I only have one other comment: If you are a DPS class, your first job is always "moar dps". Everything else is secondary

I was of the same opinion until I got tired of eating dirt and having my healers ***** at me. Remember, Dead DPS is No DPS, so learn to not take avoidable damage and use defensive cooldowns when necessary. Your ultimate (final) goal as a dps is "moar dps," but you have to be alive to do that.

I was of the same opinion until I got tired of eating dirt and having my healers ***** at me. Remember, Dead DPS is No DPS, so learn to not take avoidable damage and use defensive cooldowns when necessary. Your ultimate (final) goal as a dps is "moar dps," but you have to be alive to do that.

Ie-

If toth is smashing, don't you dare eat it.

I just translated Omophorus his post from your Marauder thread to make it easier to understand for Sentinels.

I hope I made no mistakes. Here his post, but with the names of the Sentinel's abilities.

Since I wrote that post, I stepped up my own game a little, so a change is in order.

I'd originally commented that the 2nd Precision Slash window should close with Blade Storm. My rationale for saying so was that reversing the order made it challenging (due to ability delay of Force Scream specifically, and I do not know how Blade Storm compares in that regard) to reliably land 3 Blade Rushes before the ArPen buff goes away.

By adjusting my ability queue delay (how long ahead of time you can input your next attack) shorter and paying ruthlessly close attention to the GCD, it is actually very easy now for me to get all 3 into the window. So my original rationale for doing it "wrong" is pretty much dead.

I was working off the assumption as well that if I couldn't do it right, I couldn't recommend to others to try it. I can do it right, so I can and will recommend that others do it that way.

The reason this matters is that moving the Blade Storm to the beginning of the ArPen window means it comes off CD between ArPen windows with just enough time to use (if you use it IMMEDIATELY off CD) and have it come off CD again just in time to use again after the next Master Strike. In other words, 3 uses per 30s instead of 2.

If you have Combat Trance active, Blade Storm still hits harder than Blade Rush, even without Precision Slash, so it's one of your best uses of Focus as a filler between ArPen windows, provided that using it doesn't prevent it from being off CD during said windows.

The one thing to be careful of, if you choose to make the same change yourself in search of additional DPS, is that the changed order and when you're dumping Zen'd Blade Rushes can lead to being stuck without Combat Trance for the Blade Rush in the next Precision Slash window (after Master Strike). The easiest way to avoid this, when feasible, is to pop Zen early and dump up to 3 Blade Rushes just before Precision Slash comes off CD, so that you don't have all 6 stacks to burn after the start of the ArPen window.

Edit:

Crit/ Surge relics are a complete waste. You get to your Crit and Surge caps from your gear. Get the DG Power Relic.

 

You don't want to sit at any less than 150 Crit or any more than 350 rating. Cap Surge and Accuracy then stack Power all the way. It doesn't really matter what crystal you use, just so long as your other mods and enhancements are balanced.

LagunaD's simcraft showed that one could go as low as 123 (in BH gear) without DPS loss. Anything below that is a net negative and should be avoided. 100-300 for Combat/Carnage is the happy zone, with the theoretical highest DPS at the low end, though in actual practice it's not going to matter much, if at all. In short fights, like what happens in actual combat, you'll see higher and lower numbers with a higher Crit Rating, and the average will wind up near-identical either way.

If you want to rule the leaderboards on TORParse, stack more Crit, because it'll increase the odds on having a stand-out run (when the Crit Gods are kind to you).

I was of the same opinion until I got tired of eating dirt and having my healers ***** at me. Remember, Dead DPS is No DPS, so learn to not take avoidable damage and use defensive cooldowns when necessary. Your ultimate (final) goal as a dps is "moar dps," but you have to be alive to do that.

True, but a large part of DPS survival is being smart DPS who knows how to manage aggro and knows how to avoid or reduce mob effects. If you are constantly trying to off tank or snatching aggro or not getting out of the way when mob effects are going off, which causes healers to swear at you, you are not good DPS regardless of how you are spec'd.

I will always go dmg first BUT I am someone who while not an experienced SWTOR player, is experienced DPS

While I do think this is a great guide, and have been using it to try and optimize my Watchman Sentinel's gear as I go, I noticed a couple of basic tenets the OP put forth that seem to be in conflict with each other:

1. focus on Strength over Power, since Strength also contributes to crit. chance and Power doesn't (presumably, this would also translate to focusing on Strength over Crit Rating for the reverse reason, but I don't completely know).

2. utilize only the "basic" mod parts (mod part ## as opposed to mod part ##a or ##b) because you want to avoid any mod part that has more Endurance than Strength or secondary stats.

The problem I've noticed with these two tenets, as I said above, is that they seem to conflict a bit. Example: the Deft Mod 26 gives 53 str, 32 end, and 41 pwr while the 26a version gives 68 str, 41 end, and 12 pwr. Yeah, the 26a has more end than pwr, but it also has more str than pwr. Same with the potent versions (same stat ratios, but with crit instead of pwr): the 26a has more end than crit, but it also has more str than crit. I've been trading in the basic 26 mods while putting together an "optimized" version of the Campaign Weaponmaster set, as the OP suggested, but I keep seeing my str drop along with my base damage, and I can't tell if the increase in bonus damage and crit chance from the higher pwr and crit is enough to offset the str drops I get from each mod I trade in (not sure about my damage stats, but my crit chance is already above 33% even without a Smuggler buff). Is this something I even need to be concerned about (I'm not a theorycrafter, so I don't pay attention to stats to this great a degree ordinarily)? Should I start using some of the 26a mods to get higher str at the expense of a little pwr/crit, or should I just stick with the basic 26 mods (and eventually the 27s as well, but I'm not there yet)?

1. focus on Strength over Power, since Strength also contributes to crit. chance and Power doesn't (presumably, this would also translate to focusing on Strength over Crit Rating for the reverse reason, but I don't completely know).

2. utilize only the "basic" mod parts (mod part ## as opposed to mod part ##a or ##b) because you want to avoid any mod part that has more Endurance than Strength or secondary stats.

The reason being is because while Strength is arguably better than Power, the difference isn't at a 2:1 ratio. With the lettered mods you drop your secondary stat (Crit or Power) in exchange for your Main stat or endurance, however the increase in Main stat isn't greater than the loss of secondary stat. So, while you might raise your Strength by 15 points, you'll lower your Crit or Power by 29 which is a net 14 loss of your stat budget. Loss of your stat budget is lower dps whichever way you look at it.

The reason being is because while Strength is arguably better than Power, the difference isn't at a 2:1 ratio. With the lettered mods you drop your secondary stat (Crit or Power) in exchange for your Main stat or endurance, however the increase in Main stat isn't greater than the loss of secondary stat. So, while you might raise your Strength by 15 points, you'll lower your Crit or Power by 29 which is a net 14 loss of your stat budget. Loss of your stat budget is lower dps whichever way you look at it.

I figured it was something like that, but like I said, I'm not a theorycrafter, so I never paid enough attention to notice if the numbers were offsetting each other enough to make the trade-off worthwhile. Thanks.

I figured it was something like that, but like I said, I'm not a theorycrafter, so I never paid enough attention to notice if the numbers were offsetting each other enough to make the trade-off worthwhile. Thanks.

An easy way to always consider your stats as a DPS, Tank or Healer is this:

If it decreases your secondary stat budget you did it wrong. That simple rule will keep you in good stead for the most part, unless you decide to stack 900 crit just for da lols. In that case.... I don't really know, sorry about the remod bill? xD

Quick Watchman question:

Assuming Mind Sear, Merciless Slash and Slash will finish the cooldown of Cauterize at their respective probabilities. Suppose I hit Cauterize and then MS, and MS finishes the cooldown of Cauterize. Will it make a difference whether I recast Cauterize right away, as opposed to letting it finish its ticks before recasting? Will one do more damage overall than the other?

In the rare occasion that it does happen so that Cauterize comes off CD before the DoT falls off

It's not really that rare, but I agree - don't clip, wait to reapply. It certain situations I may reapply early, but that's only if I know I have a chain of 3-4 abilities coming up outside of Cauterize.

Which would be the best tree to go with while leveling?

They are all good after 40, but getting to that point I'd recommend using focus (at least until 30ish). Focus is a really nice spec to level in due to it's ability to aoe well, as well as offer a balance between offense and defense. It is not impossible to level in any tree, so another suggestion may be to level in the tree you want to use after capping.

Personally I leveled in focus until 30, combat until 40, then watchmen to 50 (watchman is my endgame spec).

Just my opinion on the matter, do whatever you feel most comfortable with though.

There is apparently a "hands off" mentality on the classes forums so long as you're not trolling/ flaming (or calling someone out apparently...).

That's the mentality for several of the other forums as well, in particular the classes and the server forums are probably the most severe cases though.

That's the mentality for several of the other forums as well, in particular the classes and the server forums are probably the most severe cases though.

You know, I have noticed that.

Just about everything I've seen is that in single target fights it does upwards of 100 dps less than Watchmen and Combat. In AoE fights like Writhing Horror, if you're on add duty, it will do just a bit better than Watchmen and Combat, but otherwise, I wouldn't even bother.

 

Lolsmashing is (in my opinion) for PvP and don't flow too well for PvE.

Agreed 100%.

I'm fairly certain I've posted multiple times in this thread... and I still like it, but I think an update may be in order. The two things I noticed:

1. Watchman accuracy states that it should be 100% so our force attacks always hit. I think you know the problem with that, although that's nitpicky.

2. (this is the bigger one) I know rotations are lame, and I agree with generally not posting them, but I don't know you can have a Combat guide without mentioning the two burst mini-rotations for the Precision Slash windows. I think it would be a great help to existing and learning Combat players to include those in the guide.

Thoughts?

I'm fairly certain I've posted multiple times in this thread... and I still like it, but I think an update may be in order. The two things I noticed:

 

1. Watchman accuracy states that it should be 100% so our force attacks always hit. I think you know the problem with that, although that's nitpicky.

Fixed. Thanks for pointing that out, I need to reread this soon.

2. (this is the bigger one) I know rotations are lame, and I agree with generally not posting them, but I don't know you can have a Combat guide without mentioning the two burst mini-rotations for the Precision Slash windows. I think it would be a great help to existing and learning Combat players to include those in the guide.

 

Thoughts?

You're talking about explaining the Precision/ Gore Cycles? If so, I'll work on including it now.

Edit: Added it in, tell me what you think.

You're talking about explaining the Precision/ Gore Cycles? If so, I'll work on including it now.

 

Edit: Added it in, tell me what you think.

I think what you have is fine, except in the second Precision Window, you're missing the biggest component of it (Zen) and a Blade Rush in each window. You should have time for 3xBR and a BS.

I know this isn't a debate thread, but the reason I prefer the BR > BR > BR > BS for the second window is because (1) you don't have to worry about doing an additional BR before Precision Slash to proc Combat Trance, and (2) it's easier to squeeze in the BS before Precision wears off.

Assuming you hit Precision Slash and Zen .00001 seconds before your first Blade Rush, here's the timing:

Precision Slash + Zen

4 seconds of Precision Remaining

1st Blade Rush

3 seconds of Precision Remaining

2nd Blade Rush

2 seconds of Precision Remaining

3rd Blade Rush

1 second of Precision Remaining

Blade Storm

If you do it your way you will really cut it close but I believe it should theoretically still be doable, you just don't have as comfortable of a window.

Precision Slash + Zen

4 seconds of Precision Remaining

Blade Storm

2.5 seconds of Precision Remaining

1st Blade Rush

1.5 seconds of Precision Remaining

2nd Blade Rush

0.5 seconds of Precision Remaining

3rd Blade Rush

So you've only got 0.5 seconds to play with under your method. Any server lag, computer slowness (if you're not on a high rig machine and overclocking you have some degree of this, and delay between the time you activate your final Blade Rush and the time it strikes the enemy could potentially cause you to miss your final attack with Precision up, which is a substantial dps loss.

Any server lag, computer slowness (if you're not on a high rig machine and overclocking you have some degree of this, and delay between the time you activate your final Blade Rush and the time it strikes the enemy could potentially cause you to miss your final attack with Precision up, which is a substantial dps loss.

This applies to both rotations, however missing a Blade Storm during a PS window is much more of a loss than missing a BR and that's the reason why I go with mine. Squeezing in 3 BRs also, as mentioned only really works with Zen, which I mentioned.

Also, I want to try and keep this guide as entry level as possible, the rest of the discussions in the thread can get as complicated and technical as you guys decide.

This applies to both rotations, however missing a Blade Storm during a PS window is much more of a loss than missing a BR and that's the reason why I go with mine. Squeezing in 3 BRs also, as mentioned only really works with Zen, which I mentioned.

Right, but you have a 1 second error window with Zen > BRx3 > BS, and only 0.5s with the other way. I ran through the BH today with your method though and I still got all 4 attacks in during each Precision, so it's probably a moot point if you're playing well enough with a good connection/machine.

Also, I want to try and keep this guide as entry level as possible, the rest of the discussions in the thread can get as complicated and technical as you guys decide.

Fair enough. I just thought those Precision windows were too important

Right, but you have a 1 second error window with Zen > BRx3 > BS, and only 0.5s with the other way. I ran through the BH today with your method though and I still got all 4 attacks in during each Precision, so it's probably a moot point if you're playing well enough with a good connection/machine.

Yeah, practice, connection and computer are the primary factors here.

Fair enough. I just thought those Precision windows were too important

They are indeed important, I wont argue there, but you know, when I logged on earlier today I had full intentions of actually playing aaaand then I saw your reply to the thread. Ended up spending 20 minutes testing and another 10 writing... Oh well...