You can definitely win this map with no healers. You can definitely not win this map with 2-3 utterly terrible DPS. I inspect everyone right off the bat and then see how the first thirty seconds go, much as I do in most other games.

 

You can't reliably win the other warzones with no healers. Huttball is almost 100% a loss with no heals, ACW is a loss with no heals, NC can be won if your entire team is on the ball. Voidstar is by far the easiest warzone to win with no healers as long as you also have no crappy DPS.

You couldn't be further from the truth.

You can definitely win this map with no healers. You can definitely not win this map with 2-3 utterly terrible DPS. I inspect everyone right off the bat and then see how the first thirty seconds go, much as I do in most other games.

 

You can't reliably win the other warzones with no healers. Huttball is almost 100% a loss with no heals, ACW is a loss with no heals, NC can be won if your entire team is on the ball. Voidstar is by far the easiest warzone to win with no healers as long as you also have no crappy DPS.

I've won every single warzone in a pug without healers. It isn't hard as long as your team knows what they are doing.

Secondly I would agree that this warzone is the most unforgiving. I said it prior to launch of 1.6 that this warzone would be the worst with pugs, this just proves that assumption.

Each WZ is different. Is that so bad? They each require different things and not everyone will enjoy all 4. I hardly see a reason to complain here.

 

NC - Your ability to properly attack and defend nodes

Voidstar - Your ability to properly attack and defend nodes

Huttball - Your ability to navigate obstacles and score

Hypergate - Your ability to kill

 

Its a deathmatch WZ. You may not like it, but I don't think its asking to much for people to just chill out and let us deathmatchers enjoy the map. If anything, the complaint should be that you want a way to avoid a certain map, not that the map should be removed.

 

On a side note, I enjoy coming up with ways to win the new WZ. It seems like many people are lemmings with no motivation whatsoever, and really are clueless on that map. They just run around at random because they can't be bothered to stop and think about what would help them win. I feel like by suggesting a strategy to my team, we already know a secret that the other team doesn't know.

Darth Bloodloss - and, what strategy is that exactly? Setting up a gank zone seems to be the most easy way to score points; the nodes almost don't matter, except that it's necessary to take at least one and pray the rest of your team kills better than theirs. If BioWare removed them next week, I'm honestly not sure anyone would notice or care.

Not knocking your - or anyone else's - enjoyment of this map (it seems to be an unusually clever map, by MMO PvP standards), but either I'm vastly missing the point of this map - possible - or it's a map that has none. Please, elaborate more; I just don't understand this map as much as I would like.

Don't get me wrong I like the new map and mechanics, but it's difficult to win just on the new mechanics alone. They

should just remove the points you get from kills and force players to fight over the orbs.

Kill count should not be an objective in warzones.

This is a hilarious quote.

As for people saying the objectives don't even matter - do your realize how many more kills you need compared to your opponent if they two-cap you for one round but you don't do the same? A lot. The nodes are hugely important.

I don't see what's so funny about it. It's very difficult to secure both pylons when fighting a competent team. Continue doing well in this one warzone and thinking your tough stuff while kills matter. Players like you can't do **** in the other warzones if you just go for kills.

When you can completely ignore the new mechanics of a warzone and win by just getting kills there is obviously something wrong.

eh, I'd like them to change the capture cast-time to 8 seconds, other than that the warzone is fine.

AH is easily the zergeist wz; I understand why people hate it.

So, in short after reading your post...and yes I gave what seemed to be another whiner a chance and read the whole post....

 

 

Basically you want the game to be more based on who can daisy chain some boxes down to the core faster and be totally objective based because you are bad and have trouble killing people. I think UPS or the Amazon.com warehouse are looking for people like you...you can make a game of real life warehouse work.

 

All the other WZ are already more objective based than actual fight statistic based....leave this one alone its fine.

 

Some people like kill counts and taking on a pack of 3-5 people with just two and overcoming it....or completely wiping out a group that has no concept of group PVP that has been around since the START OF MMMOs (obviously no its not WoW - trolls please let it go)

 

 

Point is, its PvP - to the hardcores, the oldschoolers and otherwise more PvP focused gamers "objectives" are something new to PvP...scores werent kept or tallied in old PvP...names and legacies and bragging rights were spread from the community from being known one way or another.

 

I come from a time where PvP meant going around and killing anyone in sight (RED YOUR DEAD) taking their crap/loot/gold/armor and raiding peoples PVE Dungeons just to take their loot after they did the work.

 

To your post I say grow a pair and learn to overcome your carebear hand held world of MMOs and adjust yourself to what PvP is...

 

While I have some issues or doubts of aspects of this new battleground - the kill score/multiplier is the best part either be better or get served and take a lesson.

calm down just bc u spend everyday leveling the op classes and have just finished the gear grind on all ur toons so u can excell in a game bc u don't in life doesn't mean that this warzone and what ever feeling of worth you get from it will be taken away from you.

i agree the killing for points is lame.

The only real issue I see with the warzone is the 6 second capture time. It pretty much guarantees that if you only leave one person solo guarding your node that it's gonna get ganked by a shadow or scoundrel. Run up and stealth mez > start capping. If they break it use Force Lift/Flash Bang and cap. If they don't break it it's your node.

There's more to the warzone than just death matching, but they also stated that part of the POINT of the warzone is to encourage death matches. On every other warzone if you just sit and deathmatch then you probably cost your team the game. On this one death matching IS the objective. Unfortunately that does favor teams that are better geared, but with war hero gear so much easier to get I find that's less of an issue, and no one says you have to face the derp smashers where they're more likely to kill a ton of people.

Wouldn't know though. I spend most of this warzone either taking a node or defending a node.

I agree about imperial 10-49's. They are really bad on Prop5. Shockingly bad, considering how I feel Imperial pugs generally compare to Republic ones at 50. If you see Gìllies online sometime (alt-0236 for the first i) send me a tell. level 22 sniper, working on him mostly these days.

 

Sick of not having the crit buff on demand.

Unfortunately, 'm on Jedi Covenant. If legacy ran across servers I'd def hop on to level an alt for the buff. ....maybe someday....

I dunno... at the moment this WZ seems to take the most coordination or at least skill- I've only had it pop five times, but one game I managed to win it with a cap half a minute before the explosion, and another I managed with an op healer ally to hold half their team at their pylon for a decent chunk of time.

I think it's kind of fun- though the white orbs could give more points to make them more valuable than right now.

I dunno... at the moment this WZ seems to take the most coordination or at least skill- I've only had it pop five times, but one game I managed to win it with a cap half a minute before the explosion, and another I managed with an op healer ally to hold half their team at their pylon for a decent chunk of time.

 

I think it's kind of fun- though the white orbs could give more points to make them more valuable than right now.

Yea, people who think the objectives are unimportant are probably also the people leaving nodes single-guarded to go fight at mid while we cap with twenty seconds left (which is really fun).

Darth Bloodloss - and, what strategy is that exactly? Setting up a gank zone seems to be the most easy way to score points; the nodes almost don't matter, except that it's necessary to take at least one and pray the rest of your team kills better than theirs

You answered your own question

1) Stick together - no fail rambo tactics. A few straggler kills can decide the game

2) Control Mid. Use it as a kill zone. When there are no targets, farm orbs

3) No need to venture on their half of the map. If they don't fight for mid, stay away and farm orbs

The strat is almost to be passive, in a way. First priority is to take a pylon so the points start coming in for kills. Then take mid. Once you control mid, you actually want as little fighting as possible. If no one is killing anyone, but your team has the orbs, you win.

You watch mid, watch your node, and make sure they dont use the alternate spawn point entrance and try to sneak to your node. This is obviously a deathmath map, and they just threw in a few twists to make people lose sight of that. And it works a lot of the time.

The warzone has a ton of objectives to deal with in the two nodes, 6 second cap, explosion, controlling mid, and running the white balls. Why add the kill thing that does nothing but make gear and composition the sole way to win the match. It really screws up the normal queue way of playing it and there is no reason to have the kill thing in it. The matches would be extremely fun without it and make the white balls and mid even more important which would generate a lot of kills. This would require people to actually watch the white ball caps and prevent people from getting out of there with them. Instead over geared/premade teams just have to cap their one node and destroy people with their better gear and the other team will lose by a ton of points. Or if one team zones in with some healers and the other doesn't you pretty much lost as well which is not always the case in places like voidstar, novare, or even huttball sometimes. It makes no sense in terms of objective pvp matches.

Completely agree. That would have been fun. But the deathmatchers and kill chasers needed a bone to gnaw on and that's ok. Fellas, you can chase kills on THIS map. The rest of them are objective based (except for the tie in Voidstar).

You answered your own question

1) Stick together - no fail rambo tactics. A few straggler kills can decide the game

2) Control Mid. Use it as a kill zone. When there are no targets, farm orbs

3) No need to venture on their half of the map. If they don't fight for mid, stay away and farm orbs

 

The strat is almost to be passive, in a way. First priority is to take a pylon so the points start coming in for kills. Then take mid. Once you control mid, you actually want as little fighting as possible. If no one is killing anyone, but your team has the orbs, you win.

 

You watch mid, watch your node, and make sure they dont use the alternate spawn point entrance and try to sneak to your node. This is obviously a deathmath map, and they just threw in a few twists to make people lose sight of that. And it works a lot of the time.

And how are you supposed to do that when the other team stacks healers? When you have 3-4 healers at mid, and 4 smasher bombers murdering very thing, how is that fair? This map forces you to play a certain composition. At least those players who play bad on their own that they have to be backed up by 3-4 healers so they don't die. Any other map with this same composition you can win, because there objective points matter, not kills. It's not fair that my team brought back the most orbs, but we lost because the other side had a healermade and didn't die as much as ours. Why even have objectives if kills Is the determining factor of who wins?

Why even have objectives if kills Is the determining factor of who wins?

Its a classic game type called Deathmatch (or Team Deathmatch). It has been a very popular form of team based games for maybe 20 years or so.

Many people might be fairly new to video gaming, and are not aware of the "Deathmatch" format. But it revolves around defeating your enemies more often than they defeat you. That seems like a fairly straightforward design considering its a game about a galactic war. Not to mention its a fighting game and this takes play in a Player vs Player environment.

The reason why there are orbs and pylons is because there has to be a lesser driving factor to get players to move around the map. If it was Deathmatch with no side objectives, it would promote very boring games. Whoever wins the first encounter would just move to spawn camping.

Its a classic game type called Deathmatch (or Team Deathmatch). It has been a very popular form of team based games for maybe 20 years or so.

 

Many people might be fairly new to video gaming, and are not aware of the "Deathmatch" format. But it revolves around defeating your enemies more often than they defeat you. That seems like a fairly straightforward design considering its a game about a galactic war. Not to mention its a fighting game and this takes play in a Player vs Player environment.

 

The reason why there are orbs and pylons is because there has to be a lesser driving factor to get players to move around the map. If it was Deathmatch with no side objectives, it would promote very boring games. Whoever wins the first encounter would just move to spawn camping.

This wasnt advertised as team death match. My point is why put in objectives if playing them doesn't allow you to win? You can take more orbs than the opfor and still lose, all because they stack heals and kill you more than you can kill them. So why have pylons, why have orbs, if the only way to win is kills?

Your answer isn't sufficient. People don't move around the map at all, they stay middle and just fight there. Basically the team who has healers, or the most healers is going to win this warzone.

And thanks for that expert explanation of team deathmatch. I don't think I would have been able to grasp the concept had you not enlightened my primitive mind.

Well, I tried to explain the concept and history because people are surprised to see a Deathmatch Map in a PvP mini-game. I mean...seriously? This is the original team vs team game type.

But I do understand your opinion. If its Deathmatch, the objectives are pointless. I understand how you feel.

In my opinion, side objectives are required to prevent a team from Spawn Camping the other team. And also it prevents a team from getting ahead in points and then stalling or hiding.

I would figure Huttball to be more imbalanced. Huttball favors leapers, pullers, and fast runners. If your class doesn't do that, you are just a sidekick.

But in AH, the class balance is as normal as it gets in this game. (which is not balanced, but more so than huttball)

They need to make a patch to where orbs mean more than kills

What I mean is - if one team is getting tons of kills but ignoring balls, while other team dies alot but captures the balls, the second team wins.

It would be nice to see a dev comment on what they think about all this and there goals with the warzone

Well, I tried to explain the concept and history because people are surprised to see a Deathmatch Map in a PvP mini-game. I mean...seriously? This is the original team vs team game type.

 

But I do understand your opinion. If its Deathmatch, the objectives are pointless. I understand how you feel.

 

In my opinion, side objectives are required to prevent a team from Spawn Camping the other team. And also it prevents a team from getting ahead in points and then stalling or hiding.

 

I would figure Huttball to be more imbalanced. Huttball favors leapers, pullers, and fast runners. If your class doesn't do that, you are just a sidekick.

 

But in AH, the class balance is as normal as it gets in this game. (which is not balanced, but more so than huttball)

Huttball may favor them a bit, but you won't automatically lose because you are facing a juggernaut or shadow or pt or a healer. Team synergy will always be superior to composition in huttball. In AH, synergy doesn't matter. Skill doesn't matter. The team who has the most heals will win. That's a required composition. Huttball you can play with almost any comp and have a chance at winning if you focus objectives well enough. AH, it doesn't matter how much you play objectives, the team with the most healers wins. For example look at voidstar. Say you have 4 dps and 4 heals you are fighting. You can kill them and plant the objectives and win. Same comp, but on AH. You can kill them, play the objectives, but because they die less than you due to stacking healers, they win. They don't even have to bring a single orb to a pylon. That is not fair play. We already have guilds who run healermades on our server and we destroy them because we focus objectives. Now they have a huge advantage because they will keep their teammates alive more than their Opfor, which before AH made no difference on playing objectives.

How can you say it wasn't advertised as a deathmatch map? My understanding since it was announced was that that was the entire point. 4 other warzones you death match instead of paying attention to objectives and you're probably gonna lose. This one not so much.

That the team with sufficient healing and damage wins is kinda there by design, whether people like it or not.

Also I'll gladly feed a team kills all day at mid if they'll keep letting themselves get ninja capped with 20 seconds to go. You don't score if you don't have a pylon.

How can you say it wasn't advertised as a deathmatch map? My understanding since it was announced was that that was the entire point. 4 other warzones you death match instead of paying attention to objectives and you're probably gonna lose. This one not so much.

 

That the team with sufficient healing and damage wins is kinda there by design, whether people like it or not.

 

Also I'll gladly feed a team kills all day at mid if they'll keep letting themselves get ninja capped with 20 seconds to go. You don't score if you don't have a pylon.

Yeah that explains why the wz narrator gives us instructions to only kill.