Slowpokeking Posted July 17, 2012 Share Posted July 17, 2012 He just used 1 week to turn a strong willed Jedi to his Sith apprentice? That's really incredible, or maybe she wasn't really a jedi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurbere Posted July 17, 2012 Share Posted July 17, 2012 He just used 1 week to turn a strong willed Jedi to his Sith apprentice? That's really incredible, or maybe she wasn't really a jedi. The Sith were turning Jedi throughout the war. It's most likely that the Sith would have refined their methods for conversion. Plus a week of torture would turn plenty of Jedi. And as Jolee said, Bastila is headstrong. Throughout KOTOR, Bastila has thoughts of grandeur. She wants to become a master. Malak gave her a quick and easy path to the power she sought. And she took it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slowpokeking Posted July 17, 2012 Author Share Posted July 17, 2012 (edited) Even Anakin took Palpatine a long time to turn, some new jedi like Jaesa also took the Emperor's Wrath a lot of work. Edited July 17, 2012 by Slowpokeking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forgon Posted July 17, 2012 Share Posted July 17, 2012 Even Anakin took Palpatine a long time to turn, some new jedi like Jaesa also took the Emperor's Wrath a lot of work. Palpatine was sowing the seeds slowly because he to: a) keep up appearances b) not look too suspicious to have anyone (especially lil Ani) catch on c) make sure he is ready for when he unveils his master plan While Palpatine's method was the slow and efficient way to keep the timing and incognito in check, Malak is just actively torturing and whispering thoughts into Bastila's head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tuscad Posted July 17, 2012 Share Posted July 17, 2012 Even Anakin took Palpatine a long time to turn, some new jedi like Jaesa also took the Emperor's Wrath a lot of work. Imagine lightning constantly being sent into your very being to the point of near death, simulating death by electricution. Most people would break and do anything to make it stop, while I know not the duration of this I know it was done as one of the cinematics in the game shows it clearly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slowpokeking Posted July 17, 2012 Author Share Posted July 17, 2012 Remember that agent Baras captured, he tried everything but could not even get info from him and had to risk his apprentice to get the ravager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tuscad Posted July 17, 2012 Share Posted July 17, 2012 (edited) Remember that agent Baras captured, he tried everything but could not even get info from him and had to risk his apprentice to get the ravager. He was an exception, he was trained and conditioned for that. You would think that a Jedi would be but Bastila seemed to not have been. Edited July 17, 2012 by Tuscad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slowpokeking Posted July 17, 2012 Author Share Posted July 17, 2012 He was an exception, he was trained and conditioned for that. You would think that a Jedi would be but Bastila seemed to not have been. Jedi aren't trained to resist the Dark Side? Either way I think Bastila is a failure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tuscad Posted July 17, 2012 Share Posted July 17, 2012 Jedi aren't trained to resist the Dark Side? Either way I think Bastila is a failure. I meant torture but I really don't know, I have never seen anything published about it. Most people and things can be broken if pushed hard enough, there are a few that can resist it (and god bless them), it really depends what methods the torturer uses. I would break under the right condition (people messing with my eyes), I am sure that under the right method that you or anyone else that reads this could be tortured to doing what a torturer wants, so I can't say that I would be to hard on Bastila. It is also possible that Bastila had Stockholm Syndrom like *Saw movies spoiler* Dr.Gordon. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stockholm_syndrome Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanteKardo Posted July 17, 2012 Share Posted July 17, 2012 Turning or rather twisting Jedi through torture is in itself a simple concept, simply because of the emotional spectrum involved. Since force alignment is partially bound to the emotional state and emotional range experienced and expressed, it's an actually easy concept. You simply have to make a person angry, fearful, in some sense, simply passionate in order to pave the groundwork for Sith teachings. Now, anyone apt at Torture is capable of bringing people into a state of fear, pain and disorientation that they will do about anything, and I mean 'anything' in Order for the Torturer to stop. Ofcourse, there are people specifically trained against torture, but that usually involves condition yourself to torture. Knowing what to expect, how to deal with it, etc etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cool-dude Posted July 17, 2012 Share Posted July 17, 2012 (edited) The Jedi were able to erase Revans memory, and place a new identity into his head. He was the most powerful Jedi of his time, and it still took awhile for him to get it back. Malak was incredibly powerful, and he was only second to Revan in terms of how powerful he was.. Their teachers, if you played KOTOR, tell you that Revan and Malak were the strongest of pupils, but Revan was the strongest of the two. So, considering that, Malak could overpower Bastilas mind in a short time because he was stronger. Edited July 17, 2012 by cool-dude Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ratty Posted July 18, 2012 Share Posted July 18, 2012 I certainly don't know the details of what may or may not have happened in parts of KOTOR that it didn't show in the game. Could it have been possible that Malak had been in contact with Bastila and been slowly converting her before that point? Since we don't really know what methods were used we can only speculate. Comparisons are only useful if the people you're comparing are very similar in terms of personality, experiences, training, etc. I personally think there was a part of her that was already dark as was shown by how she behaved and spoke at times so maybe there wasn't that much effort needed to just push that part of her to the front of her mind releasing the part of her that she tried to deny or keep hidden. Also, didn't Bastila look up to Revan (IIRC)? That may have influenced things too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grandmthethird Posted July 18, 2012 Share Posted July 18, 2012 didn't she turn quickly because she wanted to be with revan, and both him and malak were dark kinda like malak saying "come on, revan's dark now and he likes it, were off out to a goth club tonight, you'll love it" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eillack Posted July 18, 2012 Share Posted July 18, 2012 The Sith were turning Jedi throughout the war. It's most likely that the Sith would have refined their methods for conversion. Plus a week of torture would turn plenty of Jedi. And as Jolee said, Bastila is headstrong. Throughout KOTOR, Bastila has thoughts of grandeur. She wants to become a master. Malak gave her a quick and easy path to the power she sought. And she took it. ^ This here... ....and bacon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReiKai Posted July 18, 2012 Share Posted July 18, 2012 Darth Revan had taught them how to convert Jedi. Those who couldn't convert were killed. Malak learned from Revan. Also there is a part about Revan's Force Bond with Bastila after she healed him which made her touch the darkness that was within his memory. Also, it wasn't "just the Jedi" who blocked Revan's memory. It took the entire Jedi Council to do it, and with a weakened Revan who was near death when they found him. The fact he even got his memory back shows the sheer strength of will he actually possesses. Anyway, Bastila's own desires and the fact she keeps trying to contour herself to the Jedi Code when she clearly has an issue with her emotions and is fairly arrogant, makes it no surprise that Malak could turn her via torture. After all, for one, she fell in love with Revan. Secondly, she had emotional moments talkin about her mother and moreso when meeting her on Tattooine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurbere Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 ^ This here... ....and bacon. Mmmm... I like bacon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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