush + Followthrough could certainly be called "burst damage", but in PvE, I'm only showing about 10-15% increase in burst DPS over sustained DPS over the 20-30sec range usually important for Operations, including using an adrenal, but not the new 6pc set bonus. That's a little better than what we had prior to 3.0 (but after losing OS) and the set bonus will give another percent or two to that on average, but it's really not a big ratio.

I haven't tested burst on other specs or classes yet, but do you think that's enough to qualify as a "burst spec"? I mean, Marauder Bloodthirst alone is 15%.

Fairly sure Sniper Volley's cooldown is not affected by its own alacrity bonus. It's because the cooldown fires first, and then the buff is applied.

What numbers are people parsing with MM right now, by any chance?

I'm only managing about 3500 DPS on the Ops dummy (1mill HP & armor reduction mods) in 180s that were optimized pre-3.0. (So I'm missing 2 or 3% accuracy). I suspect there's another 100 DPS to be found in there with some tweaking. This sounds about right, since they said DPS targets with 198 gear for sustained ranged was about 4125 and generally each tier of gear is worth about 5%, so 180 -> 198 should be about 15%: 3600 x 1.15 is 4140.

I know others consider MM a burst spec (target of 3925ish) and it might be fair to include our advantage in target-swapping (~3% on average) so it's possible that our target DPS is lower.

Has anyone managed to get the 6pc bonus and optimized gear at 192 level yet? I'd be very interested to hear what you are running.

Hello all,

actually running with one implant, the gloves and the offhand in 192, the rest in 186 and using nano-infused stim with no adrenals.

Sharpshooter : 4083 with an average at 3k9+

Dirty fighting : 4276 with an average at 4k2+

The Sharpshooter Mirror is now updated in the 2nd Reserved Post of the Thread! Enjoy guys!

Hello all,

actually running with one implant, the gloves and the offhand in 192, the rest in 186 and using nano-infused stim with no adrenals.

Sharpshooter : 4083 with an average at 3k9+

Dirty fighting : 4276 with an average at 4k2+

o// Hi Malow Great to see you posting your numbers!

Someone can post the full rotation ? (filler, corro. dart, zeroing shot, doping, lazer target.. etc.. ALL)

With :

-Opening round

-Normal cycle (above 30%)

-Normal cycle (below 30%)

And if possible with activated parse.

I'm in full 186 gear on my sharpshooter gunslinger with everthing crafted 186 gear (ears, implants, relics, armorings, mods, enhancements, barrels). Using the rotation method here with the new top skill stim, 100% accuracy, skill augments (1 acc), and about 300 crit stat and 306 surge I have been pulling 3600-3650 on the ops dummy at 1mil

This is a great rotation and guide, thanks for posting it

Hello all,

actually running with one implant, the gloves and the offhand in 192, the rest in 186 and using nano-infused stim with no adrenals.

Sharpshooter : 4083 with an average at 3k9+

Dirty fighting : 4276 with an average at 4k2+

You think you could share your stats? You using any alacrity, or just the usual pre 3.0 stat distribution?

I also would love to know stats and priority. Also, how important is Accuracy to PvE DPS Gunslinger? is 95% ok or do we need 100 or more?

What is the usual 3.0 stat priority?

I also would love to know stats and priority. Also, how important is Accuracy to PvE DPS Gunslinger? is 95% ok or do we need 100 or more?

What is the usual 3.0 stat priority?

Go back and reread the guide....specifically the gearing and stats section and the rotation. And just fyi but you want your accuracy to be as close to 100% as possible for a PvE dps toon or else you'll see your abilities missing left and right.

You think you could share your stats? You using any alacrity, or just the usual pre 3.0 stat distribution?

I'm running with 99.75 accuracy and 27.5% crit. I've tried alacrity, it's interesting on the dummy but useless in raid due to movements and lags/latency.

I use too a little of aim stat (it gives the same damage bonus and more crit than cunning) but only in sharpshooter because you don't have, except corosive dart, techno damages.

I'm running with 99.75 accuracy and 27.5% crit. I've tried alacrity, it's interesting on the dummy but useless in raid due to movements and lags/latency.

I use too a little of aim stat (it gives the same damage bonus and more crit than cunning) but only in sharpshooter because you don't have, except corosive dart, techno damages.

I disagree with the alacrity piece of this statement. Because you move a lot in raids, alacrity really shines because it gives you a better energy regen rate at that time. It also let's you get more of your rotation before you need to move. Finally, while you are moving, your hots/dots are ticking faster, further increasing your damage rate.

I disagree with the alacrity piece of this statement. Because you move a lot in raids, alacrity really shines because it gives you a better energy regen rate at that time. It also let's you get more of your rotation before you need to move. Finally, while you are moving, your hots/dots are ticking faster, further increasing your damage rate.

It also reduces your cooldown on Target Acquired/Sniper Volley/Laze Target, so, lets use this example:

You have 30 seconds of uptime on a boss, followed by 25 seconds where you can't do anything. This repeats till the boss is dead.

Yeah I know, bad design and whatnot, but in that case, getting 9.1% alacrity would mean every single DPS window could start with a Laze Target, regardless of things.

Actually thats a terrible example because if you start each uptime window with Sniper volley -> Laze target, you'll have a 52 second cooldown on it -_-

Anyway, on topic (sort of)

I went back and found the real optimal way to play marksman!

http://i.imgur.com/gDlyUpN.jpg